Latest Patents From Dr. George Cotsarelis

[Noisette]

Noisette and all, the dermarolling with prp study (non minoxidil) doesn't break down the steps. Can anyone assist? For example, is the scalp dermarolled then injected with prp? Is the scalp injected with prp then dernarolled? Is the scalp simply dermarolled with prp (not injected)? Thanks all! I understand prp is used twice a month for 6 months (which a lot) but don't know the finer details.

Hi @tomJ
I Don't know for sure what is their protocol for the comparative study.

Maybe this link could be an answer ? We don't know exactly for the injection of PRP, if it was made before or after the microneedling...

It's an another study (2017) PRP + microneedling

source: http://download.xuebalib.com/xuebalib.com.34949.pdf

"Procedure: area of the scalp was cleansed with spirit and povidone-iodine. Supratrochlear and supraorbital nerve block were given with lignocaine using an insulin syringe along with field block. With the help of insulin BD syringe, PRP was injected over affected area (multiple small injections few mm apart) under proper aseptic precaution in the minor operation theater. Microneedling (1.5 mm) was performed till pinpoint bleeding occured. "

Before and After (9 months)

 

[Dantes90]

Damn I would not mind getting those kind of results at all haha.

 

[H]

Hi @tomJ
I Don't know for sure what is their protocol for the comparative study.

Maybe this link could be an answer ? We don't know exactly for the injection of PRP, if it was made before or after the microneedling...

It's an another study (2017) PRP + microneedling

source: http://download.xuebalib.com/xuebalib.com.34949.pdf

"Procedure: area of the scalp was cleansed with spirit and povidone-iodine. Supratrochlear and supraorbital nerve block were given with lignocaine using an insulin syringe along with field block. With the help of insulin BD syringe, PRP was injected over affected area (multiple small injections few mm apart) under proper aseptic precaution in the minor operation theater. Microneedling (1.5 mm) was performed till pinpoint bleeding occured. "

Before and After (9 months)
View attachment 64390
View attachment 64391
View attachment 64387 View attachment 64388 View attachment 64389

Id love to play 20 questions with these researchers. It's strange why the receding hairline still? Does this actually create new follicles for sure or provide holes for the existing hair follicles under a layer of skin to sprout again? Can I use this anywhere on the body and it will always produce scalp hair? What about beard hair why does that not form instead of scalp hair? Does the skin know to differentiate? How come every single wound I make doesn't become a hair follicle? (That would be a cure although maybe that could be dangerous?...) Why of all things does min actually help with this? Could it just be helping out already existing follicles but dermarolling makes them easier to reach? So many questions.

 

[Noisette]

Id love to play 20 questions with these researchers. It's strange why the receding hairline still? Does this actually create new follicles for sure or provide holes for the existing hair follicles under a layer of skin to sprout again? Can I use this anywhere on the body and it will always produce scalp hair? What about beard hair why does that not form instead of scalp hair? Does the skin know to differentiate? How come every single wound I make doesn't become a hair follicle? (That would be a cure although maybe that could be dangerous?...) Why of all things does min actually help with this? Could it just be helping out already existing follicles but dermarolling makes them easier to reach? So many questions.

For the last one study you can contact the researcher at this following email:
Email: drabhijeetjha@gmail.com

 

[Dolph]

FGF-9 needs to be stored at very cold temperatures. I think there will be a stability issue. Maybe you can keep it in a freezer.

 

[d3nt3dsh0v3l]

FGF-9 needs to be stored at very cold temperatures. I think there will be a stability issue. Maybe you can keep it in a freezer.

Naw man they fixed this problem in 2016. All you have to do is get the precursor to FGF-9, package it in liposomes with some L-propionylcarnitine, and maybe some equol.

 

[Trichosan]

when using fgf9 they say it is important to have this skin regeneration from wounding. There is no way we have this efficiency with our dermarollers. Any wounding device on sale? : D

I would avoid the roller-like devices they have the potential to make micro tears in the skin and create a much larger diameter hole thus more bleeding. Dermapen is best but $3,000 USD. I'm still thinking about it though.

You could also go to a clinic that has one and have them micro your scalp, then go home and apply the Minoxidil. Cost on that is about $275-345.

Or, we just wait for Follica.

 

[Armando Jose]

FIG. 4. Topical Aza-dC treatment enhanced hair follicle regeneration in healed wounds. (A) 10 μL of Aza-dC (dissolved in DMSO) was applied topically to the wound site, once a day, for 2 consecutive days at the time of scab detachment (SD0 & SD1). Aza-dC treatment at all doses tested greatly enhanced hair follicle (HF) neogenesis compared to the vehicle control, with the strongest enhancement seen with the highest tested dose (10 μg). (A) 10 μL of Aza-dC (dissolved in DMSO) was applied topically to the wound site, once a day, for 5 consecutive days at the time of scab detachment (SD0 to SD1). While the two lower doses (1 & 5 μg) showed little effect on the regeneration, the highest dose (10 μg) still enhanced hair follicle regeneration.

What I have always liked about Cotsarelis is that he thinks about the timing of the drugs, he does not like the long treatments. is logical because they are substances that move the rapid growth of cells.

To further reduce the toxicity of Aza-dC treatment, the inhibitor was applied locally to the wound sites. Unlike systemic treatment, topical application of Aza-dC exhibited little inhibitory effect on wound-induced hair follicle regeneration. When applied to the wound site immediately following scab detachment for 2 days only, Aza-dC greatly enhanced hair follicle regeneration in healed wounds (from 3 to 8 fold) in a dose-dependent manner. (FIG. 4). Therefore, up-regulation of certain genes, via inhibition of DNA methylation, at the times when hair follicles begin to form plays a critical role in the hair follicle regeneration

+1

the thing is, cotsarelis stated already years ago that fgf9 is crucial for the hair forming process after wounding, but he also always made it sound that integrating fgf9 would require intensive studies

it is a natural process ....

 

[InBeforeTheCure]

Watch it with the fgf9 dosage guys. It activates shh so if you're gonna try it at least keep it in check.

The lowest dose actually gives the highest expression of Shh, while the highest dose decreases it.

FIG. 14. Effect of 24 h treatment using rhFGF9 (10, 20, 40 ng/ml) on markers of embryonic hair follicle development sonic hedgehog (Shh), Ptch1, and Ptch2 by qPCR.

In any case, hedgehog signaling is a normal and critical step in making the hair follicle, so any treatment that forms new hair follicles increases Shh expression somewhere down the line. FGF9 works by activating Wnt signaling in the dermis (Gay et al.) - the first step in hair follicle formation (Sennett & Rendl).

In the next step, the dermis signals to the epidermis (this step, called the "first dermal signal", is not well understood) to initiate development of a placode, a thickening of epidermal cells overlying the region of high dermal Wnt signaling. This first dermal signal initiates a positive feedback loop between Wnt signaling and EDA (ectodysplasin A) signaling in the placode. EDA signals through the transcription factor NF-kB, which activates expression of Wnt10b and Wnt10a. These Wnt ligands activate Wnt signaling to stabilize beta-catenin in the placode, and beta-catenin activates expression of EDA and/or its receptor EDAR, and on it goes. One NF-kB target gene is Shh, required for proper hair follicle development past this point. (Zhang et al.)

An illustration up to the point of Shh expression:

So the upregulation of Shh is an expected downstream consequence of FGF9's known function of dermal Wnt activation and probably nothing to worry about.

 

[dermrafok]

For the last one study you can contact the researcher at this following email:
Email: drabhijeetjha@gmail.com

Thanks Noisette!

 

[kiwipilu]

I would avoid the roller-like devices they have the potential to make micro tears in the skin and create a much larger diameter hole thus more bleeding. Dermapen is best but $3,000 USD. I'm still thinking about it though.

you could read my post about dermarollers #39 .. : ) you rarely bleed with the dermaroller I talk about even with 1.5. Actually it has same needles as the dermapen.

 

[newplayer]

Where can one get prp?

thanks!

 

[Trichosan]

you could read my post about dermarollers #39 .. : ) you rarely bleed with the dermaroller I talk about even with 1.5. Actually it has same needles as the dermapen.

I did read that. No dermaroller has the same needle as the Dermapen, they are manufactured by and assembled only for Dermapen. The original Dermaroller from Dermaroller.de is a different quality instrument than the $18-50 ones on Amazon and Ebay, but even so, I personally like the idea of a straight vertical puncture. Because rollers will have a horizontal translation that tip of the roller will exit slightly beyond the diameter of the entry point. So you will get a V shape hole instead of a cylindrical hole. I have three rollers from different companies and as I delved more into details of microneedling, I read concerns about the uniformity of the needles. So I measured them and in everyone the length of the needle varied slightly on each drum. Bottom line is you get what you pay for, but if it works for you, go for it. Also, if you could measure the diameter of the needle on your roller I will get the same info on the Dermapen for comparison. Thanks.

 

[Tano1]

Wait I found some dermapens for under $300 so which ones are you guys talking about. Why don't we just try one of those dermapens?? I think they had adjustable needle depths too.

 

[westonci]

1. I understand that Follica does not use antiandrogens.? it turns out that the new hair created by Follica is not susceptible to DHT?
2. In previous patents it was written that in their device you can use the funds of other companies (SM04554, KYTH105 (setipiprant), etc.) for the growth of new hair.
They promise 25 terminal hair. 25 hair only by damage or together with the use of other means?

Seti takes care of DHT via PGD2

 

[rupture]

Maybe I missed it but how many times in that nine weeks are they applying prp ? Is it once a week , that could get very expensive

 

[lemoncloak]

Absolutely no way will wet to dry hair make that big a difference. You can argue that with other patients wet/dry, angle, and lighting can be responsible for the results. But patient 3 looks like he had some proper solid results.

Maybe, but how hard is it to dry his hair with a towel?

The lowest dose actually gives the highest expression of Shh, while the highest dose decreases it.

View attachment 64401
FIG. 14. Effect of 24 h treatment using rhFGF9 (10, 20, 40 ng/ml) on markers of embryonic hair follicle development sonic hedgehog (Shh), Ptch1, and Ptch2 by qPCR.

In any case, hedgehog signaling is a normal and critical step in making the hair follicle, so any treatment that forms new hair follicles increases Shh expression somewhere down the line. FGF9 works by activating Wnt signaling in the dermis (Gay et al.) - the first step in hair follicle formation (Sennett & Rendl).

In the next step, the dermis signals to the epidermis (this step, called the "first dermal signal", is not well understood) to initiate development of a placode, a thickening of epidermal cells overlying the region of high dermal Wnt signaling. This first dermal signal initiates a positive feedback loop between Wnt signaling and EDA (ectodysplasin A) signaling in the placode. EDA signals through the transcription factor NF-kB, which activates expression of Wnt10b and Wnt10a. These Wnt ligands activate Wnt signaling to stabilize beta-catenin in the placode, and beta-catenin activates expression of EDA and/or its receptor EDAR, and on it goes. One NF-kB target gene is Shh, required for proper hair follicle development past this point. (Zhang et al.)

An illustration up to the point of Shh expression:

View attachment 64402

So the upregulation of Shh is an expected downstream consequence of FGF9's known function of dermal Wnt activation and probably nothing to worry about.

Even better then! Great post as usual, do you keep an organised selection of pics/articles for this stuff or is it just experience and Google fu? I've tried delving into the molecular aspect of hair loss in the past but it seemed like a huge mess

 

[rupture]

Seti takes care of DHT via PGD2

View attachment 64420

I think seti would stop the cascading effect of DHT not directly block it

 

[westonci]

I think seti would stop the cascading effect of DHT not directly block it

Sorry I worded it bad, thats what i meant.

 

[InBeforeTheCure]

Even better then! Great post as usual, do you keep an organised selection of pics/articles for this stuff or is it just experience and Google fu? I've tried delving into the molecular aspect of hair loss in the past but it seemed like a huge mess

Nah, I don't have anything organized. I've just read those studies before and got back to them with a Google search. Lately I've been mapping out relations between genes associated with A.G.A., and the pathway diagram I posted was adapted from that - genetics implicates the same system in A.G.A.

And yes, it is a huge mess.