Numerous vitamin supplements?

slurms mackenzie

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squeegee said:
sir chugalot said:
On the basis of the data presented, the Panel concludes that a cause and effect relationship has not been established between the dietary intake of vitamin E and maintenance of a normal scalp.

http://www.efsa.europa.eu/en/efsajournal/pub/1816.htm


Out of interest what form of vitamin e was used in that study.

Was it the form used in the study i linked to earlier?


Probably tocotrrienols.

the truth is it doesn't say, from what i gather most existing research on vitamin e is for tocopherols.

The wiki page says that less than 1% of studies of vitamin e are on the tocotreinol form, so far the only double blind study i've read about (and linked to in honour of powersam) said that tocotrienols were beneficial for hair, I've not read any study that conflicts with this.

So freakout you'll have to forgive me if I don't think the link you posted about vitamin e and hair is relevant to tocotrienols.

More studies may show that actually they are a load of guff, but until that day ....
 

Thom

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I think the people here are more than willing to accept herbal supplements as a cure if someone can just show us some hardcore evidence backing it up.

Not an obscure study, we want to see pictures. So far no one has been able to even show such evidence.
 

slurms mackenzie

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Thom said:
I think the people here are more than willing to accept herbal supplements as a cure if someone can just show us some hardcore evidence backing it up.

Not an obscure study, we want to see pictures. So far no one has been able to even show such evidence.

Well it's one more study than a contrarian opinion can provide at the moment, and it's published.

Hmmm now what if there was a study that proved somewhere one of the thousands of available supplements slowed down hair loss.

How would you prove that, this is what i talk about when i say the debate seems to be completely polarised), and when that happens people rule out things which may yet be proven to provide that little extra boost that's needed.

Some people will only be happy once a tribe of naked mole rats have been turned into wookies before their very eyes.
 

DM5sadouche

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ukmale24 said:
But they can help the effects of male pattern baldness.

How great would this site be if all we ever spoke of was only FDA approved treatment for male pattern baldness ... not.

I don't get why, if you don't agree with something, move the f*ck on, no need to ridicule someone else's opinion, it's so pretentious.

Exactly how did I ridcule anything? Please point that out for me please. Having baseline before pics to go along with after treatment ones are pretty standard practice. Particularly for people trying to compare unproven treatments to proven and established ones.
 

ukmale24

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DM5sadouche said:
ukmale24 said:
But they can help the effects of male pattern baldness.

How great would this site be if all we ever spoke of was only FDA approved treatment for male pattern baldness ... not.

I don't get why, if you don't agree with something, move the f*ck on, no need to ridicule someone else's opinion, it's so pretentious.

Exactly how did I ridcule anything? Please point that out for me please. Having baseline before pics to go along with after treatment ones are pretty standard practice. Particularly for people trying to compare unproven treatments to proven and established ones.


Who are you? I've not seen one post in this thread by yourself, lol.
 

DM5sadouche

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ukmale24 said:
DM5sadouche said:
ukmale24 said:
But they can help the effects of male pattern baldness.

How great would this site be if all we ever spoke of was only FDA approved treatment for male pattern baldness ... not.

I don't get why, if you don't agree with something, move the f*ck on, no need to ridicule someone else's opinion, it's so pretentious.

Exactly how did I ridcule anything? Please point that out for me please. Having baseline before pics to go along with after treatment ones are pretty standard practice. Particularly for people trying to compare unproven treatments to proven and established ones.


Who are you? I've not seen one post in this thread by yourself, lol.

Look back on page 12. If you weren't referring to me in your post immediately after mine, then I apologize.
 

freakout

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UunoTurhapuro

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freakout said:
sir chugalot said:
Out of interest what form of vitamin e was used in that study.

Was it the form used in the study i linked to earlier?

Just read this.
https://sites.google.com/a/fontsicons.c ... dant-myth/

I scanned the pages of acopyrighted material so I'm removing it after you've read it. Say two days?

You are willing to scan other books and share it with people yet you cannot copy a page from the book you advertise by Mercado. Isn't that very strange???
 

The Natural

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DM5sadouche said:
Having baseline before pics to go along with after treatment ones are pretty standard practice. Particularly for people trying to compare unproven treatments to proven and established ones.

One need do nothing more than offer, in writing, his experience(s) with said supplement that readers may choose to accept or reject (neither of which has any bearing on the effectiveness of natural treatments).
 

The Natural

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UunoTurhapuro said:
You are willing to scan other books and share it with people yet you cannot copy a page from the book you advertise by Mercado. Isn't that very strange???

LOL.
 

slurms mackenzie

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freakout said:
sir chugalot said:
Out of interest what form of vitamin e was used in that study.

Was it the form used in the study i linked to earlier?

Just read this.
https://sites.google.com/a/fontsicons.c ... dant-myth/

I scanned the pages of acopyrighted material so I'm removing it after you've read it. Say two days?

I've read it, and I think completely understand the main points of the article.

- Some vitamins have fared very badly in trials despite the fact that they are often touted as good for us.
- Megadoses of vitamins can be very detrimental
- Vitamin e tocopherol form, wasn't all it's cracked up to be.
- a diet rich in beneficial polyphenols and vits etc is a far better way to get nutrition, as far as we know at the moment, this could be down to the fact that the nutrients are also locked in with fibre and so hang around long enough to get digested.

It's hard to take an absolute contrary position to that article, I'll just add that the form of vitamin e it talks about is different to tocotrienols, which may yet prove to be another false hope, also i had no idea how popular vit e was in the US!

In terms of supplements not outperfoming a balanced diet i have another theory on it, in that i think some people use supplements because they want to compensate for having a pretty crappy lifestyle.

In terms of the whole food vs the isolated compound, I've heard this before now, if i'm right, the natural actually takes tumeric, because of it's cofactors (unknown) rather than curcumin.

It's an interesting read. Thanks
 

freakout

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Thanks, UunoTurhapuro. It's not like the scanned the entire magazine. It might even help Reader's Digest in sales. Mercado released some pages for reading if you're interested. I respect the guy and exchange email with him. He works in a remote area tending to poor people who can't pay.

sir chugalot, I had the first impression that you were a finboy :) Now I know I'm wrong. An an engineer, do you troubleshoot or are you in design or others.

Here's a paradox of male pattern baldness: The rest of the body may seem to be healthy often times. Yet the scalp shows several evidences of nutritional deficiencies.
 

freakout

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sir chugalot said:
... you'll have to forgive me if I don't think the link you posted about vitamin e and hair is relevant to tocotrienols.

I missed reading that post of yours.

In the Reader's Digest article, it says that we excrete 7 of the 8 forms of Vitamin E including tocotrienols. Which puts the study on this form in question.

When the article from EFSA mentioned Vitamin E, I think they may be referring to the group? Perhaps because Vitamin E group is contained in nature as a group and it takes a highly specialized protein from the liver to extract the form that we absorb which is tocopherol.
 

slurms mackenzie

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freakout said:
sir chugalot, I had the first impression that you were a finboy :) Now I know I'm wrong. An an engineer, do you troubleshoot or are you in design or others.

I'd probably be classed as a finboy by some, because i have no problems recommending it short term, providing people are aware are the risks.

I might have exaggerated, I'm not strictly what most engineers would class as an engineer, as I've got a BSeng (bachelor of software engineering), I tend to do a fair bit of design and architecture for financial systems.

I'll always be an engineer in my head though :)
 

slurms mackenzie

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freakout said:
Here's a paradox of male pattern baldness: The rest of the body may seem to be healthy often times. Yet the scalp shows several evidences of nutritional deficiencies.

I'm sure bloodflow would have been covered many times, I'm not sure what the official position on it is.
 

s.a.f

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Hairloss is nothing to do with bloodflow. :smack: If you cut the top of your scalp with a knife and it bleeds you dont have a scalp bloodflow problem. - Biggest myth ever as far as m.p.b is concerned.
 

slurms mackenzie

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s.a.f said:
Hairloss is nothing to do with bloodflow. :smack: If you cut the top of your scalp with a knife and it bleeds you dont have a scalp bloodflow problem. - Biggest myth ever as far as m.p.b is concerned.


Did i say i knew either way you condescending tit?
 

ukmale24

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Maybe bloodflow doesn't have something to do with the cause of male pattern baldness, but could it not have something to do with treating it? ...

Minoxidil is also a vasodilator. It is speculated that by widening blood vessels and opening potassium channels, it allows more oxygen, blood, and nutrients to the follicle.

s.a.f is the most condescending person I've seen on any of these hairloss forums. I wonder if he's letting out the pent up anger he has in him from being b*tchslapped at home by the mrs.
 
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