Topical Dutasteride Case Assessment Thread

[Orwell]

I have tried stem cells injections, minoxidil, PRP, mesotherapy, oral minoxidil (loniten), RU, finasteride, dutasteride, topical finasteride and topical dutasteride, dermarolling, saw palmetto, topical saw palmetto, laser cap, dutasteride mesotherapy and probably many other things the past 15 years.

The 4 things that made the greatest difference on my male pattern baldness were:

1) Oral Minoxidil. You grow hair like a Lion. Side effects are bad, it's a powerful med for high blood pressure. I naturally have very low blood pressure, not for me.
2) Dutasteride Mesotherapy. Once every 15 days. 2mm deep. 2ML of Dutasteride. Using a dermapen.
3) Topical Dutasteride. Stopped my hair loss cold. No sides.
4) Dermarolling. It really works.

What did not work or had too many side effects

1) Oral finasteride and dutasteride, side effects were bad
2) Topical finasteride, same sides as oral
3) PRP, did nothing
4) Stem cells did nothing
5) Saw Palmetto, nada
6) Biotin, vitamins, scalp massages

What worked moderately

1) Laser Cap. It did thicken my hair, still use it 3 times a week.
2) RU, hard to tell as I have no hair loss on topical dutasteride and have none since stopping RU.

Have you ever tried dutasteride mesotherapy carried out at by a dermatologist at a clinic, and if so, do you think it works?

 

[Mustang]

Have you ever tried dutasteride mesotherapy carried out at by a dermatologist at a clinic, and if so, do you think it works?

I stupidly did once only to realize I can do this myself and safe a bunch of money.

Yes. it works great

 

[badhabiz]

I have tried stem cells injections, minoxidil, PRP, mesotherapy, oral minoxidil (loniten), RU, finasteride, dutasteride, topical finasteride and topical dutasteride, dermarolling, saw palmetto, topical saw palmetto, laser cap, dutasteride mesotherapy and probably many other things the past 15 years.

The 4 things that made the greatest difference on my male pattern baldness were:

1) Oral Minoxidil. You grow hair like a Lion. Side effects are bad, it's a powerful med for high blood pressure. I naturally have very low blood pressure, not for me.
2) Dutasteride Mesotherapy. Once every 15 days. 2mm deep. 2ML of Dutasteride. Using a dermapen.
3) Topical Dutasteride. Stopped my hair loss cold. No sides.
4) Dermarolling. It really works.

What did not work or had too many side effects

1) Oral finasteride and dutasteride, side effects were bad
2) Topical finasteride, same sides as oral
3) PRP, did nothing
4) Stem cells did nothing
5) Saw Palmetto, nada
6) Biotin, vitamins, scalp massages

What worked moderately

1) Laser Cap. It did thicken my hair, still use it 3 times a week.
2) RU, hard to tell as I have no hair loss on topical dutasteride and have none since stopping RU.

hope you dont mind if I ask

so you use topical dutasteride and dermaroll?

 

[Mustang]

My current regime is on Topical Dutasteride once a week
I just don't need anything else

 

[Orwell]

My current regime is on Topical Dutasteride once a week
I just don't need anything else

That's what I'm intending to try. Like yourself, I experienced sides on topical fina. Are you using 1ml@1%?

 

[Mustang]

I am using 0.1% now
1% is too high

 

[Stating facts]

I wish topical duatasteride is studied in the near future with RCT more because it seems very interesting. With only 0.1 % (equivalent to 0.1 mg) applied topically that lasts for a week, the dose of 0.5 mg (daily or even EOD)seems too much orally.

 

[dgadgdea]

@Mustang Have you noticed any difference between the 0.1% once a week and 1% once a week? Have you measured DHT levels since switching to 0.1%?

I have 0.5% now but after some period if it works I will probably also want to work down to a minimum viable concentration

 

[hailbrotzu]

I am also using topical dutasteride once a week and my hair loss has mostly halted and itching is basically gone. I am still playing with dosage and frequency and looking to try the farmacia parati topical because I am getting occasional ball ache. In my case some of the topical is going systemic but I think with the right liposomal solution and dosage I can prevent it from going systemic.

 

[polishkickbuttowski]

Does anyone know where to source a good solution of topical dutasteride in America?

 

[sonictemples]

You can get it formulated in a liposomal carrier

 

[Mustang]

Does anyone know where to source a good solution of topical dutasteride in America?

I can ship you a bottle to test from Europe

 

[sonictemples]

I can ship you a bottle to test from Europe

Hello, where do you get these bottles? Pharmacy or a clinique?

 

[polishkickbuttowski]

I can ship you a bottle to test from Europe

That sounds great, I'll contact you once im in a better financial position.

 

[Dimitri001]

Get a load of this, cats

https://smj.journals.ekb.eg/article_42083_24b61cbba4be9982db23c318414034c0.pdf

They did miscroneedling in conjunction with topical duta and this is what they found at the end of treatment with regards to serum DHT and T levels:

"Testosterone and DHT levels were measured in group 1 only. Total testosterone was in
the normal range (0.47-9.8 ng/ml); after treatment; there was increase in serum
testosterone, but there was no statistically significant difference in mean testosterone
level before and after treatment. DHT was in the normal range (250-990 pg/ml); after
treatment; there was decline in serum DHT, but there was no statistically significant
difference in mean of DHT level before and after treatment (Table 9)."

There was a 5.3% change in serum DHT.

That said, the study is kind of strange and confusing and I haven't read the whole thing yet.

First, they applied 0.02% duta, is that the normal dose?

Here's the weird part:

IV.4) Treatment schedule: 13
sessions were done according to
the following schedule:
v Once every week for eight weeks
(week 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7).
v Once every two weeks for one
month (week 9, 11).
v Once every month for three
months (week 15, 19, 23).

So, in the last three months of the study, they only did three applications. They say:

Assessment was done monthly and
one week after the last session
(24th week)

So those final values were done a week after the last session. Maybe that's why they got such a small impact on DHT.

Have there been any other studies with topical duta?

UPDATE:

Here's one with duta mesotherapy

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5596657/

"It is believed that systemic absorption after mesotherapy is equal to after oral dutasteride because the scalp is highly vascular.[4] We did not detect significant differences between serum hormone levels before and after treatment, suggesting that the absorption of dutasteride after a nonintensive treatment protocol is worthless. The limitations of our study are the small sample size and the short follow-up."

 

[Mustang]

That's mesotherapy though

 

[corkmeister]

Both articles seem very poorly written to me and they're hard to follow. I doubt these are reputable journals. But nevertheless: definitely interesting.

As far as the first study is concerned, you're probably right in that they only tested serum DHT-levels a week after the last session. I would expect DHT levels to have been significantly lower during the first dosing schedule (weekly). What I don't understand is why they used three different dosing schedules (once weekly for eight weeks, once every two weeks for one month, one monthly for three months) in succession. You would expect these dosing schedules to be divided among multiple groups of test-subjects. Barring that, I would at least expect them to measure/provide data on serum DHT-levels at multiple intervals rather than only at the end.

As far as the second study is concerned, the lack of chance in serum DHT levels makes sense (0.1mg of dutasteride every 3 months is practically nothing, correct me if I'm wrong) but the results are surprising. For this to make sense, a single dose of 0.1mg of dutasteride applied in this manner would need to significantly inhibit scalp DHT. Too bad they didn't measure scalp DHT at all.

If all of this is true, then this would basically be the cure (or ultimate treatment, rather) for male pattern baldness. It's fun to think about (imagine just having to apply dutasteride once every 3 months and being done with it) but naturally, I think we should be extremely skeptical. If something seems too good to be true, it usually is. But I want to be wrong so badly.

Just to entertain the possibility of it. The challenge with topical finasteride seems to be that accumulation across many daily dosages eventually leads to systemic DHT-inhibition. Trying to avoid systemic inhibition seems even more difficult with dutasteride, unless you don't apply a large amount of consecutive doses over time, but rather one big individual dose (which you only apply a couple of times per year)

With a single dose, you'd be better able to estimate the level of dht-inhbition in scalp and serum (provided you have the data) because you don't have to account for accumulation, which I guess is still the biggest unknown variable with topical finasteride. But you would also have to be pretty sure when the dutasteride has roughly left the body, and 5ar-inhibition has ceased (and from topical finasteride we know that these things are not necessarily the same), so that you know when to re-dose. Although I do suppose you have some leeway here (miniaturization would resume once dht is active again, but you'd have some time).

 

[sonictemples]

Get a load of this, cats

https://smj.journals.ekb.eg/article_42083_24b61cbba4be9982db23c318414034c0.pdf

They did miscroneedling in conjunction with topical duta and this is what they found at the end of treatment with regards to serum DHT and T levels:

"Testosterone and DHT levels were measured in group 1 only. Total testosterone was in
the normal range (0.47-9.8 ng/ml); after treatment; there was increase in serum
testosterone, but there was no statistically significant difference in mean testosterone
level before and after treatment. DHT was in the normal range (250-990 pg/ml); after
treatment; there was decline in serum DHT, but there was no statistically significant
difference in mean of DHT level before and after treatment (Table 9)."

There was a 5.3% change in serum DHT.

That said, the study is kind of strange and confusing and I haven't read the whole thing yet.

First, they applied 0.02% duta, is that the normal dose?

Here's the weird part:

IV.4) Treatment schedule: 13
sessions were done according to
the following schedule:
v Once every week for eight weeks
(week 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7).
v Once every two weeks for one
month (week 9, 11).
v Once every month for three
months (week 15, 19, 23).

So, in the last three months of the study, they only did three applications. They say:

Assessment was done monthly and
one week after the last session
(24th week)

So those final values were done a week after the last session. Maybe that's why they got such a small impact on DHT.

Have there been any other studies with topical duta?

UPDATE:

Here's one with duta mesotherapy

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5596657/

"It is believed that systemic absorption after mesotherapy is equal to after oral dutasteride because the scalp is highly vascular.[4] We did not detect significant differences between serum hormone levels before and after treatment, suggesting that the absorption of dutasteride after a nonintensive treatment protocol is worthless. The limitations of our study are the small sample size and the short follow-up."

0.02% is 12mg per 60ml

 

[Dimitri001]

Both articles seem very poorly written to me and they're hard to follow. I doubt these are reputable journals. But nevertheless: definitely interesting.

As far as the first study is concerned, you're probably right in that they only tested serum DHT-levels a week after the last session. I would expect DHT levels to have been significantly lower during the first dosing schedule (weekly). What I don't understand is why they used three different dosing schedules (once weekly for eight weeks, once every two weeks for one month, one monthly for three months) in succession. You would expect these dosing schedules to be divided among multiple groups of test-subjects. Barring that, I would at least expect them to measure/provide data on serum DHT-levels at multiple intervals rather than only at the end.

As far as the second study is concerned, the lack of chance in serum DHT levels makes sense (0.1mg of dutasteride every 3 months is practically nothing, correct me if I'm wrong) but the results are surprising. For this to make sense, a single dose of 0.1mg of dutasteride applied in this manner would need to significantly inhibit scalp DHT. Too bad they didn't measure scalp DHT at all.

If all of this is true, then this would basically be the cure (or ultimate treatment, rather) for male pattern baldness. It's fun to think about (imagine just having to apply dutasteride once every 3 months and being done with it) but naturally, I think we should be extremely skeptical. If something seems too good to be true, it usually is. But I want to be wrong so badly.

Just to entertain the possibility of it. The challenge with topical finasteride seems to be that accumulation across many daily dosages eventually leads to systemic DHT-inhibition. Trying to avoid systemic inhibition seems even more difficult with dutasteride, unless you don't apply a large amount of consecutive doses over time, but rather one big individual dose (which you only apply a couple of times per year)

With a single dose, you'd be better able to estimate the level of dht-inhbition in scalp and serum (provided you have the data) because you don't have to account for accumulation, which I guess is still the biggest unknown variable with topical finasteride. But you would also have to be pretty sure when the dutasteride has roughly left the body, and 5ar-inhibition has ceased (and from topical finasteride we know that these things are not necessarily the same), so that you know when to re-dose. Although I do suppose you have some leeway here (miniaturization would resume once dht is active again, but you'd have some time).

Well, the theory is that topical duta is less likely to go systemic than topical finasteride due to its particle size or something like that.

Sure would be nice to see a large study on topical application at the dose and frequency of application you'd use in the actual treatment with DHT levels measured at the end. And a long study, to account for accumulation.

But that's wishful thinking, it seems like.

 

[Orwell]

Well, the theory is that topical duta is less likely to go systemic than topical finasteride due to its particle size or something like that.

Sure would be nice to see a large study on topical application at the dose and frequency of application you'd use in the actual treatment with DHT levels measured at the end. And a long study, to account for accumulation.

But that's wishful thinking, it seems like.

Unfortunately, the only way of finding out is to try it.