Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

Pls_NW-1

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In your case, Bicalutaide is propably best thing(of all the bad ones) you can take. Maybe try 25mg of bica and start low dosage oral minoxidil. Bicalutamide has high rates of gyno but is decent if you want to maintain sexual function. It wont't change your fat distribution from what i have seen. It would likely make you look younger so thats a plus for you.
Yeah, same feeling! Gotta start slowly and steady, not to overrun my liver. Cant wait starting gardening my head lol.
 

nicoandgello

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Good luck dude. I would love to start bica too, it should work great, but i have never seen an actual results. The drug is pretty underground, and most users are trans girls that start at 15 and have no hair loss.
 

Murkey Thumb

Experienced Member
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Hey guys,

I really want to be serious and proactive against my hair loss, well, genes.

I noticed my hair getting thinner and thinner over the last years, but since a year or so, it gets pretty bad. And I started to shed a lot of hair since last year september and I got a pretty annoying itch and as well a mild seb. dermatitis.

Dont know what to do, I kept researching for a long time.

Also, I'm 17 1/2.

I started noticing thinning when I got into puberty.

Now the real part...
I always thought that finasteride is THE "CURE" when you catch it early bla bla ... the past time.

But in fact, it just slows down your thinning and halts the loss on mild male pattern baldness.

So whats the deal with male pattern baldness!?
It's ANDROGENetic Alopecia lol.

So you gotta stop androgens working, especially on the scalp. And now the real problem -> If you do that, you literally start transitioning. But I still want to stay "normal" and have a nice life, like all other people in my age. Suffering of this in a young age is just horrible.

To add something more: I noticed that my skin tissue all over my body is just pretty androgen sensitive: got a ton of body hair aka. monkey, pimples all over my body, epsecially forehead, back and shoulders, and overproduction of sebum, literally overproduction. My hair is feeling like it got toss in oil after 10hrs/ish of shower or a day and then it looks like I'm severly balding.

Side note: my family history is all about baldness lol. I'm actually doomed being bald. I knew I will be bald when I'm adult, but I never expected it starting within puberty.

My father started to lose hair in his late teens, starting from the crown/top/vertex, like I do now.

He was a NW7 by the age of 25.
And If I would shave my head, I feel like the horseshoe pattern would be clearly visible.

Also something to note: I'm all about hair styles and appearence, so I can't deal with being bald EVER.

Now...

What I want to do:

I already visited 4 derms, 2 family doctors, next week the andrology and soon the endocrinology, as the family doctor noticed my DHEA being TOOO high, like over the normal range.

Also, my E2 is reaching the peak zone of the normal range and my testosterone level the opposite, weird.

And oh yeah, its visible that I have a bit of a higher E2 (lol).

One doctor will already start to prescribe me Finasteride in April. But this won't be enough for me, I already know this, as I have aggressive male pattern baldness genes/hair loss.

So I came to the thought of adding bicalutamide 50mg + maybe spironolactone 100mg. And I really want to get regrowth. I want to avoid topicals, because it's just such a hassle for me. Also, I am okay with the side effects of being temporarily impotent, developing more gyno, and having a much younger look.

I never will have kids (dont want to spread my shitty genes), will get anyways gyno surgery (better than NW7 hair transplant) and I love the youthful look, I hate beards and the TOO masculine look. Cant believe that asian culture isn't still that much widespread.

My question is; can I experience regrowth/thickening or even just stopping further hair loss with that treatment and if I can use it as a long term solution (any experiences somebody!?). I am not transgender btw lol, I am asexual if somebody wants to know that.

Pic's: (the ones, were my hair looks kinda "wet" is made one day after shower lol)

I am really not in the mood to hear someone saying that I'm not balding, family members and friends are worrying for me... Pointing it out.

And no, I don't want to start taking E or actual HRT, that would be overkill for me, and not morally.

Thanks for reading and I would appreciate any reply, no, I want a reply, please!
I would start with Dutasteride not Finasteride and use peptides and derma rolling as it's going to be better for diffuse hair.
 

Nimos0651

Member
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33
Hey guys,

I really want to be serious and proactive against my hair loss, well, genes.

I noticed my hair getting thinner and thinner over the last years, but since a year or so, it gets pretty bad. And I started to shed a lot of hair since last year september and I got a pretty annoying itch and as well a mild seb. dermatitis.

Dont know what to do, I kept researching for a long time.

Also, I'm 17 1/2.

I started noticing thinning when I got into puberty.

Now the real part...
I always thought that finasteride is THE "CURE" when you catch it early bla bla ... the past time.

But in fact, it just slows down your thinning and halts the loss on mild male pattern baldness.

So whats the deal with male pattern baldness!?
It's ANDROGENetic Alopecia lol.

So you gotta stop androgens working, especially on the scalp. And now the real problem -> If you do that, you literally start transitioning. But I still want to stay "normal" and have a nice life, like all other people in my age. Suffering of this in a young age is just horrible.

To add something more: I noticed that my skin tissue all over my body is just pretty androgen sensitive: got a ton of body hair aka. monkey, pimples all over my body, epsecially forehead, back and shoulders, and overproduction of sebum, literally overproduction. My hair is feeling like it got toss in oil after 10hrs/ish of shower or a day and then it looks like I'm severly balding.

Side note: my family history is all about baldness lol. I'm actually doomed being bald. I knew I will be bald when I'm adult, but I never expected it starting within puberty.

My father started to lose hair in his late teens, starting from the crown/top/vertex, like I do now.

He was a NW7 by the age of 25.
And If I would shave my head, I feel like the horseshoe pattern would be clearly visible.

Also something to note: I'm all about hair styles and appearence, so I can't deal with being bald EVER.

Now...

What I want to do:

I already visited 4 derms, 2 family doctors, next week the andrology and soon the endocrinology, as the family doctor noticed my DHEA being TOOO high, like over the normal range.

Also, my E2 is reaching the peak zone of the normal range and my testosterone level the opposite, weird.

And oh yeah, its visible that I have a bit of a higher E2 (lol).

One doctor will already start to prescribe me Finasteride in April. But this won't be enough for me, I already know this, as I have aggressive male pattern baldness genes/hair loss.

So I came to the thought of adding bicalutamide 50mg + maybe spironolactone 100mg. And I really want to get regrowth. I want to avoid topicals, because it's just such a hassle for me. Also, I am okay with the side effects of being temporarily impotent, developing more gyno, and having a much younger look.

I never will have kids (dont want to spread my shitty genes), will get anyways gyno surgery (better than NW7 hair transplant) and I love the youthful look, I hate beards and the TOO masculine look. Cant believe that asian culture isn't still that much widespread.

My question is; can I experience regrowth/thickening or even just stopping further hair loss with that treatment and if I can use it as a long term solution (any experiences somebody!?). I am not transgender btw lol, I am asexual if somebody wants to know that.

Pic's: (the ones, were my hair looks kinda "wet" is made one day after shower lol)

I am really not in the mood to hear someone saying that I'm not balding, family members and friends are worrying for me... Pointing it out.

And no, I don't want to start taking E or actual HRT, that would be overkill for me, and not morally.

Thanks for reading and I would appreciate any reply, no, I want a reply, please!
I just started a regimen of 50mg spironolactone 1mg Estradiol and .75mg estrogel. This is a mild regimen in the sense it wont cause very much if any feminization. I will slowly taper up the doses until I get side effects I do not want. 50mg bicalutamide with 1-2mg E should get you some re-growth but like any regimen it will take time.
 

Nimos0651

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Well, it won't get you fully feminized, but it certainly will demasculinise you.
Depends on the dosage and the individual. I have seen cases of individuals taking 200mg of spironolactone and having no feminization. 1mg E with topical estrogel also shouldnt do it too much but the results wont be as good as taking 4-6mgs
 

JaneyElizabeth

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I don't think that this will work without estrogen and I don't think that there are ways of doing this effectively without feminization. Some times there are reasons why a thing isn't done and it is because it just doesn't work. We have known since the chemical identification of estrogens about 90 years ago that supplementing estrogen was effective for hair loss. Why didn't it become a thing, then? Because estrogen supplementation is feminizing for XY's.

I continue to seek pictorial evidence that using AA's without estrogen supplementation will result in any sort of cosmetically significant hair regrowth or improvement and I have seen little or none. AA's can halt hair loss; they don't seem to regrow hair or improve it's quality. If an XY individual wants to see hair recovery, then feminization, usually meaning breast growth, is part of it. For most XY's, adult breast growth tends to be minimal but there are no guarantees. I know of only a handful of people who have provided substantial pictorial evidence that copious use of HRT medications can fully restore XY hairlines and virtually all of them have presented with substantial feminization, including facial feminization, breast growth, gyno, substantial fat re-distribution and loss of body hair below the neck. Some even experience loss of virtually all beard growth.

The founder of this thread had amazing hair regrowth and restoration. Virtually everyone agrees that this person, @bridgeburn vastly improved his physical appearance but virtually everyone also agrees that @bridgeburn became thoroughly feminized in terms of appearance. He continued to go by male pronouns but experienced substantial breast growth, facial feminization and a loss of virtually all beard growth while also appearing far younger.

There are ways to do this and still be able to produce children and engage in procreative activities but they require careful planning and disclosure to potential partners. Many females who might be attracted to such "improved" XY's, might not choose them for mating purposes, however.

My hair and feminization results continue and I am thrilled with them but I struggle now to present as male. That's simply a cost of doing this. I did not experience any diminution in beard growth but my belief is that either beard growth removal or diminution is a part of the hair improvement process that might not be avoidable. Some people shrink in stature from the effects of female hormones, from one to three inches! I started my hair loss journey with HRT not being sure whether it would be substantially feminizing or not. It is and it was only after I vastly increased my estrogen supplementation and added oral minoxidil that I began to see my way to full recovery, which continues, in a thrilling fashion. I add pictures every few weeks as indicative of this.

I try not to be cagey about any of this. People message me and compliment me on both my feminization and my hair results but this has turned into all but a full time job for me and it will for most, at least until reaching some sort of maintenance level. I expect to max out on my hair improvement, perhaps in six more months or a year and this includes count, coverage, hair quality and anagen. My hair length continues to grow without diminution in quality but this is not an easy road to hoe. I had an embarrassing shed to baldness about 18 months ago, which appears to have been completely beneficial and benevolent but how many XY's are prepared to go from mere thinning to complete baldness, if that is part of the journey? Very few and most XY's seem to drop out as soon as they see signs of shedding.

I note that @bridgeburn was already essentially horse-shoe bald (unlike me) when he started his HRT journey, so shedding was really not an issue for him. In a certain sense, people already bald beyond the pale and MtF's have an enormous advantage here since stopping HRT to hopefully stop a shed is not really an option.

For me, a lot of this is about the science and about regaining control over my looks and feelings and I have experimented and continue to, freely, hopefully to improve knowledge and to help others and anyone may PM me for help related to any aspect of this but it isn't easy, lamentably. Because I view this thread as being a success thread, I largely now post here:

 
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deathdiss

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What a crock of sh*t, I'm dramatically lowering my DHT levels and using estriol and evening primrose oil and taking desmopressin as it increases estrogen and improves body hydration and I don't even look close to female.

If anything my skin just looks better, my girlfriend recently commented on how much nicer my skin looks and that I'm far less prone to irritation and acne. I still have big f*****g arms and a muscular chest and my face is still angular, it just now looks very hydrated and even in complexion.

You don't have to transition in order to get the effective results of estrogen, the honest truth is, most people you see who are steady into their 30s who have a full head of hair and nice skin are men with higher estrogen levels by default, that's the dirty secret most people won't tell you. Most men either have higher estrogen or they're hormonally insensitive and thus look more soft and estrogenic.

All you are doing exogenously is manually tweaking either the process of aromatase or directly adding the hormone you're missing, you're being grossly hyperbolic by saying using any estrogen at all is transitioning. Most men have no f*****g clue as to how much estrogen is in their system at any time, least of which men who have zero problems with patterned hair loss, because why would you? But I can absolutely f*****g guarantee you that it's higher in men who don't have androgen insensitivity who also have a full head of hair.

There are some freaks of nature out there who can have insane test levels and have a full head of hair, but that is not the standard. Most men who have good skin and thick hair either have comparably higher estrogen levels or are so androgen insensitive that they are functionally speaking more estrogenic.

All young teenaged and 20 something boys as the stereotype goes have "higher testosterone" but everything about their complexions is completely and utterly indicative of higher estrogen as well. You don't get soft skin and features without it. It has nothing to do with merely "being young" outside of the fact that young teenaged boys and 20 something men aromatise more test into E.

I looked extremely young for my age all of my years and over time it seems like my ability to aromatise test into estrogen has suddenly declined, for what reason I don't know, but it is now improving with certain supplements and medications, and mysteriously that really nice youthful complexion has just come roaring back and I'm 40 years old.

I still look athletic, but I do look a -lot- younger. now.

love this...i also use estriol and its made my skin extremely smooth and shiny.
 

Gergely

Experienced Member
My Regimen
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481
I don't think that this will work without estrogen and I don't think that there are ways of doing this effectively without feminization. Some times there are reasons why a thing isn't done and it is because it just doesn't work. We have known since the chemical identification of estrogens about 90 years ago that supplementing estrogen was effective for hair loss. Why didn't it become a thing, then? Because estrogen supplementation is feminizing for XY's.

I continue to seek pictorial evidence that using AA's without estrogen supplementation will result in any sort of cosmetically significant hair regrowth or improvement and I have seen little or none. AA's can halt hair loss; they don't seem to regrow hair or improve it's quality. If an XY individual wants to see hair recovery, then feminization, usually meaning breast growth, is part of it. For most XY's, adult breast growth tends to be minimal but there are no guarantees. I know of only a handful of people who have provided substantial pictorial evidence that copious use of HRT medications can fully restore XY hairlines and virtually all of them have presented with substantial feminization, including facial feminization, breast growth, gyno, substantial fat re-distribution and loss of body hair below the neck. Some even experience loss of virtually all beard growth.

The founder of this thread had amazing hair regrowth and restoration. Virtually everyone agrees that this person, @bridgeburn vastly improved his physical appearance but virtually everyone also agrees that @bridgeburn became thoroughly feminized in terms of appearance. He continued to go by male pronouns but experienced substantial breast growth, facial feminization and a loss of virtually all beard growth while also appearing far younger.

There are ways to do this and still be able to produce children and engage in procreative activities but they require careful planning and disclosure to potential partners. Many females who might be attracted to such "improved" XY's, might not choose them for mating purposes, however.

My hair and feminization results continue and I am thrilled with them but I struggle now to present as male. That's simply a cost of doing this. I did not experience any diminution in beard growth but my belief is that either beard growth removal or diminution is a part of the hair improvement process that might not be avoidable. Some people shrink in stature from the effects of female hormones, from one to three inches! I started my hair loss journey with HRT not being sure whether it would be substantially feminizing or not. It is and it was only after I vastly increased my estrogen supplementation and added oral minoxidil that I began to see my way to full recovery, which continues, in a thrilling fashion. I add pictures every few weeks as indicative of this.

I try not to be cagey about any of this. People message me and compliment me on both my feminization and my hair results but this has turned into all but a full time job for me and it will for most, at least until reaching some sort of maintenance level. I expect to max out on my hair improvement, perhaps in six more months or a year and this includes count, coverage, hair quality and anagen. My hair length continues to grow without diminution in quality but this is not an easy road to hoe. I had an embarrassing shed to baldness about 18 months ago, which appears to have been completely beneficial and benevolent but how many XY's are prepared to go from mere thinning to complete baldness, if that is part of the journey? Very few and most XY's seem to drop out as soon as they see signs of shedding.

I note that @bridgeburn was already essentially horse-shoe bald (unlike me) when he started his HRT journey, so shedding was really not an issue for him. In a certain sense, people already bald beyond the pale and MtF's have an enormous advantage here since stopping HRT to hopefully stop a shed is not really an option.

For me, a lot of this is about the science and about regaining control over my looks and feelings and I have experimented and continue to, freely, hopefully to improve knowledge and to help others and anyone may PM me for help related to any aspect of this but it isn't easy, lamentably. Because I view this thread as being a success thread, I largely now post here:

I can't do anything but push through the sheds i guess, every time i touch my head there's like 5-6 hairs falling out. 280 and up every 12 hours, if i go bald i might end my self. I was reading some mtf shedding experiences and they were worried about losing 5-10 hairs a day, f*****g ridiculous.
 

JaneyElizabeth

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I can't do anything but push through the sheds i guess, every time i touch my head there's like 5-6 hairs falling out. 280 and up every 12 hours, if i go bald i might end my self. I was reading some mtf shedding experiences and they were worried about losing 5-10 hairs a day, f*****g ridiculous.
I expect you to stabilize here because I am unaware of people your age on HRT having to battle sheds permanently. I think you already agree that any other solutions would be worse in terms of precipitating male pattern baldness and not just sheds.

My hope and personal feeling is that the HRT process actually heals the follicles which should provide protective effect going forward for people who have re-set the axis and hopefully even for people like Noah who try to go off meds save say dutasteride.
 

Gergely

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I expect you to stabilize here because I am unaware of people your age on HRT having to battle sheds permanently. I think you already agree that any other solutions would be worse in terms of precipitating male pattern baldness and not just sheds.

My hope and personal feeling is that the HRT process actually heals the follicles which should provide protective effect going forward for people who have re-set the axis and hopefully even for people like Noah who try to go off meds save say dutasteride.
I have seen worrying cases, where the situation didn't improve at all, in fact it got worse. This is a picture of someone 4.5 years into hrt
4,5hair.png
 

JaneyElizabeth

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I have seen worrying cases, where the situation didn't improve at all, in fact it got worse. This is a picture of someone 4.5 years into hrtView attachment 156060
That looks better than 95 percent of the hairlines on here although it might be too thin in a female context.

I do know that DHT can be difficult to defeat, even for those who are castrated and I am aware that many transgender females on HRT continue to struggle with hair issues but for some reason, hair just isn't a big issue on MtF fora. I don't really get it and that's why I started hanging out here since 95% of the info on reddit for MtF's revolves around things having nothing to do with hair and half of the posts are from people seeking more breast growth.

My thought continues to be that many MtF's are not reaching adult female target levels and hence their hair is not completely feminizing but endocrine issues are filthy in terms of all of the different holes that we have to plug since after fixing one of them, two more might pop up. Your hair should be set but of course be vigilant. I would be sick as well if I all of a sudden had another shed to baldness but at least I know I have a decent wig and that does make it easier.
 

JaneyElizabeth

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I have posted the two main protocols used by
Hello, all.
I just signed up to the forum, but I've been following this thread for a few months now.

I am about a year older than Bridgeburn, but my miniaturization started in early 2020, I believe. So, I think I am at the beginning of losing my hair, rather than the advanced stage at which he started. I think very few of my hair follicles, if any, are close to permanently gone and my hairline is still more or less intact at this stage, but I can see it is starting to weaken. I feel like there is a lot of hope for me if I just figure out the right treatment quickly enough.

I'll start by saying that I do not mind things like facial feminization or even gyno. One of the primary reasons I started growing my hair out was because I wanted to be androgynous. It is not enough for me to maintain coverage, I want my hair to grow, at least have the miniaturized hairs eventually grow to shoulder length like so much of my hair had before this all started, or at the very least have those hairs look like they belong on the same head of hair with the unaffected strands. I recently ordered 1 mg Finasteride from Keeps, I'll be taking that to, hopefully, pause miniaturization and maintain current density while I figure everything out.

From what I can gather, Bridgeburn used an AA, CPA. But from more recent posts, it would seem that an antiandrogen might not be necessary(?) Other than that, he used topical oestrogel, as well as estrofem sublingually. I recall that he also used Dutasteride and oral minoxidil. From what I gather from the more recent pages on this thread, his complete regimen might not be necessary(?)

My hair was already quite long when this started, so I am not starting from nothing and I still have pretty full coverage including vellus hairs. What do you guys think would be the best approach for me at this stage?

So tell us who thou art, amazing hair person while we all drool at your hair, which is proper, while ignoring that you are objectively very attractive as well. Hopefully, this is an estradiol tale!
 

keepcoolmybabies

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I have posted the two main protocols used by



So tell us who thou art, amazing hair person while we all drool at your hair, which is proper, while ignoring that you are objectively very attractive as well. Hopefully, this is an estradiol tale!
It is, I used to post in this thread a ton when I first started down this route.
 

keepcoolmybabies

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My current regimen tho is 50mg bica a day, estradiol injections every 5 days, topical minoxidil on temples, and alternating days between finasteride and dutasteride... so pretty heavy regimen
 

JaneyElizabeth

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It is, I used to post in this thread a ton when I first started down this route.
I am a strange one in that I have read all of this copious thread but I only participated recently but I do remember your screen handle. Can you give us an update on your progress and journey? You hair is for many of us, the dream.

I started a separate thread here, that is geared to hopefully all XY's where trans folks are welcome regardless and which promotes ongoing pic taking here:

 

JaneyElizabeth

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My current regimen tho is 50mg bica a day, estradiol injections every 5 days, topical minoxidil on temples, and alternating days between finasteride and dutasteride... so pretty heavy regimen
Have you used any different forms of estrogen or other HRT meds? I don't want to do the third degree on you, lol but long-term XY's on HRT have so much valuable anecdotal information especially since we can see clearly that things have worked for them. I have tried to provide information to readers who are not trans in terms of how to avoid breast growth and some of those things but I have largely failed myself, lol, in those terms so my credibility related to breast growth is statistical. That is often the number one question by XY's. Can I do this and avoid visible breast growth?
 
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