Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[Almas]

You are a genius, too but you go back and forth between calling it a miracle and then saying six months, easy peasy. I think you are 19 iirc but the two of you popped up about the same time that I started my thread and you both began carrying this thread. But don't forget to go back and look at perhaps the first 300 pages because it does give a good rendering as to how many others failed and gave up, particularly due to sheds. I also sort of marveled at all of the switching of AA's every couple of months by some. It might not hurt progress but many of them seemed to shed and then give up.

I think this can be done without a shed but that might need to be part of your plan if this works. But it might be that younger guys shed less. Just saying, remember that for me, unlike @bridgeburn who was already completely bald, I had to make it through a massive shed depending upon how one looks at it, of 18 months. I am convinced that like @bridgeburn, consistent titration upwards at some point will win the race but on the other hand, those of us lucky enough to have full restoration might have some genetic aspect that helps us achieve this. I don't know because to me, it seems that restoration is now within reach for at least all MtF's but I am sure some of them feel as though they already tried everything. To the extent that balding scalp is similar to scarring, perhaps in some people the scars are just too entrenched to ever remove fully.

But we should watch carefully to see if others using extreme hormonal measures have success. I think to me, @bridgeburn's path was extreme for guys and MtF's and perhaps we forget that and only remember that he was on "HRT" but had to have been hitting very, very high estradiol levels but dude never tested. I am going in a little while to test today.

You see, life experience has shown me that I am not very lucky. And something inside me tells me something that I don't want to think about. If I am lucky at least once in my life, in such a serious problem as hair loss, it will be a miracle
Deep down, I do not believe that I will emerge victorious ...

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

You see, life experience has shown me that I am not very lucky. And something inside me tells me something that I don't want to think about. If I am lucky at least once in my life, in such a serious problem as hair loss, it will be a miracle
Deep down, I do not believe that I will emerge victorious ...

I gotcha. My fear is f*****g this up myself by using too vigorous massage so I have been trying to stick just to the derma-rolling. Literally like two more centimeters of hair in front and I declare victory. People talk about the temples growing back being impossible but there's growth there too and the rest of the hair is thick enough to obscure that area anyway. Basically my final test is being able to have bangs look good because a person's part can be used somewhat to camouflage thinning hair or to cover temples.

 

[Pls_NW-1]

I gotcha. My fear is f*****g this up myself by using too vigorous massage so I have been trying to stick just to the derma-rolling. Literally like two more centimeters of hair in front and I declare victory. People talk about the temples growing back being impossible but there's growth there too and the rest of the hair is thick enough to obscure that area anyway. Basically my final test is being able to have bangs look good because a person's part can be used somewhat to camouflage thinning hair or to cover temples.

This is literally what I do everday lol. Doing a middle part to cover thinning on temples.
But vertex is nearly gone so it's harder.

 

[Almas]

I gotcha. My fear is f*****g this up myself by using too vigorous massage so I have been trying to stick just to the derma-rolling. Literally like two more centimeters of hair in front and I declare victory. People talk about the temples growing back being impossible but there's growth there too and the rest of the hair is thick enough to obscure that area anyway. Basically my final test is being able to have bangs look good because a person's part can be used somewhat to camouflage thinning hair or to cover temples.

The growth of hair on the temples directly depends on how quickly you started treatment. I started treatment before the follicles stopped producing hair. I have 1cm long hair on my temples that does not grow longer. HRT should make them longer in no time, because it's easier than growing them on a bald patch. I have a high chance of success with HRT, but I hope for Bicalutamide
I was originally a hair fighter who looked at all methods for cis men. And I would not want to give up my idea. Moreover, the effects of HRT on the body will make me uglier as a man, because I really appreciate good shape.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

The growth of hair on the temples directly depends on how quickly you started treatment. I started treatment before the follicles stopped producing hair. I have 1cm long hair on my temples that does not grow longer. HRT should make them longer in no time, because it's easier than growing them on a bald patch. I have a high chance of success with HRT, but I hope for Bicalutamide
I was originally a hair fighter who looked at all methods for cis men. And I would not want to give up my idea. Moreover, the effects of HRT on the body will make me uglier as a man, because I really appreciate good shape.

Well. That's a complicated subject. Women tend to prefer more male-looking faces when they are fertile. The rest of the time, they prefer attractiveness. And yes, they have actually done studies. But no doubt, for many folks estrogen will be a drag on fitness derived from resistance training.

With me, my crown went much before the temples and that has filled in completely. So temporally, my oldest balding area has completely filled in. I might have had a little recession in front but not much. You really couldn't see it in pictures even when I was 50, if they were taken from the front but I did have a fairly wide center part so it took me a few years before I had to switch to a side part as the temples then did begin to falter. You can cover one area pretty well but not three, with two temples and the crown and that's when the hair loss situation actually begins more so to impact looks, I would say. A lot of guys would say that we are not men, sitting around and talking about our hair all day instead of jerking off all day long like a "normal" guy.

 

[Swarleyd]

Spironolactone is a gift, i just need constantly to be hydrated and i wake up at night to pee but the effect on my hair is incredible.

I have curly hair since 17 years old and i’m pretty sure i started balding at this age, now with 1 month of 200mg of spironolactone my hair is shiny, dark and much more straight as when i was 8 years old

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Spironolactone is a gift, i just need constantly to be hydrated and i wake up at night to pee but the effect on my hair is incredible.

I have curly hair since 17 years old and i’m pretty sure i started balding at this age, now with 1 month of 200mg of spironolactone my hair is shiny, dark and much more straight as when i was 8 years old

You don't have that one listed. Please tell us current age and dosage and if you have any pictures as we are trying to provide evidence of effectiveness for naysayers just because we are nice.

 

[Almas]

Well. That's a complicated subject. Women tend to prefer more male-looking faces when they are fertile. The rest of the time, they prefer attractiveness. And yes, they have actually done studies. But no doubt, for many folks estrogen will be a drag on fitness derived from resistance training.

With me, my crown went much before the temples and that has filled in completely. So temporally, my oldest balding area has completely filled in. I might have had a little recession in front but not much. You really couldn't see it in pictures even when I was 50, if they were taken from the front but I did have a fairly wide center part so it took me a few years before I had to switch to a side part as the temples then did begin to falter. You can cover one area pretty well but not three, with two temples and the crown and that's when the hair loss situation actually begins more so to impact looks, I would say. A lot of guys would say that we are not men, sitting around and talking about our hair all day instead of jerking off all day long like a "normal" guy.

Many girls love androgynous guys. Since my skin and face are severely disfigured by androgens and I almost became like an orc because of them, I think I will like the effect of estrogen on my face to some extent. But I look at Noah and I understand that this is overkill: his face has not only become more androgynous, he has become like a girl. This is too much feminization
On the account of the body: I would like to look manly, but apart from being short, I have narrow shoulders. Because of this, I've always wanted to gain muscle mass so as not to look like a stick. In general, for the sake of hair, I am ready to give up this desire. However, estrogen will not only prevent me from gaining mass, it will increase my body fat (I already have it, I’m not embossed) and I will become soft, as if filled with water. My hands will become plump, I will look soft. It sucks. I don't want to be skinnyfat

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Here is more from Reddit related to my acquaintance having used levels of estradiol similar to mine for at least six years. I have no axe to grind and of course, no one is to emulate me. We are all free agents in charge of our own destinies. I note also that on this thread people understand the idea that some times taking on more risk, even of breast growth, results often in far better results than playing things safer and waiting seven years like I did before:

https://www.reddit.com/r/AskMtFHRT/comments/mxh13b/_/gvvw0fh

1
Posted by
u/Brady761250

2 days ago

my bloodwork - please comment not happy with progress​

nsfw

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NaomiYves

2 days ago · edited 2 days ago

Others will know more than me, and to start your estradiol and SHBG are way too high. There’s some debate about what’s the highest level estradiol can be beneficial at. I’ve seen 200, 500, and 700 talked about. SHBG over 125 is too high. Your body is trying to cope with the excess hormones you’re injecting and that may be messing up your progress.
Edit: I’m assuming you had your blood work done at trough, right before your next injection. Otherwise the information is meaningless and you should have it redone.

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level 2
JaneyElizabeth

14 hours ago

My vote is for over 700 pg/ml. Unless somebody plumbs the heights, how will we ever learn?

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level 3
NaomiYves

13 hours ago

See the link in my second comment about the woman who was regularly over 1000 and ended up in the ER with three blood clots in her calf...

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level 4
JaneyElizabeth

16 minutes ago

I thought that it was even more than that. But yes, those stories give me pause and I wonder whether the ingestion method made a difference.
You pays your money and you takes your chances as they say. My hair has almost completely been restored so I am going to start titrating downward. The other thing is that oral minoxidil is a game changer and it might work as well as HRT does to regrow hair. I am testing today so it will be interesting because I ran out of patches and Estrogel and all I have left are spironolactone, premarin, provera, progesterone and dutasteride which probably would require at least 4 mg of Premarin to normally get me to say, 200pg/ml but I am not sure how quickly a person drifts downward.
I had to chance it because nothing else was working after four years of DIY and then two-years of low dose premarin. I was unable to tolerate spironolactone at 200 mg although I gave it a year. spironolactone induced a massive shed to baldness and before I at least had enough to comb without it looking fradulent. Sheds are good though believe it or not. I went to two patches and that seemed to finally kick-start my hair restoration but I also have used extreme amounts of Estrogel the past year.
I had been fighting baldness for 35 years and now I have almost a completely full head of hair and it has extended well below my ears. Before it would just stop growing and look mullety like a hobo if I wore it long.
And yes, stay safe. I do have a provider and a thought-out plan based upon pregnancy lasting ten months so I assume those levels of estrogen and I am only at first trimester, are tolerable for a term of pregnancy without DVT. Before this past year, I never came close to hitting levels and had fantastic breast growth so I have lucked into a couple of things and I just pass it on as knowledge. Some doctors will work with folks to maybe hit 300 pg/ml and so I have requested that of my provider. I can't afford Estrogel anymore because it isn't covered. This was my one year push more or less to see restoration was possible or was I spinning my wheels.
I will say that I came on here and asked advice about testing at ~2,600 and I probably got a few answers and the consensus seemed to be that it would be relatively innocuous to hit such high sustained targets so I do continue to question whether the needles had a deleterious effect on our poor friend who posts and helps others so frequently as a volunteer. We can all get in over our heads and especially us Reddit gals because there is such a strong DIY influence on here and a concomitant feeling of control. Most MtF's probably just take their meds without tinkering. But on here, even the folks with doctors are always conceiving of potential ways to make feminization more pervasive, like quitting an AA after two month solely based upon perceived lack of results.
Anyone else who thinks that they have had deleterious outcomes or sides because of using too much estradiol, please provide your experiences because we are all only one data point. I posted all of this including my own posts pursuant thereto on my own hormonal hair loss threat and the other main one on hairlesstalk as soon as you sent me the link. I try to adhere to the science as closely as the empirical data lets us whether it is in conflict with any personal theory or not. Plus, 2,600pg/ml is obviously overkill but I don't think that 700 pg/ml would be but I frankly don't know and I am not sure anyone does. I firmly continue to believe that post-breast growth levels of estradiol are much too low but maybe there is something else hindering so many MtF's from hair restoration that is genetic.
Janey

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Here is the post from the Dr. Wil Powers thread on Reddit and I encourage everyone to read it. I suppose that @bridgeburn and I have been mainly the two using extreme measures perhaps. I continue to feel the best that I have ever felt in my life and with elation over my hair results but this isn't worth dying for for the rest of you:

https://www.reddit.com/r/DrWillPowers/comments/mxkb31

This is the person's entry with name removed:

DVT (deep vein thrombosis) at 16 mg IM EV every 5 days for several years​

For several years (i.e. since 2014), I have been injecting 16 mg IM EV every 5 days in my glutes. I took a 9 month break during 2018, using gel during that time. Two weeks ago, after experiencing excruciating pain in my left calf with no swelling or redness associated (interestingly, I inject mostly in my left glute), I went to the emergency and they found at least 3 blood clots in my left calf. The pain continued for another 10 days or so, things are slowly getting better. I am now taking a blood thinner for the next three months. In my case, I attribute the clots to estrogen, there is no doubt in my mind. I plan to resume hormones shortly and apply gel.
I did not get vaccinated for COVID-19, never got COVID-19, I do not smoke, I do not have any family history of blood clots, I was not immobilized, I am slightly overweight, I'm healthy otherwise, I did not take any other supplements, medications or hormones. I am middle-aged. Never had cancer, nor any injury.
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[Almas]

My hair has almost completely been restored so I am going to start titrating downward

Jump on Bicalutamide with us lol.

 

[Almas]

Thrombosis is one of the reasons why I want to use HRT only temporarily. For this to happen, Bicalutamide must become a reliable support to maintain the results so that I can quit estradiol.

 

[Pls_NW-1]

Thrombosis is one of the reasons why I want to use HRT only temporarily. For this to happen, Bicalutamide must become a reliable support to maintain the results so that I can quit estradiol.

Tho you wont be able to reverse feminization.

 

[Almas]

In general, the idea of switching to a female hormonal level for the sake of hair is crazy. I really don't want to resort to this, but ... hair = life

 

[Almas]

Tho you wont be able to reverse feminization.

At the very least, the ability to build muscle, physical strength will return, the psychological effects of estradiol will go away, an erection is already a lot, isn't it?

 

[Almas]

My heart stopped when I saw Noah on HRT. I wouldn't give up on a relationship with him lol

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Jump on Bicalutamide with us lol.

I am trying to prove that one can do this without an AA. I almost bit on bica last fall but then changed my opinion about the safety of oral minoxidil in general and once I found a way to use it that didn't require a prescription, I was all on board. At first, AntyDHTor had me freaked with the dual hairlines but oral min is reversible so that assuaged me.

I honestly think that I have had to max out on hair growth since October when I started oral min. I had one guy telling me to change my diet to grow more hair and I was like, any more hair and I will be a sheep. But, knock on wood and praise be to Goddess, I don't see any path to failure any longer. Even if I shed, I have already proven the follicles are awake and viable. My opinion of HRT hair is that you are back to the beginning of incipient hair loss if you desist like Noah. So not only does he have duta to help, he also regained a couple of years of hair loss time, assuming hair loss after stopping hormones is similar to the first go around with male pattern baldness.

 

[Almas]

I am trying to prove that one can do this without an AA. I almost bit on bica last fall but then changed my opinion about the safety of oral minoxidil in general and once I found a way to use it that didn't require a prescription, I was all on board. At first, AntyDHTor had me freaked with the dual hairlines but oral min is reversible so that assuaged me.

I honestly think that I have had to max out on hair growth since October when I started oral min. I had one guy telling me to change my diet to grow more hair and I was like, any more hair and I will be a sheep. But, knock on wood and praise be to Goddess, I don't see any path to failure any longer. Even if I shed, I have already proven the follicles are awake and viable. My opinion of HRT hair is that you are back to the beginning of incipient hair loss if you desist like Noah. So not only does he have duta to help, he also regained a couple of years of hair loss time, assuming hair loss after stopping hormones is similar to the first go around with male pattern baldness.

Those responding to Bicalutamide have good prospects. They can grow on HRT and maintain on Bicalutamide as if they have never had baldness. Have perfect hair. This is why I dream of answering Bicalutamide

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Deep vein thrombosis in a transgender woman

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

In general, the idea of switching to a female hormonal level for the sake of hair is crazy. I really don't want to resort to this, but ... hair = life

Thank the non-binary movement. I know you are in a benighted place but we are generally gaining acceptance and a person can be non-binary and only dress as a man. People are free to use my line as well if families or friends ask:

HRT? I am only in it for the hair....