Why are people so against finasteride?

[20YearsOnFin]

This I have to push back on.
Being on the Spectrum isn't some version of broken or incompetence, it's a sweeping generalisation, it's just not true.

I'm sure there are some people on the Spectrum that are incompetent at everything, just as there are some Neurotypicals that are incompetent at everything. But all of them just isn't possible.
I'd say it has more to do with IQ or upbringing.

Kind of......Although a vast subject, I have a pretty good knowledge of neurodivergent behavior, Micky displays major red flags to me in many areas, from his reasoning style, spinning around what has been said against him at the first opportunity, and most shocking his inability to be able to read and interpret the manner in which something is said to him AKA Poe's law.

He also displays mindful blindness and is willing to argue any point at length even though he has no chance of affecting the other persons point of view.

these amongst others are some of the traits that stand out to me and don't appear to be related to IQ.

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[Moro]

Kind of......Although a vast subject, I have a pretty good knowledge of neurodivergent behavior, Micky displays major red flags to me in many areas, from his reasoning style, spinning around what has been said against him at the first opportunity, and most shocking his inability to be able to read and interpret the manner in which something is said to him AKA Poe's law.

He also displays mindful blindness and is willing to argue any point at length even though he has no chance of affecting the other persons point of view.

these amongst others are some of the traits that stand out to me and don't appear to be related to IQ.

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I've met many Neurotypicals that are intransigent and have poor reasoning skills. It's not exclusive to people on the Spectrum.

General incompetence is just stigma. It's not real.

The opposite is arguably true. People on the Spectrum can hyper focus on certain things, far more than a Neurotypical can. With that alone you can gain a great deal of competency.

 

[Micky_007]

Yes micky I've really failed.... maintaining my hair for 27 years is a sure sign I've lost the augment to somebody whose hair has been deteriorating for 3 years while on no treatments........So of course you are the real winner here, congratulations your winners medal is in the drain of the shower next to your hair.

The argument wasn't about whether you've maintained your hair or not, that is irrelevant, the argument was about how common side effects are on Finasteride, how important DHT is, how dangerous blocking DHT is, how important having a multi-faceted approach to hairloss is, and how there are other viable treatments currently and soon to come.

And 10% hairloss for me in 3 years isn't much, especially when I plan on starting treatment again next year so I could very possibly see a 10% improvement.

 

[20YearsOnFin]

I've met many Neurotypicals that are intransigent and have poor reasoning skills. It's not exclusive to people on the Spectrum.

General incompetence is just stigma. It's not real.

The opposite is arguably true. People on the Spectrum can hyper focus on certain things, far more than a Neurotypical can. With that alone you can gain a great deal of competency.

For what's its worth I don't believe a separation between Neurotypical and Neurodivergent exists, ultimately they are just man made label's that help the majority try to understand those that they perceive as the the minority, we are probably talking at cross purposes, as neither of us have had time to interpret who we are talking to at this point, so its difficult to attain the direction that either side is coming from, my post's are essentially bread crumb's, they are not necessarily meant to be interpreted literally as they don't represent the thoughts of an actual person. You just have to trust I have solid understanding of what the spectrum is rather than trying to ascertain my actual reasons behind inserting the topic in these posts.

 

[Oknow]

what are you supposed to do? dont take finasteride, go bald get depressed and 0 women because you're bald?
there is no alternative
pick your poison
might as well take the poison that allows you to keep your har
it's a loss loss scenario either way

Ever with finasteride you can’t get women
So what’s the point?

 

[20YearsOnFin]

whether you've maintained your hair or not, that is irrelevant

I would suggest maintaining ones hair was the sole purpose of the creation of this forum, so to me and most others its pretty relevant.

the argument was about how common side effects are on Finasteride, how important DHT is, how dangerous blocking DHT

BTW we are not having an actual argument about this, im already well aware of both points of view.

If your intention is to continually discuss sides, perhaps you would be better off only engaging into the discussion with people who actually experience them, rather than trying to argue with people who don't. It should be fairly apparent that the topics you are trying to discuss are of little value to the average finasteride user, if they valued the importance of DHT over hair, logic would dictate they wouldnt be taking finasteride in the first place

 

[Moro]

For what's its worth I don't believe a separation between Neurotypical and Neurodivergent exists, ultimately they are just man made label's that help the majority try to understand those that they perceive as the the minority, we are probably talking at cross purposes, as neither of us have had time to interpret who we are talking to at this point, so its difficult to attain the direction that either side is coming from, my post's are essentially bread crumb's, they are not necessarily meant to be interpreted literally as they don't represent the thoughts of an actual person. You just have to trust I have solid understanding of what the spectrum is rather than trying to ascertain my actual reasons behind inserting the topic in these posts.

That's entirely possible.
When you ask others how often people mistakenly ascribe an emotion to you that you didn't have, they say it happens all the time.
So, people think they're really good at "body language", while being terrible at it. lol
As to how prevalent that is and how comparable to people on the Spectrum it is, I have no idea. But it's interesting. More interesting than fear mongers flailing and bloviating over a drug.

I'm not saying you have a lack of knowledge. Just rebutting the idea of people on the Spectrum being incompetent. Talking about the idea only.

I do think there needs to be more studies on it, for certain. But I'm going to go out on a limb and say that, those stigmas are the most likely cause of unemployment and suicide within the neurodivergent demographic. Or at least it seems to be the most likely cause (or biggest contributor) I can glean atm.

 

[20YearsOnFin]

Just rebutting the idea of people on the Spectrum being incompetent.

Ok, no problem, for what its worth, Im not suggesting he is incompetent.

 

[Micky_007]

I would suggest maintaining ones hair was the sole purpose of the creation of this forum, so to me and most others its pretty relevant.

BTW we are not having an actual argument about this, im already well aware of both points of view.

If your intention is to continually discuss sides, perhaps you would be better off only engaging into the discussion with people who actually experience them, rather than trying to argue with people who don't. It should be fairly apparent that the topics you are trying to discuss are of little value to the average finasteride user, if they valued the importance of DHT over hair, logic would dictate they wouldnt be taking finasteride in the first place

Don't get me wrong, it's good if you have infact maintained your hair, the discussion was regarding Finasterides effects on the general population of users not just a few hyper responders like yourself who apparently have results for such a long time.

Yes it was a discussion not an argument.

And regarding the outcome of the discussions like this, I'm not trying to convince people like you as I know you are pro-Finasteride. The purpose is of sharing information so people have a more holistic idea of whats really going on with Finasteride, so that they can make more informed decisions. Just from this thread alone multiple people have contacted me and thanked me for sharing this information which is a side about Finasteride that many like to keep hidden.

 

[Micky_007]

That's entirely possible.
When you ask others how often people mistakenly ascribe an emotion to you that you didn't have, they say it happens all the time.
So, people think they're really good at "body language", while being terrible at it. lol
As to how prevalent that is and how comparable to people on the Spectrum it is, I have no idea. But it's interesting. More interesting than fear mongers flailing and bloviating over a drug.

I'm not saying you have a lack of knowledge. Just rebutting the idea of people on the Spectrum being incompetent. Talking about the idea only.

I do think there needs to be more studies on it, for certain. But I'm going to go out on a limb and say that, those stigmas are the most likely cause of unemployment and suicide within the neurodivergent demographic. Or at least it seems to be the most likely cause (or biggest contributor) I can glean atm.

What a load of bullshit are you writing about? From talking about people being on or off a spectrum to talking about unemployment and suicide?
Literally has zero correlation. If you're insinuating people who speak out about Finasteride are unemployed or suicidal that is thee biggest load of horse crap I have ever seen (and I type this as I'm at my office at work, fully employed as an Engineer) yet you're the one talking about IQ or upbringing LOL?? .

The only person incompetent here is you with your ludicrous conclusions you're drawing. Lol WTF.

Also, the only people who use the word "Fear Mongering" is bro science guys like you who don't realize that even medical professionals are duty bound to explain all the possible side effects of any drug. But when guys online speak about it, it's called "Fear Mongering"?? LOL.

Can you imagine going to a surgery, and the doctor being duty bound to tell you all the complications that can happen but you tell him: Stop Bro, don't tell me the possible complications of a surgery, you're just fear mongering". LMFAOOOO that is as absurd as you sound, and then trying to draw conclusions that people who Fear Monger are probably unemployed or suicidal, lmaoooo, if that were the case all doctors and surgeons especially would be unemployed and probably dead because according to you they are suicidal and unemployed.

Biggest load of horse crap I've read.

 

[Jeju]

People will refuse to take finasteride but then go and poison their body with fast food and alcohol every Friday night.

Burger King didn’t give me a limp noodle, neither did drink.

 

[20YearsOnFin]

Burger King didn’t give me a limp noodle

I don't think its always automatically included, next time ask for it specifically, as i heard its one of the extra's they keep under the counter.

 

[Norwoody]

One of the longest troll threads lol

 

[Jeju]

I don't think its always automatically included, next time ask for it specifically, as i heard its one of the extra's they keep under the counter.

Burger King keep finasteride under the counter? Well I never!

 

[infamousrodi]

I want a whopper now mmmm with side of finasteride

 

[Norwoody]

I want a whopper now mmmm with side of finasteride

Would you like to upgrade to dutasteride?

 

[20YearsOnFin]

Burger King keep finasteride under the counter? Well I never!

???????? where did anyone say that?

 

[Moro]

What a load of bullshit are you writing about? From talking about people being on or off a spectrum to talking about unemployment and suicide?
Literally has zero correlation. If you're insinuating people who speak out about Finasteride are unemployed or suicidal that is thee biggest load of horse crap I have ever seen (and I type this as I'm at my office at work, fully employed as an Engineer) yet you're the one talking about IQ or upbringing LOL?? .

The only person incompetent here is you with your ludicrous conclusions you're drawing. Lol WTF.

Also, the only people who use the word "Fear Mongering" is bro science guys like you who don't realize that even medical professionals are duty bound to explain all the possible side effects of any drug. But when guys online speak about it, it's called "Fear Mongering"?? LOL.

Can you imagine going to a surgery, and the doctor being duty bound to tell you all the complications that can happen but you tell him: Stop Bro, don't tell me the possible complications of a surgery, you're just fear mongering". LMFAOOOO that is as absurd as you sound, and then trying to draw conclusions that people who Fear Monger are probably unemployed or suicidal, lmaoooo, if that were the case all doctors and surgeons especially would be unemployed and probably dead because according to you they are suicidal and unemployed.

Biggest load of horse crap I've read.

Talking about something you won't ever have the ability to comprehend. Don't worry.

...
But you are fear mongers... Where's the lie?

Hang on, you don't like the scientific method? Seriously?

Hey, just out of curiosity; What do you do as an alternative to finasteride?

 

[Micky_007]

Talking about something you won't ever have the ability to comprehend. Don't worry.

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But you are fear mongers... Where's the lie?

Hang on, you don't like the scientific method? Seriously?

Hey, just out of curiosity; What do you do as an alternative to finasteride?

I know what on and off the spectrum means, you act as if it's a difficult concept to understand when it isn't lmaoooo that tells me a lot more about you.

My problem with it is, you tried to draw wild conclusions of people having IQ problems, upbringing problems and incompetence to understand concepts or inability for people to do ones own research simply because people are speaking against Finasteride LOL.

That's funny coming from someone (you) who considers THEMSELF (you) incapable of doing your own research and having to rely on advice on hairloss from a Dermatologist. Lol.

Also I'm pretty sure I have a much higher IQ than you, not that it's a true measure of intelligence. But even by true measures of intelligence I would greatly surpass you.

I'm not fear mongering, I'm speaking about the very possible side effects of Finasteride. Tell a endocrinologist you want to block 70% of DHT in your body and see how quickly they explain how dangerous that is in great length. Oh wait, internet guys like you would call the endocrinologist "Fear Mongering" if he did it.

That is exactly the concept i am highlighting. It's only online no-science bros who mainly use that term "Fear Mongering" because they also know deep down that the mechanism of action is risky but hope people just be optimistic when using it and hope for the best.

Which scientific method are you referring to? Because theres many different types of scientific methods that I believe are worthy, obviously not Finasteride though.

Alternatives to Finasteride are non-oral anti-androgens, to reduce systemic absorbtion and thereby reduce side effects.

Treatment of hairloss requires a multi-faceted approach, Minoxidil topical twice every day + Microneedling weekly, Shampoo containing at the minimum Caffeine, Saw Palmetto (DHT blocker) + Progesterone cream/oil (if you have/suspect you have low progesterone), all the necessary vitamins, minerals and nutrients, no sugar, regular exercise, 7 to 8 hours sleep, low stress, regular scalp massages. All of these have proven benefits on hair and helping prevent hairloss.

 

[Jeju]

???????? where did anyone say that?

Please tell me you’re joking