Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[JaneyElizabeth]

The problem here is that none of you have either a set, proven protocol, and I mean, one that is exactly the same as worked for someone else without dispute. You either add to them or modify them which can change effects.

The other issue is that MtF's shoot for specific hormonal profiles and increase dosage until they get there. No one appears to have set goal levels of T, DHT and E2 to shoot for in this discussion so it's not clear at which dosages, one should desist, increase or maintain dosage. What are the goals? Better hair? Maintenance? Regrowth? Increased anagen? Restoration? No, mostly it seems that the goal is inarticulately stated as "more hair".

Many of you already have much or most of your hair which is a different situation from the already balding and I expect that to be quite helpful to you but your results won't likely translate for even the moderately bald at the same dosages.

 

[tato123]

The problem here is that none of you have either a set, proven protocol, and I mean, one that is exactly the same as worked for someone else without dispute. You either add to them or modify them which can change effects.

The other issue is that MtF's shoot for specific hormonal profiles and increase dosage until they get there. No one appears to have set goal levels of T, DHT and E2 to shoot for in this discussion so it's not clear at which dosages, one should desist, increase or maintain dosage. What are the goals? Better hair? "Maintenance? Regrowth? Increased anagen? Restoration? No, mostly it seems that the goal is inarticulately stated as "more hair".

Many of you already have much or most of your hair which is a different situation from the already balding and I expect that to be quite helpful to you but your results won't likely translate for even the moderately bald at the same dosages.

As I said in other posts, the right thing is to study and discover your treatment better to you, as you said, we are all at different levels of baldness, and there is the issue of strong biological individuality here as well.

Since baldness has several different forms of action it is fair to expect that people will have different results with the same treatments.

In the end we are here to say that it is possible to have regrowth and the path we used to reach it, now if it will work for everyone I think that would not be true because is not possible

Malnutrition, lack of vitamins, hypothyroidism, chronic increase in serum glucose, I don't know the possibilities are endless.

However if your problem is hormonal, it is a cake batter, the question is what dosage you need and what medications. BICA, CPA, MPA, estrogen?

I agree with you, it is much more complex than I really want more hair.


Hello janey

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

As I said in other posts, the right thing is to study and discover your treatment better to you, as you said, we are all at different levels of baldness, and there is the issue of strong biological individuality here as well.

Since baldness has several different forms of action it is fair to expect that people will have different results with the same treatments.

In the end we are here to say that it is possible to have regrowth and the path we used to reach it, now if it will work for everyone I think that would not be true because is not possible

Malnutrition, lack of vitamins, hypothyroidism, chronic increase in serum glucose, I don't know the possibilities are endless.

However if your problem is hormonal, it is a cake batter, the question is what dosage you need and what medications. BICA, CPA, MPA, estrogen?

I agree with you, it is much more complex than I really want more hair.


Hello janey

I understand the difficulties in self-application in science. There's tension between creating more data points and creating better data points. Just by way of an example, and we all do this, I see people making categorical statements about dosages when we all differ in goals and genetic make-up. We don't know why but spironolactone, CPA and bica all work better for some individuals than others. One person might get nothing from CPA but copious growth from spironolactone so we are hampered right there before we even discuss sides.

It's always better to phrase things such as "at doses above 12.5mg daily, bica has been known to do X" instead of saying that 12.5 mg of bica will fix you right up or eliminate your problem or what have you. My goal is to show that huge amounts of E2 resulting in persistently high serum E2 levels can reverse male pattern baldness. I think that @bridgeburn's goal was similar, to show that ultimately baldness can be defeated with blunt force, one might say. We haven't really even established this point in terms of recognition of such individuals or more studies.

So, below the female threshold of say 200 to 300 pg/ml, the search is on to see if any particular levels improve hair loss or whether regrowth is on a spectrum, or whether regrowth is more like a light-switch where the body only "decides" to utilize scarce resources to rebuild scalp hair once the body realizes that a person is chemically female. Until that point, the body might be pretty eh about whether the person needs hair to fulfill their role as a human.

 

[tato123]

I understand the difficulties in self-application in science. There's tension between creating more data points and creating better data points. Just by way of an example, and we all do this, I see people making categorical statements about dosages when we all differ in goals and genetic make-up. We don't know why but spironolactone, CPA and bica all work better for some individuals than others. One person might get nothing from CPA but copious growth from spironolactone so we are hampered right there before we even discuss sides.

It's always better to phrase things such as "at doses above 12.5mg daily, bica has been known to do X" instead of saying that 12.5 mg of bica will fix you right up or eliminate your problem or what have you. My goal is to show that huge amounts of E2 resulting in persistently high serum E2 levels can reverse male pattern baldness. I think that @bridgeburn's goal was similar, to show that ultimately baldness can be defeated with blunt force, one might say. We haven't really even established this point in terms of recognition of such individuals or more studies.

So, below the female threshold of say 200 to 300 pg/ml, the search is on to see if any particular levels improve hair loss or whether regrowth is on a spectrum, or whether regrowth is more like a light-switch where the body only "decides" to utilize scarce resources to rebuild scalp hair once the body realizes that a person is chemically female. Until that point, the body might be pretty eh about whether the person needs hair to fulfill their role as a human.

Thanks for the wise conscience and experience, janey

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Thanks for the wise conscience and experience, janey

Can you explain why you use metformin?

Also I would say for folks to look for changes in skin in general as a possible launching point for at least some re-growth since hair and skin are closely related.

 

[Ticken]

I got excessive oxidative stress, hurting my (blood) cells.

I also have a laboratory up-close picture of them, might share them later. They look like they´re dying lol

May I ask, how was your oxidative stressed measured?
And do you know the root cause of your oxidative stress (induced by high glucose etc)?
Resveratrol not only lowers adrenal androgens but might also be beneficial for oxidative stress.

Role of resveratrol in regulation of cellular defense systems against oxidative stress - PubMed

Resveratrol, a natural polyphenolic compound, is found in various kinds of fruits, plants, and their commercial products such as red wine. It has been demonstrated to exhibit a variety of health-promoting effects including prevention and/or treatment of cardiovascular diseases, inflammation...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[tato123]

Can you explain why you use metformin?

Also I would say for folks to look for changes in skin in general as a possible launching point for at least some re-growth since hair and skin are closely related.

https://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/threads/ampk-route-metformin-akg-the-max-summary.131805/

I made a post , check janey

 

[Androgenic Alpaca]

The problem here is that none of you have either a set, proven protocol, and I mean, one that is exactly the same as worked for someone else without dispute. You either add to them or modify them which can change effects.

The other issue is that MtF's shoot for specific hormonal profiles and increase dosage until they get there. No one appears to have set goal levels of T, DHT and E2 to shoot for in this discussion so it's not clear at which dosages, one should desist, increase or maintain dosage. What are the goals? Better hair? Maintenance? Regrowth? Increased anagen? Restoration? No, mostly it seems that the goal is inarticulately stated as "more hair".

Many of you already have much or most of your hair which is a different situation from the already balding and I expect that to be quite helpful to you but your results won't likely translate for even the moderately bald at the same dosages.

Nobody here is doing science. And I don't mean that perjoratively, this is just simply not what science is. If we had millions of dollars maybe we could actually develop a hair growth plan that works for most people, but the truth is right now everyone here is just feeling around in the dark hoping to maximize their results. I think it's been proven that altering hormones can improve hair, however there is no formula and no matter how much discussion we have on this forum we will never arrive at a formula. We can come up with speculation but really we'll never have anything more.

 

[Yar]

The problem here is that none of you have either a set, proven protocol, and I mean, one that is exactly the same as worked for someone else without dispute. You either add to them or modify them which can change effects.

The other issue is that MtF's shoot for specific hormonal profiles and increase dosage until they get there. No one appears to have set goal levels of T, DHT and E2 to shoot for in this discussion so it's not clear at which dosages, one should desist, increase or maintain dosage. What are the goals? Better hair? "Maintenance? Regrowth? Increased anagen? Restoration? No, mostly it seems that the goal is inarticulately stated as "more hair".

Many of you already have much or most of your hair which is a different situation from the already balding and I expect that to be quite helpful to you but your results won't likely translate for even the moderately bald

 

[Yar]

Я проведу эксперемент,я на протяжении месяца не буду есть ничего подавляюще сахарного,это кофе 3-1,сахар,напитки газированные,конфеты,печенье,кока кола,сладкие чаи,сладкие булки,сгущенка,паста шоколаднаяВсе что содержит в себе много сахара.У меня будет обычная еда!

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Nobody here is doing science. And I don't mean that perjoratively, this is just simply not what science is. If we had millions of dollars maybe we could actually develop a hair growth plan that works for most people, but the truth is right now everyone here is just feeling around in the dark hoping to maximize their results. I think it's been proven that altering hormones can improve hair, however there is no formula and no matter how much discussion we have on this forum we will never arrive at a formula. We can come up with speculation but really we'll never have anything more.

All true. It's just that it's chaotic for even semi-outsiders to understand. With @bridgeburn, you had essentially one main voice articulating and this person was on an extended HRT formula plus oral min that was pretty easy to follow. At times, he would change AA's or go off AA's but his protocol appeared to be one that shot for well above adult female levels.

A lot of this is exactly the same with the topical use of estrogen on the scalp and which makes me shy away from categorical statements about Estrogel while using it in basically unlimited amounts of scalp and other places. It might just be the climara patches. I take some premarin, cheap and reputed to be extra good for breast modeling. Perhaps it works better for hair too but who knows?

So all's I knows is that everywhere I slathered Estrogel, the area got big, in terms of below the neck usage. The two main examples are breasts and incipient female waist/hips towards pear shape. I put it on my face and my face looked better and younger. I tried it on my hair and I experienced a period of increasing hair regrowth. Maybe all of these things would have happened just from oral E2 or a higher dosage of premarin but for me, they were all associated with direct and copious topical estrogen use. But if someone XY just pm's me, I stammer a bit as to whether estrogen topicals matter at all or if they even work. That's because we don't have the science to back up my anecdotal assertions but I have seen substantial changes even from scrotal application which is recommended for many MtF's now and the entire area appears to be far more estrogenized and intersex in aspect. My foreskin grew back, at least a huge amount of it but it resembles more a clitoral hood. The entire area is fleshy and plump and it never was like this prior to HRT.

So the changes on genitalia can be substantial, even more substantial than many imagine they would be on the penis. The penis loses very little actual size but it starts behaving like a clitoris as do the scrotum. How do I know? Well, the tissue begins to move and structure itself differently. The penis is no longer anchored but basically is along for the ride whenever the "mound" is manipulated or moved. There's a pseudo-opening and pseudo-mons. Only stereotypical female methods of masturbation work like vibration or direct pressure against something like my teddy bear. Up and down movements do nothing.

Now I am on mega-amounts of hormones but if anything the questions about will one's dick or nut shrinkage are off-target per se. The issue is more so whether they will substantially feminize then any size differences. The penis will develop a tendency to be more so internal but if you yank on it, the length varies little. If you hold the entire area down until the pubic bone, which anchors the penis, losses of fifty percent of length are possible. Remember, penile tissue equals labia minora tissue and scrotal equals labia majora tissue, and these areas may begin behaving much more like the XX equivalents. So, by putting pressure on the mound-like area below the penis/clitoris, said organ will retrench into what now acts as a clitoral hood and be more anchored. Below that, one can press quite far into the indentation and the same sorts of female stimuli work, meaning things that push the scrotal/labia majora tissue apart as much as possible. A phallic-shaped item can be used roughly equivalently to cis-female phallus use, even though there is no actual opening.

So while I have been dismissive of the penis shrinking questions, I believe that the potential changes to XY genitalia from MtF HRT can be exceedingly profound to the point that surgery might seem superfluous as everything changes and inverts.

 

[Pls_NW-1]

May I ask, how was your oxidative stressed measured?
And do you know the root cause of your oxidative stress (induced by high glucose etc)?
Resveratrol not only lowers adrenal androgens but might also be beneficial for oxidative stress.

Role of resveratrol in regulation of cellular defense systems against oxidative stress - PubMed

Resveratrol, a natural polyphenolic compound, is found in various kinds of fruits, plants, and their commercial products such as red wine. It has been demonstrated to exhibit a variety of health-promoting effects including prevention and/or treatment of cardiovascular diseases, inflammation...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

It's most likely due to my lifestyle and psychological issues (stress). I dunno how the Doctor measured it, but he showed me clear pictures of my blood cells and they were actually dying.

 

[Fuchsilein]

https://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/threads/ampk-route-metformin-akg-the-max-summary.131805/

I made a post , check janey

I am also using Metformin, but for different reasons. Good to know that it is also beneficial for hair. Thanks!

 

[Yar]

Второй день,чувствую себя хорошо,пока никаких позывов съесть сахар

 

[Yar]

Ребята может кто знает за счет чего волос приобретает длинну ?у меня см волосы но никак не становятся длинными

 

[Pls_NW-1]

Ребята может кто знает за счет чего волос приобретает длинну ?у меня см волосы но никак не становятся длинными

Sorry, I couldn't follow yesterday... What are you taking now, Yar?

 

[Yar]

Извини, вчера я не мог проследить ... Что ты сейчас берешь, Яр?

Сейчас я беру эстрадиол в геле и прогестерон.В зонах андрогенной алопеции у меня выросли маленькие волосики,они никак не могут набрать длинну

 

[Yar]

Мне нужен гормон роста,немного гормона роста который стимулирует рост тканей

 

[Pls_NW-1]

Мне нужен гормон роста,немного гормона роста который стимулирует рост тканей

No! Excessive IFG-1 is bad for A.G.A.

 

[Pls_NW-1]

I am honestly worried with my hair, it gets downhill pretty fast, damn.

@Yar Also, nice hair!