2.5mg of dutasteride reaching a steady state?

[hair today gone tomorrow]

oh ok, i understand now....well whats the "highest" possible SS you can attain? would that be at 2.5mg? I mean it has to plateau at some point.

It doesn't plateau at any point. It's proportional to the dose. The more you take, the higher the blood level.

At higher levels (like around 1 mg/day and above), the steady-state level is almost DIRECTLY proportional to the dose. In other words, doubling the dose approximately doubles the steady-state blood level. At lower doses (like 0.1 mg/day, for example), doubling the dose has an even GREATER effect on steady-state levels, because of dutasteride's non-linear elimination characteristics.

Ok makes sense for dutasteride blood levels...but really there would be not point in going over 2.5 mg/day because while dutasteride blood levels will keep increasing with higher dosages, dht inhibition levels plateau greatly at 2.5mg....because its just at about 100% of the alpha R II enzyme is destroyed....right?

 

[blaze]

but really there would be not point in going over 2.5 mg/day because while dutasteride blood levels will keep increasing with higher dosages, dht inhibition levels plateau greatly at 2.5mg....because its just at about 100% of the alpha R II enzyme is destroyed....right?

If 0.5mg of dutasteride per day inhibits 98% of type 2 5AR, then 2.5mg of dutasteride per day would definitely inhibit 100% of the type 2 5AR enzyme.

 

[phish]

i think .5 inhibits 98.5 type2 i always thought any more then 1mg is over kill because its prob like 99.9. if your still losing tons of hair at 1mg then its obvious that dht is not the cause of your hair loss. your much better off saving the extra cash your wasting on buying 2.5mg and having a regimen that hits from all angles. like say 1mg of dutasteride rogaine foam twice a day and revita shampoo everyday left on scalp for 10 minutes or any of dr. proctors products like prox n.

 

[Bryan]

Ok makes sense for dutasteride blood levels...but really there would be not point in going over 2.5 mg/day because while dutasteride blood levels will keep increasing with higher dosages, dht inhibition levels plateau greatly at 2.5mg....because its just at about 100% of the alpha R II enzyme is destroyed....right?

Yeah, seems like it. Even the contribution to the blood from the type 1 enzyme is pretty small at that point...

 

[hair today gone tomorrow]

Ok makes sense for dutasteride blood levels...but really there would be not point in going over 2.5 mg/day because while dutasteride blood levels will keep increasing with higher dosages, dht inhibition levels plateau greatly at 2.5mg....because its just at about 100% of the alpha R II enzyme is destroyed....right?

Yeah, seems like it. Even the contribution to the blood from the type 1 enzyme is pretty small at that point...

thanks again bryan.

its interesting though...b/c there is a pretty significant jump in hair counts between .5 mg and 2.5mg YET dht inhibition is only ~1% higher with 2.5 (from 98.5-99.5%)

 

[stampede]

[quote="hair today gone tomorrow":ae07d]Ok makes sense for dutasteride blood levels...but really there would be not point in going over 2.5 mg/day because while dutasteride blood levels will keep increasing with higher dosages, dht inhibition levels plateau greatly at 2.5mg....because its just at about 100% of the alpha R II enzyme is destroyed....right?

Yeah, seems like it. Even the contribution to the blood from the type 1 enzyme is pretty small at that point...

thanks again bryan.

its interesting though...b/c there is a pretty significant jump in hair counts between .5 mg and 2.5mg YET dht inhibition is only ~1% higher with 2.5 (from 98.5-99.5%)[/quote:ae07d]


Goes to show that even 1.5% of normal DHT is a hair killer :thumbdown2:

 

[Bryan]

its interesting though...b/c there is a pretty significant jump in hair counts between .5 mg and 2.5mg YET dht inhibition is only ~1% higher with 2.5 (from 98.5-99.5%)

Goes to show that even 1.5% of normal DHT is a hair killer :thumbdown2:

I have a somewhat different slant on that. To me, that probably IS mainly an indication of the greater type 1 inhibition that you get with 2.5 mg/day, compared to only 0.5 mg/day. Remember, I've never said that the type 1 enzyme plays no role whatsoever in balding, just that it's the type 2 enzyme which does MOST of the damage.

Although there have been conflicting results in some studies which looked at the distribution of the 5a-reductase enzymes in hair follicles, the type 1 enzyme almost certainly does exist in some specific locations, and DHT from that source probably plays some relatively small role in male pattern baldness. I suppose it's also possible that DHT produced in the sebaceous glands from the type 1 enzyme could also be involved, considering the relatively close proximity to the hair follicle.

 

[blaze]

Remember, I've never said that the type 1 enzyme plays no role whatsoever in balding, just that it's the type 2 enzyme which does MOST of the damage.
Although there have been conflicting results in some studies which looked at the distribution of the 5a-reductase enzymes in hair follicles, the type 1 enzyme almost certainly does exist in some specific locations, and DHT from that source probably plays some relatively small role in male pattern baldness. I suppose it's also possible that DHT produced in the sebaceous glands from the type 1 enzyme could also be involved, considering the relatively close proximity to the hair follicle.

If type 1 5AR does play a role in Androgenetic Alopecia then shouldnt some of the psuedos exhibit signs of Androgenetic Alopecia?

 

[Bryan]

If type 1 5AR does play a role in Androgenetic Alopecia then shouldnt some of the psuedos exhibit signs of Androgenetic Alopecia?

When I wrote that reply above, there wasn't the slightest doubt in my mind that somebody was going to bring up the issue of the pseudos!

As I've mentioned a bunch of times in the past, I believe a critical factor with the pseudos is the timing issue. They are that way from birth (from conception, actually), which is a profound factor in the future health of their scalp hair. When it comes to hairloss, an ounce of prevention is worth a TON of cure.

My general feeling is that even when scalp follicles are just exposed to a small amount of DHT from the blood (or from other nearby parts of the follicle or the sebaceous glands, via the type 1 enzyme), it doesn't quite pass a certain threshhold of androgenic stimulation that's required for the initial impetus toward balding, but it can apparently make a difference in men who have already started the balding process, and are trying to stop it. That hypothesis (and that's all it is, just a hypothesis) is the only thing I can think of that would seem to explain the dutasteride results.

 

[blaze]

As I've mentioned a bunch of times in the past, I believe a critical factor with the pseudos is the timing issue. They are that way from birth (from conception, actually), which is a profound factor in the future health of their scalp hair. When it comes to hairloss, an ounce of prevention is worth a TON of cure.
My general feeling is that even when scalp follicles are just exposed to a small amount of DHT from the blood (or from other nearby parts of the follicle or the sebaceous glands, via the type 1 enzyme), it doesn't quite pass a certain threshhold of androgenic stimulation that's required for the initial impetus toward balding, but it can apparently make a difference in men who have already started the balding process, and are trying to stop it. That hypothesis (and that's all it is, just a hypothesis) is the only thing I can think of that would seem to explain the dutasteride results.

Fair enough, Bryan. Your hypothesis seems plausable.

 

[blueshard]

are there any updates from anyone on 2.5?

 

[stampede]

are there any updates from anyone on 2.5?

Yep, the hair is growing but so are the boobs :thumbdown2:

Don't do it lol...

 

[Pondle]

So are you off your 2.5mg/day regimen then stampede? A shame, but I guess you're in safer territory with a more modest dose.

 

[stampede]

So are you off your 2.5mg/day regimen then stampede? A shame, but I guess you're in safer territory with a more modest dose.

Only temporarily until I sort this gyno. I'm on 0.25mg Anastrozole 2x a day now and I've got some Tamoxifen on the way from UP... can't wait until the lazy arse postman gets off his strike and delivers it and, of course, assuming he doesn't steal it like he's stolen other things of mine :jackit: :jackit: :jackit:

I'm actually on one dutasteride every 3 days at the moment. I'd like to do more but I really really don't want this gyno getting out of hand. I do hope I won't lose too much hair in the meantime.

Gutted. But I suppose that no-one said this hairloss fight would be easy

 

[stax]

Arimidex is a rather weak Aromatize inhibitor, as far as Estradiol goes atleast. Would jump on 1mg per day or eod untill your symptoms go away.


You need some Aromasin.

 

[Timi]

stampede

2,5mg is to heavy and is Suicide for the Body
less often is more

one men in ouer Page take all 5Days one dutasteride Cap
and the Hairs good, better as with finasteride Dayli

and other take finasteride 4Days, and in Day 5 0,5mg dutasteride
and very good success



Timi

 

[stampede]

Arimidex is a rather weak Aromatize inhibitor, as far as Estradiol goes atleast. Would jump on 1mg per day or eod untill your symptoms go away.

Noted, thanks. Do you have any opinions on Rebound Reloaded?

You need some Aromasin.

What's that mate?

 

[stampede]

stampede

2,5mg is to heavy and is Suicide for the Body
less often is more

one men in ouer Page take all 5Days one dutasteride Cap
and the Hairs good, better as with finasteride Dayli

and other take finasteride 4Days, and in Day 5 0,5mg dutasteride
and very good success



Timi

2.5mg is doing wonders for my hair, even at this early stage. My bald spot has gone from huge to being split in two and is filling in nicely.

I can't see what advantage there would be to taking both finasteride and dutasteride. It makes no sense :dunno:

 

[Timi]

stampede

2,5mg is to heavy and is Suicide for the Body
less often is more

one men in ouer Page take all 5Days one dutasteride Cap
and the Hairs good, better as with finasteride Dayli

and other take finasteride 4Days, and in Day 5 0,5mg dutasteride
and very good success



Timi

2.5mg is doing wonders for my hair, even at this early stage. My bald spot has gone from huge to being split in two and is filling in nicely.

I can't see what advantage there would be to taking both finasteride and dutasteride. It makes no sense :dunno:

Yes stampede

but 2,5mg you cannot hold for Longtime
you can this make at the beginning and than reduce

the combination finasteride dutasteride have less side effects and finasteride isn't not so badly in the effect he works good

Timi

 

[stax]

Aromasin is a stronger AI than Arimidex, and is supposed to have less side effects and is less harsh on your lipids, and is even shown to improve bone density, in woman atleast. Its the AI of choice. Its supposed to be better at reducing estradiol, the worst estrogen.


It's a favourite among many bodybuilders.



Dont bother with rebound reloded, gyno isnt something to play around with.



P.S. does United Pharmacy ship to Canada?

Whats the adress link?


Thanks.