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Numerous vitamin supplements?

Discussion in 'Men's General Hair Loss Discussions' started by shamura, Jul 16, 2011.

  1. The Natural

    The Natural Established Member

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    No. I would be willing to bet that most members of HairLossTalk.com have not tried herbal supplements. And one's success or failure with natural treatments is not contingent upon the availability of photos or studies.

    Admittedly, from my experience and readings, internally, the right combination of herbs, vitamins, and minerals should slow hair loss for most; stop hair loss for many; and regrow hair for some/a few. The addition of a natural topical will, of course, increase the chances for success.
     
  2. slurms mackenzie

    slurms mackenzie Established Member

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    So you think supplements will have no effect whatsoever? I'm not talking about stopping male pattern baldness dead in it's tracks,

    None at all nada? not even slow things down by 1%? that's what i mean when i talk about the debate being polarised.

    This might shock you but personally i don't think vitamins and supps are enough to stop hairloss for most people , although that doesn't mean they don't help and some studies do look promising.


    Here's the deal kids, if you want to tackle hair loss, your best bang per buck is propecia, if you want to regrow hair your best bang per buck in minoxidil.


    Although the more i read about propecia the more i'm convinced it's not something that should be used as a long term treatment, but should be okay to tide people over for a couple of years.

    There are vitamins and supplements that have a good chance as helping as anciliary supplements, for example reducing TGF Beta and so on. If you have the money, i'd consider looking into some of these things, do the reading. See what feels right for you, by that i mean for example if you feel that your scalp is constantly inflamed look for stuff which reduces inflamation, if you have a history of coranary disease in your family and are going at the crown (chugalot style) try something that will help endothelial function.

    If not in the grand scheme of things, minoxidil and finasteride should be enough.
     
  3. freakout

    freakout Experienced Member

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    Still can't believe what your're reading - that Vitamins including other supplements absolutely do nothing for hair?

    And may i add that most supplements do nothing for health at all except for a few like folic acid, Vit D calcium and a few others. That we even benefit from supplements are more of an exception in reality. It's hard to believe I know after decades of these "supplemens". If you're going to do some reading, do read the other side of the debate - the radicals who are exposing wholesale scams. The Reader's Digest if full of articles exposing the reality of things.

    Here is an analogy: If a car was your food and the spark plug is the vitamin, you cannot take out the spark plug, put it in your hand and expect it to function like a spark plug. It will just be a piece of metal. Bottom line: Get your nutrients from FOOD.

    Look at your finger nails. If they're defective, you may have some nutritional deficiencies/disorders that will affect your hair. Otherwise, don't expect supplements to help.

    But here is the paradox. While one may be perfectly healthy, the balding scalp shows several indications of nutritional deficiencies.
     
  4. freakout

    freakout Experienced Member

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    Here some more to be added to what I posted earlier.

    A claim on vitamin A and maintenance of normal hair has already been assessed with an unfavourable outcome and the references cited for this claim did not provide any additional scientific data that could be used to substantiate the claim.

    http://www.efsa.europa.eu/en/efsajournal/pub/1754.htm

    On the basis of the data presented, the Panel concludes that a cause and effect relationship has not been established between the dietary intake of vitamin E and maintenance of a normal scalp.

    http://www.efsa.europa.eu/en/efsajournal/pub/1816.htm
     
  5. slurms mackenzie

    slurms mackenzie Established Member

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    Out of interest what form of vitamin e was used in that study.

    Was it the form used in the study i linked to earlier?
     
  6. squeegee

    squeegee Banned

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    Probably tocotrrienols.
     
  7. slurms mackenzie

    slurms mackenzie Established Member

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    the truth is it doesn't say, from what i gather most existing research on vitamin e is for tocopherols.

    The wiki page says that less than 1% of studies of vitamin e are on the tocotreinol form, so far the only double blind study i've read about (and linked to in honour of powersam) said that tocotrienols were beneficial for hair, I've not read any study that conflicts with this.

    So freakout you'll have to forgive me if I don't think the link you posted about vitamin e and hair is relevant to tocotrienols.

    More studies may show that actually they are a load of guff, but until that day ....
     
  8. Thom

    Thom Senior Member

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    I think the people here are more than willing to accept herbal supplements as a cure if someone can just show us some hardcore evidence backing it up.

    Not an obscure study, we want to see pictures. So far no one has been able to even show such evidence.
     
  9. slurms mackenzie

    slurms mackenzie Established Member

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    Well it's one more study than a contrarian opinion can provide at the moment, and it's published.

    Hmmm now what if there was a study that proved somewhere one of the thousands of available supplements slowed down hair loss.

    How would you prove that, this is what i talk about when i say the debate seems to be completely polarised), and when that happens people rule out things which may yet be proven to provide that little extra boost that's needed.

    Some people will only be happy once a tribe of naked mole rats have been turned into wookies before their very eyes.
     
  10. slurms mackenzie

    slurms mackenzie Established Member

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    http://www.tocotrienol.org/images/stori ... beyond.pdf

    And of course people will have their criticisms of this as well, which is perfectly fair, but its more than reasonable to bring these things to peoples attentions when there is no evidence to the contrary, that i know of.


    Yet!

    <<edit>>

    That's a really sh*t picture actually.
     
  11. DM5sadouche

    DM5sadouche Member

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    Exactly how did I ridcule anything? Please point that out for me please. Having baseline before pics to go along with after treatment ones are pretty standard practice. Particularly for people trying to compare unproven treatments to proven and established ones.
     
  12. ukmale24

    ukmale24 Established Member

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    Who are you? I've not seen one post in this thread by yourself, lol.
     
  13. DM5sadouche

    DM5sadouche Member

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    Look back on page 12. If you weren't referring to me in your post immediately after mine, then I apologize.
     
  14. freakout

    freakout Experienced Member

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    Just read this.
    https://sites.google.com/a/fontsicons.c ... dant-myth/

    I scanned the pages of acopyrighted material so I'm removing it after you've read it. Say two days?
     
  15. UunoTurhapuro

    UunoTurhapuro Established Member

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    You are willing to scan other books and share it with people yet you cannot copy a page from the book you advertise by Mercado. Isn't that very strange???
     
  16. The Natural

    The Natural Established Member

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    One need do nothing more than offer, in writing, his experience(s) with said supplement that readers may choose to accept or reject (neither of which has any bearing on the effectiveness of natural treatments).
     
  17. The Natural

    The Natural Established Member

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    LOL.
     
  18. slurms mackenzie

    slurms mackenzie Established Member

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    I've read it, and I think completely understand the main points of the article.

    - Some vitamins have fared very badly in trials despite the fact that they are often touted as good for us.
    - Megadoses of vitamins can be very detrimental
    - Vitamin e tocopherol form, wasn't all it's cracked up to be.
    - a diet rich in beneficial polyphenols and vits etc is a far better way to get nutrition, as far as we know at the moment, this could be down to the fact that the nutrients are also locked in with fibre and so hang around long enough to get digested.

    It's hard to take an absolute contrary position to that article, I'll just add that the form of vitamin e it talks about is different to tocotrienols, which may yet prove to be another false hope, also i had no idea how popular vit e was in the US!

    In terms of supplements not outperfoming a balanced diet i have another theory on it, in that i think some people use supplements because they want to compensate for having a pretty crappy lifestyle.

    In terms of the whole food vs the isolated compound, I've heard this before now, if i'm right, the natural actually takes tumeric, because of it's cofactors (unknown) rather than curcumin.

    It's an interesting read. Thanks
     
  19. freakout

    freakout Experienced Member

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    Thanks, UunoTurhapuro. It's not like the scanned the entire magazine. It might even help Reader's Digest in sales. Mercado released some pages for reading if you're interested. I respect the guy and exchange email with him. He works in a remote area tending to poor people who can't pay.

    sir chugalot, I had the first impression that you were a finboy :) Now I know I'm wrong. An an engineer, do you troubleshoot or are you in design or others.

    Here's a paradox of male pattern baldness: The rest of the body may seem to be healthy often times. Yet the scalp shows several evidences of nutritional deficiencies.
     
  20. freakout

    freakout Experienced Member

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    I missed reading that post of yours.

    In the Reader's Digest article, it says that we excrete 7 of the 8 forms of Vitamin E including tocotrienols. Which puts the study on this form in question.

    When the article from EFSA mentioned Vitamin E, I think they may be referring to the group? Perhaps because Vitamin E group is contained in nature as a group and it takes a highly specialized protein from the liver to extract the form that we absorb which is tocopherol.
     

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