Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[JaneyElizabeth]

Try retin-a or copper peptides at night, maybe vitamin c serum during the day, collagen and MSM supplements along with Vitamin C. Needling at 1.5mm is good, only do it once a month though, no need to do it more although you can use 0.25mm more often. No need for a big complex regimen or anything, you are covering all the bases with that, maybe a moderate strength glycolic acid peel now and again

I am currently microneedling at 2.0 mm, between one and three times weekly and I find the longer needles to be more effective and less taxing in terms of scalp damage. Particularly with the longer needle gauges you don't have to press as hard and they are much better for moderate to long hair lengths. It works great on the skin and on scars as well. I had it done once in a salon to see how much damage required how much down time and derma-rolling at home seems actually less taxing than whatever they used on my face at the salon was. Recovery time for the salon treatment was actually twice as long I would say.

The other thing that I have done that seems like a no-brainer is to have the masseter muscles relaxed by botox. This is mentioned on Perfect Hair Health and there are studies as well. It is possible that men's chewing muscles add to surface tension and cause baldness. Botox isn't expensive and it makes basically everyone more attractive.

 

[ReturnOfExtreme]

Just based upon this thread, the jump up from 2 mg might be helpful. Many of those struggling seem to max out at 2 mg of estradiol while hoping that the AA will be enough to push them over the edge but except for @bridgeburn and me, nobody seems to be taking over 4 mg of estradiol daily orally. He did use sublingually at times while I only use parenteral currently, except for a booster of 1.25 Premarin in the morning and evening of late. We don't have much research but hitting adult female targets for E and T seems necessary for hair growth while being completely unnecessary for breast growth. The issue for non-MtFs is that you have to go through the breast growth part of the experience before you can proceed to the hair growth part.

In terms of hair loss, however, lesser amounts of estrogen might work to prevent hair loss. Yes, dutasteride can as well but dutasteride is a mere palliative while estrogen is more of a cure. Overall, the estrogen experience is stupefying in terms of tissue renewal and youth effects in my case and I think that anyone who looks at transition pics will say that these youth effects are often incredible pictorially.

I was extremely lucky to have an androgynous appearance pre-HRT, so I feminised enough from 2mg to have an unidentifiable gender with short hair, so I’m hoping with longer hair I look more feminine. I shaved my head last year after a mental breakdown so I’m waiting for it to grow long again. I want to feminise more though, hence my increase in dosages. I’m not bothered about breast growth so much but I’m more focused on facial feminisation and more bodily feminisation.

It’s true. On E, after shaving my head, I looked 14 whilst being 19. It made me look significantly more youthful. Have you seen a decrease in age based on your appearance? Bridgeb looks around 18 to me, especially if he has his facial hair removed.

 

[franzliszt]

I have been on HRT for two years or so. I am on the waiting list to see a gender specialist currently, I’ve been on the list since 2019.

I am currently microneedling at 2.0 mm, between one and three times weekly and I find the longer needles to be more effective and less taxing in terms of scalp damage. Particularly with the longer needle gauges you don't have to press as hard and they are much better for moderate to long hair lengths. It works great on the skin and on scars as well. I had it done once in a salon to see how much damage required how much down time and derma-rolling at home seems actually less taxing than whatever they used on my face at the salon was. Recovery time for the salon treatment was actually twice as long I would say.

The other thing that I have done that seems like a no-brainer is to have the masseter muscles relaxed by botox. This is mentioned on Perfect Hair Health and there are studies as well. It is possible that men's chewing muscles add to surface tension and cause baldness. Botox isn't expensive and it makes basically everyone more attractive.

I've also had the massater botox, It really helps to slim jaw. My scalp also feels more malleable, which my be a combination the the botox and scalp massages.

 

[franzliszt]

I was extremely lucky to have an androgynous appearance pre-HRT, so I feminised enough from 2mg to have an unidentifiable gender with short hair, so I’m hoping with longer hair I look more feminine. I shaved my head last year after a mental breakdown so I’m waiting for it to grow long again. I want to feminise more though, hence my increase in dosages. I’m not bothered about breast growth so much but I’m more focused on facial feminisation and more bodily feminisation.

It’s true. On E, after shaving my head, I looked 14 whilst being 19. It made me look significantly more youthful. Have you seen a decrease in age based on your appearance? Bridgeb looks around 18 to me, especially if he has his facial hair removed.

2 years seems long enough to increase your E dosage, I started out much higher which probably wasn't the best way to do it. I think if you're on HRT and still in boymode, you'll end up looking years younger; someone asked if I was 16 at work (despite my NW3 hair).

 

[ReturnOfExtreme]

2 years seems long enough to increase your E dosage, I started out much higher which probably wasn't the best way to do it. I think if you're on HRT and still in boymode, you'll end up looking years younger; someone asked if I was 16 at work (despite my NW3 hair).

I can pass as a girl in boy-mode with some makeup and clothing. I dress as a girl regardless, which helps too. But without makeup, I’ve had people on my hookups ask if I’m legal... Which is embarrassing, but I put my transition first.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

I've also had the massater botox, It really helps to slim jaw. My scalp also feels more malleable, which my be a combination the the botox and scalp massages.

I stopped the massages although I did get to the point where the skin was much more malleable. I was doing the massages and the derma-rolling when I shed and the massages to me, along with the spironolactone were the culprit. Those massages are harsh and for people who still have much or most of their hair, might be less beneficial than for those dealing with bare scalp tissue where there is nothing to shed. When a benevolent shed comes, it is hard to slow down, though since essentially the scalp/hair system is saying that it is moving forward towards a new type of "better" hair.

2 years seems long enough to increase your E dosage, I started out much higher which probably wasn't the best way to do it. I think if you're on HRT and still in boymode, you'll end up looking years younger; someone asked if I was 16 at work (despite my NW3 hair).

I agree with this. I present younger, except for hair, as male. For lack of a better word, I have always had a boyish quality and without any beard now, that's similar to 15, 16, 17 year old boys. Longer hair to me seems to be far more feminizing and it also adds maturity to my look. As soon as my own hair is long enough to frame my face, which should be by the first of the year, I expect to be essentially androgynous. At that point, things like painted nails and jewelry and clothing choices become paramount in terms of signalling others as to whether I am presenting as male, female or other. I love everything about HRT but that's just playing with the house money since I am in this, above all, for the hair!

And the hair improvement is thrilling. I know what it feels like to have the wind at my back in this restoration quest and it is wonderful, Goddess preserve, and I hope you guys get to know what I mean. Waking up each day and checking the hand mirror in the lighted mirror and actually seeing something different and positive that can be proved pictorially as opposed to other past treatments or periods where I was afraid to look in the mirror.

 

[franzliszt]

I stopped the massages although I did get to the point where the skin was much more malleable. I was doing the massages and the derma-rolling when I shed and the massages to me, along with the spironolactone were the culprit. Those massages are harsh and for people who still have much or most of their hair, might be less beneficial than for those dealing with bare scalp tissue where there is nothing to shed. When a benevolent shed comes, it is hard to slow down, though since essentially the scalp/hair system is saying that it is moving forward towards a new type of "better" hair.

I agree with this. I present younger, except for hair, as male. For lack of a better word, I have always had a boyish quality and without any beard now, that's similar to 15, 16, 17 year old boys. Longer hair to me seems to be far more feminizing and it also adds maturity to my look. As soon as my own hair is long enough to frame my face, which should be by the first of the year, I expect to be essentially androgynous. At that point, things like painted nails and jewelry and clothing choices become paramount in terms of signalling others as to whether I am presenting as male, female or other. I love everything about HRT but that's just playing with the house money since I am in this, above all, for the hair!

And the hair improvement is thrilling. I know what it feels like to have the wind at my back in this restoration quest and it is wonderful, Goddess preserve, and I hope you guys get to know what I mean. Waking up each day and checking the hand mirror in the lighted mirror and actually seeing something different and positive that can be proved pictorially as opposed to other past treatments or periods where I was afraid to look in the mirror.

Estrogen really does change you. I think we started off the same way, initially it was just for the hair, but all the benefits of E started showing and then the thought of transition started.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Estrogen really does change you. I think we started off the same way, initially it was just for the hair, but all the benefits of E started showing and then the thought of transition started.

Looks are subjective but in my case, I think that I present much more nicely either as a male or a female than I did as a male at the age of 53. It's hard to explain but I felt used up before HRT and I all but literally feel like I have the body of a 20-something person again.

The thing that probably most fear is the loss of strength. This does occur but once I went off spironolactone, I seemed to snap back in terms of strength fairly quickly. I will have to see with my old hand weights but I really don't miss any strength. Flexibility and the way that my body now moves makes up for it and it isn't even close. The sexual aspect can be just as good especially when not using an AA. Regardless, the fixation aspect is largely gone and that is one of the most oppressive things about testosterone/DHT.

 

[DogoDiLaurentiis]

I just found this and figured it might be of interest to the rest of you, as much as zinc is beneficial for many things, the fact that it substantially increases IGF-1 makes it a pretty strong liability factor for people struggling with hair loss of a potentially unknown etiology.

You need some IGF-1 to live and function properly, but in excess it is toxic to hair.

The influence of zinc supplementation on IGF-1 levels in humans: A systematic review and meta-analysis

The effect of supplementation with zinc on levels of IGF-1 remains relatively unexplored, and many of previous studies have reported equivocal finding…

www.sciencedirect.com

The same can also be said for vit-D as well, which makes maintaining a balance of that hormone and constraining IGF-1 a challenge.

Vitamin D, IGF-1, Growth Hormone Have Deep Ties

Vitamin D and insulin-like growth factor-1 (IGF-1) are involved in a complex interplay that may have implications for growth hormone dosing, researchers found.

www.medpagetoday.org

Serum IGF1 concentration is positively associated with 25-hydroxyvitamin D level and increases upon treatment with vitamin D | ICEECE2012 | 15th International & 14th European Congress of Endocrinology | Endocrine Abstracts

www.endocrine-abstracts.org

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

I just found this and figured it might be of interest to the rest of you, as much as zinc is beneficial for many things, the fact that it substantially increases IGF-1 makes it a pretty strong liability factor for people struggling with hair loss of a potentially unknown etiology.

You need some IGF-1 to live and function properly, but in excess it is toxic to hair.

The influence of zinc supplementation on IGF-1 levels in humans: A systematic review and meta-analysis

The effect of supplementation with zinc on levels of IGF-1 remains relatively unexplored, and many of previous studies have reported equivocal finding…

www.sciencedirect.com

The same can also be said for vit-D as well, which makes maintaining a balance of that hormone and constraining IGF-1 a challenge.

Vitamin D, IGF-1, Growth Hormone Have Deep Ties

Vitamin D and insulin-like growth factor-1 (IGF-1) are involved in a complex interplay that may have implications for growth hormone dosing, researchers found.

www.medpagetoday.org

Serum IGF1 concentration is positively associated with 25-hydroxyvitamin D level and increases upon treatment with vitamin D | ICEECE2012 | 15th International & 14th European Congress of Endocrinology | Endocrine Abstracts

www.endocrine-abstracts.org

Is there a basis for believing that we don't get enough zinc via food and daily vitamin supplementation? Otherwise, it is just like biotin.

 

[Staticwavves]

Hello all,

I'm new here to the forum. I’ll try to keep this as brief as possible. Growing up I always had a nice thick head of hair. Balding doesn’t run in my family, however my brother has been balding pretty bad and always had me concerned for my future. At about 23 I started noticing my hair was looking sparse and thinning and had to switch hairstyles to start making things less noticeable. But I figured things were fine and I had hair. Fast forward to now. I’m 34 and about 3 years ago I started dealing with really really bad shedding/thinning. Nobody mentioned anything and just told me you lose hair daily. Which I understand. But between what falls out with brushing, and what comes off when I wash my hair exceeds the normal. Then I began losing my forelocks, the hair right in the middle front of my hairline and really began to get concerned. After much pushback I was able to get Finasteride prescribed about 6 months ago. I’ve also done minoxidil pretty steadily as well as Nizoral. But so far results have been negligible. I’ve yet to really get progress on my forelocks, but I do see some baby hairs coming in through my scalp as the rest of my hair is past my chin. Medically I have found some factors that could be contributing. When I tested my iron few years back my ferritin was so low. At 14. Currently it’s up to 83 so I’ve been able to get that up. Everything else is normal as far as labs go. As well as hormonal labs. The only way thing that is abnormal, is my testosterone is super high. Like through the roof high. Total, available, and free are all on the very very high end and there is no medical explanation as to why. My endocrinologist essentially is going with it’s just how my levels run. I’ve not experienced any side effects from Finasteride. High testosterone came before I started finasteride, so please don’t say finasteride is the cause. It’s not. My school of thought is due to my super high testosterone levels, I’m dealing with a much stronger DHT issue. So much so that I need something stronger like Dutasteride which i finally got a script for today. Also dealt with dandruff scalp issues that I believe are causing inflammation in my follicles. All this being said, I value my hair number 1. And I’m willing to go to some extreme routes to gain back ground lost in thickness and overall growth. I’ve hovered over these forums a bit after seeing crazy results people were getting by using different hormones. I’m a cis male that’s looking to keep as much manliness that I can while regaining my hair. I understand this is a difficult balance and I’d really like some advice in regards to what hormonal route I could follow that is the least likely to give me side effects such as gyno etc. One other thing I’ll mention is dryness. I deal with really really dry hair which makes me have to lessen how often I can use Nizoral as well as very dry skin. Again not sure if super high testosterone is contributing due to my estrogen not being in balance and maybe I need more estrogen?

As far as hormonal routes go, what should I add to the mix? Would some form of estrogen like pills or cream be strong enough to produce hair growth while avoiding gyno? Thank you for any advice and or help on my journey. Seems like Estriol cream at a low dose is my best option.

 

[Staticwavves]

Some of that will depend upon your time frame. I wouldn't mess around with estriol unless you are taking the lonnnnggg run approach plus there's not much evidence if any regarding its efficacy, nor that perhaps of even estrogel on the scalp. I do believe there can be localized effects but I mostly used Bi-estro so I was sort of in the middle. Yes, I do believe that I have previously posted pics of my hair improvement related to using Life Flo Bi-estro. I rarely used the other two versions but counting all three and other brands, I have made over one hundred purchases going back to 2014 so I obviously think they are worth at least trying and certainly for maintenance. I don't think estriol is strong enough for regrowth though unless maybe used in massive quantities like a couple of the guys. Still, I am estradiol-only and I post pictures. Very few do among those who tout massive stacks. Right now, my touts are oral minoxidil and estrogel on the scalp used freely and without restraint.

Would estrogel cause gyno?

 

[DogoDiLaurentiis]

Is there a basis for believing that we don't get enough zinc via food and daily vitamin supplementation? Otherwise, it is just like biotin.

Contrary to biotin in terms of how it makes your skin look, you at least need to be getting enough zinc that you're not deficient, and I would say in general, it has an overall factor of improving skin if you aren't.

Another thing to look at is that immunological stress can deplete your body of zinc, and we now live in crazy covid times in which I personally believe many many many more people have and transmit the virus than the governments of the world are able to keep track of.

All I know is that my skin generally looks better and has looked better in the past when I have ensured I have gotten enough. Another thing to look at from a male perspective is that zinc is required for reproductive functions which is something that happens automatically, and by comparison elevates the requirements regardless of sexual activity as sperm and seminal fluid are produced and cycled out of the body over time.

You probably don't need to take a ton, unless you're using it as an immunological prophylaxis measure, but men still do need -some- and like I said, skin and collagen require a certain amount as well which will increase if you're on a compound like estrogen because estrogen greatly boosts collagen production.

I would go so far as to say that you're not getting the full benefits of what estrogen can do for the skin if you're not fully providing the nutrients your body needs to meet the demands of the hormone itself.

 

[DogoDiLaurentiis]

I differ a bit on the opinion that Janey on what is required for hair regrowth but honestly I also think that depends on the receptor sensitivity of the person in question and also other hormonal factors.

I'm now a pretty big believer in the fact that other hormones such as IGF-1, insulin, prolactin and DHEA can also make things difficult when it comes to regrowing hair.

I'm already on the recovery after a wave of hair loss but it doesn't seem to be as solid and I get this sort of "sine wave" quality to my hair recovering where it improves a lot and then declines, when I look at pictures from my past, it is very obvious from my face that I had a much higher level of circulating estrogen back in my late 20s when I had my first bad hair fall event.

This thread has reminded me sufficiently that it's not just mitigating the effects of testosterone and specifically DHT, but increasing the hair growth inducing properties of estrogen. Comparing myself now to 10 years ago, my estrogen was a LOT higher, so I fully expect to be able to dose myself topically with enough estrogen to manage a systemic increase and induce hair growth and balance out the deleterious effects of testosterone.

Estrogen will 100% help with dry skin and dry scalp/hair, etc, that's one of estrogen's most potent qualities.

I'm basing the things I say on my own genetic development and physiology, my hair has already made an impressive recovery without a ton of circulating estrogen and with my testosterone being higher than I would like. So I feel like if you're in a similar situation to myself and you know your body has at one point tolerated a decent amount of estrogen systemically, you can return to that state with minimal side effects.

I am going to start low and topically, estrogen as a hormone interacts at the receptor level on the skin, meaning you're getting a very quick and potent response from your skin where you apply it (in this case you want to apply it on your scalp). It also takes time for the estrogen to make its way into the bloodstream which gives your body time to start metabolizing it before it builds up too much.

The less you're bombing your bloodstream and your liver with estrogen it has to process, the more of a preferable balance you'll see when applying it if you wish to avoid side effects. As I've said in the past, I've tried progesterone creams and they did absolutely nothing for me, I've used progesterone capsules as prescribed by a doctor and I got about two weeks into taking them every day before I started feeling the symptoms of gyno.

That to me is indicative of the difference that estrogen will potentially have on your body at the systemic level, only that estrogen will absolutely antagonize the effects of DHT where it is applied to the skin, and it will absolutely induce hair growth and produce vasodilatory effects to aid in it. I can always increase my dose, I'm not in the danger zone where I'm freaking out, I have some leeway, so I'm going to start at a low dose, one that my doctor will find acceptable to try without presuming I'll just immediately get side effects and quit.

That aside, I would have to say that the hormonal approach for hair regrowth is primarily going to be estrogen therapy, along with mitigating any other hormones in excess which might be toxic to that regrowth, that's it basically.

 

[Selb]

My current approach is to take as much estradiol as my bio-feedback indicates. I have been procrastinating about being tested probably because I am so far over levels but honestly my prescriber probably doesn't care. My thought is push for pregnancy levels of estrogen. Yeah, I know it goes from estradiol though estrone to estriol but essentially, the idea is flood the system. For those who don't want breasts, from what we know flooding the system with estradiol is the best way of turning off breast growth permanently. In my opinion, the main reason why we don't have this more standardized is because MtFs are obsessed with breast growth and breast growth and hair regeneration/regrowth don't occur on the same place on the normal cis-female feminization hairline. Since virtually no pubertal cis-girls bald or are balding, this aspect is obscured in cis-females as per MtFs shooting for both breast growth and hair regrowth/improvement.

Is there any research to this theory? It seems if avoiding gyno is as easy doubling your estrogen dose then most finasteride resistant people would try it. That is unless doubling your estrogen would also double your chance of ED or impotency

 

[Staticwavves]

I differ a bit on the opinion that Janey on what is required for hair regrowth but honestly I also think that depends on the receptor sensitivity of the person in question and also other hormonal factors.

I'm now a pretty big believer in the fact that other hormones such as IGF-1, insulin, prolactin and DHEA can also make things difficult when it comes to regrowing hair.

I'm already on the recovery after a wave of hair loss but it doesn't seem to be as solid and I get this sort of "sine wave" quality to my hair recovering where it improves a lot and then declines, when I look at pictures from my past, it is very obvious from my face that I had a much higher level of circulating estrogen back in my late 20s when I had my first bad hair fall event.

This thread has reminded me sufficiently that it's not just mitigating the effects of testosterone and specifically DHT, but increasing the hair growth inducing properties of estrogen. Comparing myself now to 10 years ago, my estrogen was a LOT higher, so I fully expect to be able to dose myself topically with enough estrogen to manage a systemic increase and induce hair growth and balance out the deleterious effects of testosterone.

Estrogen will 100% help with dry skin and dry scalp/hair, etc, that's one of estrogen's most potent qualities.

I'm basing the things I say on my own genetic development and physiology, my hair has already made an impressive recovery without a ton of circulating estrogen and with my testosterone being higher than I would like. So I feel like if you're in a similar situation to myself and you know your body has at one point tolerated a decent amount of estrogen systemically, you can return to that state with minimal side effects.

I am going to start low and topically, estrogen as a hormone interacts at the receptor level on the skin, meaning you're getting a very quick and potent response from your skin where you apply it (in this case you want to apply it on your scalp). It also takes time for the estrogen to make its way into the bloodstream which gives your body time to start metabolizing it before it builds up too much.

The less you're bombing your bloodstream and your liver with estrogen it has to process, the more of a preferable balance you'll see when applying it if you wish to avoid side effects. As I've said in the past, I've tried progesterone creams and they did absolutely nothing for me, I've used progesterone capsules as prescribed by a doctor and I got about two weeks into taking them every day before I started feeling the symptoms of gyno.

That to me is indicative of the difference that estrogen will potentially have on your body at the systemic level, only that estrogen will absolutely antagonize the effects of DHT where it is applied to the skin, and it will absolutely induce hair growth and produce vasodilatory effects to aid in it. I can always increase my dose, I'm not in the danger zone where I'm freaking out, I have some leeway, so I'm going to start at a low dose, one that my doctor will find acceptable to try without presuming I'll just immediately get side effects and quit.

That aside, I would have to say that the hormonal approach for hair regrowth is primarily going to be estrogen therapy, along with mitigating any other hormones in excess which might be toxic to that regrowth, that's it basically.

Thank you, that definitely makes a lot of sense! As far as estrogen cream goes, is there one that you can recommend? And you think estrogen over estriol?

 

[DogoDiLaurentiis]

Is there any research to this theory? It seems if avoiding gyno is as easy doubling your estrogen dose then most finasteride resistant people would try it. That is unless doubling your estrogen would also double your chance of ED or impotency

I'm extremely skeptical of this as my experience is that progesterone can induce gyno and it took two weeks of the hormone building up in my system for me to start to feel the effects.

I have no reason to believe that estrogen would be any different.

I know that one strong mediating factor for how much estrogen is and will circulate in your body is how well your liver processes it. If your liver function is impaired and you're even using a small dose of estrogen it will build up quickly, and thus using a high dosage will cause you to get hormonally piled up that much faster.

Definitely not calling into question Janey's hypothesis on why higher dosing might circumvent the development of gyno, definitely an interesting one, but I know personally from my own experience with hormones that can develop undesired sides on my part, that impaired metabolism or simply bombing your system can cause those effects.

Thank you, that definitely makes a lot of sense! As far as estrogen cream goes, is there one that you can recommend? And you think estrogen over estriol?

I believe estrogen, but starting at a low dose. estrogen is proven to grow hair, if estradiol proves to be a poor fit, then you move to something less proven and more side effect safe.

Since I am going to go through a doctor I will give him my proposed dosage range he will prescribe me the product that most accurately fits the criteria. I have yet to embark on this treatment yet, I've taken increasing measures including using spironolactone topically under his supervision and this is the next step.

I'm going to offer basically a plan/proposal for my doctor so that he understands that I have a good understanding of what I'm doing and that I won't simply go on this and flip out and report him to his bureaucratic overseers and scream "look what this irresponsible doctor did to me", which is a serious issue where I live considering medical bureaucracy.

He already knows that I have a substantially better than average understanding of hormones and how they work and knowing they're not to be fucked with willy nilly. All I really need to do is prove to him that I do have an actual plan and an understanding of how to achieve my goals, so that he can trust that I will accept personal responsibility/liability for any bad outcomes and not throw him under the bus if things don't work out.

I live in a country where socialized healthcare involves doctors being strongly chastized for taking any risks at all with patients, for those of you living in the states, all that glitters is not gold when it comes to government run healthcare.

 

[Staticwavves]

I'm extremely skeptical of this as my experience is that progesterone can induce gyno and it took two weeks of the hormone building up in my system for me to start to feel the effects.

I have no reason to believe that estrogen would be any different.




I believe estrogen, but starting at a low dose. estrogen is proven to grow hair, if estradiol proves to be a poor fit, then you move to something less proven and more side effect safe.

Since I am going to go through a doctor I will give him my proposed dosage range he will prescribe me the product that most accurately fits the criteria. I have yet to embark on this treatment yet, I've taken increasing measures including using spironolactone topically under his supervision and this is the next step.

I'm going to offer basically a plan/proposal for my doctor so that he understands that I have a good understanding of what I'm doing and that I won't simply go on this and flip out and report him to his bureaucratic overseers and scream "look what this irresponsible doctor did to me", which is a serious issue where I live considering medical bureaucracy.

He already knows that I have a substantially better than average understanding of hormones and how they work and knowing they're not to be fucked with willy nilly. All I really need to do is prove to him that I do have an actual plan and an understanding of how to achieve my goals, so that he can trust that I will accept personal responsibility/liability for any bad outcomes and not throw him under the bus if things don't work out.

I live in a country where socialized healthcare involves doctors being strongly chastized for taking any risks at all with patients, for those of you living in the states, all that glitters is not gold when it comes to government run healthcare.

That sounds like an excellent plan. What would you do if you were someone like me that can’t present their situation to a regular doctor. Should I just resort to some estrogen cream from Amazon?

 

[DogoDiLaurentiis]

Yeah, but if I were you, I would start at a low dose, because if you aim and hit your dosage too high, you're going to have to potentially wait weeks for the adverse effects to taper off before you can try again. I know this from personal experience because the sides of gyno lingered for weeks and it was annoying and unpleasant.

In the case where you wish to just dive right in and transition or go non-binary in presentation, you may as well take Janey's advice, but if you're looking to split the difference as I am, and get the best of both worlds while preserving your identity as a male, then you most certainly should slap on the training wheels instead of jumping on a Harley, if you know what I mean.

My only annoyance with the idea of buying it on ebay or amazon is the markup, I can technically get my estrogen gel covered if I go with my doctor and he accepts which I think he honestly will. But it all comes down to you, do you trust yourself? Do you know your body well enough? Because when it comes to hormones, nobody can tell you regardless of reference ranges what hormonal range feels "right". You need to determine that for yourself, so if you're willing and you feel you are genuinely able, then yes, try.

I would however start at less than a milligram in terms of dosing, but that's my plan, you must take into account everything you read here and be attentive to the counsel that all people provide on this forum because in the end you're the one in charge.

I will offer this though, if you feel like you're getting overloaded hormonally, buy some calcium d-glucarate, and/or some betaine hydrochloride, as one will hormonally flush you out (beware this means testosterone as well), and the other will help metabolize estrogen.

Good luck, and please report back.

 

[ReturnOfExtreme]

I will never understand why people want to take E but additionally want to avoid breast growth. What do they expect from taking female hormones?