Group Buy: ARV-110 PROTAC+ WAY-200070 ERb Agonist

[Left4bald]

Correct, he is a really nice man and very helpful and answered all my questions.

Very nice ! Thank you man !

 

[jjoshh8]

Very nice ! Thank you man !

No worries man, we’re all in this together, let me know how it works out for you.

 

[Satchel]

I am trying to wrap my head around the photos in the OP. I've read about the DP stem cells becoming depleted and miniaturization can't be reversed, fibrosis, arrector pili detachment, etc. At what point can't hair follicles be saved? I understand the photos are during drastic body changes, but holy cow.

 

[royce gracie]

I am trying to wrap my head around the photos in the OP. I've read about the DP stem cells becoming depleted and miniaturization can't be reversed, fibrosis, arrector pili detachment, etc. At what point can't hair follicles be saved? I understand the photos are during drastic body changes, but holy cow.

I don't know if there's any solid science behind the point of no return theory so it might all just be a myth. That said, assuming there really is a point of no return. It could be that the hair follicles are incredibly atrophied to the point that the majority of the time there is no visible hair. Like it grows so thin and shitty and unpigmented that it falls out almost immediately. Giving the appearance of slick bald. It could be that follicles can remain in this state of living death for a surprising amount of time.

All speculation of course, much of baldness remains a mystery.

 

[FromHairy2LarryDavid]

Currently broke af but ill sub here in case u guys find it to be a breakthru treatment.

Now looking at this, as well as GT20029 and Pyrilutamide when it comes to promising future solutions.

 

[Jakejr]

The old methods don’t work too good.. Got to keep trying. If you are lucky enough to stop the deterioration that’s a major accomplishment. Next getting regrowth.
If you start getting regrowth, you realize how far you still have to go. Some areas of regrowth flourish, others stubbornly don’t. My hair hasn’t been as good as it is now for a very long time. BUT it’s the tip of the iceberg. I do most of the protocols in these forums & more. So I am looking forward to trying these two topicals ARV & Way 200070. The logic makes sense.
I’m experimenting with dissolvable microneedle patches, PDO threads to complement basic microneedling. I’ve seen 1/4 inch regrowth of completely new hairs on sides, which for me have receded previously.. But I need much more regrowth. Topical Duasteride works a little, but not great regrowth. Minoxidil I don’t think works at all. RU haven’t seen anything much. So for topicals like those I have to layer them one on top of another to see any thickening. To me they’re not strong enough.

 

[inmyhead]

The old methods don’t work too good.. Got to keep trying. If you are lucky enough to stop the deterioration that’s a major accomplishment. Next getting regrowth.
If you start getting regrowth, you realize how far you still have to go. Some areas of regrowth flourish, others stubbornly don’t. My hair hasn’t been as good as it is now for a very long time. BUT it’s the tip of the iceberg. I do most of the protocols in these forums & more. So I am looking forward to trying these two topicals ARV & Way 200070. The logic makes sense.
I’m experimenting with dissolvable microneedle patches, PDO threads to complement basic microneedling. I’ve seen 1/4 inch regrowth of completely new hairs on sides, which for me have receded previously.. But I need much more regrowth. Topical Duasteride works a little, but not great regrowth. Minoxidil I don’t think works at all. RU haven’t seen anything much. So for topicals like those I have to layer them one on top of another to see any thickening. To me they’re not strong enough.

How do you think contributed most to your regrowth?

 

[Jakejr]

I’m always trying new things.
I think topical Duasteride is better than minoxidil or RU58441. So if you dropped those two, probably good thing, although I still have them. On essential oils or vitamins. I don’t think any of them do much, so wouldn’t focus on them and I’ve tried about 100 of them. Biosil drops is only one I’d keep.
Microneedling is ok, but as I said I do PDO threads, have about 40 in my scalp now & dissolvable microneedle patches w) hyaluronic Acid w) sprinkle of cerium oxide. Seems to be doing something. Moving the needle.
I also do the CBD elongation thing mentioned in a previous thread. It really does grow hair faster.. Sulforaphane too.
May not regrow damaged balding hairs exactly, but the hair you have it works. I had hair to my shoulders at last hair cut.
So those things DO something.
Spirolactone I’ve tried. The tablets are powerful & I wouldn’t recommend them.
I have a topical which I think works a little.
Someone mention estriol.. I have it and think it helps a little.
So that’s about all I think works.
Laser caps.. I have I don’t think it does anything. Massage & blood flow to scalp.
I don’t think any of it works, however I have a massage wand I bought from Target. Toshiba? The original.. I think that’s the best scalp massage there is. I think it helps. The rest forget.
So since I am getting some regrowth. I am starting to focus on different areas of my scalp. If I see an area that has receded or thinned… like a muscle I focus more to balance. I didn’t like my right side compared to left.. so I worked the hell out of that side extra doses of everything & it has started to regrow..
I’m excited to try ARV & WAY because they maybe strong enough to really regrow & give thickness/density.

 

[tonybu]

Thank you @pegasus2 for all your effort. I hadn't visited the forums in a long long time. This is very exciting and i'm in for the next group buy.
I'll keep an eye on this!

 

[tonybu]

If someone by any chance stepped back of the group buy, please let me know! Thanks.

 

[Roeysdomi]

We have a report of acne and increased libido with WAY.

WAY dosent show any sign of good result so far ,and in thoery it should deliver “Trans hrt result”… sadly :/

 

[fellow1]

WAY dosent show any sign of good result so far ,and in thoery it should deliver “Trans hrt result”… sadly :/

When making such claims you need to back it up with something.

 

[Johnson40]

Honestly lads, if you're using SMI+ a Wnt agonist + Minoxidil ( So potentially another wnt agonist ) + A 5ar inhibitor + WAY + Some anti inflammatory stuff like ket shampoo.
What's left for you to regrow? You're targeting every known area of hair loss, unless you're an 80 yo with a NW7 i fail to see how you guys still have much to gain from that.

I'd expect at least a complete regrowth with that cocktail. Unless the calcification and aerector pili preventing regrowth proved to be true.

 

[Jakejr]

Gut bacteria transplant— that’s a newie

 

[Jakejr]

Rob English. perfect hair guy has a big article on this topic. Mentions gut may regulate DHT somehow. Seems he think skipping carbohydrates & eating carnivore diet is good for hair.

 

[Roeysdomi]

They have hope because of the OP demonstrations of regrowth, which would suggest hair follicles are hardly dead-DEAD. But one flaw with the WAY drug is that mtf trans are on full blown estrogen. This causes physical changes in them similar to traits in a female:

More fat distribution
There's been evidence to suggest fat adipose tissue in the scalp induces some hair growth.

Universalis hair growth
View attachment 170136

Androgenetic Alopecia hair growth (less impressive but it's there)
View attachment 170137

Of course this was only after one injection, can't find followup. But once on estrogen you'd have an ongoing change to reduce muscle and increase fat. I read once that in males this subcutaneous layer is depleted by test.

Sex differences in gut bacteria
There's also a difference in male and female gut bacteria, have to assume estrogen changes that as well. Here's an 86 year old after receiving a gut bacteria transplant from a healthy donor
View attachment 170138

Increased density and gray reversal. Say what you will, if any of the drugs you've taken induced such growth you'd be calling it the cure.

So if WAY doesn't work, I hope it does, they'll need to look at what exactly some mtf people go through physiologically. Although I've heard a good share that not all of them have such miraculous regrowth

Way might work but based on the pic that ppl upload it didnt , maybe only 1 person but its stil not clear.

 

[jan_miezda]

Honestly lads, if you're using SMI+ a Wnt agonist + Minoxidil ( So potentially another wnt agonist ) + A 5ar inhibitor + WAY + Some anti inflammatory stuff like ket shampoo.
What's left for you to regrow? You're targeting every known area of hair loss, unless you're an 80 yo with a NW7 i fail to see how you guys still have much to gain from that.

I'd expect at least a complete regrowth with that cocktail. Unless the calcification and aerector pili preventing regrowth proved to be true.

And don’t forget micro needling

 

[hairlossisevil]

Rob English. perfect hair guy has a big article on this topic. Mentions gut may regulate DHT somehow. Seems he think skipping carbohydrates & eating carnivore diet is good for hair.

We'll he's an idiot. Gut microflora does have effect on immune system though. That's why (fecal matter transplant) it was effective for AA and is effective for many other autoimmune disorders. So no, exclusively eating dead animals won't regrow your hair. There is no diet that will prevent stop or reverse Androgenetic Alopecia.

 

[mtx29]

We are organizing a group buy now for a PROTAC androgen receptor degrader and a highly selective estrogen receptor beta agonist. Everyone is welcome to join. The combination of these two compounds should give hair regrowth comparable to traditional mtf regimens but without the sexual side effects. I will start with a brief overview of how each of these compounds work.

ARV-110 is a potent PROTAC. It recruits the AR (androgen receptor) to the E3 ubiquitan ligase promting its degradation so that DHT cannot bind to it. This is temporary because new receptors are generated, but until that happens it eliminates AR activation. This is the first step that's required to treat hair loss. Kintor is currently developing a similar PROTAC to treat Androgenetic Alopecia, and they expect it to have no side effects.

WAY-200070 is a potent and selective ERβ (estrogen receptor beta ) agonist. It binds to ERβ without binding to ERα (estrogen receptor alpha) except at very high doses. This is perfect for us because ERβ is believed to mediate 17β-estradiol-induced hair growth, and does not have any feminizing effects. Things like breast growth and fat distribution etc., are believed to be controlled by ERα. ERβ activation actually silences ERα so it is expected to have the opposite effect and actually reduce or inhibit gyno while still promoting hair growth.

We have seen tremendous hair regrowth, and in some cases complete reversal of hair loss in male to female transgenders who use potent AR antagonists combined with 17β-estradiol. CIS men can't do that of course because the side effects are unacceptable. These two new compounds are available to us now and should allow us to reproduce the hair growth results of such feminizing treatments without the feminization aspect. Here are some of the examples of hair growth from using estrogen and potent AR antagonists, and what type of regrowth is expected from the combination of these two compounds at the proper dose.

View attachment 169266View attachment 169265View attachment 169264View attachment 169263View attachment 169262View attachment 169261

WAY-200070 is already being used by a handful of people on discord and they are reporting new vellus hairs in their temples. The people currently trialing are using concentrations between .1-.5% and applying it once to twice daily. The only side effects noted so far are hives/rash at the site of application in some and better skin generally. Now we are ordering more WAY-200070, and getting ARV-110 to go with it for the perfect combination. ARV-110 is being developed for castration resistant prostate cancer. The oral dose is 280-420mg daily, and almost totally suppresses the AR systemically at that dose. We will use just a small fraction of that dose topically. No one can guarantee what dose is safe and effective for either of these compounds, but most of us on discord are planning to use ARV-110 at .1% once a week. It has a 110 hour half-life so daily dosing is unnecessary. That's just 1mg/ml, or approximately 1/2000th of the oral dose for prostate cancer. Oral bioavailability is estimated at 25%. We estimate that only 5% of the topical dose will be absorbed systemically. That would give a systemic concentration that is 1/10,000th the concentration used in trials to shutdown the AR. This dose should not give any side effects. Personally I plan to use it daily so that I can just mix it together with WAY-200070. I will still use a concentration of .05-.1%, so I will be using more than others, about 7-14mg per week. Even this dose will give a systemic concentration that is around 1/700th that required to silence the AR systemically. One mg or less is impossible for most people to measure, so a stock solution may be required if you're using smaller and infrequent doses.

Here I will post further information on both compounds. ARV-110 has a large molecular weight of 812 Daltons so DMSO or microneedling will be required for topical absorption, but the large weight also helps to limit systemic absorption. At an oral dose of 35mg daily no adverse events were reported.

ARV-110 Phase 1/2 Dose Escalation: Interim Update

View attachment 169272


WAY-200070 is 67-fold more selective for ERβ over ERα. Erteberal has been trialed in humans for schizoprhenia at up to 150mg orally, and no sexual side effects were noted, leaving them to conclude that the doses used do not activate ERα. Since it's about 10x less potent there should be no activation of ERα at 15mg daily doses of WAY-200070. I am currently using this dose.

View attachment 169273

Price:
WAY-200070 is $130/g. Must order in increments of 1g.
ARV-110 is $130/200mg. Must order in increments of 200mg.
Shipping is $55 with a reship policy if your order is not received.

If you would like to participate in this group buy let us know here.

Hi pegasus, I appreciate all your hard work on this and would like to participate in this as I am looking to maintain and regrow my hair! Could I also get an invite to the discord please?

 

[BaldLion]

Hello, thanks again to Pegasus for sharing some precious finding like this with us.
I am very interested to buy those products, can someone invite me in the discord group buy please?
i would be very grateful