- Reaction score
- 527
Heres what I am going to be trying
Darolutamide: ~5mg/ml
RU558841: 50mg/ml
Finasteride: ~0.1mg/ml
Estradiol: ~0.1mg/ml
Now if anyone wonders why my dosages for certain compounds are so low you have to understand that alot of what is applied topical will go systemic. The advantage of topicals is that you can get concentrations locally of these drugs in your scalp with micro dosages that would take very large oral dosages to achieve. So the aim when using topicals is to use a dose that would have little to no systemic effect when taken orally, so that you can get a high dose in your scalp but a very low dose for your body. Also the less active derivatives and the shorter systemic half life a drug has, the better.
For those of you who had seen my Bicalutamide log, I will give my conclusion of topical bicalutamide here. It's very effective. However, due to its 6 day half life it builds up very high systemically even with small topical dosages. So I have dropped it because it was causing me to get gyno which when I combatted with Anti-estrogens made my hairloss even worse (more on this below). If anyone is doing an aggressive oral regiment and does not care about gyno I would 100% recommend adding topical bicalutamide to your regiment as I have never felt anything that effective for hairloss in my life. I was getting regrowth in my temples within a couple weeks of using it and it completely anialated my scalp itch and shedding. Im not about that gyno life tho so unfortunately, I've had to move on.
Purpose of each compound explained
UPDATE: decided to drop RU as it was causing me heart problems.
Will be using Daro, finasteride, and estradiol. Should be fine since Daro is so much stronger anyway
IMPORTANT
Hers how Daro compares with DHT and Testosterone for strength
ORM-15341: (Ki) of 8 nM and an IC50 of 38 nM
Darolutamide: (Ki) of 11 nM and an IC50 of 26 nM
DHT: (Kd) of 0.25 to 0.5 nM and an EC50 for activation of the AR is 0.13 nM
Testosterone: Kd = 0.4 to 1.0 nM and an EC50 of 0.66 nM
^explanation of the above
My hair loss:
very aggressive finasteride/dutasteride resistant hair loss. NW7 diffuse pattern, sides of head have thinned significantly also. The only part that is simar density to pre male pattern baldness is the middle of the back of my head. The rest is all significantly thinner, I used to have insanely thick hair. The left side of top has receded and thinned faster than the right, my hairline has moved up about 1cm.
Current Status Pre Regiment
July 26, 2018- https://imgur.com/a/COt5gAn Fist Day of Daro
Darolutamide: ~5mg/ml
RU558841: 50mg/ml
Finasteride: ~0.1mg/ml
Estradiol: ~0.1mg/ml
Now if anyone wonders why my dosages for certain compounds are so low you have to understand that alot of what is applied topical will go systemic. The advantage of topicals is that you can get concentrations locally of these drugs in your scalp with micro dosages that would take very large oral dosages to achieve. So the aim when using topicals is to use a dose that would have little to no systemic effect when taken orally, so that you can get a high dose in your scalp but a very low dose for your body. Also the less active derivatives and the shorter systemic half life a drug has, the better.
For those of you who had seen my Bicalutamide log, I will give my conclusion of topical bicalutamide here. It's very effective. However, due to its 6 day half life it builds up very high systemically even with small topical dosages. So I have dropped it because it was causing me to get gyno which when I combatted with Anti-estrogens made my hairloss even worse (more on this below). If anyone is doing an aggressive oral regiment and does not care about gyno I would 100% recommend adding topical bicalutamide to your regiment as I have never felt anything that effective for hairloss in my life. I was getting regrowth in my temples within a couple weeks of using it and it completely anialated my scalp itch and shedding. Im not about that gyno life tho so unfortunately, I've had to move on.
Purpose of each compound explained
Darolutamide: To prevent testosterone (and some DHT) binding to the follicle AR. Hopefully, it will also degrade the scalp ARs somewhat which would slow down the rate of my hairloss. I am not counting on it tho
RU558841: Garbade compound, been using it for ~2 weeks now and is hardly doing anything as I am still itching all over my scalp and losing hairs. Has a very short systemic half-life tho and others have had success with it apparently so why not throw it in there. Anything it gives me is a bonus
Finasteride: Two purposes, to prevent testosterone from converting into DHT which may overpower Daro, but also to prevent the 5ar enzyme of converting the topical estradiol into testosterone
Estradiol: It was made perfectly clear to me when I took 25mg of Aromasin. for three days in a row, how important estrogen is for hair. For about 2-4 days after this, I was shedding like no tomorrow. I always knew it was a key factor, but I had no idea that low estrogen can make you shed more than high DHT. Its very clear when you look at some of the MTF logs in the success section how effective estradiol is for women. Typically its dosed at around 2-4mg per day for MTF and HRT but this study showed that 50-100 micrograms of topical estradiol per day was effective at alleviating vaginal atrophy while at the same time not raising serum estradiol levels. So, I thought it would be worth a try
I do have Aromasin and Nolvadex on hand in case I start to get gyno I can stop/lower the dosages of this protocol, and use those drugs to prevent gyno.
RU558841: Garbade compound, been using it for ~2 weeks now and is hardly doing anything as I am still itching all over my scalp and losing hairs. Has a very short systemic half-life tho and others have had success with it apparently so why not throw it in there. Anything it gives me is a bonus
Finasteride: Two purposes, to prevent testosterone from converting into DHT which may overpower Daro, but also to prevent the 5ar enzyme of converting the topical estradiol into testosterone
Estradiol: It was made perfectly clear to me when I took 25mg of Aromasin. for three days in a row, how important estrogen is for hair. For about 2-4 days after this, I was shedding like no tomorrow. I always knew it was a key factor, but I had no idea that low estrogen can make you shed more than high DHT. Its very clear when you look at some of the MTF logs in the success section how effective estradiol is for women. Typically its dosed at around 2-4mg per day for MTF and HRT but this study showed that 50-100 micrograms of topical estradiol per day was effective at alleviating vaginal atrophy while at the same time not raising serum estradiol levels. So, I thought it would be worth a try
I do have Aromasin and Nolvadex on hand in case I start to get gyno I can stop/lower the dosages of this protocol, and use those drugs to prevent gyno.
Will be using Daro, finasteride, and estradiol. Should be fine since Daro is so much stronger anyway
IMPORTANT
Hers how Daro compares with DHT and Testosterone for strength
ORM-15341: (Ki) of 8 nM and an IC50 of 38 nM
Darolutamide: (Ki) of 11 nM and an IC50 of 26 nM
DHT: (Kd) of 0.25 to 0.5 nM and an EC50 for activation of the AR is 0.13 nM
Testosterone: Kd = 0.4 to 1.0 nM and an EC50 of 0.66 nM
^explanation of the above
unfortunately there have been no SARMs developed yet that are able to bind to the AR with the power anywhere near of even just testosterone let alone DHT. This is why we have to play a hoping game when it comes to hairloss, because nothing can bind to the AR with the power anywhere near DHT, we always need to have higher levels of the anti-androgen in order to stand a chance.
This is why I believe those of you using weaker compounds stand no chance for regrowth, everyone always says "oh anti-androgens are not enough for regrowth, you need estrogen etc etc..." Well I believe thata major reason for that fact is that we dont have a drug anywhere near as strong as needed. Hopefully, in the future, they will be able to figure it out, for women there has been a drug for year now (Raloxifene) which binds to the ER at a much much stronger affinity than estradiol.
Well anyways, this is why I believe that for now we also need to rely on estradiol if you are someone with extremely aggressive androgenic alopecia. Estradiol binds very strongly to the ER and I have no research to comfirm this but I do believe that the ER and the AR of the hair follicle cells cant be activated at the same time (Im not sure). This would explain the regrowth that becomes possible with estradiol because it would be shutting down AR expression (if my theory is correct).
Cliffs:
If your male pattern baldness is aggressive you have no shot with Ru or similarly weak anti-androgens because they bind so much weaker to the AR the testosterone
This is why I believe those of you using weaker compounds stand no chance for regrowth, everyone always says "oh anti-androgens are not enough for regrowth, you need estrogen etc etc..." Well I believe thata major reason for that fact is that we dont have a drug anywhere near as strong as needed. Hopefully, in the future, they will be able to figure it out, for women there has been a drug for year now (Raloxifene) which binds to the ER at a much much stronger affinity than estradiol.
Well anyways, this is why I believe that for now we also need to rely on estradiol if you are someone with extremely aggressive androgenic alopecia. Estradiol binds very strongly to the ER and I have no research to comfirm this but I do believe that the ER and the AR of the hair follicle cells cant be activated at the same time (Im not sure). This would explain the regrowth that becomes possible with estradiol because it would be shutting down AR expression (if my theory is correct).
Cliffs:
If your male pattern baldness is aggressive you have no shot with Ru or similarly weak anti-androgens because they bind so much weaker to the AR the testosterone
My hair loss:
very aggressive finasteride/dutasteride resistant hair loss. NW7 diffuse pattern, sides of head have thinned significantly also. The only part that is simar density to pre male pattern baldness is the middle of the back of my head. The rest is all significantly thinner, I used to have insanely thick hair. The left side of top has receded and thinned faster than the right, my hairline has moved up about 1cm.
Current Status Pre Regiment
July 26, 2018- https://imgur.com/a/COt5gAn Fist Day of Daro
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