NorwoodGuardian
Established Member
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How about a dermapen?
Very Impressive Dermarolling And Minxodil Results - From Tressless
How about a dermapen?
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Yes I was contemplating investing in one of the Dr Pen models. Just trying to work out if its worth it. From what I've read scanning the forum it seems that combination with minoxidil would be the most promising to gain any result, hence my original question. I really didn't want to add minoxidil to my regime, at least not yet. I just wondered if anyone thought using minoxidil so infrequently alongside needling would maybe provide a slight nudge in the right direction while potentially avoiding any minoxidil sides/sheds.
waynakyo
Experienced Member
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OK, I wonder whether its has to do with seborrheic dermatitis. I heard that dermarolling could be detrimental in that case: (e.g. here and here)
Seborrheic derm does not necessarily involve dandruff, nor is it necessarily visible. SD is known to cause hair fall, so aggravating it is not good.
I have pictures of my follicles with yellow dots and unhealthy condition. Apparently these yellow dots are common feature in male pattern baldness ( e.g., here). But the causality is not clear according to the paper.
I think more people should buy those digital handheld microscopes, as scalp health is paramount. Further it is a good way to monitor hair.
Seborrheic derm does not necessarily involve dandruff, nor is it necessarily visible. SD is known to cause hair fall, so aggravating it is not good.
I have pictures of my follicles with yellow dots and unhealthy condition. Apparently these yellow dots are common feature in male pattern baldness ( e.g., here). But the causality is not clear according to the paper.
I think more people should buy those digital handheld microscopes, as scalp health is paramount. Further it is a good way to monitor hair.
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I don't know what's worse, 4chan nerds or reddit cucks. They are both retarded in their own ways. Reddit cucks believe anything they hear as long as it comes from a source of perceived authority, and can't evaluate any information themselves. 4chan nerds also lack the ability to evaluate scientific studies for themselves, so they go the opposite direction and don't believe in the scientific method at all.
This is the only known method to create new hairs without wounding:
Coordinated hedgehog signaling induces new hair follicles in adult skin
Hedgehog-pathway activation in adjacent epithelial and stromal cells, but not in epithelial or stromal cells alone, enables the generation of functional de novo hair follicles in unwounded adult mouse skin.elifesciences.org
Since 4chan nerds don't believe in science they won't read it.
Now here is how new hairs are formed by wounding
Wnt-dependent de novo hair follicle regeneration in adult mouse skin after wounding - Nature
The mammalian hair follicle was thought to form only during development, so loss of an adult follicle was considered permanent. Here Cotsarelis and colleagues solve a fifty-year-old debate, and show that wounding the skin of adult mice triggers de novo hair follicle regeneration.www.nature.com
Neogenesis is dependent on Wnts. The more Wnts, the more hair. What upregulates Wnt signalling? Minoxidil does. If 4chan nerds would learn how to read something more complex than a meme they could stop clogging up this thread with nonsense. Wounding alone works if done right, but nobody has achieved cosmetic regrowth from it. The best case results in any study show wounding monotherapy to be equivalent to minoxidil monotherapy. Minoxidil is a lot less painful, and easier to do. Now if you combine the two, the studies show the combination being several-fold more effective than either treatment alone, and that's backed up by the experimentation we've seen on the forums. However, minoxidil is just one of many drugs that can be used in combination with wounding to increase hair growth. There are dozens of alternative compounds listed in the Follica patents, including SAG, purmorphamine, bimatoprost, adenosine, AS101, etc. Anything that upregulates Wnt and Shh will work.
This is one of the problem for sure!
DHT introduces Dickkopf 1 which inhibits the the Wnt/β-catenin signaling pathway.
Androgenetic alopecia (Androgenetic Alopecia) is the commonest form of hair loss in men. Alopecia areata (AA) is an organ-specific autoimmune disease. Studies revealed that Dickkopf 1 (DKK-1), a powerful suppressor of the Wnt/β-catenin signaling pathway, induced anagen-to-catagen transition in mice. Moreover, in vitro studies suggested that DKK-1 played a role in dihydrotestosterone (DHT)-induced balding.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/262...etic Alopecia),to-catagen transition in mice.
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I used my camera on the top of my head, and they all had these orangey spots at each root. Camera sucks, so the quality isn’t that great.
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NorwoodGuardian
Established Member
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How to remove DKK-1 then?
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L-ascorbic acid 2-phosphate represses the dihydrotestosterone-induced dickkopf-1 expression in human balding dermal papilla cells - PubMed
Recent studies suggested that dihydrotestosterone (DHT)-driven alteration in the autocrine and paracrine factors may be a key to androgen-potentiated balding. Also, we recently claimed that DHT-inducible dickkopf-1 (DKK-1) is one of the key factors involved in the androgen-potentiated balding...
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
Preventable effect of L-threonate, an ascorbate metabolite, on androgen-driven balding via repression of dihydrotestosterone-induced dickkopf-1 expression in human hair dermal papilla cells - PubMed
In a previous study, we recently claimed that dihydrotestosterone (DHT)-inducible dickkopf-1 (DKK-1) expression is one of the key factors involved in androgen-potentiated balding. We also demonstrated that L-ascorbic acid 2-phosphate (Asc 2-P) represses DHT-induced DKK-1 expression in cultured...
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
Which one are you using? Thanks.
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I believe Samumeds SM04554 inhibits the DKK-1 protein.
waynakyo
Experienced Member
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@Rubicant112 @iCloud
I used this microscope camera. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07PVMRZQH/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o05_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1
@Rubicant112 Yes I have the exact feature at the root of my hairs. But only in the thinning areas. Did you check the donor area? My donor area is very healthy, attached.
The point is that dermatologist and surgeons surprisingly don't look that close. The paper I cited above shows the ignorance at that level.
I would be very interested to see whether those that respond well to propecia/minoxidil/derma improve their scalp condition.
I used this microscope camera. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07PVMRZQH/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o05_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1
@Rubicant112 Yes I have the exact feature at the root of my hairs. But only in the thinning areas. Did you check the donor area? My donor area is very healthy, attached.
The point is that dermatologist and surgeons surprisingly don't look that close. The paper I cited above shows the ignorance at that level.
I would be very interested to see whether those that respond well to propecia/minoxidil/derma improve their scalp condition.
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He says that he rolls for 20-30 minute sessions and doesn’t press in hard. Do you guys think that makes a difference? Or would pressing hard bring the same results?
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That’s the same one I purchased. I just wondered what that golden colored stuff is. Is it just sebum or something? My donor doesn’t look like that even though I have DUPA.
Thanks, I ordered a different but quite similar one, as I could not immediately find this model on a European website. Looking forward to using this tool to compare different areas on my head and see what is going on on a microscopic level. Science is cool!
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This is crazy. I think more than rolling, there are some individuals who responds to minoxidil more than others. Maybe the enzyme plays a important role for minoxidil to work, and I recall a liquid coming out in this month that can be used to create the enzyme on your scalp.