Samumed- Sm04554 Phase 2 Results Safety And Biopsy Outcomes

M

mr_robot

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tress_dreams said:
I'm not picky. This causes neogenesis? Sure, sounds good. I'll get a transplant and use this and stay on finasteride and minoxidil. Potentially rebuild the donor after a year and repeat. I'll take what I can get. It's a totally different mechanism of action than finasteride. Might be that this works well with wounding too.

I hope they continue the research. We haven't even seen what this could do for a head that's on finasteride where the DHT isn't inhibiting follicular neogenesis.

Take all the drugs and get a FUE. You'll see me randomly shirtless in the grocery store all like:

Click to expand...

You can't get neogenesis in scar tissue.
 
M

mr_robot

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wow-wow said:
Neogensis mean the results are permanent right? If you stop the treatment you won't shed.
Click to expand...

Neogensis is the generation of a completely new hair follicle where as existing treatments try to recover declining/dormant follicles. How hardy the new follicles are yet to be seen.
 
tylerduren

tylerduren

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Swoop said:
Castration is always the answer to Androgenetic Alopecia arrest.

Tranny regimen you might get your hair back to some extent.
Click to expand...

The tranny regime has given nw4/5 to nw1 . Just looked at the recent log on here. Its funny all these companys trying to birth folicles when it would appear they never die
 
Swoop

Swoop

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tylerduren said:
The tranny regime has given nw4/5 to nw1 . Just looked at the recent log on here. Its funny all these companys trying to birth folicles when it would appear they never die
Click to expand...

You mean..

regrowthhhhhhh.jpg



Painful to look at. Androgenetic Alopecia is damn brutal.

Pray for Tsuji mate.
 
hellouser

hellouser

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Swoop said:
You mean..

regrowthhhhhhh.jpg



Painful to look at. Androgenetic Alopecia is damn brutal.

Pray for Tsuji mate.
Click to expand...

That right there along with what Dr. Cotsarelis said a few years back is solid evidence that follicles DEFINITELY don't die. I wonder what makes the DP count increase in the follicles?
 
resu

resu

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hellouser said:
That right there along with what Dr. Cotsarelis said a few years back is solid evidence that follicles DEFINITELY don't die. I wonder what makes the DP count increase in the follicles?
Click to expand...


Dr. Van Voorhees: What is the mechanism that accounts for the miniaturization of hair?

Dr. Cotsarelis: We know that inhibiting the testosterone pathway slows down the miniaturization of the follicle. Jaworsky, Kligman, and Murphy had a paper 20 years ago showing that half the time there is also inflammation around the hair follicle, which led to some thought that maybe inflammatory cells including mast cells were contributing to hair loss. Studies and case reports of transgender operations where men become women and receive high doses of estrogen show that a scalp that was almost completely bald can have, after castration and high estrogen supplementation, a tremendous amount of hair growth.
Click to expand...

He's aware...
 
Trouse

Trouse

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Those pictures are absolutely outrageous. The woman on the bottom goes from a legit 6.5 to a NW0. That is both highly encouraging and disheartening at the same time.
 
hellouser

hellouser

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Trouse said:
Those pictures are absolutely outrageous. The woman on the bottom goes from a legit 6.5 to a NW0. That is both highly encouraging and disheartening at the same time.
Click to expand...

Would you rather lose your balls or your hair?
 
InBeforeTheCure

InBeforeTheCure

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tylerduren said:
So what is it about estrogen that helps so much ?

What mechanism is estrogen on the scalp... pge1 ?

We can mimick this without effecting our dicks im sure of it
Click to expand...

Genes upregulated by estrogen in male hair follicles:

Code: 
Gene Fold Change
FLNA 2.18
COMP 2.16
KRT19 1.92
KRT2 1.92
TAGLN 1.87
SRRM2 1.86
KRT75 1.85
LAMA5 1.76
PDLIM7 1.73
KRT37 1.73
KRT17 1.7
NKTR 1.64
MAGEA11 1.63
COL18A1 1.61
PMEL 1.57
ATP5D 1.56
ACTB 1.56
KRT14 1.55
COL6A2 1.54
CSPG4 1.54
MAP2K2 1.52
PTK7 1.52
GSTP1 1.52
CCND1 1.52
ERCC2 1.52
NFATC4 1.51
COL11A1 1.51
COL16A1 1.49
TKT 1.49
PPP1R13L 1.49
FOSL2 1.48
NDUFA3 1.47
KRT5 1.46
BASP1 1.44
MGP 1.43
EGFR 1.42

Genes downregulated by estrogen in male hair follicles:

Code: 
Gene Fold Change
MMP3 0.18
FLG 0.2
MMP1 0.32
SPP1 0.33
JAK1 0.35
FN1 0.36
ITGAV 0.37
SOD2 0.38
FGFR2 0.39
CDKN2B 0.4
GLRX 0.41
HACL1 0.41
AIM1 0.42
COL12A1 0.42
CDH1 0.43
CDKN1A 0.43
DCN 0.43
S100A9 0.44
SPRR2D 0.44
EPS8 0.44
HK2 0.45
CD36 0.45
S100A7 0.46
SPRR1A 0.46
SOCS5 0.46
NOV 0.47
LCN2 0.48
SPARCL1 0.48
MCL1 0.49
SDCBP 0.5
GJA1 0.5
TDG 0.5
CANX 0.5
CASP2 0.5
NID1 0.51
SERPINE1 0.51
IL1A 0.51
EDNRB 0.52
PTGDS 0.52
TNFRSF19 0.52
TXLNA 0.52
CCNG2 0.53
DSC1 0.53
ITGA6 0.53
CXCL1 0.53
IQGAP1 0.54
ITGB6 0.54
PDLIM5 0.54
MAPK14 0.54
DDX3X 0.55
EMP1 0.55
UBQLN1 0.56
TJP2 0.56
IL6 0.56
PLIN2 0.56
RAF1 0.56
EPS15 0.57
ITGA2 0.57
PPIL4 0.57
CALR 0.57
CCT8 0.57
EIF4H 0.58
ADAM9 0.58
ABCC5 0.58
MAPK6 0.59
SEC31A 0.59
HIF1A 0.6
GLUL 0.6
FOS 0.6
STAT2 0.6
STAT1 0.6
CCT4 0.6
FCGR1A 0.6
FMOD 0.61
VCAN 0.61
BCL2L13 0.62
COL6A3 0.62
THBS2 0.62
UNG 0.62
VEGFA 0.62
THBS1 0.62
LTBP1 0.62
ASAH1 0.62
GCLC 0.62
TNFRSF1A 0.62
CCNC 0.63
KRT38 0.63
MAPK1 0.63
CLU 0.63
IGFBP3 0.63
CD55 0.63
MCC 0.63
CASP8 0.63
HSPD1 0.64
S100A8 0.64
CORO1C 0.64
CDH5 0.64
TFDP1 0.64
DNAJA3 0.64
ERO1A 0.65
ABCB6 0.65
CD44 0.65
CGA 0.65
LUM 0.65
CDKN1B 0.65
PSAP 0.65
TGFA 0.65
CASP7 0.65
HADHB 0.65
GLIPR1 0.65
MFAP3 0.65
BCL10 0.65
PTK2 0.65
KRT1 0.65
CD34 0.66
ACOX1 0.66
VHL 0.67
EIF3E 0.67
BCL2L2 0.67
PSEN1 0.67
TNFSF10 0.67
LDLR 0.67
RIPK1 0.67
KRT36 0.67
PIM1 0.68
GJB2 0.68
B2M 0.68
LAMA4 0.68
XRCC5 0.68
CPE 0.68
HOPX 0.69
P4HB 0.69
PRKCH 0.69
LGALS8 0.69
MFAP5 0.69
VBP1 0.69
BCL2L1 0.69
ITGB1 0.7
CWC27 0.7
TP53 0.7
CTNNB1 0.7
MCM5 0.7
PDZK1IP1 0.7


Source: Substantial Sex-Dependent Differences in the Response of Human Scalp Hair Follicles to Estrogen Stimulation In Vitro Advocate Gender-Tailored Management of Female Versus Male Pattern Balding

If you figure out a way to mimic this, let us know. :D
 
tylerduren

tylerduren

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InBeforeTheCure said:
Genes upregulated by estrogen in male hair follicles:

Code: 
Gene Fold Change
FLNA 2.18
COMP 2.16
KRT19 1.92
KRT2 1.92
TAGLN 1.87
SRRM2 1.86
KRT75 1.85
LAMA5 1.76
PDLIM7 1.73
KRT37 1.73
KRT17 1.7
NKTR 1.64
MAGEA11 1.63
COL18A1 1.61
PMEL 1.57
ATP5D 1.56
ACTB 1.56
KRT14 1.55
COL6A2 1.54
CSPG4 1.54
MAP2K2 1.52
PTK7 1.52
GSTP1 1.52
CCND1 1.52
ERCC2 1.52
NFATC4 1.51
COL11A1 1.51
COL16A1 1.49
TKT 1.49
PPP1R13L 1.49
FOSL2 1.48
NDUFA3 1.47
KRT5 1.46
BASP1 1.44
MGP 1.43
EGFR 1.42

Genes downregulated by estrogen in male hair follicles:

Code: 
Gene Fold Change
MMP3 0.18
FLG 0.2
MMP1 0.32
SPP1 0.33
JAK1 0.35
FN1 0.36
ITGAV 0.37
SOD2 0.38
FGFR2 0.39
CDKN2B 0.4
GLRX 0.41
HACL1 0.41
AIM1 0.42
COL12A1 0.42
CDH1 0.43
CDKN1A 0.43
DCN 0.43
S100A9 0.44
SPRR2D 0.44
EPS8 0.44
HK2 0.45
CD36 0.45
S100A7 0.46
SPRR1A 0.46
SOCS5 0.46
NOV 0.47
LCN2 0.48
SPARCL1 0.48
MCL1 0.49
SDCBP 0.5
GJA1 0.5
TDG 0.5
CANX 0.5
CASP2 0.5
NID1 0.51
SERPINE1 0.51
IL1A 0.51
EDNRB 0.52
PTGDS 0.52
TNFRSF19 0.52
TXLNA 0.52
CCNG2 0.53
DSC1 0.53
ITGA6 0.53
CXCL1 0.53
IQGAP1 0.54
ITGB6 0.54
PDLIM5 0.54
MAPK14 0.54
DDX3X 0.55
EMP1 0.55
UBQLN1 0.56
TJP2 0.56
IL6 0.56
PLIN2 0.56
RAF1 0.56
EPS15 0.57
ITGA2 0.57
PPIL4 0.57
CALR 0.57
CCT8 0.57
EIF4H 0.58
ADAM9 0.58
ABCC5 0.58
MAPK6 0.59
SEC31A 0.59
HIF1A 0.6
GLUL 0.6
FOS 0.6
STAT2 0.6
STAT1 0.6
CCT4 0.6
FCGR1A 0.6
FMOD 0.61
VCAN 0.61
BCL2L13 0.62
COL6A3 0.62
THBS2 0.62
UNG 0.62
VEGFA 0.62
THBS1 0.62
LTBP1 0.62
ASAH1 0.62
GCLC 0.62
TNFRSF1A 0.62
CCNC 0.63
KRT38 0.63
MAPK1 0.63
CLU 0.63
IGFBP3 0.63
CD55 0.63
MCC 0.63
CASP8 0.63
HSPD1 0.64
S100A8 0.64
CORO1C 0.64
CDH5 0.64
TFDP1 0.64
DNAJA3 0.64
ERO1A 0.65
ABCB6 0.65
CD44 0.65
CGA 0.65
LUM 0.65
CDKN1B 0.65
PSAP 0.65
TGFA 0.65
CASP7 0.65
HADHB 0.65
GLIPR1 0.65
MFAP3 0.65
BCL10 0.65
PTK2 0.65
KRT1 0.65
CD34 0.66
ACOX1 0.66
VHL 0.67
EIF3E 0.67
BCL2L2 0.67
PSEN1 0.67
TNFSF10 0.67
LDLR 0.67
RIPK1 0.67
KRT36 0.67
PIM1 0.68
GJB2 0.68
B2M 0.68
LAMA4 0.68
XRCC5 0.68
CPE 0.68
HOPX 0.69
P4HB 0.69
PRKCH 0.69
LGALS8 0.69
MFAP5 0.69
VBP1 0.69
BCL2L1 0.69
ITGB1 0.7
CWC27 0.7
TP53 0.7
CTNNB1 0.7
MCM5 0.7
PDZK1IP1 0.7


Source: Substantial Sex-Dependent Differences in the Response of Human Scalp Hair Follicles to Estrogen Stimulation In Vitro Advocate Gender-Tailored Management of Female Versus Male Pattern Balding

If you figure out a way to mimic this, let us know. :D
Click to expand...

The funny thing, is that the answer to going from NW6 to NW1 , lies within those codes.

I think we should all pick one and research its effect on the follice then look for drugs that express or downregulate the genes we narrow down.

Funny thing is, we will probably work that out before the cure comes out :p:D:eek:
 
tylerduren

tylerduren

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Anyone know much about SERMS?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selective_estrogen_receptor_modulator

I know SARMS ( selective androgen receptor modulator )are being designed to act like steroids with minimal side effects.

Also what about phytoestrogens ?

We need Patrick Arnold from bodybuilding.com to start going bald. He was the scientist invovled in Balco undetectable steroids and also created many prohormones and hybrids. Hybrid estradiol ftw !
 
G

g.i joey

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tylerduren said:
I know SARMS ( selective androgen receptor modulator )are being designed to act like steroids with minimal side effects.
!
Click to expand...

if they are actually designing these they can make a new version of finasteride and prob save alot of people the side effects.
 
B

bigentries

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tylerduren said:
So what is it about estrogen that helps so much ?

What mechanism is estrogen on the scalp... pge1 ?

We can mimick this without effecting our dicks im sure of it
Click to expand...
That's what I wonder

There are numerous cases of transwomen showing regrowth that puts finasteride and minoxidil to shame and no one seems to be open to studying it

As you said, maybe estrogen works in a mechanism that could be reproduced without affecting hormone levels
 
InBeforeTheCure

InBeforeTheCure

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tylerduren said:
The funny thing, is that the answer to going from NW6 to NW1 , lies within those codes.

I think we should all pick one and research its effect on the follice then look for drugs that express or downregulate the genes we narrow down.

Funny thing is, we will probably work that out before the cure comes out :p:D:eek:
Click to expand...

It's probably not just one gene though, but rather a large number of genes controlled by a few important pathways that make the difference. Maybe a combination of treatments could mimic it to some extent, provided you find the right combination...
 
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