List Of Strongest To Weakest Antiandrogens

[DHTcel]

DHT is the only hormone that has been proven to be involved in hair loss. The belief that other hormones can be involved is not proven and is just speculation. It is irresponsible and dangerous to be making these sorts of claims, and to be advertising to newcomers these very powerful transgender-like treatments that will basically turn a man into a woman. It is a known and proven fact that 5ar type 2 deficient males never lose any hair at all. It is also a known and proven fact that finasteride and dutasteride are incredibly effective for hair loss. Just look at the studies if you don't believe me. If DHT was not by far the biggest culprit in hair loss, these facts simply wouldn't be the case.

Completely wrong, first of all hair loss is not hormonal, it is genetic. Second of all, hair loss is an androgen dependent condition, not dht dependent. Maybe you should open up a textbook before making such uneducated claims.you are the only irresponsible and dangerous one here. @Ikarus and I are proof alone you are wrong.

 

[hemingway_the_mercenary]

I don't know a lot about endocrinology, but I'd like to ask if the others of these reduce actual DHT levels — either directly or indirectly — to the same extent as finasteride and dutasteride are able to?

Lmfao dude you don’t have a cluuee...

 

[TK421]

androgens cause hair loss, not only dht. look at my thread here: https://www.hairlosstalk.com/intera...on-androgenetic-alopecia.123178/#post-1806171

I think my hair might also be sensitive to testosterone. If that's the case, could taking bica make my hairloss worse since it increases testosterone?

 

[Ikarus]

DHT is the only hormone that has been proven to be involved in hair loss. The belief that other hormones can be involved is not proven and is just speculation. It is irresponsible and dangerous to be making these sorts of claims, and to be advertising to newcomers these very powerful transgender-like treatments that will basically turn a man into a woman. It is a known and proven fact that 5ar type 2 deficient males never lose any hair at all. It is also a known and proven fact that finasteride and dutasteride are incredibly effective for hair loss. Just look at the studies if you don't believe me. If DHT was not by far the biggest culprit in hair loss, these facts simply wouldn't be the case.

A significant amount of women don’t respond to 5AR inhibitors and continue to lose hair. Using an oral anti-androgen is what combats female pattern hair loss in most cases, due to such a significant sensitivity to androgens. Within women, they combat androgens to treat hair loss; they do not use 5AR inhibitors.

Studies which conducted that men with 5ARD ‘never go bald’ are old studies and were mainly focused on such people having smaller prostates. I believe they can go bald, similar to women since they have significantly less DHT than men, due to a sensitivity to androgens.

If DHT was truly the ‘only’ cause of hair loss, then why aren’t there any permanent responders? Wouldn’t there be no non-responders?

 

[Ikarus]

I think my hair might also be sensitive to testosterone. If that's the case, could taking bica make my hairloss worse since it increases testosterone?

That increase in T is blocked

 

[Father_of_Shiseido]

It has been observed in studies of different groups of these individuals. There have been large numbers of 5ar type 2 deficient males studied in places such as the Dominican Republic, Turkey, and Papua New Guinea. In all of these individuals, there was no evidence of any hair loss.

I also read the same thing and in addition to that they never grew their beard.

 

[I'mme]

I also read the same thing and in addition to that they never grew their beard.

Hahaha

 

[Greenlandic guy]

Completely wrong, first of all hair loss is not hormonal, it is genetic. Second of all, hair loss is an androgen dependent condition, not dht dependent. Maybe you should open up a textbook before making such uneducated claims.you are the only irresponsible and dangerous one here. @Ikarus and I are proof alone you are wrong.

I never denied that hair loss is genetic in the first place. DHT levels and the level of sensitivity to DHT of the hair follicles are both mostly genetically determined. Hair loss is initially triggered by DHT antagonizing the androgen receptors of the hair follicles, which in turn causes a cascade of events that ultimately leads to miniaturization of the follicles. DHT is the only hormone that has been proven to be capable of antagonizing the androgen receptors of the hair follicles.

A significant amount of women don’t respond to 5AR inhibitors and continue to lose hair. Using an oral anti-androgen is what combats female pattern hair loss in most cases, due to such a significant sensitivity to androgens. Within women, they combat androgens to treat hair loss; they do not use 5AR inhibitors.

Studies which conducted that men with 5ARD ‘never go bald’ are old studies and were mainly focused on such people having smaller prostates. I believe they can go bald, similar to women since they have significantly less DHT than men, due to a sensitivity to androgens.

If DHT was truly the ‘only’ cause of hair loss, then why aren’t there any permanent responders? Wouldn’t there be no non-responders?

There are much more recent studies on 5ar type 2 deficiency also. There are a large amount of individual case studies as well as larger scale studies on groups of these individuals in different parts of the world that have been performed. To date there is no evidence that these individuals ever lose any of their hair.

 

[Ikarus]

I never denied that hair loss is genetic in the first place. DHT levels and the level of sensitivity to DHT of the hair follicles are both mostly genetically determined. Hair loss is initially triggered by DHT antagonizing the androgen receptors of the hair follicles, which in turn causes a cascade of events that ultimately leads to miniaturization of the follicles. DHT is the only hormone that has been proven to be capable of antagonizing the androgen receptors of the hair follicles.


There are much more recent studies on 5ar type 2 deficiency also. There are a large amount of individual case studies as well as larger scale studies on groups of these individuals in different parts of the world that have been performed. To date there is no evidence that these individuals ever lose any of their hair.

You completely disregarded the other information I provided. Nonetheless, there isn't much information on those with 5ARD in general. However, since there are a significant amount of 5AR inhibitor users worldwide, we can assume that DHT isn't the single cause of androgenic alopecia. If DHT was truly the single cause of hair loss, surely there would be at least one person who has had permanent results from 5AR inhibitors? If there isn't DHT, what other hormone could miniaturise the follicle? Why don't particular men respond to 5AR inhibitors? Why don't women generally respond to 5AR inhibitors? Why were younger patients within finasteride studies less responsive to finasteride compared to their older counterparts? Why do 5AR users eventually experience a significant loss in effectiveness?

 

[bridgeburn]

But why is it that males who have congenital 5ar type 2 deficiency never lose any of their hair?

If I jump up and down right now, it doesn't hurt me. That's testosterone.

If I jump off a building and then my legs become injured. That's DHT

If I try to jump up and down again. It would hurt me this time because I am already injured. Thats testosterone after being exposed to DHT.


- Eunuchs castrated before puberty do not go bald.

- physical castration after years of baldness doesn't reverse hairloss but stops its progression.
Going back to the previous hormonal state as before doesn't put you in the same physical state as you were before.
Otherwise, Dutasteride would be a cure for everybody. but If you start dutasteride early enough it Might stop or slow the progression.. some have too aggressive hairloss, and need to go beyond, reducing any adrogenic signalling as much as possible so that the hair can have a chance to recover

 

[DHTcel]

I think my hair might also be sensitive to testosterone. If that's the case, could taking bica make my hairloss worse since it increases testosterone?

no, bicalutaamide at 100mg reduces androgen signaling in the body by 97% that value is 25% for finasteride and 35% on dutasteride

 

[Father_of_Shiseido]

You completely disregarded the other information I provided. Nonetheless, there isn't much information on those with 5ARD in general. However, since there are a significant amount of 5AR inhibitor users worldwide, we can assume that DHT isn't the single cause of androgenic alopecia. If DHT was truly the single cause of hair loss, surely there would be at least one person who has had permanent results from 5AR inhibitors? If there isn't DHT, what other hormone could miniaturise the follicle? Why don't particular men respond to 5AR inhibitors? Why don't women generally respond to 5AR inhibitors? Why were younger patients within finasteride studies less responsive to finasteride compared to their older counterparts? Why do 5AR users eventually experience a significant loss in effectiveness?

DHT is the sole hormone which triggers male pattern baldness. However, once the process is started, DHT inhibition is not always the answer to male pattern baldness. In order to win the battle against male pattern baldness, you have to replace testosterone by estrogen. Even then we have the example of @ithymadscalpe who did not respond to full hrt.

 

[Father_of_Shiseido]

no, bicalutaamide at 100mg reduces androgen signaling in the body by 97% that value is 25% for finasteride and 35% on dutasteride

35% for dutasteride but a what dose?

 

[Father_of_Shiseido]

If I jump up and down right now, it doesn't hurt me. That's testosterone.

If I jump off a building and then my legs become injured. That's DHT

If I try to jump up and down again. It would hurt me this time because I am already injured. Thats testosterone after being exposed to DHT.


- Eunuchs castrated before puberty do not go bald.

- physical castration after years of baldness doesn't reverse hairloss but stops its progression.
Going back to the previous hormonal state as before doesn't put you in the same physical state as you were before.
Otherwise, Dutasteride would be a cure for everybody. but If you start dutasteride early enough it Might stop or slow the progression.. some have too aggressive hairloss, and need to go beyond, reducing any adrogenic signalling as much as possible so that the hair can have a chance to recover

A very nice analogy.

 

[DHTcel]

35% for dutasteride but a what dose?

look at the chart

 

[Father_of_Shiseido]

look at the chart

Ok, I got it. It is 0.5 mg of dutasteride. What about 2.5 mg dutasteride? Do you have a similar result for the same?

 

[michel sapin]

i wouldn't use ralox if I were you . I also used it for 4 month and it has hurted my hairline.
We have no studies proving it doesn't hurt hair such as tamox. And it has almost the same mechanism in the hair follicle.

 

[DHTcel]

i wouldn't use ralox if I were you . I also used it for 4 month and it has hurted my hairline.
We have no studies proving it doesn't hurt hair such as tamox. And it has almost the same mechanism in the hair follicle.

yeah but u are only using finasteride, if I was on finasteride and getting gyno I wouldn't bother going above 15mg raloxifine. 60mg which was the dose u probably used is enough if not more than enough to offset the hair benefits of finasteride and possibly put you in a worse situation. Remember finasteride is widely recognized as the weakest anti androgen.

 

[DHTcel]

Ok, I got it. It is 0.5 mg of dutasteride. What about 2.5 mg dutasteride? Do you have a similar result for the same?

I couldn't find any graphs using 2.5mg dutasteride, considering DHT inhibition of finasteride is 70% and has a 25% reduction in PSA, and dutasteride has dht inhibition of 95% at 0.5mg and a 35% reduction in PSA. I would not expect any much more reduction of PSA at 2.5mg considering 0.5mg already reduces DHT by 95%

source: "A total of 399 patients with BPH were randomized to receive once-daily dosing for 24 wk of dutasteride (0.01, 0.05, 0.5, 2.5, or 5.0 mg), 5 mg finasteride, or placebo. The mean percent decrease in DHT was 98.4 ± 1.2% with 5.0 mg dutasteride and 94.7 ± 3.3% with 0.5 mg dutasteride, significantly lower (P < 0.001) and with less variability than the 70.8 ± 18.3% suppression observed with 5 mg finasteride"

 

[michel sapin]

yeah but u are only using finasteride, if I was on finasteride and getting gyno I wouldn't bother going above 15mg raloxifine. 60mg which was the dose u probably used is enough if not more than enough to offset the hair benefits of finasteride and possibly put you in a worse situation. Remember finasteride is widely recognized as the weakest anti androgen.

i was on dutasteride 0.5 mg and minoxidil bro while taing ralox...