EVERYONE Will Get Finasteride Side-Effects Eventually

Micky_007

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The amount of pro-Finasteride people that make assumptions about people they don't even know in real life truly amaze me.

It's actually crazy that you lot make assumptions about people or events that y'all don't even know about. This is also literally the first time you've ever messaged me... On the internet... But you assume you know my life, LMFAOOOO.

Almost noticing a pattern: Ya'll just make wrong assumptions and lie.
 

20YearsOnFin

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The amount of pro-Finasteride people that make assumptions about people they don't even know in real life truly amaze me. It's actually quite funny how crazy it is to make assumptions about people or events that they don't even know personally.

Almost noticing a pattern: They assume wrong and lie.
If you have genetic male pattern baldness and were indeed previously balding, then you are still balding now, just like everyone on finasteride and Dutasteride are still balding, minoxidil and microneedling hasn't cured you from a genetically predisposed condition. Claiming otherwise is a lie regardless of whether or not we are acquainted on a personal level.
 
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Micky_007

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If you have genetic male pattern baldness and were indeed previously balding, then you are still balding now, just like everyone on finasteride and Dutasteride are still balding, minoxidil and microneedling hasn't cured you from a genetically predisposed condition. Claiming otherwise is a lie regardless of whether or not we are acquainted on a personal level.

Technically everyone with Androgenetic Alopecia is Balding, just that some are Balding at different levels, some are Balding aggressively or some are Balding at a rate that is so slow that is can almost be considered negligible/maintenance.

When you say "Balding" it can be misinterpreted as someone who is aggressively Balding, which isn't the case. My hairloss has been quite slow over the 3 years that I stopped Finasteride, whereby I'd say I only lost about 10% of my density and thickness, which can be considered negligible for that amount of time (3 years).

Even for those who use Finasteride and the few of them who manage to "maintain", its usually not 100% maintenance and most people who consider themselves very good responders to Finasteride would be happy with only a 10% worsening from baseline.

Hence when I said I'm "not Balding", it was to distinguish that I'm not aggressively Balding and that whatever hairloss I've had whilst not on any anti-androgen, has been what can be considered "negligible" but technically is still Balding.

To repeat though. Taking my hair at 2016 as my baseline, I started Finasteride in 2017 to 2018, which made my hair far worse than my 2016 baseline (probably 70% worse). It's entirely possible and quite common even for Finasteride to cause a worsening of hairloss. Maybe due to reflex hyperandrogenicity and upregulation of the AR.

It took 9 to 12 months (2019), after stopping Finasteride at the end of 2018, for my hair to recover and get to only 20% worse from my 2016 baseline, as opposed to a massive 70% worse from Finasteride.

Since 2019 (only 20% worse from my 2016 baseline), till now (2021), my hair has only seen a further 10 to 15% decline, which is to be expected given the large time period.

My point is that, you made it seem as if me stopping Finasteride would have caused me to bald more aggressively, when it was the complete opposite, having stopped Finasteride actually saved my hair.
 
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20YearsOnFin

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Technically everyone with Androgenetic Alopecia is Balding, just that some are Balding at different levels, some are Balding aggressively or some are Balding at a rate that is so slow that is can almost be considered negligible/maintenance.
Off course, That's why im correcting the fact you mentioned you are ''not still balding''
When you say "Balding" it can be misinterpreted as someone who is aggressively Balding, which isn't the case. My hairloss has been quite slow over the 3 years that I stopped Finasteride, whereby I'd say I only lost about 10% of my density and thickness, which can be considered negligible for that amount of time (3 years).
10% density loss over 3 years is a problem, and could nowhere be called ''not still balding'' .
Even for those who use Finasteride and the few of them who manage to "maintain", its usually not 100% maintenance and most people who consider themselves very good responders to Finasteride would be happy with only a 10% worsening from baseline.
Fully agree, i need finasteride to maintain my hair at least 30years so 10% worsening from baseline over that period would be acceptable.
Hence when I said I'm "not Balding", it was to distinguish that I'm not aggressively Balding and that whatever hairloss I've had whilst not on any anti-androgen, has been what can be considered "negligible" but technically is still Balding.
10% density loss over 3 years can not be classed at ''not balding'', over a 20 year period the likelihood is that will develop to norwood pattern that is unacceptable if your goal is hair maintenance.
To repeat though. Taking my hair at 2016 as my hairline, I started Finasteride in 2017 to 2018, which made my hair far worse than my 2016 baseline (probably 70% worse). It's entirely possible and quite common even for Finasteride to cause a worsening of hairloss. Maybe due to reflex hyperandrogenicity and upregulation of the AR.
Agree ,Ive taken more than a dozen + brands of finasteride only 4 were able to maintain my hair, the rest caused my hair to worsen significantly, which is why they ended up in the bin.
It took 9 to 12 months (2019), after stopping Finasteride at the end of 2018, for my hair to recover and get to only 20% worse from my 2016 baseline, as opposed to a massive 70% worse from Finasteride.
Yes in my case, each time its taken my hair a year or 2 to recover.
My point is that, you made it seem as if me stopping Finasteride would have caused me to bald more aggressively, when it was the complete opposite, having stopped Finasteride actually saved my hair.
No, that's just your interpretation I posted a pinocchio giff because you stated you were not "still Balding". You are still balding because you likely have male pattern baldness which isn't cured by minoxidil and microneedling and is unlikely to be able to maintain your hair close to baseline for a 20 year period.
 

Micky_007

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Off course, That's why im correcting the fact you mentioned you are ''not still balding''

10% density loss over 3 years is a problem, and could nowhere be called ''not still balding'' .

Fully agree, i need finasteride to maintain my hair at least 30years so 10% worsening from baseline over that period would be acceptable.

10% density loss over 3 years can not be classed at ''not balding'', over a 20 year period the likelihood is that will develop to norwood pattern that is unacceptable if your goal is hair maintenance.

Agree ,Ive taken more than a dozen + brands of finasteride only 4 were able to maintain my hair, the rest caused my hair to worsen significantly, which is why they ended up in the bin.

Yes in my case, each time its taken my hair a year or 2 to recover.

No, that's just your interpretation I posted a pinocchio giff because you stated you were not "still Balding". You are still balding because you likely have male pattern baldness which isn't cured by minoxidil and microneedling and is unlikely to be able to maintain your hair close to baseline for a 20 year period.

No one will need to be using Finasteride for the next 20 years. In the next 20 years we'd probably even have hair hacloning available much before then.

There will also be significantly better treatment than Finasteride within this decade alone.

But even sooner than that, I just need to more or less maintain until 2023 which let's say is approximately 1.5 years away until Pyrilutamide is available. Which should be a much better and safer treatment than finasteride.

Until then Microneedling + Minoxidil alone could be sufficient to buy me just 1.5 years, especially when people only start noticing peak results on Min + Microneedling around that time.
 
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20YearsOnFin

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No one will need to be using Finasteride for the next 20 years. In the next 20 years we'd probably have hair longing available much before then.

thats what they have been saying since 2000
But even sooner than that, I just need to more or less maintain until 2023 which let's say is approximately 1.5 years away until Pyrilutamide is available. Which should be a much better and safer treatment than finasteride.
You are not maintaining on your current regime if your are loosing ground over such a short period
Until then Microneedling + Minoxidil alone could be sufficient to buy me just 1.5 years, especially when people only start noticing peak results on Min + Microneedling around that time.
Ideally for a anti hairloss regime you should be looking to stabilize your hair loss to almost undetectable level, which by your own admission your current regime is unable to do.
There will also be significantly better treatment than Finasteride within this decade alone.
Hopefully you are right , and maybe you will be fortunate that we are now almost in 2022, but for guys who have been trying to maintain their hair since the late 90's regimes involving Finasteride or similar would have been one of the only nonsurgical ways to maintain your hair over a 20year + period.
 
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20YearsOnFin

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But even sooner than that, I just need to more or less maintain until 2023 which let's say is approximately 1.5 years away until Pyrilutamide is available. Which should be a much better and safer treatment than finasteride.
What's your back up plan if none of the products in development are as successful as first thought or if they are delayed until the end of the decade?
 

Micky_007

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thats what they have been saying since 2000

You are not maintaining on your current regime if your are loosing ground over such a short period



Ideally for a anti hairloss regime you should be looking to stabilize your hair loss to almost undetectable level, which by your own admission your current regime is unable to do.


Hopefully you are right , and maybe you will be fortunate that we are now almost in 2022, but for guys who have been trying to maintain their hair since the late 90's regimes involving Finasteride or similar would have been one of the only nonsurgical ways to maintain your hair over a 20year + period.

I'm not even on any regimen for the past 3 years. To have lost only 10% is really good actually. Even hyper responders on Finasteride easily can notice a 10% worsening after the 1 or 2 peak phase.

You mention "Ideally", but for the majority of people, maintaining 100% is almost impossible. People can at best slow down the hairloss and rarely* get some regrowth/thickening but stopping 100% for prolonged periods is extremely rare.

So if someone was on hairloss treatment and they only lost 10% in 3 years, relatively compared to the standard of efficicay of all current treatments (even at the upper % best possible results), it would be considered fairly good maintenance.

Amd the fact that I did it without any treatment, is why I say I have pretty much "maintained".


Also, I haven't even started using Microneedling + Minoxidil as yet, so I might possibly be able to hold on till 2023 for Pyrilutamide just based on that.
 
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Micky_007

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What's your back up plan if none of the products in development are as successful as first thought or if they are delayed until the end of the decade?

It's extremely unlikely none in the pipeline will work. The rate of technological advancements today cannot be compared to the 2000's.

We have useable Gene Editing Therapy, using CRISPR, mRNA, scientists being able to return cells to a younger state.
It won't take 20 years for this technology to be implemented in hair. There's companies and some of the richest men in the world invested in seeing this technology work.
 

20YearsOnFin

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I'm not even on any regimen for the past 3 years. To have lost only 10% is really good actually. Even hyper responders on Finasteride easily can notice a 10% worsening after the 1 or 2 peak phase.
Well if you are not actually on any regime then no wonder you are loosing ground.
You mention "Ideally", but for the majority of people, maintaining 100% is almost impossible. People can at best slow down the hairloss and rarely* get some regrowth/thickening but stopping 100% for prolonged periods is extremely rare.
I know you have the best intentions, but if you are not even on a hairloss regime, what personal experience do you have in the the field of hair maintenance and what makes you think that there are not people maintaining their hair for 10 - 25 years on their selected regimes, of course the purpose of the regime would be to slow the hairloss down, which is why you need to start at the first sign of loss, but we are talking about doing this for decades to ride out your entire 20's and 30's which is what many people are able to achieve,

the type of results you are looking for are like this guy
https://www.hairlosstalk.com/intera...uccess-rogaine-ru58841-now-finasteride.49405/
So if someone was on hairloss treatment and they only lost 10% in 3 years, relatively compared to the standard of efficicay of all current treatments (even at the upper % best possible results), it would be considered fairly good maintenance.
I find it alarming that you think losing 10% in 3 years would be considered fairly good maintenance. and it just goes to show a naivety on the subject and a dismissive view on what results are available .
Also, I haven't even started using Microneedling + Minoxidil as yet, so I might possibly be able to hold on till 2023 for Pyrilutamide just based on that.
Why are you recommending Microneedling + Minoxidil then, as one of the best options to other users if you have never even tried it?

Anyway I wish you the best of luck with your ''wait and see'' regime and I hope a new treatment comes along that helps you out, but based on your current direction the probable outcome is you will struggle to recover the hair you are loosing on a daily basis even if something new does get released this decade.
 
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JohnSmith21

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Strong arguments bro, as usual.

And you're the one who takes fina but cries in a thread about side effects whenever a new study is posted. If you're so sure it's so safe why are you crying itt? Because deep down you know it's not safe. Typical, insecure fina taker.

Anyway, keep posting here, you're a great example of the cognitive dissonance I was talking about.
Again it haulted my hair loss at NW1.5 and it feels like I’m on a sugar pill. I’m not even super pro finasteride, but you guys just scare people out of using a relatively safe treatment . I do acknowledge that their are sides and risk factors, but people are so overblown about it that it creates a strong push back hence Being “super pro finasteride”. It’s the best treatment out, the only one that actually works, and there really isn’t any harm in trying it. If I came on this website 4 years ago and saw all this sh*t u guys obsess over, I might have not started treatment, and would be regretting it right now
 

JohnSmith21

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Your comment just shows how silly you are.
The fact that I have taken Finasteride, gives me the right to talk about Finasteride as long as I live if I want to. You literally have no valid point.

Its called creating awareness and helping others not make uninformed decisions.

Also the fact that you are so insecure about Finasteride because people are researching and posting studies that are anti-Finasteride says a lot about you.

You'd be happy as long as people stay quiet and naive and fit your narrative about what Finasteride is and isn't.

Guess what, I will continue. Your attempt at trying to find a reason why speaking out about the side effects of Finasteride being bad is weak, stupid and transparent af.

Also, your assumption about me "still Balding" is wrong, my hair is actually STILL far better than what it was AFTER stopping Finasteride for OVER 3 years now.
Yes, Finasteride made my hair much worse than my baseline whilst I was on it.
If your hair is better after stopping it, you weren’t balding. 10% loss in density over 3 years is pretty much natural loss in density for most men who wouldn’t consider themselves “balding”. Id prob be a Norwood 3 by now if I didn’t start finasteride. So the fact that I kept a Norwood 1.5 with great density, and Havnt gotten sides, makes me view finasteride as a great treatment. And again, most people will experience the same thing as I did. Far fewer people will get sides. Therefore, if you value your hair, it’s a great treatment to “give a try”. Everyone knows there are possible sides, but again, if someone new to the hair loss game is balding fast, and we’re to read this thread, they prob won’t try finasteride, when in reality it would most likely save their hair and most likely wouldn’t give them sides. Most likely, Is the key words. I personally wouldn’t even use finasteride if I was experiencing hair loss as slow as you. And I would bet money if your hair was absolutely peeling at a rapid rate, you might try finasteride again, at a lower dose, such as 3 times per week. U clearly don’t have a hair loss problem, so it’s easy for you to have a strong stance against something. It’s all risk reward
 
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Micky_007

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Well if you are not actually on any regime then no wonder you are loosing ground.

I know you have the best intentions, but if you are not even on a hairloss regime, what personal experience do you have in the the field of hair maintenance and what makes you think that there are not people maintaining their hair for 10 - 25 years on their selected regimes, of course the purpose of the regime would be to slow the hairloss down, which is why you need to start at the first sign of loss, but we are talking about doing this for decades to ride out your entire 20's and 30's which is what many people are able to achieve,

the type of results you are looking for are like this guy
https://www.hairlosstalk.com/intera...uccess-rogaine-ru58841-now-finasteride.49405/

I find it alarming that you think losing 10% in 3 years would be considered fairly good maintenance. and it just goes to show a naivety on the subject and a dismissive view on what results are available .

Why are you recommending Microneedling + Minoxidil then, as one of the best options to other users if you have never even tried it?

Anyway I wish you the best of luck with your ''wait and see'' regime and I hope a new treatment comes along that helps you out, but based on your current direction the probable outcome is you will struggle to recover the hair you are loosing on a daily basis even if something new does get released this decade.

I started off with Minoxidil + Microneedling about a year and a half before trying Finasteride in 2017. So you can say I started min + Microneedling in mid 2015, only did it for 6 months and I had pretty good results. Only reason I stopped was because at the time I was studying + working part time so applying Minoxidil twice a day, everyday was becoming impossible with my schedule, and if I wasn't going to use Minoxidil twice a day I might as well not have used it at all. So I stopped treatment to focus solely on my studies + job.

Fortunately I did not have any noticeable hairloss/shedding after stopping treatment. I also did not have any sides on min + Microneedling.

Fast forward to 2017 when I completed my studies and I was only working, I was recommended finasteride by my derm and Minoxidil. Used both. Minoxidil didn't have any results. finasteride only made my hairloss far worse as I explained, you know that part of the story.

So I do have experience with hairloss treatments to give advice. Looking back I should have just stuck with min + Microneedling.

What I meant by "I haven't even started Minoxidil + Microneedling" is that I haven't re-added it to my regimen again. Not that I've never use it before.

Also, I'm still surprised you consider 10% hairloss over 3 years something big. That's actually something I'm completely okay with for the price of not messing up with my hormones from using anti-androgens.

There's lots of people who are on finasteride for way less than 3 years because it did not do anything significant nor slow their hairloss down by 10% in even as little as 1 year (even if they were the lucky few not to get sides).... So I maintain, 10% is still really good for 3 years.

There's nothing naive about it. I'm well aware of how much decline people on treatments still get and unless their the rare hyper responders, only losing 10% in 3 years is really good and falls into the category of non-aggressive hair loss.
 
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20YearsOnFin

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There's nothing naive about it. I'm well aware of how much decline people on treatments still get and unless their the rare hyper responders, only losing 10% in 3 years is really good and falls into the category of non-aggressive hair loss.
Ok, look there seams to be a difference in opinion about what I'm talking about, and what the goals and aims are when starting a hair loss regime, while some are hit hard by the norwood reaper and can reach a norwood 7 in a few years, for the majority of people hairloss is progressive state that takes many years or decades to get from the first signs of loss to their final norwood pattern, this is key and this was the original point of hair loss sites like these, it was to share with people that its entirely possible to slow down hair loss to the level that you can make it from your early 20's all the way to your 40's and beyond, with hair in a massively marked improved state than if no regime had be commenced, i'm not talking about hyper responders or 1 in a million guys i'm talking about the average guy who takes this seriously, chooses a regime that works for them and sticks with it day in and day out for the next 20years this is what I did, and this is the key factor in all the guys that have a successful hair loss regime.

With respect If you are the type of person that start's a regime then stops after a few months then 100% you do not have any long term experience
on this topic and seam to have no idea what it takes to maintain hair successfully for decades, its like a guy who goes to a gym for 6 months then starts giving advice to guys that have been training their whole life.

The whole problem is people who don't stick to regimes seam to have a misconception about what results are possible and are in denial that any of these treatments work for anybody apart from a chosen few .
 
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20YearsOnFin

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only losing 10% in 3 years is really good and falls into the category of non-aggressive hair loss.
Ok i'll just post some pictures of the Snooker player John Higgins, to illustrate what im talking about incase its not 100% clear

John Higgins is a similar age to me and has been loosing his hair for a similar amount of time as me.

hqdefault.jpg

This is him around 1996, he is about 21 and looks to have been already loosing for around 3 years

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age 23 - 1998 loosing hair for 5 years

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age 30 - 2005 loosing hair for 12 years

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age 40 - 2015 loosing hair for 22 years

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age 46 - 2021 loosing hair for 28 years

He still hasn't reached his final norwood pattern yet, you can argue if you want that this is non-aggressive hair loss, as he is only loosing 10 or whatever percent every 3 years, because its taken him 28 years to get there. but At the end of the day he is bald.

If he had started a hair loss regime in 1998 there is a very high probability that he would have been able to maintain the majority of his hair until now, the same like I have, so where as I look about 35 he looks closer to 60.

This is why people need to stick to there regimes for decades. and this why the people who do have success.
 
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DoctorHouse

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Ok i'll just post some pictures of the Snooker player John Higgins, to illustrate what im talking about incase its not 100% clear

John Higgins is a similar age to me and has been loosing his hair for a similar amount of time as me.

View attachment 171400
This is him around 1996, he is about 21 and looks to have been already loosing for around 3 years

View attachment 171401
age 23 - 1998 loosing hair for 5 years

View attachment 171402
age 30 - 2005 loosing hair for 12 years

View attachment 171403
age 40 - 2015 loosing hair for 22 years

View attachment 171404
age 46 - 2021 loosing hair for 28 years

He still hasn't reached his final norwood pattern yet, you can argue if you want that this is non-aggressive hair loss, as he is only loosing 10 or whatever percent every 3 years, because its taken him 28 years to get there. but At the end of the day he is bald.

If he had started a hair loss regime in 1998 there is a very high probability that he would have been able to maintain the majority of his hair until now, the same like I have, so where as I look about 35 he looks closer to 60.

This is why people need to stick to there regimes for decades. and this why the people who do have success.
Definitely agree. You have to be proactive at the beginning and stick with your treatments consistently. Most people can't do that and wonder why they fail.
 

Wolf Pack

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Ok i'll just post some pictures of the Snooker player John Higgins, to illustrate what im talking about incase its not 100% clear

John Higgins is a similar age to me and has been loosing his hair for a similar amount of time as me.

View attachment 171400
This is him around 1996, he is about 21 and looks to have been already loosing for around 3 years

View attachment 171401
age 23 - 1998 loosing hair for 5 years

View attachment 171402
age 30 - 2005 loosing hair for 12 years

View attachment 171403
age 40 - 2015 loosing hair for 22 years

View attachment 171404
age 46 - 2021 loosing hair for 28 years

He still hasn't reached his final norwood pattern yet, you can argue if you want that this is non-aggressive hair loss, as he is only loosing 10 or whatever percent every 3 years, because its taken him 28 years to get there. but At the end of the day he is bald.

If he had started a hair loss regime in 1998 there is a very high probability that he would have been able to maintain the majority of his hair until now, the same like I have, so where as I look about 35 he looks closer to 60.

This is why people need to stick to there regimes for decades. and this why the people who do have success.
God damn brutal typical Anglo, yeah he looks like he has a pension but his skin is also gone. Another reason I am a finasteride lover which has kept all my hair and vigour for life, I understand if one gets genuine life changing sides, but not taking it over fear or "feeling tired" is lame. Transplants will only help him with some situational coverage now without removing the baldness fully, since he lacks donor thickness and is at least Norwood 6. Even with that poor skin, imagine a system/full hair slicked and beard - suddenly he looks fine lol.
 

Micky_007

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Ok, look there seams to be a difference in opinion about what I'm talking about, and what the goals and aims are when starting a hair loss regime, while some are hit hard by the norwood reaper and can reach a norwood 7 in a few years, for the majority of people hairloss is progressive state that takes many years or decades to get from the first signs of loss to their final norwood pattern, this is key and this was the original point of hair loss sites like these, it was to share with people that its entirely possible to slow down hair loss to the level that you can make it from your early 20's all the way to your 40's and beyond, with hair in a massively marked improved state than if no regime had be commenced, i'm not talking about hyper responders or 1 in a million guys i'm talking about the average guy who takes this seriously, chooses a regime that works for them and sticks with it day in and day out for the next 20years this is what I did, and this is the key factor in all the guys that have a successful hair loss regime.

With respect If you are the type of person that start's a regime then stops after a few months then 100% you do not have any long term experience
on this topic and seam to have no idea what it takes to maintain hair successfully for decades, its like a guy who goes to a gym for 6 months then starts giving advice to guys that have been training their whole life.

The whole problem is people who don't stick to regimes seam to have a misconception about what results are possible and are in denial that any of these treatments work for anybody apart from a chosen few .

I've been on Propecia for literally 2 entire years. I have experience in it.

Also, for every picture you can post of some lucky guy who managed to supposedly maintain their hair on Finasteride for x amount of years, there's statiscally FAR MORE who have NOT managed to maintain their hair longer than a year or 2 and thats looking at the pro-Finasteride studies (even those show peak results are at the 1 or 2 year mark) and considering the what can be considered as "hyper responders" or under 5% category which manage to maintain for many many years on Finasteride without seeing a decline in baseline. Those people are just rare.

But fortunately, we would most probably see a much better and safer treatment within the next few years than Finasteride that we can all use.
 

300

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I've been on Propecia for literally 2 entire years. I have experience in it.

Also, for every picture you can post of some lucky guy who managed to supposedly maintain their hair on Finasteride for x amount of years, there's statiscally FAR MORE who have NOT managed to maintain their hair longer than a year or 2 and thats looking at the pro-Finasteride studies (even those show peak results are at the 1 or 2 year mark) and considering the what can be considered as "hyper responders" or under 5% category which manage to maintain for many many years on Finasteride without seeing a decline in baseline. Those people are just rare.

But fortunately, we would most probably see a much better and safer treatment within the next few years than Finasteride that we can all use.
Here we go again.It worked for many people far longer than 2 years.
 
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