Topical Dutasteride Case Assessment Thread

[georgman]

From what I could understand he believes that Topical Dutasteride works because it goes systemic and the sticking to oral finasteride is easier in the long rung that applying a topical. He does acknowledge the sides on Finasteride orally but believes they can be managed by adjusting the dosage, for example 0.25mg EOD or even less. 0.25mg twice a week.

He was surprised with my crown though and so no miniaturization and knew I was only on Topical Dutasteride for 18 months.

He said I can continue with Topical Dutasteride but add low dose oral finasteride which I will do Topically. He said he is open minded to change his mind as more research comes in on this.

You have to understand these surgeons have been using this pill for 10 to 25 years on their patients with good results to stabilize their androgenic alopecia and this is a new thing. So is CB0301.

OMG he really believes the only reason why topical Dutasteride works is because it goes systemic?

I totally understand his point. He works with Finasteride for years, the patients who take it have a better end result etc. But I totally don't understand you. You change your well working regime because a Doctor(who obviously doesn't take anything by himself or doesn't do any research on the topic) just because he says so? I mean yes Dr. Ferreira is a top notch FUE surgeon but probably half of the readers here in this thread have gained more knowledge about topical/oral application of dutasteride/finasteride than him.

This Thread exists for a reason, we get f*****g side effects and it's so important to us that we spend hours online chatting with other guys around the globe. I just would have expected you to stay with your regime and tell him he has no idea what he's talking about, because he obviously isn't. I still like him and are looking forward get my hair done by him tho.

 

[georgman]

There are different working mechanisms for hormones, dht is regarded as a paracrine hormone that is produced and used by the body locally , rather than travelling around

So that means there is no reason to worry about systemic DHT travelling to the scalp since we only nuke scalp DHT?

 

[Mustang]

OMG he really believes the only reason why topical Dutasteride works is because it goes systemic?

I totally understand his point. He works with Finasteride for years, the patients who take it have a better end result etc. But I totally don't understand you. You change your well working regime because a Doctor(who obviously doesn't take anything by himself or doesn't do any research on the topic) just because he says so? I mean yes Dr. Ferreira is a top notch FUE surgeon but probably half of the readers here in this thread have gained more knowledge about topical/oral application of dutasteride/finasteride than him.

This Thread exists for a reason, we get f*****g side effects and it's so important to us that we spend hours online chatting with other guys around the globe. I just would have expected you to stay with your regime and tell him he has no idea what he's talking about, because he obviously isn't. I still like him and are looking forward get my hair done by him tho.

Like I said, things are evolving and these things are relatively new and I am sure more doctors will hop on this as well as CB0301 if it it's safe and doesn't shut down adrenals.

My reasoning is I am willing to try anything. I recently (past 2 months) had a lot of shedding after 18 months of not losing almost any hair so my mind is wide open.

I am going to give Topical finasteride a try at 0.025% twice a week just to see what kind of serum DHT reduction I get. If I get sides or it's more than the allegedly 25% I will stop. It's a good opportunity to check this out. After that it's CB for 2 months and check adrenal function and sides.

I am extremely interested in research, testing, bloodwork and comparing treatments so for me it's more about that.

And congratulations on choosing him as your surgeon, he is on a different level and the most professional and nicest guy you'll meet. His results are also staggering.

 

[georgman]

Like I said, things are evolving and these things are relatively new and I am sure more doctors will hop on this as well as CB0301 if it it's safe and doesn't shut down adrenals.

My reasoning is I am willing to try anything. I recently (past 2 months) had a lot of shedding after 18 months of not losing almost any hair so my mind is wide open.

I am going to give Topical finasteride a try at 0.025% twice a week just to see what kind of serum DHT reduction I get. If I get sides or it's more than the allegedly 25% I will stop. It's a good opportunity to check this out. After that it's CB for 2 months and check adrenal function and sides.

I am extremely interested in research, testing, bloodwork and comparing treatments so for me it's more about that.

And congratulations on choosing him as your surgeon, he is on a different level and the most professional and nicest guy you'll meet. His results are also staggering.

If you do this in the purpose of research, that's totally fine and I highly appreciate that.

So just for better understanding. You try topical Finasteride again because you think topical Dutasteride might not do the job as good as we assume and since Finasteride definitely goes systemic you assume it might work better(if you manage the sides sufficiently)?

Thank you, I had the same feeling when I was in Porto for consultation. He definitely is an Artist and the fact that he worked with Dr. Lorenzo is a big plus too.

 

[Mustang]

I am trying Topical Finasteride 0.025% twice a week because I want to confirm or refute the research that it only reduces 25% of serum DHT (which is similar what 0.25% of Topical Dutasteride would reduce). TD reduces 80% scalp DHT at that dosage vs only 50% on Finasteride. So that is the main reason for attempting this. I want to have another alternative since TD is hard to get sometimes. Topical Dutasteride does do the job and I will resume after my finasteride and CB experiment.

The second reason being that Dutasteride inhibits both types of enzymes being one of them critical for allopregnanolone which as you know as great anxiolytic effects and Dutasteride inhibits completely while Finasteride inhibits only partially. I remember having massive anxiety on oral dutasteride.

My ultimate goal is to go on TRT and take the minimum oral or topical finasteride dose to keep my DHT in check, nuke scalp DHT with Topical Dutasteride and wash out scalp T with CB0301 so I am all up for experimenting.

I have had everything done, stem cells, PRP, topicals, research chemicals bla bla bla bla... so that's just me. I like to experiment and learn.

 

[losingbattle88]

I am trying Topical Finasteride 0.025% twice a week because I want to confirm or refute the research that it only reduces 25% of serum DHT (which is similar what 0.25% of Topical Dutasteride would reduce). TD reduces 80% scalp DHT at that dosage vs only 50% on Finasteride. So that is the main reason for attempting this. I want to have another alternative since TD is hard to get sometimes. Topical Dutasteride does do the job and I will resume after my finasteride and CB experiment.

The second reason being that Dutasteride inhibits both types of enzymes being one of them critical for allopregnanolone which as you know as great anxiolytic effects and Dutasteride inhibits completely while Finasteride inhibits only partially. I remember having massive anxiety on oral dutasteride.

My ultimate goal is to go on TRT and take the minimum oral or topical finasteride dose to keep my DHT in check, nuke scalp DHT with Topical Dutasteride and wash out scalp T with CB0301 so I am all up for experimenting.

I have had everything done, stem cells, PRP, topicals, research chemicals bla bla bla bla... so that's just me. I like to experiment and learn.

at what month did you experience massive anxiety from oral dutasteride? im 5 months on it feeling 100% normal.

 

[corkmeister]

I am trying Topical Finasteride 0.025% twice a week because I want to confirm or refute the research that it only reduces 25% of serum DHT (which is similar what 0.25% of Topical Dutasteride would reduce). TD reduces 80% scalp DHT at that dosage vs only 50% on Finasteride. So that is the main reason for attempting this. I want to have another alternative since TD is hard to get sometimes. Topical Dutasteride does do the job and I will resume after my finasteride and CB experiment.

The second reason being that Dutasteride inhibits both types of enzymes being one of them critical for allopregnanolone which as you know as great anxiolytic effects and Dutasteride inhibits completely while Finasteride inhibits only partially. I remember having massive anxiety on oral dutasteride.

My ultimate goal is to go on TRT and take the minimum oral or topical finasteride dose to keep my DHT in check, nuke scalp DHT with Topical Dutasteride and wash out scalp T with CB0301 so I am all up for experimenting.

I have had everything done, stem cells, PRP, topicals, research chemicals bla bla bla bla... so that's just me. I like to experiment and learn.

What research are you referring to? The study by Caserini et al (Polichem)? They achieved a 50/25% reduction (scalp:serum) after one week of daily application. But rather you're going to apply it twice a week and check levels at the 1 month and 2 month mark to see if the results line up? This doesn't make sense at all to me.

The research doesn't indicate that 0.025% somehow magically only reduces 25% of serum dht in every context. All that study shows it that applying it daily over the course of a week results in a 25% serum reduction, at that specific point in time. So what would you be confirming or refuting?

 

[Mustang]

That is exactly what I am trying to do.
If daily application achieved 50/25 then twice a week should hopefully decrease less than 25% serum DHT. So I'm hoping it will be even less but let's see. I can also increase to daily usage on the second month and repeat the blood test after a week or a month.

What doesn't precisely make sense to you?

"The research doesn't indicate that 0.025% somehow magically only reduces 25% of serum dht in every context. All that study shows it that applying it daily over the course of a week results in a 25% serum reduction, at that specific point in time"

Yes. I know.

 

[corkmeister]

Because you're trying to replicate/refute the outcome of a study while radically adjusting the parameters of the study. If you're curious about the effects of applying .025% twice a week, I totally get that, but I don't see what the study has to do with it at that point. You're significantly decreasing the frequency (from 7 times a week to 2 times a week) while increasing the duration of the experiment (from 1 week to 1/2 months).

How would this allow you to confirm or refute the finding that applying 0.025% daily for a week results in a 25% serum reduction? And even then, what would it really matter? It's just gonna keep dropping after that first week (or in your case, after the first month), which is exactly the main drawback/shortcoming of the Caserini studies.

 

[Mustang]

I am not trying to refute a study. I am trying to see what happens with my serum DHT using this dosage and at even lower frequency.

If my DHT plummets or decreases 50-70% with this dosage twice a week it's pretty obvious this treatment is not for me.

If anything my experiment is beneficial as this drug is accumulative and one week doesn't say much.

We will see. I'll do bloodwork baseline, one week, one month and maybe increase to 1ml daily to then to repeat a week later. Let's see what happens.

Why is this a problem for you? So much negativity on this thread. You rather me not test anything and not report anything?

 

[corkmeister]

I am trying Topical Finasteride 0.025% twice a week because I want to confirm or refute the research that it only reduces 25% of serum DHT

The only research that shows this is the Caserini study

I am not trying to refute a study.

It's not a problem for me, I welcome any data you might provide but I'm just trying to make sense of what you're trying to do here. You're just extremely hard to follow which makes people skeptical and wary of any data that you do report.

All I'm saying is that this experiment cannot confirm or refute the findings of another experiment which was set up completely differently. But you don't seem to disagree with that, so maybe that was just a miscommunication. I guess you meant that in the broadest sense, the Caserini studies show that topical finasteride is theoretically viable in terms of serum inhibition vs efficacy? And that's what you want to test out? Whatever the case, I agree that it'll be interesting to see what the effects of .025% twice a week will be. I've always believed that the key to using topical finasteride succesfully is building up the effect very slowly over time until you reach an equilibrium, whereas the approach in the Polichem studies was too fast (i.e. too high a dose) because after a week you're already at the point where the body can no longer keep up with the amount of finasteride going into circulation.

 

[Mustang]

Yes, you got it right. I don't see how me posting my bloodwork (good or bad) would be beneficial for me on a compound available everywhere.

I hate Finasteride. I am giving it a last try to see what happens at such a low dosage. Perhaps it is true that lowering the dose helps.

I am trying to find out if this is a viable option for me and what kind of build up 0.025% presents in the body after 2 months

 

[Btg]

caserini study was bullshit, phase 3 trials proved that p3074 was the same as taking oral finasteride in the long term

 

[corkmeister]

caserini study was bullshit, phase 3 trials proved that p3074 was the same as taking oral finasteride in the long term

How was it bullshit? It all depends on the conclusion you draw from it. I think it's pretty significant that it's possible to achieve a 50% reduction in scalp dht paired with a 25% reduction in serum dht. It's just that arriving at that point after only a week is not desirable, as it'll obviously continue to drop further after that. But the fact that such a ratio is possible is interesting in itself.

The marketing pitch that topical finasteride only reduces 25% serum dht is obviously nonsense, but the results of the study open some interesting possibilities. They should have done follow-up studies at lower dosages for longer periods of time.

 

[Mustang]

I am offering myself to find out

I'll dose it twice a week for a month (test baseline, 1 week and at 1 month). If it remains stable and the same after one month at least we know that 0.025% could potential only inhibit 25% after 5 weeks of usage dosed twice a week. Finasteride acts during 4 days despite the short half life. Given the drug's half-life I doubt much more accumulation would occur.

Then I'll do it daily for another month and check again and back to twice a week to check for a last time.

I have no no further systemic accumulation with Topical Dutasteride at 0.1% once the cycle has been met. In fact may last DHT test came out above 300 and it was 270 before with 0.1%. It got has low as 175 with 0.5% but I mega dosed purposely to see.

I am done with Parati. I ran out of Trichosol and bought a few bottles. Got them. Insomnia, no libido, dead dick, no morning wood (it's 3am now and just woke up again after 4 hours) and anxiety after 2 applications of 0.5%. So much for Liposomes preventing systemic absorption. At least there is no brain fog. Also, it's a complete pain in the *** to apply this gel if you have long hair. It leaves it sticky for hours.

Back to 0.1% Trichosol after this. Open to try 0.25% as well.

 

[Stating facts]

Everyone, did any of you had an unexplained morning wood on topical dutasteride? With unexplained I mean that it was so unusual that it hurts in the boxers. Sorry for the weird anecdote, but I am not using anything apart from topical dutasteride after stopping minoxidil due to its ineffectiveness on my hair. Thus I attribute this to topical dutasteride.
Yes I know that T increases on dutasteride, but with my application of 1mg every 10 days, and this too happening on 5th day after the last application was surprising.

 

[Paul C]

Well, the shed has reduced after around 3-4 months, but no new regrowth so far.

I'm just about to start topcial dutasteride and nervous about shed. What happens? Do you initially look more bald then recover?

Where are you at right now? Are you more, less or same baldness as you started with?

 

[Seuxin]

I am offering myself to find out

I'll dose it twice a week for a month (test baseline, 1 week and at 1 month). If it remains stable and the same after one month at least we know that 0.025% could potential only inhibit 25% after 5 weeks of usage dosed twice a week. Finasteride acts during 4 days despite the short half life. Given the drug's half-life I doubt much more accumulation would occur.

Then I'll do it daily for another month and check again and back to twice a week to check for a last time.

I have no no further systemic accumulation with Topical Dutasteride at 0.1% once the cycle has been met. In fact may last DHT test came out above 300 and it was 270 before with 0.1%. It got has low as 175 with 0.5% but I mega dosed purposely to see.

I am done with Parati. I ran out of Trichosol and bought a few bottles. Got them. Insomnia, no libido, dead dick, no morning wood (it's 3am now and just woke up again after 4 hours) and anxiety after 2 applications of 0.5%. So much for Liposomes preventing systemic absorption. At least there is no brain fog. Also, it's a complete pain in the *** to apply this gel if you have long hair. It leaves it sticky for hours.

Back to 0.1% Trichosol after this. Open to try 0.25% as well.

Thanks for the feedback. My pharma grade raw dutasteride is on shipment ( i got it by a pharmacist friend...not a website), i will do my own with eth+poly80+pg+cyclodextrin, using a magnetic stirrer. Now, i wonder what dose to use...0,1% once a week ? More ? Less ? For information i'm on avodart oral since 2016, no real side, just e2 too much higher now, that's why i want to switch to topical.

 

[Mr.Shelby]

I'm just about to start topcial dutasteride and nervous about shed. What happens? Do you initially look more bald then recover?

Where are you at right now? Are you more, less or same baldness as you started with?

I am on the 6th month with topical dutasteride 0.1% with trichosol once weekly and my frontline is worse than at the beginning.

Shedding continues, thinking of coming back to oral finasteride.

 

[inmyhead]

I am on the 6th month with topical dutasteride 0.1% with trichosol once weekly and my frontline is worse than at the beginning.

Shedding continues, thinking of coming back to oral finasteride.

did you drop oral finasteride? thats scary