Cassiopeia Release Full Year Results To 2018 Including Update On Breezula

[mymlon]

Thanks very much, it does seem like we should probably include all of these. Do you know what the correct ratios are between the Pg / ethanol / transcutol / polysorbate 80 / ascorbyl palminate ?

Check out "Example 4" in this patent:
https://patents.google.com/patent/EP3108879A1

Grams per 100g:
Cortexolone-17α-propionate 5.00
Diethylene glycol monoethyl ether 31.50
Alcohol (Ethanol) 31.50
Ascorbyl palmitate 0.50
Polysorbate 80 0.10
Propylene glycol 31.40

Also, note that these are mass ratios. Volumetric ratios will be slightly different because of different densities:
Ethanol 95% - 0.816 g/cm³
Diethylene glycol monoethyl ether (transcutol) 0.99 g/cm³
Propylene glycol 1.04 g/cm³


For this reason volumetric ratios will be closer to 4/3/3 (eth/pg/transcutol). I don't know if it matters though.

 

[Phatalis]

Check out "Example 4" in this patent:
https://patents.google.com/patent/EP3108879A1

Grams per 100g:
Cortexolone-17α-propionate 5.00
Diethylene glycol monoethyl ether 31.50
Alcohol (Ethanol) 31.50
Ascorbyl palmitate 0.50
Polysorbate 80 0.10
Propylene glycol 31.40

Also, note that these are mass ratios. Volumetric ratios will be slightly different because of different densities:
Ethanol 95% - 0.816 g/cm³
Diethylene glycol monoethyl ether (transcutol) 0.99 g/cm³
Propylene glycol 1.04 g/cm³


For this reason volumetric ratios will be closer to 4/3/3 (eth/pg/transcutol). I don't know if it matters though.

Nice dude!! Good to see posts of substance.

I was messing about trying to figure out how to make this vehicle myself.

Also - if you believe in this company enough now would be a potential good time to buy stock since it's so low.

 

[Ollie]

@Desmond_84 thanks for pitching in. I trialed CB myself a year ago with the original of their phase I trials - vehicle of Pg:Eth:transcutol, but like their first trial results I got very little result.

What makes you think your suggested vehicle will equate to that of phase 2 results ? As you’ve brought it up I’m consider using the Fagron product or making a liposomal solution for CB .

Do we need a license to buy the fargon solutions ?

 

[tomJ]

@Desmond_84 thanks for pitching in. I trialed CB myself a year ago with the original of their phase I trials - vehicle of Pg:Eth:transcutol, but like their first trial results I got very little result.

What makes you think your suggested vehicle will equate to that of phase 2 results ? As you’ve brought it up I’m consider using the Fagron product or making a liposomal solution for CB .

Do we need a license to buy the fargon solutions ?

Good questions ollie...what makes phase 2 much better then phase 1?

 

[Ollie]

Good questions ollie...what makes phase 2 much better then phase 1?

Well I believe concentrations were more or less the same . So it really must be all down to the vehicle.

I’m not clued up on patent info but it might be the case once they publically filed full phase 2 results, we’ll be able to see the vehicle.

They might actually be using liposomes/ ethosomes for their new vehicle . Although at 7.5% I doubt it .

 

[tomJ]

Any idea when they will show results?

 

[Karl Hungus]

@Desmond_84 thanks for pitching in. I trialed CB myself a year ago with the original of their phase I trials - vehicle of Pg:Eth:transcutol, but like their first trial results I got very little result.

What makes you think your suggested vehicle will equate to that of phase 2 results ? As you’ve brought it up I’m consider using the Fagron product or making a liposomal solution for CB .

Do we need a license to buy the fargon solutions ?

When you trialed the CB...what % were you using?

 

[Ollie]

the second study confirmed the results form the first one. in the first one they did 5% and had a hair count of 12 and in the second study the 5% group also had a hair count of 12. so it's not the vehicle. even the 2.5% performed better than 5 for some reason.

I think you're right and i was thinking of the results they got when they used iontophoresis. Still getting finasteride equivelant results at 6 months vs 1 year is pretty great.

When you trialed the CB...what % were you using?

Using only 4% once per day. However only trialed for 4 months.

Dont have time to wait untill 2022 so now the price has come down a bit i want to trial a higher % but im going to try and use liposomes and see what happens.

 

[Phatalis]

I think you're right and i was thinking of the results they got when they used iontophoresis. Still getting finasteride equivelant results at 6 months vs 1 year is pretty great.



Using only 4% once per day. However only trialed for 4 months.

Dont have time to wait untill 2022 so now the price has come down a bit i want to trial a higher % but im going to try and use liposomes and see what happens.

Real quick. People keep going over this over and over...


But in the trials for the patent they had two other ingredients in the vehicle.

The vehicle was NOT just pg/ethanol/transcutol.

They also had an emulsifier (polysorbate 80) and an antioxidant.

How do we know these things weren't super helpful for the delicery??

And emulsifier makes a lot of sense to have in a vehicle.

Now maybe they didn't use this vehicle at all. Maybe we're all reading wrong. Or maybe they used iontophoresis.

But if you look at the patent they didn't simply use pg/eth/transcutol.

I'm going to keep bringing this up and drilling it because it just seems to be overlooked.

 

[Phatalis]

I think you're right and i was thinking of the results they got when they used iontophoresis. Still getting finasteride equivelant results at 6 months vs 1 year is pretty great.



Using only 4% once per day. However only trialed for 4 months.

Dont have time to wait untill 2022 so now the price has come down a bit i want to trial a higher % but im going to try and use liposomes and see what happens.

I def think we should all get into some plan to make our own experiments with vehicles.

Maybe a few groups trying different things until we nailed a good one down.

We know clascoterone works. So the doubt doesn't lie there.

The only thing it could be is the vehicle or the clascoterone we are getting from our suppliers ourselves.

 

[Phatalis]

I can't wait for 2022 either. I hope this sh*t makes it through customs. I'm going to apply 7.5% and be very cautious of the vehicle I use. I don't believe in just using any old vehicle.

Some people suggested neogenic but that shits expensive and it's vehicle includes water which if I recall cb doesn't work well with.

So that seems like a bad idea right away.

(On another note why does this forums autocomplete when I type on mobile suck so much ***. It parses words wrong. It only happens on this site, nowhere else)

 

[Phatalis]

Any idea when they will show results?

March-June

Somewhere in there.

 

[Phatalis]

well I wouldn't be surprised if this turns out to be another flop and they doctored the data in the trials. nobody has ever had any success using CB online which obviously could be due to vehicle reasons but I highly doubt that. it could be a concentration or once a day vs twice a day issue but it IS kind of discouraging to realize that we don't have a single verified story of someone who had improvements with this compound.

on the other hand I can list like 5 people who have used RU with decent success but were disappointed by CB. so it would make sense to suggest that RU is stronger pound for pound-or gets absorbed better, whatever.


it's kind of disgusting that this is were we are in 2019, which all the hopes of the past decade, we have a topical anti androgen that MAYBE works as good as finasteride but won't come out in the next 3.5-4 years. (in my country probably more like 5). and thats the only thing we have.

and if we want to maintain our hair in the middle of the 21st century and we can't take finasteride we have to spend thousands of dollars, experiment with potentially impure research chemicals, get them through customs worry every time whether the next batch will be pure or whether it will even arrive-or whether you will get into legal trouble even. then invest countless of hours into making a solution at home, having to do research on stability and all that. and then you still a topical which is a mess to apply at the crown and mid scalp.

all for "maybe" maintenance and an at this point unverified chance of regrowth.

thats so depressing

Dude lol.

They couldn't have doctored the data. They'd be liable to be sued as they have a company who invested like 20 million into them already. And that would imply winlevi doesn't work either.

Maybe I'm wrong to do this but I trust the data and the trials more than I trust Joe schmoes on these forums.

We have a few people on these forums who say cb maintain a really well for them also. But then you have others who say all sorts of random sh*t. So I'll take a hard pass on worrying about people on these forums.

 

[Btg]

I guess so. you also have people on the forums who say finasteride doesn't work for them. I'm just kind of confused that we have not seen a SINGLE case where someone outside of a study has achieved success with CB. and when you talk about maintenance, that's often highly subjective and you are not really able to evaluate that after just 6 months or so. plus people are on multiple treatments often time. I don't think they have literally faked the numbers but maybe the created and environment in which hair count could be higher. like in finasteride studies, some studies show more efficiency than others and that might be due to sample size and how they actually conducted the study, where on the scalp it is being applied etc. although I hear CB was applied to the temples which is kind of impressive if it improved haircout there

i think the combination of low doses + once a day didnt produce any results , it is obvious from the study that it needs to be used BID , it probably gets eliminated fast leaving your androgen receptors susceptible to DHT .
Also i dont believe many people trialed it for more than 3 months

 

[Phatalis]

yeah, even with the 7.5% once day only yielded 11 in hair count whereas twice a day almost double of that. imagine how weak once a day 1-2% must be then. so maybe thats the key

Once a day even at 7.5 showed half potency. So if people here were doing 2.5 or whatever, divide that potency by 2 because they may have been doing once a day.

Likely they didn't see any changes at all.


Seems like BID is almost necessary and at least dosages of 5+

 

[Btg]

not sure about the 5+, 2.5% performed better after 6 months in hair count and almost as good in the self assessment. so I don't think that makes the big issue. I do think that CB unlike RU doesn't stick as long to the androgen receptor so dht has still like half a day where it can damage your hair

Dht has a small half life , but it is produced continuously

 

[Phatalis]

http://www.cassiopea.com/~/media/Im...product-pipeline_2019_800x358.png?h=358&w=800 they still have data readout for Q1. I think it might happen this month or march

Probably March. Just a gut feeling.

 

[Phatalis]

Honestly, I think I'm getting fucked by U.S. customs right now on the CB I ordered.

YIPEEE

Probably due to fentanyl - which is really more of an issue caused by doctors, which was also more of an issue caused by greedy pharmaceuticals.

but yay im getting fucked. Yay f*****g United States. Everyone has the right to own a gun and shoot anyone but not the right to order some medicinal sh*t for themselves.

f*** this sh*t

 

[Ollie]

Honestly, I think I'm getting fucked by U.S. customs right now on the CB I ordered.

YIPEEE

Probably due to fentanyl - which is really more of an issue caused by doctors, which was also more of an issue caused by greedy pharmaceuticals.

but yay im getting fucked. Yay f*****g United States. Everyone has the right to own a gun and shoot anyone but not the right to order some medicinal sh*t for themselves.

f*** this sh*t

How much CB did you order and what was the price ?

 

[ScaredOfBalding]

Honestly, I think I'm getting fucked by U.S. customs right now on the CB I ordered.

YIPEEE

Probably due to fentanyl - which is really more of an issue caused by doctors, which was also more of an issue caused by greedy pharmaceuticals.

but yay im getting fucked. Yay f*****g United States. Everyone has the right to own a gun and shoot anyone but not the right to order some medicinal sh*t for themselves.

f*** this sh*t