Topical Finasteride which "locks into the scalp to avoid systemic absorption"

[Afro_Vacancy]

underrated?

Yes, i think.it's a very nice movie.

 

[PrinceWilliamThe2nd]

Topical Finasteride is not going to be the cure due to a number of factors:

1) Oral Finasteride already reduces skin & scalp DHT levels by similar levels in serum.

2) 5aR is produced in the skin and scalp, in addition to other parts of the body.

3) Finasteride has a molar mass 372 g/mol so can penetrate the skin relatively well, yet topical application is not effective again Androgenetic Alopecia unless it goes systemic.

4) 5aR is also produced in the follicle, men with male pattern baldness do not have elevated DHT serum levels yet have elevated scalp DHT levels.

5) Therefore Finasteride does not seem to be able to inhibit the 5aR that is produced in the follicle, it looks likes it works by reducing the amount of DHT in the serum that reaches the follicle therefore reducing the total amount of DHT available to attach to the AR. Note that DHT is also present on non-balding follicles except at around half the level of balding follicles, likewise T levels are around double the level in non-balding follicles compared to balding ones.

6) The above is the reason why dutasteride although more effective, is not that much more effective considering how potent it is against serum DHT levels.

So unless there is a way of reducing 5aR produced by the follicle, inhibiting DHT without messing with the rest of your body is a dead end. The other hopes are topical AR antagonists that don't go systemic (CB) or anything downstream of DHT before it hits DKK-1.

Can you please provide links to scientific articles to each of your statements.

4) 5aR is also produced in the follicle, men with male pattern baldness do not have elevated DHT serum levels yet have elevated scalp DHT levels.

5) Therefore Finasteride does not seem to be able to inhibit the 5aR that is produced in the follicle, it looks likes it works by reducing the amount of DHT in the serum that reaches the follicle therefore reducing the total amount of DHT available to attach to the AR.

I don't get what you are trying to say with this, as these two points are contradictory. Wouldn't the key to stop DHT overexpression in the scalp then be to stop DHT overexpression in the scalp, and solely in the scalp epidermis?

 

[Rockinlove]

I suppose that the OP intends to extrapolate the effects of precision medicine. However, the question remains if a one size fits all approach would work and that in certain instances such an approach might be less effective since it intends to abate symptoms by as much as possible?

Even if we were to go the route of the conventional pill then would not a tailor made solution make more sense? I suppose the only contention here would be the expense incurred.

Can you please provide links to scientific articles to each of your statements.




I don't get what you are trying to say with this, as these two points are contradictory. Wouldn't the key to stop DHT overexpression in the scalp then be to stop DHT overexpression in the scalp, and solely in the scalp epidermis?

 

[mowingdown]

Jup. I read about a couple who got harsh sides on oral finasteride and experienced the same with this formulation. It's been around for a while now.

Can you provide me with a source? Everyone I've read about having information about the topical has been "I know someone who has side effects or read something about side effects being the same on the liposome formulation". Overall I think H&W's inability(or active neglect) to address the confusion is telling of it's difference with oral finasteride, but I'd still like to settle this once and for all.


PS. first post on HairLossTalk.com. Very glad to be getting away from bald truth, you just get a sense that someone is leading the discussions in a certain direction in every single thread over there (Transplant!).

 

[Pavi]

STILL not available in the U.S.? Come on fellas

 

[jd_uk]

Bump for more info on this...

- Anyone had serum DHT levels checked before and after using topical finasteride.... if just some people did this then it would literally end the debate on whether it goes systemic/by how much.

- efficacy of it.

- Safety of it. How long does it have to be left on before being washed off. I am speaking of safety to other people here...e.g. pregnant women.

 

[Pray The Bald Away]

Bump for more info on this...

- Anyone had serum DHT levels checked before and after using topical finasteride.... if just some people did this then it would literally end the debate on whether it goes systemic/by how much.

- efficacy of it.

- Safety of it. How long does it have to be left on before being washed off. I am speaking of safety to other people here...e.g. pregnant women.

I was curious about this as well. What keeps a pregnant woman from accidentally making contact with your hair and then ending up with a deformed baby. I wouldn't use this stuff for that reason alone.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

I've also thought about the pregnant woman thing. Topical finasteride does seem like a health hazard.

 

[Stupidon]

I was curious about this as well. What keeps a pregnant woman from accidentally making contact with your hair and then ending up with a deformed baby. I wouldn't use this stuff for that reason alone.

 

[whatevr]

I was curious about this as well. What keeps a pregnant woman from accidentally making contact with your hair and then ending up with a deformed baby. I wouldn't use this stuff for that reason alone.

I know right. I have pregnant women touching me all day long, can't beat 'em off with a stick. Guess no topical finasteride for me.

Sigh...

I'd use it even if it meant people within 10 ft of me would be killed DEAD. You know, if it actually worked...

 

[Pray The Bald Away]

I know right. I have pregnant women touching me all day long, can't beat 'em off with a stick. Guess no topical finasteride for me.

Sigh...

I'd use it even if it meant people within 10 ft of me would be killed DEAD. You know, if it actually worked...

You make it sound silly but I'd wager my hair has touched at least one pregnant woman before. I'd feel radioactive.

 

[hilbert]

I know right. I have pregnant women touching me all day long, can't beat 'em off with a stick. Guess no topical finasteride for me.

Sigh...

I'd use it even if it meant people within 10 ft of me would be killed DEAD. You know, if it actually worked...

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

You make it sound silly but I'd wager my hair has touched at least one pregnant woman before. I'd feel radioactive.

It's clear that they never bothered figuring out the minimum dose for finasteride. The standard advice is for people to super-saturate themselves with 1mg/day, useless and possibly dangerous.

The finasteride packaging actually says that pregnant women can't even touch the pill. My sister for example was not allowed to touch my father's prostate cancer medication and she wasn't even pregnant, just trying to be. Touching the tablet is like 0.0001 mg or something.

Yet according to whatevr, it'd be fine for people to supersaturate their hair with 1,2, or 3 or more mg of finasteride.

 

[Mach]

I was thinking Propecia was coated to avoid finasteride skin contact. Cutting of proscar was a no no around pregnant women. Personally I wouldn't have the topical around her. Maybe that's why merck did not follow up with a topical?

 

[whatevr]

Yet according to whatevr, it'd be fine for people to supersaturate their hair with 1,2, or 3 or more mg of finasteride.

I was mainly trying to make a laugh out of the fact that he'd discard topical finasteride just based on that ONE reason. Not even asking the other more immediate and important questions like - is it even effective? Does it cause side effects? (if it does, it's useless, etc.) I'd love the efficiency of finasteride without the risk of side effects. If that meant avoiding pregnant women well you know... that wouldn't be a deal breaker.

BTW. How is me being 'super-saturated' with 1 mg of finasteride (1.25, to be exact) dangerous to anyone, except potentially myself?
And I made it more than clear enough to all the females (and teenagers) in my household not to even think about touching the pills, and I keep them in my room so they can't.
Just in case I'm being made out as some irresponsible nutjob who throws finasteride bombs at all the pregnant women and teens in the neighborhood.

 

[d3nt3dsh0v3l]

This is exactly why RU58841 never made it to market.

It has nothing to do with whether it works or not. Scientific studies proved it did in most men equally to propecia. The problem is it would have been an enormous liability for a drug company to release it to market.

Can you imagine how fast they would have a class action lawsuit from all the pregnant women who have boys with abnormal genitalia because they were rubbing their hands through their partner's hair, or sharing the same pillows?

In my case I live completely alone and when I'm out in the world, I simply don't touch my hair. At all. To prevent me from contaminating anything with this stuff. If I do touch my hair, I wash my hands.

I'm sure my house has already been thoroughly contaminated with RU58841 all over the damn place in trace amounts. But there are no pregnant women or small children coming over here (no women at all damnit, besides maybe my sister periodically who has an IUD so no worry there).

Definitely any topical antiandrogen is at least potentially a dangerous thing.

This is why even though topical darolutamide would also make a fantastic treatment for drug companies to make, they never will. Every penny they make will be lost in lawsuits. Even if it isn't the med that causes a woman's child to become abnormal, they will blame the drug, and the drug company will not be able to defend themselves.

Topical antiandrogens will never be a conventional treatment. It's only an option for those of us who want to roll the dice or are forced to because nothing else works or is tolerated.

If I could just pop finasteride and keep my hair I gladly would. It would be much safer and I wouldn't have to worry about being my head being covered in potential toxins for others.

You're replying to a post from over a year ago :-/

 

[IdealForehead]

You're replying to a post from over a year ago :-/

LOL I have no idea how I got here.

What year is it? Where do I live? Huh? Speak louder sonny.

 

[vegetassj]

Does topical now work or not

 

[otis]

Its NOT proven its just being prescribed off label.

 

[Dolph]

Its NOT proven its just being prescribed off label.

Polichem's phase II is proof enough for me that they have made some progress on stopping systemic absorption, but not enough. The problem is they're applying very little of the solution in their study. But they have probably further improved since then. We'll see -- Phase III data coming up soon. It's actually the first thing we have to look forward to, but because it's finasteride, no one gives a sh*t. I'm hopeful it might help some people who got sides on oral finasteride, but some people will probably get sides with both.