Propecia's devastating effect on neurohormones

[Ende]

Take a look at the chart. Example; allopregnanolone was reduced by more than 300% (!!!) after 4 months treatment.

5 mg finasteride a day, is just as potent as 1 mg a day.

 

[Wuffer]

Damn, that's actually some scary stuff..

Do you have more info on how these numbers were obtained? Was it just from one patient, or an average from a number of patients?

Have you had your allopregnanolone levels tested, Enden (or is having it tested viable?)

 

[Ende]

Download- and take look at the study which is attached in the first post. The numbers are the average result. I don't remember how many patients that they used in the study, but it was a group of men.

I wanted to check my neurohormones, but my doctor wouldn't refer me to a specialist...

 

[Ende]

Take a closer look at allopregnanolone. In one case, the level was reduced by 876.5%!!!

 

[Wuffer]

Oh right, I didn't see that.

Are neurohormones actually tested from your brain tissue, or is it from a spinal tap or something?

I don't know much about hormones, but I assume allopregnanolone can not easily (or at all) be supplemented.

 

[Ende]

Oh right, I didn't see that.

Are neurohormones actually tested from your brain tissue, or is it from a spinal tap or something?

I don't know much about hormones, but I assume allopregnanolone can not easily (or at all) be supplemented.

I have no idea. I guess they draw some blood from your arm like they do with most other tests. I think the paper states how they did this in the study. Allopregnanolone is made from progesterone, so a progesterone cream (they're available OTC) could increase the allopregnanolone level.

 

[Ende]

Low level of allopregnanolone has been linked to MS as well.

Individuals with multiple sclerosis (MS) may have impaired production of important neurosteroid molecules in their brains, so replacement therapy could be helpful, researchers said.

Autopsy findings from 16 MS patients showed high expression of micro-RNA molecules in white matter that suppress enzymes responsible for neurosteroid synthesis, particularly allopregnanolone, according to Christopher Power, MD, of the University of Alberta in Edmonton, and colleagues.

The researchers also confirmed that levels of allopregnanolone and other steroids were depressed in the MS patients' white matter, they reported online in Brain.

(...)

and as if that wasn't enough

(...)

Although neurosteroids had not previously attracted much attention in MS research, their involvement should not be a surprise, Power and colleagues argued.

These substances "exert diverse effects on neural cell function and survival in the brain," they wrote. In particular, allopregnanolone is recognized as a regulator of GABAergic function, which in turn affects behavior and survival of glial cells and neurons.

Allopregnanolone also appears to diminish proinflammatory activity of at least some immune cells, the researchers indicated. But unlike glucocorticoids, it lacks broad immunosuppressive effects -- "hence, this and related molecules might provide new therapeutic options, devoid of the side-effects of common immunosuppressive therapies," Power and colleagues wrote.

Brain Steroids Found Lacking in MS

 

[6730]

does Allopregnalone levels rise once u get off the drugs

is there any irreversible damage?

 

[TravisB]

Merck is a huge, HUUUUGE pharma. I actually think that they can get away with everything that isn't killing people. It's virtually impossible for Propecia to not have any negative effect on your organism when it fucks up your hormones so much. Some people can not feel any symptoms, but as it's documented by many people on the internet, the tactile sides can come out after many years (even 10 years), or just after you drop the drug. I just don't see how can you alter your hormones for so many years, and then not be screwed up.

However, I'm considering Finasteride myself, but I don't have any certainty that something better will come out in the next 5 years, and I certainly don't want to be on finasteride for a very long time!

 

[Prop]

However, I'm considering Finasteride myself, but I don't have any certainty that something better will come out in the next 5 years, and I certainly don't want to be on finasteride for a very long time!

but even if a new drug come out with promising result, will be advisable use it without any long term study?
new drugs new risks

unfortunately after my fina exeperience i became too much cautious

 

[Timi]

i think Finasterid makes more Heartproblems as minoxidil

for 3Months i have take 0,5mg Oraly and 0,1mg Topic finasteride

my Bloodpressure goes high to 190/125 Heartracing Pulse 125
become breathig Problems!
No minoxidil!! it was finasteride allone


Timi

 

[Ende]

Merck is a huge, HUUUUGE pharma. I actually think that they can get away with everything that isn't killing people.

Propecia is killing people, and more people will commit suicide if PFS isn't solved. If all those people leave a suicide note, which explains everything - how can Merck get away with it? People will be describing the same symptoms, and it's clear that the experience has had a major impact your life, if you chose to commit suicide. They can't argue against it, unless a victim has been prescribed an anti-depressant BEFORE being prescribed Propecia.

 

[Timi]

but minoxidil is the same Bad Drug
when i apply it dizzy Head-Heartracing
Pain in my Lungs-Heart Pain
swelling Face-Tinnitus
extreme tiredness for 5Days

the Drugs
Plague and cholera

Timi

 

[kehcorpz]

Not everyone is affected by propecia the same way. In fact, a very small percentage is. People are dying from peanuts because of allergies you do not see them banning peanuts. The internet has a lot of people experiencing problems from numerous different things from natural vitamins to pharmaceutical drugs. When you have issues you go to the internet to research and voice your opinion. If you consider the amount that are not suffering from it you realize what a small percentage the side effects affect. Planes crash, did you want to ban flight? It's a small percentage of occurrence. You don't make decisions for other people and try to get something like this banned just because it doesn't work for you. I know many people who have no issues on it and have been on it for over 8 years +. I have had depression since I was young and Propecia barely made a dent to my allopregnanolone levels but they were already low. After taking Lexapro my allopregnanolone/serotonin levels went way up and i'm super happy and enjoying life. There's people out there that have the most horrific side effects on Lexapro, yet I don't. I would hate for them to ban a medication that helps me and millions of others just because it doesn't help a small percentage. It changed my life and I'm glad that it's still being produced regardless of all the people that had issues. Medicine is not exact because we are all different. If we weren't then things would be much easier.

And propecia if taken at the 1mg dose only impacts 5-ar type II enzyme. Allopregnanolone is not converted by this enzyme.

5?-reductase inhibitor drugs are used in benign prostatic hyperplasia, prostate cancer, male pattern baldness, and hormone replacement therapy (male to female) for transgendered women. Both isoforms are also produced in the brain, where they serve to create the neurosteroid allopregnanolone (5AR type I) and convert T to DHT(5AR type II)(1). Finasteride inhibits the function of only one of the isoenzymes (type 2), whereas dutasteride inhibits both forms.

This explains why my allopregnanolone levels were not effected after 6 months of propecia use. I have been using 1mg and am now up to 1.25mg. But once again we are all different and there may be other mechanisms by which a lowering of neurosteroids occurs. Either way, don't ruin a chance for someone else to gain benefits just because you didn't.

Merck is a huge, HUUUUGE pharma. I actually think that they can get away with everything that isn't killing people.

Propecia is killing people, and more people will commit suicide if PFS isn't solved. If all those people leave a suicide note, which explains everything - how can Merck get away with it? People will be describing the same symptoms, and it's clear that the experience has had a major impact your life, if you chose to commit suicide. They can't argue against it, unless a victim has been prescribed an anti-depressant BEFORE being prescribed Propecia.

 

[Ende]

Propecia affects neurohormones somehow, but it appears to be some sort of chain reaction, and not the inhibition of 5AR Type 2 - because like you said, allopregnanolone is made through 5AR Type 1 only. I recently had a discussion about it on propeciahelp. I've confronted Mew with it a couple of times since he began preaching about it here on HairLossTalk.com, but he never responded.

http://www.propeciahelp.com/forum/viewt ... f=5&t=5748
http://www.propeciahelp.com/forum/viewt ... f=1&t=5960

You clearly don't understand how dangerous Propecia is. It's poison, yet the authorities claims that it's safe! I don't care who chose to swallow the pills - despite being aware of the risk, but Merck and the authorities have FAILED to inform about the severe effects of this drug. That's the problem!

Propecia is supposed to reduce the DHT level, and increase the testosterone- (it actually decreases the free testosterone level in all the cases) and estrogen level, yet it fucks some people up like nothing else, and that's because A LOT MORE hormone levels are altered in those cases!

 

[kehcorpz]

Ok fair enough. My doctor is responsible and has been taking tests regularly and nothing is out of the ordinary. I have also never experienced sexual side effects. I feel for those who have. I agree that people should be made aware of the potential problems that could arise. Doctors should also be more educated and only allow the drug if regular tests are done. I think Merck is acknowledging some of the bad effects by listing "Depression" as one of the side effects. Problem is depression is really complex and scientists don't truly understand it. Even SSRIs are believed to work through another mechanism than serotonin increase. It's some sort of chain reaction that occurs which fixes the depression, just like with propecia some sort of chain reaction may cause problems.

 

[kc444]

If 5mg of finasteride is just as potent as 1mg, then why would any doctor prescribe 5mg? Also, consider that many drugs which are selective at low doses lose their selectivity when the dosage is higher, which very well be the case here. If you look at the percentages, you'll find that a significantly higher number of people experience side effects at 5mg compared to 1mg. 18% of people experience lowered libido at 5mg compared to only 2% at 1mg. There's no way they are exactly the same.

I'm not trying to dismiss this, because obviously this sounds serious and should be looked into ASAP. On the other hand, it's quite likely that there is a difference between the two dosages.

 

[Timi]

i have take 0,1mg and the same side effects as 1mg

than 0,1mg Topic the same side effects as oraly
and more Eyeproblems as Oraly and insane headaches

i have stoped all Drugs for 3Months the side effects goes not away
Libido Zero and Fat Body

 

[Ende]

If 5mg of finasteride is just as potent as 1mg, then why would any doctor prescribe 5mg? Also, consider that many drugs which are selective at low doses lose their selectivity when the dosage is higher, which very well be the case here. If you look at the percentages, you'll find that a significantly higher number of people experience side effects at 5mg compared to 1mg. 18% of people experience lowered libido at 5mg compared to only 2% at 1mg. There's no way they are exactly the same.

I'm not trying to dismiss this, because obviously this sounds serious and should be looked into ASAP. On the other hand, it's quite likely that there is a difference between the two dosages.

A single dose inhibits an equal amount of DHT. Ever thought that maybe more than 2% experienced side effects from Propecia? I recently had a look at the FDA's statistical review on Propecia, and noticed that every single person who took finasteride for a year, experienced sexual side effects - according to a questionnaire they answered before- and after the treatment.

Comparisons between treatment groups at Month 12 on changes from baseline scores in the Sexual Function Questionnaire showed decreases in all parameters in patients treated with finasteride, while those treated with placebo did not or showed less decrease.

http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfd ... _STATR.PDF

 

[cuebald]

I just took 25mg of finasteride (5 5mg Proscar tablets) i will report back if anything happens