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Why not run RU again now that your off cycle? And I take it you did not maintain during those 4 months?
Ru58841 – Usage, Efficacy, Side Effects, Impressions
- Thread starter Manochoice
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I did maintain during those 4 months. But the hairloss from the steroids was pretty slow. Meaning i dont know if it maintained because of RU, or because the hairloss was pretty slow. Again my hair was just too dense (compared to now) to really tell if somethings happening. I told myself it was helping, but im really not sure. I just hoped for regrowth, which was a unrealistic goal though.
I believe though that RU can be a pretty powerful prevention treatment. I have seen several reports of steroid users who say they experience no shedding when they use RU during their cycles. Its just not enough to actually cause regrowth on hormones.
I just cant be bothered to buy it again, its not like its cheap. Also i think 2 weeks ago i stumbled upon the holy grail of hair regrowth (for me). Its been promising so far in just 2 weeks and i wanna see if it keeps getting better
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anagen inc
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Basically my problem is if that area is covered with hair because it is, then how do I get it to be absorbed by the scalp and not stay on the hair?
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Ironically enough, a huge number of the RU success stories are fellow steroid users. Somewhat interesting to me. I'm at the point where prevention is kind of my goal as I'm having some thinning on my hairline but crown is dense and overall hair is dense. I'm just not convinced CB/RU will be my "holy grail" of side free prevention treatment due to the efficacy. With that said, what is this treatment you stumbled on 2 weeks ago? Can you talk about your experience with it?
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It should be. Its an anti-androgen. Dutasteride is an anti-DHT. But then Duta is oral use, and RU is topical. And if theres one thing i have learned over the years, its that orals are almost always superior to topicals.
Yes. People say that Ru is weak, but i have seen so many forum members from BB communities report great success with RU on their cycles. When i start cycling again, im definetely going to use it.
I dont know why you would think RU has side effects.
Aight, let me give you a timeline to explain why i think this method is working. Sorry for the wall of text.
https://www.hairlosstalk.com/intera...s-from-tressless.117746/page-547#post-1824812
This is my post on the big needling thread. Look at the timeline before you continue reading..
Okay, so after this initial regrowth (which happened in august, and could very well be due to the end of the shedding), nothing happened anymore. Just absolutely nothing. I thought im in the "recovering phase" now, but it wasnt. My hair just didnt improve. And then 4 weeks ago, at september 25th, my dutasteride ran out. I ordered new packages for 300$ and all of it got stuck or seized. Nothing arrived. (f*** you border patrol)
So i was getting almost no results with religious needling + dutasteride, and now the dutasteride is gone. So im "stuck" with needling alone, how am i supposed to get my hair back?
I stumbled upon this video:
Thats why i just tried it out. I mean, everyone knows about castor oil, and everyone knows about PGE 2 and its wonderful effects on hair growth. You just barely hear anyone actually using that stuff, and i've never heard of anyone taking it orally. I went into this with no expectations, taking 10ml per day.
I have a small area on my left hairline that i monitor all the time because it got decimated the most (almost went completely bald there ), so if something is truly working its going to show there, because, as i said, its by far the worst affected area of my hair due to male pattern baldness. (the pictures in the other thread showing my hairline do not show correctly just how fucked that piece of hairline was)
Because i basically just gave up all hope (previous protocol barely working, dutasteride gone) stopped checking on my hairline so frequently.
Until 2 weeks ago (2-3 weeks after i started this oral castor oil thingy), i was looking in the mirror, checking my hair, touching it with my hand, looking at my hairline (the usual thing balding people do) and my hairline immediately cought my attention. It wasnt me looking at my hairline for 20 minutes through a magnyfying glass and thinking "YES see that hair? its 0.5mm longer!". I was just casually checking out my hairline from far away and immediately saw something was different. Why? Because everything was darker. When you see a destroyed hairline for many months and it suddenly becomes a shade darker, you notice it immediately. You just know something happened at that point.
So i go closer to the mirror and kept checking that portion of hairline and i was seeing thick dark hair sprouting out of my hairline, when before it was almost completely bald.
Im not someone to jump to conclusions too early. Hair can look vastly different day to day, so gave myself another 2 weeks to be sure that hair is actually new and not just a spawn of my imagination.
2 weeks later (now) i can say for certain theres some legit hair growth happening there, that didnt exist a month ago. And it wasnt just that portion of destroyed hairline. It was everywhere around my hairline. Everywhere, little, but thick dark hairs sprouting.
So lets sum up what happened 1 month ago:
-My dutasteride ran out
-i started taking castor oil
a month later, im seeing sudden hair growth. I cant possibly grow hair when i STOP taking dutasteride. This MUST be the castor oil.
Im going to continue with this and see how my hair is going to improve. I hope its going to get better and better. I mean everyone knows how magical PGE 2 is, but we dont really know to what extent it can actually grow hair. And if this turns out to be a really good hair growth protocol and it gives me some real cosmetic improvements, im going to create a progress thread for it. Fingers crossed, i hope im not delusional with the stuff thats happening with my hair.
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If you saw my last thread I posted you would know I am a massive fan of Derek at moreplatesmoredates. The guy is incredibly knowledgeable and very transparent about what he runs and the science behind it. I watched this castor oil video when it first came out and didn't think much about it since I'm so focused in what can be done to suppress androgens. I also couldn't find any reports of oral castor oil results aside from him, so I kind of wrote off the whole idea in my head.
To speak to your question of why do I think RU has sides? It's an anti androgen that goes systemic to some level. Inhibition of androgen receptors in vital organs like the heart and eyes and lungs is very dangerous and deadly. Chest pains and blurry vision are pretty common side effects I saw reported in the various RU threads. Even though slight chest pains isn't inconvenient, it's indicative that the drug is negatively effecting the heart. I want to save my hair, but I don't want to nuke my endocrine system or compromise my vital organs in the process.
Back to the castor oil stuff, my opinion has been changed. I just ordered the castor order Derek links to thanks to your positive report. This seems low enough risk and your post was incredibly motivating to me. I will run this alongside you and we'll see what happens. A couple questions about your process. Do you just get a 10ml dropper and squirt it into your mouth every day? Also, 10ml seems like a lot. Castor oil used in doses of greater than 2ml has laxative effects and potential gut health concerns long term. That sounds kind of unpleasant. Are you experiencing other effects like beard growth or body hair growth? Any negative effects? Should it be taken with food or without food? Do you use the food grade castor oil that Derek links to or a different one?
On a side note, do you still needle? Have you always needled without minoxidil? What depth? Do you use a pen or a roller? Do you bleed when you needle? I found I had a good bit of blood and pain with a 1.5mm Dr. Pen A6. Frequency? Your needling results show a lot of new growth in the form of dense small hairs. That was posted in August, now that it's November have those hairs remained even though you dropped dutasteride? Have they grown longer or are the still short. I would love to see an updated picture of your hairline.
Sorry I have a lot of questions. But I'm very interested in your experience since we are more or less in the same boat.
Derek is using 1ml. I think I will start with 2ml and up the dose if needed.
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Its all good man, i happily answer.
I get you. As i said earlier, i didnt expect anything out of it. I only did it because i kinda got desperate when my dutasteride ran out.
I dont know about the RU. That just sounds like alot of fear mongering from other people. I personally didnt notice anything, but maybe thats just me. You can always just try it out and drop it if your heart is about to explode.
Im using a big 20ml syringe that i just put into the bottle. I drain around 6-8ml (so around 13-15ml per day), pour it into my mouth and chug it down with water. I do that twice per day, in the evening and the morning. I do believe its best to take it with food.
I was concerned about the laxative effects but its just not doing anything to me. I dont have to go to the toilet more often than i usually do. Dereks friend is taking 5ml per day, so i thought ill just guinea pig it and try 10ml. No issues. Tried 15ml, no issues. Its been 4 weeks now, no side effects whatsoever. Yes i heard about the gut problems. I dont care at this very moment. I know its reckless but i just want my god damn hair back. Ill gladly trade my gut in, for it.
Theres a brand in my country called "naissance" and i always buy oils from them as i believe they have very good quality. Its cold-pressed castor oil with a transparent, slightly yellow-ish colour. Probably the same thing derek is using https://www.amazon.de/Naissance-kal...7N21NPF9AMJ&psc=1&refRID=0SWN02B2M7N21NPF9AMJ
I shave my beard almost everyday so i cant really say anything about it. I didnt pay attention to my body hair either. I have a lot of body hair to begin with so i think i wouldnt notice much of a difference anyway.
Needling: Aight, so i started needling in april i think. Never used minoxidil. From the first day on i was using a dermastamp with 1.5 mm https://www.amazon.de/Koi-Beauty-De...ŽÕÑ&keywords=dermastamp&qid=1572489011&sr=8-6
My needling sessions have always been the same up until 2 weeks ago. I always stamped once a week with heavy bleeding, meaning i pressed really hard. Like my entire scalp was covered in blood (wasnt drooling of course). I did that every week.
So let me explain my hair growth in that update post. I did indeed experience some increased density when i posted it and it was real. But thats it. Nothing happened after that. No more growth, not even a tiny bit. I got really frustrated as i was needling religiously with dutasteride and nothing was changing. I got confused as to why i got this initial growth in august. So i came to the conclusion that the regrowth i had was just me recovering from the shedding. If you read that post you know that i was experiencing some crazy shedding that destroyed a big portion of my hair. So i guess when i recovered from that a little bit, my hair looked better. But still much worse compared to before i started the treatment. Thats how much worse my hair got from the dutasteride.
Anyways, even during that update post, while my entire scalp got a shade darker, that decimated portion of my hairline still looked like sh*t. It was untouched. Its impossible to see that in the pictures. The pictures show something thats completely different from how it looks in real life (apart from the fact that my hair got denser). Forget the hairline in those pictures, they are meaningless. But yes, my hairline stayed that way after that, its just that the dead portion of my hairline never changed. Again, impossible to see in the pictures.
The key factor here is really the dead portion of my hairline. It never recovered and never got any regrowth, even in august. And thats precisely the reason why i am so blown away by the last 2 weeks. The most fucked up portion of my hair suddenly started spourting thick dark hairs everywhere. Something that dutasteride + needling didnt achieve in 10 months.
I took pictures 2 weeks ago of my hairline and the regrowth, and again 5 days ago. Im going to keep track of it.
I was just gonna upload the picture but somehow bringing the pictures from my phone to my computer completely messed up the image. My hair looks way worse on the computer than it does on my phone. It doesnt represent what it actually looks like in real life, which is why i didnt post them. The pictures are actually good but they just get messed up putting them on my computer. Ill try to explain:
See the red circle? Thats the dead portion of my hairline. Its actually slightly larger and goes deeper into my hairline than whats shown in the picture.
Anyways, this does NOT represent what you actually see in person. Those hairs in the red circle, even those very thinn and tiny ones you can barely see are actually very DARK and THICK and very visible. They look like the hairs you can see on the left, where the arrow is poiting at and i mean it. I actually have no idea why putting those pictures on my computer distorts and frauds the picture so much. But just believe what i say.
In fact, that distorted picture is a good representation of what it used to look like just a month ago, even worse than that.
Now theres one more thing i noticed. See the green area? That part is completely independent from anything thats happening with my hair. It has always looked the same, wether i lost hair or regrew it. I also didnt needle it, and i could swear those hairs there got darker and longer too.
I know im making a big fuss about some hairs on my hairline, but you would understand it if you were me. I looked at my hairline for 10 months almost everyday. 10 months on dutasteride and needling, with almost no change whatsoever. This is by far the most male pattern baldness effected area of my scalp/hair. This where i have the biggest damage. And a combination of needling and dutasteride wasnt able to do sh*t to it after 10 months.
So i start drinking castor oil for 2 weeks and see the first actual real regrowth there for the first time since almost a year. Thats just a very huge indicator to me that the castor oil is actually doing something. This might sound like alot of yadda yadda to you but i hope you understand what im trying to say here. My fingers are still crossed and im not expecting any miracles, but literally 2 weeks of castor oil have done more than 10 months of duta and needling.
Now theres one thing i forgot: As i wasnt getting an real progress with my previous needling protocol, i decided to change it up 2 weeks ago. Instead of stabbing my scalp like a madman, ill just go deep enough to cause some redness of the scalp and nothing more, like they did in the studies. You might argue that im getting this regrowth because im needling correctly now, but i just think thats very unlikely. I still hope its actually doing better for my hair than what i previously did.
Theres one more thing im trying to figure out:
PGE2, needling and hairloss in generall all have something to do with inflammation. Many people believe that inflammation can cause hairloss.
We also know that PGE2, like any prostaglandin is an agonist for inflammation as weird as that sounds. And many people also believe that the inflammation caused by needling is whats causing the hair growth.
There are several anti-inflammatory oils out there that i have stocked up at home. I just cant decide wether i should fight inflammation on my scalp or not by applying these oils everyday. On one hand i could be inhibiting hair growth induced by PGE2 or needling, on the other hand i could speed up the process if those procedures are working independently from inflammation.
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So Ive seen a guy on youtube mixing RU+alfatradion,could that be a good idea?I mean alfatradion(pantostin) is dirty cheap(about 40 euros for 300ml).Havent really found anything better,im already using minoxidil and I will probably be stacking topicals(RU 2 hours after minoxidil).
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Why wouldnt you just use pure ethanol or alcohol and PG ?
I cant my scalp will be a complete mess than,thats why im using foam minoxidil right now.