- Reaction score
- 44
Part I
So... I really don't want to be here but unfortunately it came to my attention that there was an extremely vitriolic thread about me posted here that posted disinformation, ad-hominem, and repeated slanderous and disgusting accusations about me which accuse me in engaging in criminal behaviour and was the subject of a defamation lawsuit I recently settled.
It's extremely upsetting to me of course that this lawsuit has come to the attention of so many people as accusations against me, as someone who teaches K-12 physical education to the student athlete population are not only fallacious but extremely embarrassing and a threat to my reputation and livelihood as anyone who googles my name can come across these kind of threads and being that the accusations touch on an emotionally charged issue may not take the time to evaluate it critically so at the very least I feel I should give my side of the story and address some of the more egregious allegations made against me in the thread titled Kevin Mann VS Encyclopedia Dramatica.
Before I talk about the individual comments made on that thread please understand that I am not permitted to speak regarding details of the settlement and the same thing goes for the opposing party as we both agreed but you'll notice that the defamatory page about me in question is no longer on Encyclopedia Dramatica so that should give you some idea of which party the settlement favoured.
I am not going to respond to every post as some of the things claimed about me here are true like that I had a hair transplant. I'm also not going to bother responding to the real stupid posts like I wear a wig because even though it is not true I don't give a sh*t if people are stupid enough to believe that. Also, to the few people who defended me here, thank you.
So let me go ahead and get this over with and address some of the claims made against me.
Rudolphus wrote-
"He's suing Encyclopedia Dramatica for a page they put on their website about him which said some not very nice things about him. On the page, they have pasted posts that Kevin Mann appears to have publicly made in the past (with his name and photo showing it is him), some of which were creepy and others racist, and one which was a sexually inappropriate comment about a child. I don't know if it could all have been fabricated though, because it would be possible for someone to use Photoshop to falsely make it look like Kevin made these posts when he actually didn't. Therefore, I reserve judgement."
Thank you for reserving judgement and while again I cannot reveal the details as it pertains to the settlement I will say that all of the comments written about me on that page were presented in false light. Keep in mind, ED is a satirical wiki that aims to be as offensive and politically incorrect as possible but the way those comments were presented in that thread were made as if I had said them in earnest. What I was saying there was absolutely in no way any different than what anyone else was writing, I just happened to get on someone's bad side hence why I had a sh*t article made about me. That doesn't mean I don't regret that sh*t but was I being serious? f*** no.
Catagen wrote-
"Its all real and he doesn't deny any of it."
Bullshit, if it were all real and I admitted it then I would have had no case, the judge would've thrown it out. By definition if something is real it cannot be considered defamation and I would have no case.
Rudolphos replied
"Is that known for sure though? Unless he's actually said in a video or a post he's made that he doesn't deny any of it, then I think we should give him the benefit of any doubt that there is."
No it isn't, I never admitted it in a video or anywhere else. If I did it would've been found and used against me by the defense.
Catagen wrote-
"Yeah as the guy said he posted a video about it. He says they make him look bad and take it out of context but the guy is very weird. He talks very fast and stumbles all the time and has questionable beliefs."
Why don't you put a video up of you speaking to the camera so we can all judge how you sound? Easy to talk sh*t about the way I sound on camera when you don't have any videos of yourself speaking. I speak quickly because my videos are very long and filled with detail. I don't speak super fast like that when I'm off camera, it is just a way for me to cover a lot of ground in a short period of time.
"In these 2 threads he reveals he doesn't use finasteride. And in the first he says it gave him ED. But on his channel he claims he never had any side effects even from dutasteride.
Also to this day he uses misc lingo in a non comedic setting, very weird."
That thread is 8-9 years old from what I remember. At the time I wasn't on finasteride because back then I really did buy into the fear mongering and I gave myself a nocebo effect. A lot of the things I thought finasteride was doing to me were just normal occurrences I took for granted before beginning treatment. I have never kept this a secret and I have discussed my struggles to overcome the fear of using finasteride many times on my channel. My own experiences on the matter are what inspired me to speak out on the subject in hopes on other people who are conflicted on the matter.
Also, as for the whole "misc lingo" thing, I just do that to add some levity to my videos as they can be pretty long and boring; It's just something to keep my viewer's attention.
"All of these threads are him. Also here is his old channel which he references in his wids with busomjack in the name(see link): [can't post link because I am a new user]
Which confirms the encyclopedia dramatica post on him."
The T-Nation threads were indeed written by me during a time when my views on finasteride and hair loss in general were not fully established. They are not reflective of my present day views so unless you're suggesting nobody has the right to ever change their opinion then that means everybody from the Propeciahelp forum is a fraud since they presumably at least at one point believed taking finasteride was a good idea.
That username from my old channel confirms nothing, it is an obscure reference to a character that appeared in the mailbag section from PC Accelerator Magazine which was a magazine I was a fan of in the 90s. The horrific posts on Ebaumsworld being attributed to me were the primary reason I filed the lawsuit to begin with. The username mentioned there is similar to the one I have used in the past but I have NEVER had an account on Ebaumsworld and I had never seen that thread until it was posted. What happened was the person who wrote the article doxxed me knowing the username from my old channel and he must've stumbled upon that foul thread and then just assumed I was the one who wrote it.
The thread looks like a joke thread where people were talking about their parents catching them masturbating but the article used those posts and claimed that it is proof I sexually abuse children and I raped an underage cousin (which I don't even have.)
Just think about it, if those claims were true do you think I would've filed a lawsuit? The defense could've pushed for discovery to confirm the claims which not only would've killed my defamation suit but also meant I could be facing criminal charges since what they accused me of was statutory rape and incest, both federal crimes.
Like I said before, one of the things I do to make money is I train the student-athlete population, mostly teenagers whose parents I am on good terms with. For a time when you googled my name that sh*t article would appear on the first page of google. That was completely unacceptable, I don't care if they bill themselves as a "satire website", that article was not presented as satire and I could not tolerate such horrific and unsubstantiated libel being written about me.
Pigeon Wrote-
"That's fcked up.
Isn't this the guy that says it's almost impossible to get side effects from fina? Meanwhile he had/has them himself.
Just checked his channel, jup like I thought another dangerous bro scientist. Loved how he cherry picked studies to dismiss PFS and ignored all other studies, lol.
It's also clear he's mentally unstable and narcissistic. Saddest part of all is young guys who get brainwashed by this hairloss "guru" and think it's completely safe taking 5AR inhibitors...."
Again...it was a nocebo effect. If I really got horrible sides from finasteride, why would I continue using it? I have a videos where I literally pop a quartered proscar on camera so don't accuse me of lying about it.
So, I'm a "dangerous bro-scientist." Why is that? Because I don't tell you what you want to hear. You didn't look at any of my videos because if I you really were convinced I was full of sh*t you would've responded to the specific points I made in them. I have seen your posts in other threads and I notice you have a habit of just dumping out whatever random scientific article you can possibly cite without any regards to the quality or methodology. The only litmus test is that the study confirms your biases and you post it without offering any editorial point of view as if it's just gospel that we must all accept. You'll notice in my videos I don't just back up my claims with science, I disseminate the scientific research and explain why or why not a certain study should be trusted. You on the other just flood the forums with whatever the Hell you can and hope that people will be so overwhelmed with the mountain of bullshit you throw at them that they won't bother responding.
Giegosiganoe wrote-
"Haven't seen those before. Pretty odd I'll admit. But I'd like to think he has changed. I have no reason to think he's like that anymore. Even if he had finasteride sides in the past, they were probably just in his head because he takes it now without problem."
Thank you for keeping an open mind. You are correct, I have changed my views since then on both lifestyle and finasteride. During that time in my life I had just gotten over a horrible breakup with a woman who I wanted to marry, at almost 40 years old that is the one and only time in my life I ever considered marriage and I had my heart torn to shreds. I coped with it through many means such as drug abuse as well as eventually engaging in sexually risky behaviour which made me feel good but caused other problems and seeking any scapegoat I could I blamed the finasteride for it. It wasn't until I cleaned up my act and discovered Dr. Trueb's research that I realized how all these problems were imaginary and were just things I took for granted (like occasionally not waking up with morning wood) or problems caused by my absolute sh*t lifestlye at the time that damage my body and mind.
Nothing in the world made me feel better than cleaning up and restarting finasteride in confidence knowing that all the problems I worried the drug was causing me were either imaginary or self-inflicted. I haven't stopped since and have been on the drug consistently for 8 years and my hair has only gotten better.
Derelict wrote-
"Most sensible people don't claim finasteride/duta is risk free. Like any drug it carries risk, what people have to decide is whether the benefits outweigh the risks like everything else in life."
Yup, and I have never once claimed that finasteride or dutasteride is risk free. Every drug carries risks, the only thing I have spoken about is the neurotic and rampant fear-mongering that floods the internet and may have very well scared many people who would've otherwise been good responders to finasteride from getting on treatment and losing hair. I felt it important that people who are considering treatment hear from the perspective of someone who has had a positive experience for a change. Ultimately, what they decide is up to them and their doctor but people who have had a positive experience from finasteride shouldn't be shamed out of sharing their experiences. That is all I am doing, you can think of me as a Yin to the PFS foundation's yang.
Pigeon wrote-
"Can one really trust such a guy? Considering his past he would have no problems lying about his sides to further his youtube career as a hairloss guru.
He also isn't honest and transparent in his videos that he experienced side effects from fina."
Again, I wasn't lying. You said you've "checked out my channel" but you didn't look very deep as I have spoken about my struggles with the nocebo effect in several of my videos and I have never denied that I was once anti-finasteride. What I do on youtube is not a "career", it's a hobby. I do it because I enjoy it, not because I need to. I would probably need 1 million subscribers to make it a viable career alternative to me. The fact that you just jump to this conclusion without doing the research necessary to confirm this proves you don't give a sh*t about the facts, only what supports your biases. If I am lacking honesty and transparency because I was once anti-finasteride then everybody from the propeciahelp forums is dishonest because they used to be pro finasteride at one point, at least enough to take it.
Pigeon wrote-
"Some get sides for years after quitting, enough members on this forum alone who can tell you about it.
He minimzes the risks of 5ar inhibtors, ignores and cherry picks studies, lies and has a very shady past. He's a dangerous wannabe hairloss guru painting a false picture.
Anyway this thread isn't about side effects so I'll leave it at that."
You have no basis to say that side effects of finasteride are mostly reported when people come off. Finasteride side effects while taking the drug do occur and I have never denied that despite your claims. However, reports of supposed side effects occurring after stopping the drug are untrustworthy because how do you exclude other factors for these symptoms, or nocebo effect, or psychological problems, depression from untreated hair loss, or any external factors that may be happening in people's lives? I dealt with PFS in a couple of my videos. I assume you've seen them since you claimed to check out my channel. Rather than just lazily posting a bibliography of research that supports your confirmation bias, why not respond to each specific point I made in the video? You won't be able to because you aren't capable of forming coherent arguments, you just cite other people's research and hope that will do the argument for you and don't make any attempts to explain why whatever outcome you're citing is based on south methodology.
No, you seem to think that just the existence of a study is evidence enough and in that regard you're the one cherry picking research since you're dismissive of all the research I have not just cited, but also broken down and explained to justify its citation in my videos; something you're not capable of because you don't give a sh*t about scientific research, you're just seeking a safe zone to cope with your decision to not use finasteride.
So again, don't waste my time with your sh*t bibliography, I explain the methodology and assess the quality of the outcomes in my study and if you want to argue with me then you need to be held to that same standard.
Continued in Part II...
So... I really don't want to be here but unfortunately it came to my attention that there was an extremely vitriolic thread about me posted here that posted disinformation, ad-hominem, and repeated slanderous and disgusting accusations about me which accuse me in engaging in criminal behaviour and was the subject of a defamation lawsuit I recently settled.
It's extremely upsetting to me of course that this lawsuit has come to the attention of so many people as accusations against me, as someone who teaches K-12 physical education to the student athlete population are not only fallacious but extremely embarrassing and a threat to my reputation and livelihood as anyone who googles my name can come across these kind of threads and being that the accusations touch on an emotionally charged issue may not take the time to evaluate it critically so at the very least I feel I should give my side of the story and address some of the more egregious allegations made against me in the thread titled Kevin Mann VS Encyclopedia Dramatica.
Before I talk about the individual comments made on that thread please understand that I am not permitted to speak regarding details of the settlement and the same thing goes for the opposing party as we both agreed but you'll notice that the defamatory page about me in question is no longer on Encyclopedia Dramatica so that should give you some idea of which party the settlement favoured.
I am not going to respond to every post as some of the things claimed about me here are true like that I had a hair transplant. I'm also not going to bother responding to the real stupid posts like I wear a wig because even though it is not true I don't give a sh*t if people are stupid enough to believe that. Also, to the few people who defended me here, thank you.
So let me go ahead and get this over with and address some of the claims made against me.
Rudolphus wrote-
"He's suing Encyclopedia Dramatica for a page they put on their website about him which said some not very nice things about him. On the page, they have pasted posts that Kevin Mann appears to have publicly made in the past (with his name and photo showing it is him), some of which were creepy and others racist, and one which was a sexually inappropriate comment about a child. I don't know if it could all have been fabricated though, because it would be possible for someone to use Photoshop to falsely make it look like Kevin made these posts when he actually didn't. Therefore, I reserve judgement."
Thank you for reserving judgement and while again I cannot reveal the details as it pertains to the settlement I will say that all of the comments written about me on that page were presented in false light. Keep in mind, ED is a satirical wiki that aims to be as offensive and politically incorrect as possible but the way those comments were presented in that thread were made as if I had said them in earnest. What I was saying there was absolutely in no way any different than what anyone else was writing, I just happened to get on someone's bad side hence why I had a sh*t article made about me. That doesn't mean I don't regret that sh*t but was I being serious? f*** no.
Catagen wrote-
"Its all real and he doesn't deny any of it."
Bullshit, if it were all real and I admitted it then I would have had no case, the judge would've thrown it out. By definition if something is real it cannot be considered defamation and I would have no case.
Rudolphos replied
"Is that known for sure though? Unless he's actually said in a video or a post he's made that he doesn't deny any of it, then I think we should give him the benefit of any doubt that there is."
No it isn't, I never admitted it in a video or anywhere else. If I did it would've been found and used against me by the defense.
Catagen wrote-
"Yeah as the guy said he posted a video about it. He says they make him look bad and take it out of context but the guy is very weird. He talks very fast and stumbles all the time and has questionable beliefs."
Why don't you put a video up of you speaking to the camera so we can all judge how you sound? Easy to talk sh*t about the way I sound on camera when you don't have any videos of yourself speaking. I speak quickly because my videos are very long and filled with detail. I don't speak super fast like that when I'm off camera, it is just a way for me to cover a lot of ground in a short period of time.
"In these 2 threads he reveals he doesn't use finasteride. And in the first he says it gave him ED. But on his channel he claims he never had any side effects even from dutasteride.
Also to this day he uses misc lingo in a non comedic setting, very weird."
That thread is 8-9 years old from what I remember. At the time I wasn't on finasteride because back then I really did buy into the fear mongering and I gave myself a nocebo effect. A lot of the things I thought finasteride was doing to me were just normal occurrences I took for granted before beginning treatment. I have never kept this a secret and I have discussed my struggles to overcome the fear of using finasteride many times on my channel. My own experiences on the matter are what inspired me to speak out on the subject in hopes on other people who are conflicted on the matter.
Also, as for the whole "misc lingo" thing, I just do that to add some levity to my videos as they can be pretty long and boring; It's just something to keep my viewer's attention.
"All of these threads are him. Also here is his old channel which he references in his wids with busomjack in the name(see link): [can't post link because I am a new user]
Which confirms the encyclopedia dramatica post on him."
The T-Nation threads were indeed written by me during a time when my views on finasteride and hair loss in general were not fully established. They are not reflective of my present day views so unless you're suggesting nobody has the right to ever change their opinion then that means everybody from the Propeciahelp forum is a fraud since they presumably at least at one point believed taking finasteride was a good idea.
That username from my old channel confirms nothing, it is an obscure reference to a character that appeared in the mailbag section from PC Accelerator Magazine which was a magazine I was a fan of in the 90s. The horrific posts on Ebaumsworld being attributed to me were the primary reason I filed the lawsuit to begin with. The username mentioned there is similar to the one I have used in the past but I have NEVER had an account on Ebaumsworld and I had never seen that thread until it was posted. What happened was the person who wrote the article doxxed me knowing the username from my old channel and he must've stumbled upon that foul thread and then just assumed I was the one who wrote it.
The thread looks like a joke thread where people were talking about their parents catching them masturbating but the article used those posts and claimed that it is proof I sexually abuse children and I raped an underage cousin (which I don't even have.)
Just think about it, if those claims were true do you think I would've filed a lawsuit? The defense could've pushed for discovery to confirm the claims which not only would've killed my defamation suit but also meant I could be facing criminal charges since what they accused me of was statutory rape and incest, both federal crimes.
Like I said before, one of the things I do to make money is I train the student-athlete population, mostly teenagers whose parents I am on good terms with. For a time when you googled my name that sh*t article would appear on the first page of google. That was completely unacceptable, I don't care if they bill themselves as a "satire website", that article was not presented as satire and I could not tolerate such horrific and unsubstantiated libel being written about me.
Pigeon Wrote-
"That's fcked up.
Isn't this the guy that says it's almost impossible to get side effects from fina? Meanwhile he had/has them himself.
Just checked his channel, jup like I thought another dangerous bro scientist. Loved how he cherry picked studies to dismiss PFS and ignored all other studies, lol.
It's also clear he's mentally unstable and narcissistic. Saddest part of all is young guys who get brainwashed by this hairloss "guru" and think it's completely safe taking 5AR inhibitors...."
Again...it was a nocebo effect. If I really got horrible sides from finasteride, why would I continue using it? I have a videos where I literally pop a quartered proscar on camera so don't accuse me of lying about it.
So, I'm a "dangerous bro-scientist." Why is that? Because I don't tell you what you want to hear. You didn't look at any of my videos because if I you really were convinced I was full of sh*t you would've responded to the specific points I made in them. I have seen your posts in other threads and I notice you have a habit of just dumping out whatever random scientific article you can possibly cite without any regards to the quality or methodology. The only litmus test is that the study confirms your biases and you post it without offering any editorial point of view as if it's just gospel that we must all accept. You'll notice in my videos I don't just back up my claims with science, I disseminate the scientific research and explain why or why not a certain study should be trusted. You on the other just flood the forums with whatever the Hell you can and hope that people will be so overwhelmed with the mountain of bullshit you throw at them that they won't bother responding.
Giegosiganoe wrote-
"Haven't seen those before. Pretty odd I'll admit. But I'd like to think he has changed. I have no reason to think he's like that anymore. Even if he had finasteride sides in the past, they were probably just in his head because he takes it now without problem."
Thank you for keeping an open mind. You are correct, I have changed my views since then on both lifestyle and finasteride. During that time in my life I had just gotten over a horrible breakup with a woman who I wanted to marry, at almost 40 years old that is the one and only time in my life I ever considered marriage and I had my heart torn to shreds. I coped with it through many means such as drug abuse as well as eventually engaging in sexually risky behaviour which made me feel good but caused other problems and seeking any scapegoat I could I blamed the finasteride for it. It wasn't until I cleaned up my act and discovered Dr. Trueb's research that I realized how all these problems were imaginary and were just things I took for granted (like occasionally not waking up with morning wood) or problems caused by my absolute sh*t lifestlye at the time that damage my body and mind.
Nothing in the world made me feel better than cleaning up and restarting finasteride in confidence knowing that all the problems I worried the drug was causing me were either imaginary or self-inflicted. I haven't stopped since and have been on the drug consistently for 8 years and my hair has only gotten better.
Derelict wrote-
"Most sensible people don't claim finasteride/duta is risk free. Like any drug it carries risk, what people have to decide is whether the benefits outweigh the risks like everything else in life."
Yup, and I have never once claimed that finasteride or dutasteride is risk free. Every drug carries risks, the only thing I have spoken about is the neurotic and rampant fear-mongering that floods the internet and may have very well scared many people who would've otherwise been good responders to finasteride from getting on treatment and losing hair. I felt it important that people who are considering treatment hear from the perspective of someone who has had a positive experience for a change. Ultimately, what they decide is up to them and their doctor but people who have had a positive experience from finasteride shouldn't be shamed out of sharing their experiences. That is all I am doing, you can think of me as a Yin to the PFS foundation's yang.
Pigeon wrote-
"Can one really trust such a guy? Considering his past he would have no problems lying about his sides to further his youtube career as a hairloss guru.
He also isn't honest and transparent in his videos that he experienced side effects from fina."
Again, I wasn't lying. You said you've "checked out my channel" but you didn't look very deep as I have spoken about my struggles with the nocebo effect in several of my videos and I have never denied that I was once anti-finasteride. What I do on youtube is not a "career", it's a hobby. I do it because I enjoy it, not because I need to. I would probably need 1 million subscribers to make it a viable career alternative to me. The fact that you just jump to this conclusion without doing the research necessary to confirm this proves you don't give a sh*t about the facts, only what supports your biases. If I am lacking honesty and transparency because I was once anti-finasteride then everybody from the propeciahelp forums is dishonest because they used to be pro finasteride at one point, at least enough to take it.
Pigeon wrote-
"Some get sides for years after quitting, enough members on this forum alone who can tell you about it.
He minimzes the risks of 5ar inhibtors, ignores and cherry picks studies, lies and has a very shady past. He's a dangerous wannabe hairloss guru painting a false picture.
Anyway this thread isn't about side effects so I'll leave it at that."
You have no basis to say that side effects of finasteride are mostly reported when people come off. Finasteride side effects while taking the drug do occur and I have never denied that despite your claims. However, reports of supposed side effects occurring after stopping the drug are untrustworthy because how do you exclude other factors for these symptoms, or nocebo effect, or psychological problems, depression from untreated hair loss, or any external factors that may be happening in people's lives? I dealt with PFS in a couple of my videos. I assume you've seen them since you claimed to check out my channel. Rather than just lazily posting a bibliography of research that supports your confirmation bias, why not respond to each specific point I made in the video? You won't be able to because you aren't capable of forming coherent arguments, you just cite other people's research and hope that will do the argument for you and don't make any attempts to explain why whatever outcome you're citing is based on south methodology.
No, you seem to think that just the existence of a study is evidence enough and in that regard you're the one cherry picking research since you're dismissive of all the research I have not just cited, but also broken down and explained to justify its citation in my videos; something you're not capable of because you don't give a sh*t about scientific research, you're just seeking a safe zone to cope with your decision to not use finasteride.
So again, don't waste my time with your sh*t bibliography, I explain the methodology and assess the quality of the outcomes in my study and if you want to argue with me then you need to be held to that same standard.
Continued in Part II...