Topical Cetrizine for Hair Loss instead of Finasteride (Propecia)

[casperz]

So the stuff on the bottom is CET that didn't dissolve...so that can be recovered and re-used...I guess when we're talking concentrations, you might be getter more CET in another medium than water to dissolve...

...for the first time I took pictures...I was pretty shocked to see the scope of the loss on my crown and vertex....to be honest, I don't know if my donor area is gonna cut it....if CET can hold on to what I have, a hair transplant will be worth it for the front, but otherwise, it wouldn't bee...

I think the stuff at the bottom can just be thrown out, it's the fillers used to shape the tablet. Most of the Cet is going to be suspended in the water. From what I gathered on the German forum Cet dissolves the best in water.

I was shocked the first time I took pics, I had no idea my crown had gotten bald, guess I never paid much attention to it.

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Hi,
Just joined this forum...
I will try cetrizine topically, in low % EtOH / destilled water, starting next week and will post my results here.
I am NWIII, and do not follow any treatment regime wich will make my experiment less confounded with other factors.
I am a researcher in molecular biology and have read a lot about hair loss in the primary literature. My belief (as many others' with me) after reading up is that male pattern baldness is dependent on inflammatory response, and that DHT is clearly necessary but not sufficient for the hair miniaturization. I have been looking for compounds reducing inflammatory response, and that this is why I will now try cetrizine.
Let's see how it goes.

Nice! Keep us posted, I'm sure with your background you can provide valuable input.

 

[what]

I started my treatments tonight. This is how i made a 3mg/mL solution of it:

1. I used a small coffee bean grinder to pulverize 30 cetirizine tablets (10mg) into powder.

2. Dissolved the powder in 50mLs of deionized water, making sure to shake up the powder and get it fully dispersed into the water with no clumps.

3. I VERY mildly warmed the water solution (like you would a baby's bottle) for 20-30mins to assist getting cetirizine in solution. Periodically shaking vial.

4. Centrifuged the Cetirizine solution so that all filler material was in bottom of vial and took off the supernatant.

5. Took the 50mLs of cetirizine solution (supernatant) and added 30mL of ethyl alcohol and then 20mL of propylene glycol.


I used a dermaroller and went over my head a couple times and then used an eye dropper to administer about 1-2mL of cetirizine solution over entire head. Rubbing it in with finger tips. I'll being applying this (most likely) 1x per day. Also will be using minoxidil foam 1x/day and nizoral shampoo 1-2x per week.

It's a little messy but no worse than liquid minoxidil. I'm hoping this works!

 

[Sparky4444]

I think the stuff at the bottom can just be thrown out, it's the fillers used to shape the tablet. Most of the Cet is going to be suspended in the water. From what I gathered on the German forum Cet dissolves the best in water.

I was shocked the first time I took pics, I had no idea my crown had gotten bald, guess I never paid much attention to it.

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Nice! Keep us posted, I'm sure with your background you can provide valuable input.

ah..ok..that make sense, thanx!....

 

[casperz]

I started my treatments tonight. This is how i made a 3mg/mL solution of it:

1. I used a small coffee bean grinder to pulverize 30 cetirizine tablets (10mg) into powder.

2. Dissolved the powder in 50mLs of deionized water, making sure to shake up the powder and get it fully dispersed into the water with no clumps.

3. I VERY mildly warmed the water solution (like you would a baby's bottle) for 20-30mins to assist getting cetirizine in solution. Periodically shaking vial.

4. Centrifuged the Cetirizine solution so that all filler material was in bottom of vial and took off the supernatant.

5. Took the 50mLs of cetirizine solution (supernatant) and added 30mL of ethyl alcohol and then 20mL of propylene glycol.


I used a dermaroller and went over my head a couple times and then used an eye dropper to administer about 1-2mL of cetirizine solution over entire head. Rubbing it in with finger tips. I'll being applying this (most likely) 1x per day. Also will be using minoxidil foam 1x/day and nizoral shampoo 1-2x per week.

It's a little messy but no worse than liquid minoxidil. I'm hoping this works!

Very nice write up, I have some questions. I'm making up a new batch soon and I purchased a quart of propylene glycol to use.

Does the PG and alcohol mix OK with the water?

Did you use 70% rubbing alcohol or something else?

What length is your Dermaroller?

How much did the centrifuge help with the cloudiness? I did some searching and I can get a 4000rpm centrifuge
for about $50.

Thanks for any info.

 

[what]

Very nice write up, I have some questions. I'm making up a new batch soon and I purchased a quart of propylene glycol to use.

Does the PG and alcohol mix OK with the water?

Did you use 70% rubbing alcohol or something else?

What length is your Dermaroller?

How much did the centrifuge help with the cloudiness? I did some searching and I can get a 4000rpm centrifuge
for about $50.

Thanks for any info.

The propylene glycol is miscible with water - so it mixes perfectly. Can't tell it's in there.

I used 70% rubbing alcohol. However, i think this is a mistake. I didn't check to see if there were other ingredients in it - just assumed EtOH and water. Turns out there is a bunch of other crap in there. Including acetone - which gives it a very strong chemical smell and can get metabolized to other things. I'm making a new batch and going to use 100% ethanol. I think if you purchased grain alcohol from liquor store you're getting a pretty pure solution of ethanol - at the least there wouldn't be anything harmful in there.

My derma roller is 1.0mm (i believe, can double check). I press very lightly when using it.

When i initially dissolved my pills in the water it looked like milk. After centrifuging for 10mins and 3000rpm it looked slightly cloudy. Perhaps a little better than the photos in this thread showin the solution after sitting all night. It made it easy to take off the supernatant b/c material was so tightly packed on the bottom. so, i think it helps...

Will say my hair looked like crap after putting this on. Definitely a before bed kind of treatment, because i couldn't walk around in public looking like that. Makes me wonder about the amount of PPG and whether that much is necessary. Also, found it a pain when applying cause liquid was running all over the place - half of it down my face. So, i'm starting to aquire the material to make a lotion out of it. basically will use the water extraction method i detailed and combine it with an oil and emulsifying agent and then blend it. Couple of videos on youtube give good tutorials on how to make them. Think that will make the application part easier.

 

[casperz]

The propylene glycol is miscible with water - so it mixes perfectly. Can't tell it's in there.

I used 70% rubbing alcohol. However, i think this is a mistake. I didn't check to see if there were other ingredients in it - just assumed EtOH and water. Turns out there is a bunch of other crap in there. Including acetone - which gives it a very strong chemical smell and can get metabolized to other things. I'm making a new batch and going to use 100% ethanol. I think if you purchased grain alcohol from liquor store you're getting a pretty pure solution of ethanol - at the least there wouldn't be anything harmful in there.

My derma roller is 1.0mm (i believe, can double check). I press very lightly when using it.

When i initially dissolved my pills in the water it looked like milk. After centrifuging for 10mins and 3000rpm it looked slightly cloudy. Perhaps a little better than the photos in this thread showin the solution after sitting all night. It made it easy to take off the supernatant b/c material was so tightly packed on the bottom. so, i think it helps...

Will say my hair looked like crap after putting this on. Definitely a before bed kind of treatment, because i couldn't walk around in public looking like that. Makes me wonder about the amount of PPG and whether that much is necessary. Also, found it a pain when applying cause liquid was running all over the place - half of it down my face. So, i'm starting to aquire the material to make a lotion out of it. basically will use the water extraction method i detailed and combine it with an oil and emulsifying agent and then blend it. Couple of videos on youtube give good tutorials on how to make them. Think that will make the application part easier.

I like the idea of a lotion, keep us updated on that. With water only it's not bad and evaporates quickly but I think PG helps it get
absorbed better. I suspect that a lot of it remains sitting on the scalp after the water dries.

Here are new pics where I was able to play around with the lighting and I think got some better shots. The tiny new
hairs seem to be getting very thick at the base very quickly and many of them are turning dark. Some are as large
at the base as the mature hair. The pic showing the curved hairline is the very front where my hairline once was and are
areas of my scalp that were the first to go 15+ years ago. Also keep in mind the depth of focus is very short and you
only see a sliver of area in focus. In the last pic it looks like there is just a strip of new hair in front of the mature hair but
the new tiny hair just behind is just out of focus. The new hairs extend well into the mature hairs and as you move the camera back you can see them.

I'm certain the Cet is doing something good, the questions is will the hairs continue to mature.

 

[Aks20]

My goodness, casperz is that all due to cetrizine? How long have you been taking it topically? Any side effects that you have noticed?
I am very side effect prone especially with anti androgens so this is my new hope.

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I'm 5 weeks in and I'm fairly optimistic cetirizin is doing something. I've completely stopped shedding as a start and all the vellus hairs in the frontal hairline are looking much thicker and longer. There are at least 5 or 6 vellus hairs that have turned dark in areas that have been bald for years.

It's impossible to get any kind of picture of these vellus hairs at this point but they are definitely changing. I'll report more as things develop.

Are you using vodka with this? Dissolve in water and then use Vodka?

I wonder whether alcohol on our skin daily is safe, but thats in Fluridil and minoxidil solution, too, right.

Big challenge is not to drink all the vodka up before applying to hair, LOL.

 

[casperz]

My goodness, casperz is that all due to cetrizine? How long have you been taking it topically? Any side effects that you have noticed?
I am very side effect prone especially with anti androgens so this is my new hope.

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Are you using vodka with this? Dissolve in water and then use Vodka?

I wonder whether alcohol on our skin daily is safe, but thats in Fluridil and minoxidil solution, too, right.

Big challenge is not to drink all the vodka up before applying to hair, LOL.

I've been using it for 55 days and all this has happened since I started. Guys on the German forum have also reported fast
results in some cases. See my first post on this thread, it has other specifics. I'm using only Cet mixed
with water. Been using minoxidil since 2007, stopped finasteride in Feb of this year.

 

[zeroes]

casperz anyone using cet without the big 3 getting results on the German forum?

 

[casperz]

casperz anyone using cet without the big 3 getting results on the German forum?

The user minox86 is using Cet and minoxidil, he is the guy getting the amazing growth that I posted a pic of earlier this week. A lot of guys
are saying they are getting growth but have not posted pictures yet. I don't recall anyone saying they were on the big three in addition
to Cet but some may be. My experience is that there is some synergy with using multiple products far beyond using any individually. I had
amazing regrowth in 2009 with the big 3 plus plus plus but it was too much to keep up with and I got lazy and lost interest (and lost all my regrowth).

 

[nohawk]

Anyone notice any sides on this? I applied a 30mg/30ml solution for 4 days and had excruciating testicle pain and libido loss. Balls scrunched up to my pelvis and slowly got better over the course of the week. My body had a very finasteride-like response to the Cet. Can anyone comment on why this happened and how the two drugs could possibly be causing the same sides in differing ways?

 

[Nickel]

Hey Casperz,

What did cet do to the rest of your exiting hair, in my case i dont need regrowth just thickening.
But for past experiences i noticed that these 2 things come together.

 

[casperz]

Anyone notice any sides on this? I applied a 30mg/30ml solution for 4 days and had excruciating testicle pain and libido loss. Balls scrunched up to my pelvis and slowly got better over the course of the week. My body had a very finasteride-like response to the Cet. Can anyone comment on why this happened and how the two drugs could possibly be causing the same sides in differing ways?

Wow that's crazy. It sounds like the Cet did something to your Testosterone levels but since guys take it orally for long periods
that's hard to imagine. I have not had any sides from Cet except for maybe dry eyes and poor sleep, but I never had the symptom you
describe on finasteride. finasteride in a nutshell made me feel tired with no motivation. I did not realize how much it was affecting me until I stopped,
it made such a difference that I vowed that I'd never take finasteride again. It's not like I had a full head of hair with it anyway.

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Hey Casperz,

What did cet do to the rest of your exiting hair, in my case i dont need regrowth just thickening.
But for past experiences i noticed that these 2 things come together.

I'm only about 2 months in but I would say my hair is starting to feel thicker. I have had zero shedding once it stopped
after I started Cet so that alone is a good thing. I stopped finasteride in Feb and had been shedding since then and it increased
when I started Cet for about 2 to 3 weeks and has tapered off to nothing.

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I'm at almost 60 day now, here is a shot from above now and where I started Sept 1. The crown seems to be thicker but the front is
about the same. I've also not cut my hair since the first picture so we are not comparing apples to apples but I see some improvement.

 

[chicknlittle]

Interesting thread. Thank you for volunteering for the experiment and posting results : )

I still wonder what mechanism cetrizine is supposed to be helping. My understanding is that as an antihistamine it would be working by preventing mast cell release of PGD2 (as it's not a PGD2 receptor antagonist). If so, oral Zyrtec (cetrizine) could/would have similar effect. And, If that is the mechanism, then I suspect that topical hydrocortisone (low dose, over the counter strength, or low dose in shampoo, over the counter) might have similar effect. Searching I do see other threads with similar reports of benefit with hydrocortisone topical or injection... Those threads often report some initial benefit, but always devolve into discussion of fears of long term cortisone effects on skin. However 1%hydrocortisone is quite weak compared to most topical steroids, and presumably safer/less likely to cause those effects. http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=10&threadid=63213

In any case, on considering, i think I will pulverize some Zyrtec (cetrizine) and put it in a small bottle of shampoo (Possibly hydrocortisone containing 1% shampoo... easily available in the pet section for pet eczema... yes I know, its for animals. People are animals) for use 3 times a week, alternating with nizoral, while awaiting the results of these experiments, and the release of actual PGD2 receptor blockers. Why shampoo? Because Im already using topical minoxidil twice a day. Don't want the inconvenience of another topical if it can be avoided..

 

[casperz]

Interesting thread. Thank you for volunteering for the experiment and posting results : )

I still wonder what mechanism cetrizine is supposed to be helping. My understanding is that as an antihistamine it would be working by preventing mast cell release of PGD2 (as it's not a PGD2 receptor antagonist). If so, oral Zyrtec (cetrizine) could/would have similar effect. And, If that is the mechanism, then I suspect that topical hydrocortisone (low dose, over the counter strength, or low dose in shampoo, over the counter) might have similar effect. Searching I do see other threads with similar reports of benefit with hydrocortisone topical or injection... Those threads often report some initial benefit, but always devolve into discussion of fears of long term cortisone effects on skin. However 1%hydrocortisone is quite weak compared to most topical steroids, and presumably safer/less likely to cause those effects. http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=10&threadid=63213

In any case, on considering, i think I will pulverize some Zyrtec (cetrizine) and put it in a small bottle of shampoo (Possibly hydrocortisone containing 1% shampoo... easily available in the pet section for pet eczema... yes I know, its for animals. People are animals) for use 3 times a week, alternating with nizoral, while awaiting the results of these experiments, and the release of actual PGD2 receptor blockers. Why shampoo? Because Im already using topical minoxidil twice a day. Don't want the inconvenience of another topical if it can be avoided..

I was using topical 1% hydrocortisone as part of my KSR(see details in my sig link) regime back in 2007-2010 and saw some amazing regrowth far beyond what most people see. It may have the same effect as the Cet. Keep us updated if hydrocortisone/Cet shampoo works for you, I don't care what the topical is, as long as it works better than the Big-3 I'd try it.

 

[Stefan_88]

is it Zyrtec you all talk about? its 3-4 euros in Turkey.

Btw, Hydrocortisone is really that useful for hairs? When i talked to an italian dermatoligst, he said that its very useful for hairs and gave me some advices about using it.

 

[casperz]

is it Zyrtec you all talk about? its 3-4 euros in Turkey.

Btw, Hydrocortisone is really that useful for hairs? When i talked to an italian dermatoligst, he said that its very useful for hairs and gave me some advices about using it.

That looks like the same thing. How much Cet does it contain per pill?

Hydrocortisone does appear to help with hair loss, google turns up a lot of information on it.

 

[zeroes]

I purchased a pill crusher for $13, I'll give it ago once I get cet.

 

[Stefan_88]

That looks like the same thing. How much Cet does it contain per pill?

Hydrocortisone does appear to help with hair loss, google turns up a lot of information on it.

10mg.

 

[what]

Hey Casperz, how soon did you notice shedding? I've only been on this for about 4 or 5 days and i'm shedding like crazy. I feel like a couple more months of this type of shedding and i'll be bald! Can't believe how many hairs i just cleaned off the bathroom sink. And i feel like the density of the hair on my head has changed. It doesn't seem likely that using a treatment for only four days would cause that, so maybe it was supposed to happen naturally. But, damn!