regrowth by antiandrogens only , is it possible ?

JAKE12321

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i will take finasteride and ru can ru deal with the 20-30% remaining DHT and T ? or should i take dutasteride? i am planning on using caffeine and stemoxydine

is this a good stack for regrowth? i think it should work since people who are trans get unbelievable regrowth so if i managed to block both DHT and T on scalp i think i will have similar effect
 

nicoandgello

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It CAN work for sure. I don't think it can regrow hair up to norwood 1 for BIG MAJORITY of people. Trans girls have test levels lower than girls born females. I would add low dose oral minoxidil for best regrowth(2.5mg of it works for 90% of people).
 

hemingway_the_mercenary

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If you want real regrowth you need to block all Androgens not just DHT. Ru topically does almost nothing due to poor absorption which is why you've never seen a single user ever post a regrowth progress pictures while only using RU but there have been many who get regrowth only using oral spironolactone, flutamide, Bicalutamide, etc.

Topical absorption through the scalp is very limited unfortunately and is the main barrier to successfully regrowing most of our hair while avoiding systemic side effects
 

Selb

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If you want real regrowth you need to block all Androgens not just DHT. Ru topically does almost nothing due to poor absorption which is why you've never seen a single user ever post a regrowth progress pictures while only using RU but there have been many who get regrowth only using oral spironolactone, flutamide, Bicalutamide, etc.

Topical absorption through the scalp is very limited unfortunately and is the main barrier to successfully regrowing most of our hair while avoiding systemic side effects
I’ve been wondering about this. Let’s say you use a weak dose of RU after a microneedling session. Bad absorption mixed with the small dose should mean that it’ll go only slightly systemic. But then microneedling will allow for that dose to completely concentrate on the scalp. Even if it’s a small dose, RU is dose dependent. If you have enough substance to cover the scalp it’ll inhibit androgens at the follicles.

Also, a lot of people need estrogen to get regrowth. Not just AAs
 

JAKE12321

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It CAN work for sure. I don't think it can regrow hair up to norwood 1 for BIG MAJORITY of people. Trans girls have test levels lower than girls born females. I would add low dose oral minoxidil for best regrowth(2.5mg of it works for 90% of people).
yeah but what about the wrinkles and water retention? the bloating was so bad i looked like a ball
 

JAKE12321

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If you want real regrowth you need to block all Androgens not just DHT. Ru topically does almost nothing due to poor absorption which is why you've never seen a single user ever post a regrowth progress pictures while only using RU but there have been many who get regrowth only using oral spironolactone, flutamide, Bicalutamide, etc.

Topical absorption through the scalp is very limited unfortunately and is the main barrier to successfully regrowing most of our hair while avoiding systemic side effects
i will use 50ml of ru a day is this enough , also i heard its bad to use anything right after dermarolling so should i use it the day after ? and i heard that ru breaks down to harmless metabolites if it goes systemic so

i forgot to mention oral castor oil rednsyl
 

mooreu

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i will use 50ml of ru a day is this enough , also i heard its bad to use anything right after dermarolling so should i use it the day after ? and i heard that ru breaks down to harmless metabolites if it goes systemic so

i forgot to mention oral castor oil rednsyl

You're thinking of clascoterone (i.e. CB-03-01 or 17AP) not RU. If RU goes systemic then you will notice signs of lowered androgen levels. I had chest pains while using RU.
 

JaneyElizabeth

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You have to define what you mean by regrowth because no one ever defines this term or contrasts it with the terms "growth" or "improvement". I think that AA's, including reductase inhibitors can halt hair loss fairly effectively and probably, few debate this. As regrowth agents, they are likely to work best for the very young.

Once follicles go completely dormant, however, I don't think that there is good evidence that AA's cause regrowth or that they awaken dormant follicles. This appears to be what estrogens do, however. This is why virtually all of the impressive "recoveries" are by either transgender females or XY's who don't attempt to avoid feminization like @bridgeburn on the hormonal life thread.

It's not safe to take AA's other than reductase inhibitors without estrogen, however, for longer than a handful of months. My feeling is that the AA's (mainly spironolactone, CPA and bicalutamide) spoof regrowth in some but it doesn't last and it is probably due to some lengthening of anagen more so than due to the awakening of dormant follicles but we don't know. I harp constantly for the people using AA's without estrogen to post pics and none of them ever do.
 

hemingway_the_mercenary

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You have to define what you mean by regrowth because no one ever defines this term or contrasts it with the terms "growth" or "improvement". I think that AA's, including reductase inhibitors can halt hair loss fairly effectively and probably, few debate this. As regrowth agents, they are likely to work best for the very young.

Once follicles go completely dormant, however, I don't think that there is good evidence that AA's cause regrowth or that they awaken dormant follicles. This appears to be what estrogens do, however. This is why virtually all of the impressive "recoveries" are by either transgender females or XY's who don't attempt to avoid feminization like @bridgeburn on the hormonal life thread.

It's not safe to take AA's other than reductase inhibitors without estrogen, however, for longer than a handful of months. My feeling is that the AA's (mainly spironolactone, CPA and bicalutamide) spoof regrowth in some but it doesn't last and it is probably due to some lengthening of anagen more so than due to the awakening of dormant follicles but we don't know. I harp constantly for the people using AA's without estrogen to post pics and none of them ever do.

I’ve seen first hand a bunch of amazing regrowth results from bica only. It inhbiitngs AR activation while at the same time doubling E2 in the body. You don’t need to take estradiol with it for regrowth but it could help slightly. Only slightly thought, bica alone is about 85% as effective as bica and estradiol and wayyy more effective than finasteride and minoxidil combined
 

JaneyElizabeth

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I’ve seen first hand a bunch of amazing regrowth results from bica only. It inhbiitngs AR activation while at the same time doubling E2 in the body. You don’t need to take estradiol with it for regrowth but it could help slightly. Only slightly thought, bica alone is about 85% as effective as bica and estradiol and wayyy more effective than finasteride and minoxidil combined
I respect your opinion but I still will monitor closely for people who post pics. It might be that the AA's cause havoc in other ways and people drop out but the results of people who used AA's only seemed quite negative on the @bridgeburn thread. Many appeared to shed and people were changing AA's frequently to little good effect, it appeared. Beyond this, having used spironolactone, I just can't recommend AA's to anyone even though some tolerate it, hopefully to good effect.

I think that there is something different in terms of how estrogen addresses hair loss although I do note as you say, that AA's might greatly increase circulating estrogens in some. We might all be a massive shed away from failure but I believe that MtF's often successfully maintain their hair gains indefinitely and on here, even the people claiming good results never seem satisfied and few to none ever post pics.

MtF's shouldn't need AA's in most circumstances but they might help some who struggle to meet levels. One thing is that unless people upload their testing results, it is hard for anyone to evaluate at what T and E2 levels improvement and/or regrowth is taking place. Perhaps, hair regrowth can take place with middling levels of T and E2 but it didn't work that great for me until I began blasting my E2 levels into the stratosphere and then I added oral minoxidil. Many, like me, have such thick stacks in their protocols that it can make evaluation of efficacy of any treatment difficult or impossible to third parties although each of us might think that we know what improved what.

Lastly, the sides of AA's seem invariably to be far harder to deal with than any estrogen sides and AA's might be more, not less, feminizing to many in terms of the things that matter to them, like strength and libido. Having not used spironolactone without estrogen, though, I can't comment on it's single shot sides but when added to estrogen, it made me stereotypically weak as a kitten and unable to open the blasted jar of peanut butter or to walk stairs without being completely out of breath. When I dropped spironolactone, even after increasing my estradiol levels many times, my strength and baseline fatigue levels, and libido, seemed to return.
 
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Pls_NW-1

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You have to define what you mean by regrowth because no one ever defines this term or contrasts it with the terms "growth" or "improvement". I think that AA's, including reductase inhibitors can halt hair loss fairly effectively and probably, few debate this. As regrowth agents, they are likely to work best for the very young.

Once follicles go completely dormant, however, I don't think that there is good evidence that AA's cause regrowth or that they awaken dormant follicles. This appears to be what estrogens do, however. This is why virtually all of the impressive "recoveries" are by either transgender females or XY's who don't attempt to avoid feminization like @bridgeburn on the hormonal life thread.

It's not safe to take AA's other than reductase inhibitors without estrogen, however, for longer than a handful of months. My feeling is that the AA's (mainly spironolactone, CPA and bicalutamide) spoof regrowth in some but it doesn't last and it is probably due to some lengthening of anagen more so than due to the awakening of dormant follicles but we don't know. I harp constantly for the people using AA's without estrogen to post pics and none of them ever do.
May I ask, why in your opinion the usage of AA's for the long-run are a no-no without estrogen?

I mean, AA's are rising E2 levels extremly.
 

JaneyElizabeth

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May I ask, why in your opinion the usage of AA's for the long-run are a no-no without estrogen?

I mean, AA's are rising E2 levels extremly.
Lowering T without there being a dominant hormone can cause bone loss. This is more of a problem for post-surgical MtF's who need to supplement but no one advises the use of AA's only in the approved protocols for transgender females, generally known as wpath. Why would one use an AA instead of estrogen to begin with? AA's are more so intended to be facilitators but not the main hormone itself.
 

Pls_NW-1

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Lowering T without there being a dominant hormone can cause bone loss. This is more of a problem for post-surgical MtF's who need to supplement but no one advises the use of AA's only in the approved protocols for transgender females, generally known as wpath. Why would one use an AA instead of estrogen to begin with? AA's are more so intended to be facilitators but not the main hormone itself.
But what about bicalutamide? It does not lower sex hormones, it increases both extremly, but blocks T from binding and the opposite for E. In my eyes, thats the best you can get for preservation and halting hair loss...

Why would you add exogenous E with bica, when your body aromatizes already all the excessive T to E!?
 

el_duterino

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where are those unbelievable trans regrowth pics ?

If the loss is recent - less than a year maybe - you may get the follicles back from the dead, with a lot of luck, but you also need minoxidil for sure. There was a guy in our office, he went from a Nw2 to a Nw4 in one year, then started finasteride and minoxidil did regrow to a solid nw2, I saw it with my own eyes and asked how he did it, very luck guy but he also was young, maybe mid 20's. Age would play a role too.

Still, a hair transplant is the best bet you can design your own hairline, a better than original if you even want
 

JaneyElizabeth

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where are those unbelievable trans regrowth pics ?

If the loss is recent - less than a year maybe - you may get the follicles back from the dead, with a lot of luck, but you also need minoxidil for sure. There was a guy in our office, he went from a Nw2 to a Nw4 in one year, then started finasteride and minoxidil did regrow to a solid nw2, I saw it with my own eyes and asked how he did it, very luck guy but he also was young, maybe mid 20's. Age would play a role too.

Still, a hair transplant is the best bet you can design your own hairline, a better than original if you even want
For one here: https://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/threads/exploring-the-hormonal-route-hair-life.109288/page-638

This gal has better hair than any cis-females that I know.

I am sure that you are familiar with @bridgeburn. I have seen several others, usually younger folks. I have posted my pics for seven years essentially and I don't want to jinx myself but I have seen extensive regrowth and thickening everywhere. Anyway, in my opinion, under HRT, regrowth takes place in an atmosphere of female pattern hair meaning regrowth can be subtle because it occurs everywhere (including thickening and quality improvements) at the same time. It's not like dutasteride or minoxidil growth which seem more so focused in two areas non-defuse folks.

I use tons of estradiol though and so have all of the others with more or less complete recoveries.
 

keepcoolmybabies

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I can't speak to RU, which largely seems anecdotal, but there have been a several people in the past here who have had good regrowth that they documented with pics using spironolactone (and no E).
 

JaneyElizabeth

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I can't speak to RU, which largely seems anecdotal, but there have been a several people in the past here who have had good regrowth that they documented with pics using spironolactone (and no E).
I shall continue to seek out pics then of this related form of HRT. I have no ax to grind except that MtF's spend huge amounts of time griping about all of the big three AA's and I think spironolactone worked too well and made me shed to baldness so I want people to know that the AA's seem more jarring and more side-effect prone than Lady Estrogen, of whom I am both acolyte and protector of her virtue. Estrogen embodies the very Spirit of Our Lady Above and everything changed for me once I knelt in submission to Her.

Really, I am not crazy, just creative. Jehovah made me bald so I jumped that ship, for something kinder and gentler.

Joke: What's a transgender female's favorite AA? It's the one that she hasn't taken yet. Meaning, I see question after question like this: Currently on bica and getting good results, want to try CPA for more breast growth. On here, it is hair.
 
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