New Dermaroller Study; Thoughts, comments?

[2young2retire]

guys maybe after completing the study we start to loose hair again in X years where x is the amount of years we started balding since birth.

 

[squeegee]

minoxidil upregulates the expression of vascular endothelial growth factor in human hair dermal papilla cells.

Lachgar S, Charveron M, Gall Y, Bonafe JL.
Source

Laboratoire de Biologie Cellulaire Cutanée, Institut de Recherche Pierre Fabre, Faculté de Médecine Rangueil, Toulouse, France.

Abstract

The hair follicle dermal papilla which controls hair growth, is characterized in the anagen phase by a highly developed vascular network. We have demonstrated in a previous study that the expression of an angiogenic growth factor called vascular endothelial growth factor (VEGF) mRNA varied during the hair cycle. VEGF mRNA is strongly expressed in dermal papilla cells (DPC) in the anagen phase, but during the catagen and telogen phases. VEGF mRNA is less strongly expressed. This involvement of VEGF during the hair cycle allowed us to determine whether VEGF mRNA expression by DPC was regulated by minoxidil. In addition, the effect of minoxidil on VEGF protein synthesis in both cell extracts and DPC-conditioned medium, was investigated immunoenzymatically. Both VEGF mRNA and protein were significantly elevated in treated DPC compared with controls. DPC incubated with increasing minoxidil concentrations (0.2, 2, 6, 12 and 24 mumol/L) induced a dose-dependent expression of VEGF mRNA. Quantification of transcripts showed that DPC stimulated with 24 mumol/L minoxidil express six times more VEGF mRNA than controls. Similarly, VEGF protein production increases in cell extracts and conditioned media following minoxidil stimulation. These studies strongly support the likely involvement of minoxidil in the development of dermal papilla vascularization via a stimulation of VEGF expression, and support the hypothesis that minoxidil has a physiological role in maintaining a good vascularization of hair follicles in androgenetic alopecia.

 

[Rocky V]

i think 2.5mm is best. I'm started to see my hair get thicker.

 

[2young2retire]

with 2.5mm you touch the sculp lol. i dont believe more than 1.75 would benefit much more. 2mm should be the limit.

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[bushbush]

4) Violet Ray (VERY IMPORTANT for guys that have been bald for many years) Violet

There is evidence always behind everything I do (Both scientific evidence & convincible anecdotal evidence.)

What is the evidence in support of violet rays?

For me the studies backing up the Galea Theory & the overwhelming amount of anecdotal evidence out there that also supports it suits my belief system very well and this is why I follow my regimen.

Hair loss is not a religion. It will be solved by science, not belief.

 

[opti]

any1 knows if progesteron or propecia are non prescribtion in usa?Heard that u can buy finasterid at wal marts lol.

when i get my numb creme im going for a hard rolling session(also on face) and will let it heal for 2-3 weeks completely then going to start again every week

 

[Haircules]

We need proactive people on here that bring something to the thread.

@squegee:
You are right squeegee - from my point of view there are two possibilities to react on a new post with a question that has already been asked....
1. either say nothing, in order to keep this thread shorter.
2. or answer the question....
using swearwords every time (your posts have little stars "*" everywhere) and filling this thread even more, worsens this thread a lot! So either dont reply, or get "proactive" as you say and help... this is not your forum!!

@2young2retire
dude!! i saw your blood pictures - when will you stop, what is your goal, if there is any? I think you lost control... and also it is known that minoxidil loses its effectiveness after around two years... at this point we dont know if it will lose it too, when you use a derma roller.... and i am afraid that if minoxidil loses its effectiveness you might derma roll even more until you cause severe damages to your buddy.... so my advice for you - set a goal, and then stop derma rolling for half a year and see what happens so that you dont harm yourself....
thanks for your photo documenation!!

@casperz: great job through this forum, i enjoy your posts a lot.

 

[closetmetrosexual]

Hey BeliefISKEY, could you share where do you have that Violet ray from and how u use it? thx

I'd like to know this, too.

 

[Chromeo]

guys maybe after completing the study we start to loose hair again in X years where x is the amount of years we started balding since birth.

There is no "completing the study"...we're rolling for life, bro. :book:

 

[casperz]

The guys not getting regrowth also ties in with what me and squeege know to be true (they have follicles that need to be stimulated and awakened.) And all of these positive results stemmed from a LOOSE GALEA=>BETTER BLOOD FLOW & OXYGEN=>REGULATED DHT & ESTRADIOL LEVELS AROUND THE SCALP (GALEA AREA)(in male pattern baldness, estradiol levels are decreased because there is not enough oxygen for estradiol levels to flourish thus then DHT is overproduced and over accumulated ONLY IN THE GALEA AREA THOUGH) so DHT basically overpowers estradiol levels and that's possibly why most of us notice "thinner scalps" Estradiol is a very important factor in hair loss/growth.

There used to be a transgender woman on here and had great results, don't remember the screen name but she started out slick bald Norwood 5 or 6 and grew a respectable head of hair. I think there was some transplants in the front, but the mid scalp and vertex responded well to her hormone regime. So that gives credence to the fact that estradiol is involved since she would have been taking large doses of it. Of course she would also have very low T and thus little DHT. Estrodiol seems to be protective of hair follicles since menopausal women also start to lose hair with falling estrogen levels. I think everybody here would be able to eliminate or greatly reduce their baldness using estrogen but I doubt there would be many takers since you would also get a nice set of breasts, *** and legs and all the other attributes associated with high estrogen.

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Here's a link to the minoxidil absorption timeline; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2395092
If you've absorbed 50% in an hour and greater than 75% in 4hrs as the study shows, then yes you could probably shower at 2hrs without losing much, if any.

Here's another interesting study concerning application frequency and systemic absorption. I believe someone was asking about applying 3 times daily a while back?
"Subjects received 1 ml 3% minoxidil solution applied four, six, or eight times daily to the scalp or two, four, six, or eight times daily to the chest for 14 days. Serum and urine were collected and analyzed for minoxidil. No systemic minoxidil accumulation occurred from increasing application frequency to the scalp."
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2702797

Well that blows my theory of side effects right out of the water. I'm going back to 3x day and see if the side effects come back, maybe it takes ramping up to it. I sure seem to be sensitive to the dosage though.

 

[squeegee]

@squegee:
You are right squeegee - from my point of view there are two possibilities to react on a new post with a question that has already been asked....
1. either say nothing, in order to keep this thread shorter.
2. or answer the question....
using swearwords every time (your posts have little stars "*" everywhere) and filling this thread even more, worsens this thread a lot! So either dont reply, or get "proactive" as you say and help... this is not your forum!!

@2young2retire
dude!! i saw your blood pictures - when will you stop, what is your goal, if there is any? I think you lost control... and also it is known that minoxidil loses its effectiveness after around two years... at this point we dont know if it will lose it too, when you use a derma roller.... and i am afraid that if minoxidil loses its effectiveness you might derma roll even more until you cause severe damages to your buddy.... so my advice for you - set a goal, and then stop derma rolling for half a year and see what happens so that you dont harm yourself....
thanks for your photo documenation!!

@casperz: great job through this forum, i enjoy your posts a lot.

haircules.. Females lost more blood within a month than us rolling.. Get over it.. It is the added pressure to the roller that make him looks worst. Does 2young is having results? yes.. so stop your little complaints.. I will highly suggesting you to go change your tampon ASAP.

You 2 need a fighting card with GSP!. Going to be a fun night in Vegas! Danawhite1 , haircules.. Complete fighting night soon!!

[video=youtube;r_gH5_5Vfeg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_gH5_5Vfeg[/video]

 

[Morinohtar]

squeegee is our forum Cartman ehehehe "screw you guys im going home!!!" lol

 

[BeliefISKEY]

@Bush hey idiot... While you're here questioning us and waiting for "science" to put a brand on the techniques we're indulging in here on these forums YOU will keep loosing your hair. Many people, as well as myself, have potentally cured hair loss already... There is science and common sense backing up my theory & I'm not going to sit here and wait for mainstream science to create a product that can potentially mimicking what we do here and charge a fortune for it.... You are a close minded idiot. I went from NW1.5-2 to NW0-.5 how's your hair loss going attacking nothing but DHT (which will screw up your sex life by the way, lol.

There are many papers written on electrotherapy GO FIND THEM... They are out there. After all, are made up of energy, wouldn't you think stuff like that has some merit just by using your noggin?

 

[bushbush]

@Bush hey idiot... While you're here questioning us and waiting for "science" to put a brand on the techniques we're indulging in here on these forums YOU will keep loosing your hair. Many people, as well as myself, have potentally cured hair loss already... There is science and common sense backing up my theory & I'm not going to sit here and wait for mainstream science to create a product that can potentially mimicking what we do here and charge a fortune for it.... You are a close minded idiot. I went from NW1.5-2 to NW0-.5 how's your hair loss going attacking nothing but DHT (which will screw up your sex life by the way, lol.

There are many papers written on electrotherapy GO FIND THEM... They are out there. After all, are made up of energy, wouldn't you think stuff like that has some merit just by using your noggin?

Thank you for providing that highly convincing evidence.

 

[casperz]

The transgender user I was talking about was GeminiX

Amazing regrowth with some transplants.

 

[BeliefISKEY]

@Bush Modern day Science isn't the answer for everything.... Beliefs shape your whole life, this is why placebo grows hair & makes hair FALL. Many studies have shown how the power of belief grows hair... There was also a study that proved negative thoughts/beliefs (nocebo effect) induced hair FALL. Patients were given fake radiation and since the conventional wisdom tells us radiation=hair fall, that's what happened to some of those test subjects. You are a prehistoric minded individual that holds nothing but crappy Newtonian beliefs within his belief system that have already been disproved/enhanced time and time again. Please update your brain.

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@Squeege Interesting studies man... How bad do you think ones male pattern baldness situation woukd have to be in order for apoptosis to be induced?

 

[bushbush]

@Bush Modern day Science isn't the answer for everything.

Questions in the natural world that science can't currently answer --- it is working on, in a sound, reasoned, and hypothesis driven way. Do you honestly believe that you personally have a better system than the scientific method? An approach that has lead to all of the technological advances that we currently enjoy (including this very conversation).

The placebo effect is nothing special, it is a well explained and documented phenomenon.

You are a prehistoric minded individual that holds nothing but crappy Newtonian beliefs within his belief system that have already been disproved/enhanced time and time again.

There is some irony to this statement.

 

[BeliefISKEY]

LMAO welly documented? Nothing special about it? Why do we still take meds if placebo has been proven to cure most if not all illness already? You're a walking contradiction bro. I want to say so much but I'll just take 1 shot at this reply. How does consciousness work? Why and how do we experience consciousness? Explain. No theories, I want hard facts and evidence. Once you can answer that question (which you can't) THEN you can tell me how the placebo affect (Which is the MINDS ability to HEAL physical aliments & ETC. WITHOUT ANY "SCIENTIFICALLY PROVEN/APPROVED MEDICATION") works and how it isn't a "big deal" or anything "special" You can't tell me how a process of the MIND works when you don't know much about how we even experience consciousness lol..

Also, please explain to me why all of these scientifically proven/approved medications are the number one cause of human death? They go through countless studies until proven better than placebo and they still kill people even when taken as prescribed? Why hasn't science cured cancer yet? German New Medicine was before one of the doctors got jailed for I think "malpractice" and the guy had a 92% success rate in curing cancer. Wake up man... It's nearly 2014 already and you haven't gotten the memo already?

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@Bush I'm on an iPhone.... My computer is screwed up. I'm not going to hold your hand and provide you with studies. In order to beva "science head" you have to go and find/read new studies right? I'm telling you to go and keyword search wtf in talking about.... Or are you too stupid to do so? There are studies on everything I talk about as well as a whole bunch of anecdotal evidence. Whatever idiot that believes mainstream science is the answer for male pattern baldness or anything for that matter will die a very uncomfortable death lol. If mainstream scientists were so good & wanted to help us out so much why aren't there any mainstream cures for certain diseases out there? All there is, is maintanence so the Big pharma can profit. They wouldn't patent a natural substance even if it cured every disease because of the lack of profit they would receive from it... They admitted this already.

We're shifting to an era where we're about to release flying cars but still no mainstream cure for cancer even after what I said on my last post? I'm done with your simple minded ***. Back to the original topic.

 

[squeegee]

Casperz! I ****ing love your avatar! Common guys! get yours! it adds some personality to the forum!

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squeegee is our forum Cartman ehehehe "screw you guys im going home!!!" lol

hahahhhahahahaha! :salut:

[video=youtube;zyltK6pmJGg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyltK6pmJGg[/video]

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The transgender user I was talking about was GeminiX

Amazing regrowth with some transplants.

Casp..If I walk around in a dress at the shopping mall, is my estrogen level will rise?

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@Squeege Interesting studies man... How bad do you think ones male pattern baldness situation woukd have to be in order for apoptosis to be induced?

When you hair start thinning, then game over! This is why it is important for the new balders to jump on the problem ASAP just like cancer I guess!

 

[Jlyncher]

The transgender user I was talking about was GeminiX

Amazing regrowth with some transplants.

Gemini did have some good regrowth, and several $double digit transplants. Unlimited funds probably help, apparently she was Darren the Multimillionaire before becoming Danielle the Diva.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/a...-Darren-Hallett-sets-aside-120-000-woman.html