The science of intermittent fasting

[Afro_Vacancy]

How does this go hand in hand with working out though? Say if you work out 5 days a week, 36 hour fasts are still fine? Do you just work through it on low energy, is there any risk of injury?

There is only research paper out right now on weight training + fasting. It showed that fasting is good for muscle gains, however it was a research paper of low quality, so we shouldn't let it influence us.

Some recommendations from people like krista varady are that fasted exercise is ok, but the work out should be at the end of a fast.

A lot of people are doing fasted weight training which you can look up. I was often going to lift weights first thing in the morning, then shower then food.

When I was working out 4-6 days a week previously, the 36-hour fast was on an off-day.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

I will have a last meal tonight and will begin my first long calorie-free fast tomorrow. The minimum I want to do is 4.5-days (Friday through Monday inclusive) but I'd like to do between 7 and 21 days. My previous record is 3.5 days, done twice. I will track my progress with scale measurements and photos.

I'm not sure what's for dinner tonight. I'm thinking two miso soups, a few nuts, a tablespoon of coconut oil, a small salad.

What's been stalling my progress recently is almost certainly subpar eating on non-fasting days. Once I'm done this fast, I will try and go gluten free, added sugar free, alcohol free, while simultaneously placing a heavy emphasis on oily fish, vegetables, and fermented foods for an extended period, maybe three months.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

How does this go hand in hand with working out though? Say if you work out 5 days a week, 36 hour fasts are still fine? Do you just work through it on low energy, is there any risk of injury?

We now apparently have a good study on intermittent fasting and lifting, article:
http://translational-medicine.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12967-016-1044-0
analysis:
http://strengtheory.com/intermittent-fasting-study/
and more analysis:
http://www.leangains.com/2016/10/the-leangains-study.html

This study had a large sample size (over 30 subjects), a well-defined diet for both groups, and measured many variables. What they found:

Our results suggest that an intermittent fasting program in which all calories are consumed in an 8-h window each day, in conjunction with resistance training, could improve some health-related biomarkers, decrease fat mass, and maintain muscle mass in resistance-trained males.

From Martin Berkhan:
1. In this study, intermittent fasting beats out a normal diet, assuming we count points based on the overall impact on body composition. Over 8 weeks, subjects doing intermittent fasting a la Leangains, lost a lot more fat - and even gained more muscle - than subjects on a normal diet.

2. True, the muscle gain is non-significant - scientifically speaking - but for someone in the real world, adding 1.4 lbs of muscle over 8 weeks is quite a bit, especially if you're simultaneously losing fat.

3. These guys were not beginners either. Starting out with an average bench of 107-110 kg at 84 kg or so, they were well into the intermediate stage. It's worth noting that the intermittent fasters upped their bench by 3.3 kg, while the other group barely gained anything (0.7 kg). Increasing your bench press while losing weight is a b**ch, that's why it's worth noting. On the leg press, gains were about equal in both groups (8-10 kg).

*******

We can thus clearly conclude that for fixed nutritional intake, for above-averag-but-not-elite athletes seeking to make progress, an 8-hour eating window is superior to a 16-hour eating window.

 

[Rudiger]

Crazy, thanks for that David. Sorry I haven't had time to read properly about it but was the study done based on daily intermittent fasting, or were their breaks through the week? Glancing through the links I couldn't see, so I assume it's every day.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

Crazy, thanks for that David. Sorry I haven't had time to read properly about it but was the study done based on daily intermittent fasting, or were their breaks through the week? Glancing through the links I couldn't see, so I assume it's every day.

This one compared 8-hour eating window to normal eating. So food every day.

 

[hairblues]

i can't do fasting i get too cranky but i have done very low calorie days followed by moderate calorie days and that works when your at a plateau..i think it kind of shakes up the metabolism a bit. The days i have done very low i just dont work out and choose it to be a day i dont have to do much and i drink a lot of tea because it kills appetite.
i think some people call it calorie cycling..I don't realy do that i just sometime drop down if i am stuck and then go back to normal and a pound will come off that week.

once i figure this sh*t out with my hair diagnosis (nail bitting) I am going to go back to that one day a week doing vlcd and rest of week moderate.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

I'm trying to do my first long fast right now, I have not eaten a meal since Thursday night so this is day 2. I did accidentally break it today by ordering a chai tea at starbucks, which came with milk (to my surprise), so I had about 190 calories which isn't the end of the world:
http://www.starbucks.com/menu/drinks/tea/chai-latte#size=135608&milk=63
I'll just pretend that didn't happen.

October 22nd, 2016, 181.8 lbs, 82.5 Kg

I'm overall pretty relaxed right now though I was cold this morning. I'm trying to drink a lot of water. I bought three litres of sparkling water at a local pharmacy (CVS).

If I last past Monday morning, I will have broken my record. I would like to go 7-14 days.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

October 22nd, 2016, 181.8 lbs, 82.5 Kg
October 23rd, 2016, 180.2 lbs, 81.7 Kg

Looks like my water weight converged pretty quick. Or maybe drinking that coffee had a big effect. I normally lose ~3 lbs on the second day, not 1.6 lbs. Oh well. One day at a time.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

October 22nd, 2016, 181.8 lbs, 82.5 Kg
October 23rd, 2016, 180.2 lbs, 81.7 Kg
October 24th, 2016, 177.0 lbs, 80.3 Kg

Yesterday I mostly drank sparkling water. I had 1 coffee black without cream nor sugar, and a couple tablespoons of salted, grassfed butter. I read that salted grassfed butter is a good hack during fasts, as it brings in salts which prevent dehydration, and the butter has zero protein and zero carbs. Grassfed butter is healthier than normal butter too.

 

[CopeForLife]

butter...

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

butter...

Butter from grass-fed cows is good for you.

 

[Dench57]

Hang on, you just ate tablespoons of butter on its own?

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

October 22nd, 2016, 181.8 lbs, 82.5 Kg
October 23rd, 2016, 180.2 lbs, 81.7 Kg
October 24th, 2016, 177.0 lbs, 80.3 Kg
October 25th, 2016, 175.0 lbs, 79.4 Kg

Yesterday, I had almost entirely water, plus 1 cup of black coffee, 1 cup of tea, and a few pieces of gum which apparently have a few calories. I do wonder when my water weight converges, as I'm still dropping over 1 lbs a day.

Hang on, you just ate tablespoons of butter on its own?

Approximately two tablespoons. Yes, it's a fasting hack to take in some salt, as salted butter contains salt. Butter is also pure fat so it shouldn't disrupt a fat as much, since glucose raises insulin levels and protein raises mtor levels.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

October 22nd, 2016, 181.8 lbs, 82.5 Kg
October 23rd, 2016, 180.2 lbs, 81.7 Kg
October 24th, 2016, 177.0 lbs, 80.3 Kg
October 25th, 2016, 175.0 lbs, 79.4 Kg
October 26th, 2016, 173. 8 lbs, 78.8 Kg

I only lost 1.2 lbs yesterday, my smallest loss yet, which I think means my water weight is converging, finally. I feel pretty good overall.

Yesterday I consumed 1 cup of black coffee, 1 cup of white tea, 1 cup of green tea, and a whole lot of water. At night I had a glass of salt water, where I put in about two teaspoons of sea salt.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

October 22nd, 2016, 181.8 lbs, 82.5 Kg
October 23rd, 2016, 180.2 lbs, 81.7 Kg
October 24th, 2016, 177.0 lbs, 80.3 Kg
October 25th, 2016, 175.0 lbs, 79.4 Kg
October 26th, 2016, 173. 8 lbs, 78.8 Kg
October 27th, 2016, 172.2 lbs, 78.1 Kg

Aside from water/tea/coffee/salt, I had one piece of gum yesterday, 2.5 calories.
I did lose too much weight yesterday, but it may be due to the fact I finally took a poop. That was overdue by several days.

An interesting side effect, I can't feel my paraumbilical hernia anymore, I wonder if it's gone.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

October 22nd, 2016, 181.8 lbs, 82.5 Kg
October 23rd, 2016, 180.2 lbs, 81.7 Kg
October 24th, 2016, 177.0 lbs, 80.3 Kg
October 25th, 2016, 175.0 lbs, 79.4 Kg
October 26th, 2016, 173. 8 lbs, 78.8 Kg
October 27th, 2016, 172.2 lbs, 78.1 Kg
October 28th, 2016, 171.8 lbs, 77.9 Kg

I broke my fast yesterday because I was not feeling good. I might not be feeling good because of the fast not working, or because of a cold -- a congested throat is really bothering me. Aside from the usual water/tea/coffee/salt/chewing gum, I had ~1000 calories, made up of very high-fat foods:

- 200 calories of salted, grassfed butter;
- 2 teaspoons of coconut oil;
- A club soda with some lime juice dumped in;
- 2 pieces of 85% dark chocolate with some peanut butter slabbed on;
- roasted macadamia nuts;

The 0.4 lbs of weight loss probably signal some fat loss + water gain. I think today and tomorrow I'll clock in at ~1,000 calories too. I might restart fasting on Sunday.

 

[matthewmarcos24]

i'm going to start doing this 1-2 days a week to see if it helps with my pfs recovery.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

October 22nd, 2016, 181.8 lbs, 82.5 Kg
October 23rd, 2016, 180.2 lbs, 81.7 Kg
October 24th, 2016, 177.0 lbs, 80.3 Kg
October 25th, 2016, 175.0 lbs, 79.4 Kg
October 26th, 2016, 173. 8 lbs, 78.8 Kg
October 27th, 2016, 172.2 lbs, 78.1 Kg
*October 28th, 2016, 171.8 lbs, 77.9 Kg
*October 29th, 2016, 172.8 lbs, 78.4 Kg

I continued my inter-fasting period yesterday and put on more water weight as such.

Breakfast: small basket of blackberries (~60 calories, negative net carbs), one probiotic yogurt with very low added sugar (~190 calories), one bottle of probiotic kombucha (~50 calories), and one piece of salmon fillet (~300 calories?), so ~600 calories total.

Lunch: a cup of chicken noddle (~150 calories?) where I threw in lots of extra herbs, salts, pepper; and a large salad of spinach, kale, broccoli, eggplant, zuchini, onion, cabbage, some tuna, a bit of olive oil and balsamic vinegar (~350 calories? zero net carbs no doubt).

So overall I ate ~1,200 calories yesterday, which were nearly perfect in quality. I'll have another meal and likely resume fasting tomorrow.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

*October 21st, 2016, 186.6 lbs, 84.6 Kg
October 22nd, 2016, 181.8 lbs, 82.5 Kg
October 23rd, 2016, 180.2 lbs, 81.7 Kg
October 24th, 2016, 177.0 lbs, 80.3 Kg
October 25th, 2016, 175.0 lbs, 79.4 Kg
October 26th, 2016, 173. 8 lbs, 78.8 Kg
October 27th, 2016, 172.2 lbs, 78.1 Kg
*October 28th, 2016, 171.8 lbs, 77.9 Kg
*October 29th, 2016, 172.8 lbs, 78.4 Kg
*October 30th, 2016, 176.2 lbs, 79.9 Kg

I continued my inter-fasting period yesterday and put on more water weight as such. I must of had between 3,000 and 3,500 calories, maybe 4,000 calories. I had a moderate lunch ... and then a large dinner. It was a friend's birthday, we went to a lebanese restaurant where I had a full meal, and then went to a bar afterwards where I had 1 beer. The calories were mostly very good though.

Long fast re-begins today, I'll see how long I can go, I have not set end in mind.

 

[kj6723]

I binged ate hardcore this weekend. The amount of ice cream and other sh*t I hate was obscene. Will likely take me at least a week to recover from this one lol