rogaine contraindicated

hairhelp

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Have a look at the protocol section on this website. They do not recommend Rogaine
http://www.hairloss-research.org/protocol.htmlaine!
ROGAINE CONTRAINDICATED

Based on the preponderance of studies and anecdotal reports, we have omitted Rogaine 2 and 5% from our protocol. It appears that Rogaine, despite its short term effectiveness in some patients almost invariably loses its effectiveness due to tolerance. The usual timeframe on tolerance to set in is from 12 to 18 months. More importantly, it causes a tremendous amount of shedding in all patients upon stoppage. Of real concern is that this shedding is typically above and beyond what one would have normally gained through any treatment response. This phenomena is clinically termed loss of “minoxidil dependent hairâ€￾, and implies that stopping minoxidil use may result in loss of hair that may have been otherwise unaffected by androgenetic alopecia (pattern loss). Stopping other treatments such as Propecia will result in a gradual regression to the pre-treatment state. With Minoxidil this loss is much more dramatic. This seems to occur regardless of other treatments being used to offset this process. Any review of the medical literature will confirm its transient and marginal effectiveness at both 2 and 5 percent concentrations. If you are currently using Rogaine you would be well advised to stay on it, however you will likely need to use increasingly higher concentrations to maintain any results. In fact there is a 12.5% version being made available by one doctor. If you are currently using Rogaine and chose to get off it would be wise to gradually reduce your usage and substitute the Pyridine-N-Oxides (Dr. Proctor) to avoid the hair loss that invariably occurs with the cessation of Minoxidil treatment. Because of the similarity in their core technology, the Pyridine-N-Oxides appear unique in their ability to do this. The current thinking on Rogaine by several practitioners is that it is best avoided altogether.
 

rill

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I wish they could tell this a year ago, y hairline would feel a lot better
 

youngguy_uk

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ohhh dear, so that puts a big dent in things..the 2nd biggest treatment not recommended..but didnt everyone know that minoxidil wears off anyway? but 12-18 months..hardly worth it for a lifetime treatment or extra loss. i was planning on using propecia, when that wears off switch to avodart, and when that wears off keep it going with minoxidil 2%, then 5%, then 12.5%...if this all worked it could have kept hair for about 10-20 years. so much for that plan then.
 

jacksprat

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Re: the article

Look a little further down on that website:
DR. PROCTOR'S ADVANCED HAIR REGROWTH FORMULA- Contents a potent dose of "natural" minoxidil (NANO), combined with SODases (Copper complexes like Folligen) and a natural 5-alpha-reductase inhibitor. It simultaneously counters the autoimmune inflammatory effects and DHT components of the balding process, in addition to having a strong hair growth stimulating effect.

Guess what? This guy is peddling another formula that contains minoxidil, the main ingredient in Rogaine. This guy's advice doesn't add up.
 

Resultsnottypical

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minoxidil

I do not doubt that there could be a tolerance built up to minoxidil (or propecia for that matter). I think it all comes down to personal choice.

First, you may find that you gain hairs for THREE years, or one and a half, or FIVE...you never know until you try. You could use propecia and find that it has very little affect on regrowth, but does allow you to maintain (nevermind side-effects, lets say it is a rarity).

Secondly, you have to figure, you want to keep and/or increase what you have for the long run. minoxidil figures into that equation, as does propecia, the only two proven treatments. For me, at 33, if I continue to see regrowth this year and maintain for another one- to- five years, or maybe only three, or only one more year, I will have bought some time. Then I can consider if I want to go on 1mg of finasteride, or just shave my head as I have done in the past.

Each treatment has its negatives, people forget that. THey are not all risk free, or the end-all to saving your hair. In the end, there is the reality that your body is trying to lose hair, that it is genetically rigged to do that, and anything that helps stop that, is good fortune. So pick the best, proven treatments, stick with them, and accept their eventual problems (whether it be side-effects, less efficacy, or the fact that they don't really regrow that much hair).
 

youngguy_uk

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celtictygr - i think people know the consequences that can come out of minoxidil use, but i think its a case of them knowing it after rather than before. when i saw a trichologist, she wanted to get me started on propecia and minoxidil. it was only because i knew about the effects of minoxidil i said no. she didnt even mention a thing about having to stick with it for life, or that itd wear off very quickly, or that it could cause shedding. at best, i think before starting minoxidil most people know it might wear off after years - they dont know itll probably last 12-18 months, unless they are lucky enough to come to a place like hairlosstalk first. and even then.

id be interested to know what the findings are regarding how long minoxidil lasts if you begin at 2% and step up a strength when one begins to fail.
 

ColtsFan

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Kelly is the guy that runs that web site and he is very knowledgable. That being said, I personally have had great success w/ minoxidil, and i wouldnt let his advice alter your "protocol" as he puts it.

I mean look, Dr Lee, Dr Proctor, Dr Raztec, Dr Pickart, etc all agree that minoxidil is one of only 2 or 3 proven treatments to grow hair, and I would put my trust in them before I would a guy trying to sell Dr Proctors Regrowth Formula at an inflated price (you can get it cheaper at LEF.com)

Dont get me wrong Dr P' Formula (aka Proxiphen-n) is an awesome product, but dont ditch it for minoxidil if youre getting results.....

just my 2 cents
 

Resultsnottypical

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the part about having to use it for life, is a given, just as with propecia. the part about it wearing off, is another matter. i would have to look at the studies, but i was thinking that hair weights and growth had held steady for several years in some studies.

i think the worst part might be that if you stopped using it, but had picked up propecia, as an alternative, you will lose all the minoxidil hairs ( assuming i suppose, they are "different" hairs), anyhow. now THAT sucks.

i guess im stuck with it for two more years. we shall see.
 

The Gardener

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I don't see what the big deal is here. The article says what we all already know, that after a certain period of time the regrowth properties of minoxidil stop. This article pegs it at 12-18 months, other 'knowledgeable people' (Dr Lee, for instance), peg it at 2-3 years.

As for hair falling out due to minoxidil dependency, this only happens when you STOP taking minoxidil, which everyone knows because it is written in the minoxidil instruction pamphlet.

Averaging out the article's 12-18 month and Dr Lee's 2-3 years estimates, lets say that I get regrowth for 2 years. Then, if I switch from my 5% to a higher concentration of minoxidil, let's say Xandrox 15%, then I might get another year or two. Basically, I am getting three years worth of regrowth (and yes, the minoxidil IS and continues to regrow my hair) and then after that I get maintenance via once daily applications. Regardless of the regrowth I am enjoying, the minoxidil is doing a splendid job of saving my hairline which is my real goal.
 

rill

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You guys are missing the point, they say that you do not only loose the hair you have regrown but you also loose the other "healthy" hair that you perhaps would have kept.
 

Axon

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As a 19 month user of Minoxidil, I disagree and do not think this is accurate . I still have way more hair than baseline.
 

rill

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The POINT is, when you STOP using minoxidil, there is a possibility that you will loose even moore hair than you would wihout minoxidil in the first place.
This is ofcourse uncertain.
 

Jack ITB

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Well, after reading a few books on landscape watering techniques and spending a little time that the Home Depot procuring hardware, I have set up a trickle watering system on my scalp that is controlled by timer. I just put Rogaine in the reservoir instead of water, and voila.
 

Jude

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HairLossTalk.com,

Can you PLEASE shed some light on this because this topic is scaring the ever-loving sh*t out of me (and probably everyone else too)

Thanks in advance.
 

The Gardener

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I heard it was kind of a down and then back up result. You quit minoxidil, shed, and yes the shed makes you lose more hair than if you never were on minoxidil. BUT, those hairs grow back after the shed. So, it can and does get worse, but then improves again to where you would have been without minoxidil.

I mean, if a hair is programmed to grow and not be affected by DHT, then it will grow, whether or not minoxidil is present. The minoxidil chemical will affect this hair, make it shed when you start minoxidil, and make it shed when you stop minoxidil... but minoxidil will not kill a hair.

But the main point of your worry is correct. When you start minoxidil, you start it for life. So if you are not sure about using it, then don't start it. This is why when a newbie asks for a regime recommendation on this website, I am always hesitant of immediately saying "Big 3".
 

david60176

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Just a couple of quick thoughts/questions:

1. I would actually like to know, methodlogically, how researchers determine if hair loss is abnormally accelterated post-minoxidil use. Considering how everyone loses hair at different rates and not even indivudal hair loss is chronolgically consistent, one would think it would be highly diffifcult to detereine what is accelerated and what is not.

2. Sounded somewhat like a sales pitch at the end. I wouldn't be suprised if they are bending and twisting the research.

3. In a intuative sense, I think Gardner hit it right ont he nail when he said: "Hair unaffected by DHT, and barring any other environmental or nutritional factor, will grow."

4. Wasn't this topic brought up serveral months ago?
 

HairlossTalk

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Cmon guys.

Where exactly are the credentials for this web site?

Does it say the site is run by a guy who knows his stuff?

I know for a personal fact that this site is run by a surfer in Florida who only does this as a hobby.

He is not an expert, he is not a hair researcher, and he is not a doctor.

Read the CLINICAL DATA (!!!!!!!!!) on things.

Do not live and breathe by some random page you find on the internet that could have been written by homer simpson for all you know!

Think, think think!

Minoxidil was already clinically proven to work for at least 5 years in FDA trials. Don't be so swayed by anything and everything you see online guys!

Question, Question, Question! Question everything!

HairLossTalk.com
 
G

Guest

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Well in terms of being on finasteride and minoxidil at the same time, isn't it likely that being on finasteride would help lenghten the time minoxidil works on somebody? I mean with the minoxidil you are stimulating regrowth but not doing anything against the main cause of male pattern baldness. The main cause being the DHT, would be supressed while on finasteride therefore it would allow the minoxidil to work even better.

That's just what i think, i don't know if its true or not. But anyways, say if it does stop working in 2 years(i doubt it), then why not just up the concentration of minoxidil. I know of a bunch of posters on this website that have been using minoxidil for many years and are still maintaing above baseline. Remember Bruce Lee? He's been on minoxidil for over 10years, and its still keeping his crown covered with hairs. Also he is a good example of somebody using DHT blockers along with minoxidil. At one point he got on finasteride, but i he dropped it and got on crinagen i believe. Maybe due to the use of the antiDHT topicals, the minoxidil is able to last longer.

One more thing, can anyone post the 5 year study results?
 
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