Topical Bicalutamide Log (lets See If This Works)

[hemingway_the_mercenary]

What about resistance? We do know that androgen receptors in prostate cancer cells like LNCaP-BC2 or LNCaP develop resistance to Bicalutamide when it's used as monotherapy. But I don't know about the androgen receptors of other cells, like those in hair follicles. There have been anecdotal claims that prolonged exposure to anti-androgens, like Finasteride, Dutasteride, RU58841 and perhaps a couple more AAs, has made the hair follicles even more sensitive and they were bound to increase their dosage and finally switch to Flutamide or Cyproterone Acetate. Some claim that Bicalutamide makes their scalps oilier and itchy and had no effect on their hair loss, though my experience is just the opposite.
Is there a possibility that after years of Dutasteride, the androgen receptors were so sensitive to testosterone that they didn't bind to Bicalutamide, just like they do in the testes, where androgen levels are high enough to prevent binding of Bicalutamide?
The only theory that I can possibly think of about the unexpected failure of Bicalutamide is that since Bicalutamide takes around three months to reach its stable serum levels, it's not sufficient enough to dominate over the already flaring testosterone and DHT, that occurred due to withdrawal of Dutasteride. But it still doesn't explain why the dose needs to be increased over time when it seemed to have been working well before.
I'm just concerned about developing resistance to oral Bicalutamide, because if it happens and second generation NSAAs don't become available and affordable by then, then the only option that'd be left to me will be surgical castration or GnRH analogues.

Theres a huge difference between cancer cells and regular cells. Of course cancer cells become resistant, your regular cells do not work this way. Bicalutamide at 50mg or more orally will easily be able to combat hairloss, but the only question is how effective is it topically. The main issue ive run into is I can hardly dissolve it, meaning the dosage is very low.

Think about it like this, the AR need to be binded to by an androgenic molecule for hairloss to occur. If there is competition as to what binds to the AR then the gene expression will be lower. The ideal scenario would be to have a molecule that has as strong of an affinity to the AR as DHT but I am not aware of such a molecule. Howver, bicalutamide compensates for its lack of strenght by volume. There are so many bicalutamide molecules available to bind the the AR that it overpowers testosterone. Thats why it works otherwise it would not be effective as testosterone would just keep binding to the receptors as if bicalutamide wasnt even there

 

[Ein]

Theres a huge difference between cancer cells and regular cells. Of course cancer cells become resistant, your regular cells do not work this way. Bicalutamide at 50mg or more orally will easily be able to combat hairloss, but the only question is how effective is it topically. The main issue ive run into is I can hardly dissolve it, meaning the dosage is very low.

Think about it like this, the AR need to be binded to by an androgenic molecule for hairloss to occur. If there is competition as to what binds to the AR then the gene expression will be lower. The ideal scenario would be to have a molecule that has as strong of an affinity to the AR as DHT but I am not aware of such a molecule. Howver, bicalutamide compensates for its lack of strenght by volume. There are so many bicalutamide molecules available to bind the the AR that it overpowers testosterone. Thats why it works otherwise it would not be effective as testosterone would just keep binding to the receptors as if bicalutamide wasnt even there

Well, I knew about most of it already, but we haven't have any studies about androgen receptors of normal cells being "non-resistant" to Bicalutamide on prolonged treatment. Though it's pretty obvious that there's no way to figure that out currently. I'll just have to wait.
The reason for this skepticism was the infiltration of the claims of RU58841 users in my mind, that the hair becomes RU dependant after long term usage. Perhaps, I was overthinking this one.

 

[arnoldd]

Is there any study that AAs can change the sensitive of androgen receptors?

 

[Ein]

The main issue ive run into is I can hardly dissolve it, meaning the dosage is very low.

Maybe K&B solution is not suitable for dissolving Bicalutamide. It contains 60% ethanol which means 0.6mg/ml solubility, and the presence of 35% deionized water can greatly reduce the solubility.
Try using DMSO. Bicalutamide has a solubility of 14mg/ml in DMSO and it's a safe and easily available solvent. You can even get it in cream and gel form, and it's a potent absorption enhancer.
Bicalutamide has a solubility of 20mg/ml in DMF, but is not safe.
You can get 10% to 90% DMSO without prescription anywhere.

 

[Ein]

Is there any study that AAs can change the sensitive of androgen receptors?

I haven't found any studies yet. I've only seen anecdotal claims. That's why I was looking for someone who has some knowledge about this and has found any studies.

 

[hemingway_the_mercenary]

Maybe K&B solution is not suitable for dissolving Bicalutamide. It contains 60% ethanol which means 0.6mg/ml solubility, and the presence of 35% deionized water can greatly reduce the solubility.
Try using DMSO. Bicalutamide has a solubility of 14mg/ml in DMSO and it's a safe and easily available solvent. You can even get it in cream and gel form, and it's a potent absorption enhancer.
Bicalutamide has a solubility of 20mg/ml in DMF, but is not safe.
You can get 10% to 90% DMSO without prescription anywhere.

dmso takes it basically straight to the bloodstream. Its too effective

 

[TK421]

Theres a huge difference between cancer cells and regular cells. Of course cancer cells become resistant, your regular cells do not work this way. Bicalutamide at 50mg or more orally will easily be able to combat hairloss, but the only question is how effective is it topically. The main issue ive run into is I can hardly dissolve it, meaning the dosage is very low.

Think about it like this, the AR need to be binded to by an androgenic molecule for hairloss to occur. If there is competition as to what binds to the AR then the gene expression will be lower. The ideal scenario would be to have a molecule that has as strong of an affinity to the AR as DHT but I am not aware of such a molecule. Howver, bicalutamide compensates for its lack of strenght by volume. There are so many bicalutamide molecules available to bind the the AR that it overpowers testosterone. Thats why it works otherwise it would not be effective as testosterone would just keep binding to the receptors as if bicalutamide wasnt even there

Have you tried Fluridil? It's expensive, but it comes premixed in ampules and is manufactured by a legit company. I'm currently using it but no benefits yet (I've only been using for 6 days, though).

 

[hemingway_the_mercenary]

Have you tried Fluridil? It's expensive, but it comes premixed in ampules and is manufactured by a legit company. I'm currently using it but no benefits yet (I've only been using for 6 days, though).

I haven’t tried it but it said some bs like the molecule is instantly destroyed as soon as it hit the blood stream so I lost all interest

Bicalutamide is better than flutamide anyways

 

[el_duterino]

Fluridil is very weak at best I tried like 3 times the daily amount and got a reduction of shedding but no reduction in miniaturization

No one ever seem to get any solid results with it

For male pattern baldness the best topicals are RU or CB far far better than fluridil or try DARO and see of you have side effects

 

[hemingway_the_mercenary]

Fluridil is very weak at best I tried like 3 times the daily amount and got a reduction of shedding but no reduction in miniaturization

No one ever seem to get any solid results with it

For male pattern baldness the best topicals are RU or CB far far better than fluridil or try DARO and see of you have side effects

yea I dont believe in fluridil

but how come there are zero before and afters posted with RU or cb showing any regrowth if their so good

 

[hemingway_the_mercenary]

Update still no itch

looking for any way to substitute ethanol out of the solution, its so unhealthy for the scalp skin

 

[furrydome]

Safety and side effects: darolutamide. It doesn't cross the blood-brain barrier and it doesn't block feedback of the HPG axis. Least chance for cognitive, emotional, or sexual side effects

Daro not crossing the BBB has been sort of debunked in the Daro thread. @whatevr and myself experiencing anxiety, and (at least me) experiencing sexual sides.

 

[furrydome]

well daro does damage to the ar so on the chane it goes systemin i dont want to cause too much damage

Do we have evidence of Daro damaging the AR? First I've heard of it.

 

[hemingway_the_mercenary]

Daro not crossing the BBB has been sort of debunked in the Daro thread. @whatevr and myself experiencing anxiety, and (at least me) experiencing sexual sides.

how bad was the anxiety you experianced and how were the sexual sides?

Do you feel it worked better than any other treaments like finasteride, ru, etc?

As for damaging the AR I belive I read about it somewhere in the Enza thread and Daro acts in a very similar way (idk, I just assumed they both would damage the AR, otherwise enza would be stronger)

 

[Ein]

Update still no itch

looking for any way to substitute ethanol out of the solution, its so unhealthy for the scalp skin

If you remove ethanol from that solution, you'll be left with 87.5% Deionized Water and 12.5% K&B Emulsifier. I don't think Bicalutamide will dissolve in that. Besides, the only two substitutes that I know of, currently, are DMSO and DMF. But they're both very potent and can make Bicalutamide go systemic.

 

[el_duterino]

Ethanol is not a problem for the skin not sure why people make these claims there isn't such study

 

[Maave]

Daro not crossing the BBB has been sort of debunked in the Daro thread. @whatevr and myself experiencing anxiety, and (at least me) experiencing sexual sides.

Yeah I saw that thread after posting. It's lower than others but clearly still enough for you to notice. It's odd that so many resources say that it doesn't cross or it's minimal.

 

[whatevr]

how bad was the anxiety you experianced and how were the sexual sides?

Do you feel it worked better than any other treaments like finasteride, ru, etc?

As for damaging the AR I belive I read about it somewhere in the Enza thread and Daro acts in a very similar way (idk, I just assumed they both would damage the AR, otherwise enza would be stronger)

I got a panic attack within 30 minutes of applying it to my scalp, same as enzalutamide. Pretty bad. Wouldn't be able to function or go to work while taking it. Needless to say I only applied it once so I don't know about any other side effects.

 

[el_duterino]

Panic attack isn't an androgenic side effect

I bet this isn't the first time you experienced a panic attack in you life you may be prone to this due to anxiety etc I think you mentionned using benzos in the past

No one got panic attacks on other systemic anti androgen

You need to check how your dick works and you will quickly know if this Daro gives sides or not

 

[hemingway_the_mercenary]

Panic attack isn't an androgenic side effect
No one got those on other anti androgen

You need to check how your dick works and you will know

I actually tend to agree with you. Would be very strange if somehow you could get a panic attack for like 5mg of Daro if it even absorbed. I mean if you get a panic attack at 5mg how bad would 50mg be? The drug would be very hard to promote

Maybe it an unrelated side effect of the drug but it all seems so so strange.

Would you say you are someone who is prone to placebo? Not to be rude, but you have to agree its very strange