Insulin resistance, PCOS, and male pattern baldness

[squeegee]

I had a look at the link you provided, and i think it is worth carefull consideration. I will post about it later if i can.

Very interested in your thoughts on the subject!



Idontwanttobebalding

This is a phenomenally interesting and usefull thread.

Signatures aside :whistle:

I know! :beer: int:

 

[Bryan]

The question i ask is how could androgens be "directly" involved at such an early stage, when it is only DP cells that have androgen receptors?

Give me a reference or citation in support of that claim.

 

[S Foote.]

You are on the record in this thread as supporting the idea that male pattern baldness evolved in humans as a brain cooling aid. How can you support something you dont understand Bryan? How do you think male pattern baldness would help cool the brain, if not by the radiator principle? Please tell us how this idea you support would work by any other heat disapation method? Be carefull because you are begining to make a fool of yourself now :woot:

What do you mean, I "don't understand it"?? Obviously it _does_ work by a kind of "radiator principle". Cabanac et al proved in their own experiments that it helps with cooling, although possibly for more than just one reason.

What other reason, what other cooling mechanism? Wild guesses now Bryan. And what does it help to cool? scalp tissue yes, but certainly not the brain as explained in the Falk critique.

Why cant you understand the point here Bryan? You support the male pattern baldness brain cooling idea, and the Falk link clearly shows that brain cooling happens despite male pattern baldness! Thats probably why male pattern baldness is not mentioned :whistle:

Sweet Mother of Mercy! You FINALLY answered my question, after only about half a dozen requests from me!! Will wonders never cease??

Yes, from what I can tell, Falk apparently suggests that a number of evolved mechanisms help cool the brain. That certainly doesn't disprove the theory that balding is yet another evolutionary change to provide even MORE cooling.

Rubbish, what other methods of brain cooling has Falk proposed? be specific. The bald scalp does not provide any "extra" brain cooling, read the link i provided to the Falk critique! This idea does not hold up, cant you read!

That's where you tear your pants: suggesting your own eccentric theory for a supposed mechanism behind the miniaturiaztion of hair follicles. That was shot-down in flames years ago, but you just can't admit it.

Shot down by who and with what scientific evidence? I have already refered to Sawayas comment that other scientists are thinking along the same lines, so go tell them you know better :whistle:

LOL!! Shot down by me, and others over the years. More than one poster here (they will remain nameless) has Private Messaged me with support over the years, in my efforts to respond to you and make you see the light. One of them even told me a long time ago that my citation of Sawaya's own evidence in favor of the Standard Theory was a "slam dunk" in my favor (I'm not joking about this).

Oh i see. Private messages between self elected internet science experts, who will remain nameless because they are afraid to put their names to their "expert" opinions. And one of these nameless "experts" said you had a "slam dunk" citation in your favour! And your so excited about this, you say your not joking! Wow i am really impressed, and am am sure everyone else here is also. :woot:

That has to be the most telling response about your personal delusions i have had from you Bryan :bravo:

I bet everyone here is just dying to know what this "slam dunk" of yours is? I know i am? Or is this just going to remain among your private messaging fan club :whistle:

 

[S Foote.]

The question i ask is how could androgens be "directly" involved at such an early stage, when it is only DP cells that have androgen receptors?

Give me a reference or citation in support of that claim.

Are you saying that other follicle cells have androgen receptors? If so please clarify.


I'am done for today

 

[abcdefg]

Its funny how crazy some theories of male pattern baldness get when we know in one part of the process at least that androgen are the definitive factor. From a common sense everyday observational point of view men go bald and women generally do not. Hormones are the main difference between men and women so it fits that is the reason for hair loss. Also I notice asians and men that are older like 30+ with no hair loss and teenage hair lines generally have no facial hair at all like I did when I was 19 and had no hair loss at all. It all has to be more then a coincidence combined with the fact we know androgens are the culprit our current treatments just frankly suck. I want to see a 100 percent perfect androgen inhibitor and see the results of how that works.
Really sweat glands and fluid pressure? Why do women not have scalp tension like that and I know fat girls that are diabetic and eat garbage all day but never lose any hair how does that happen if diet is so important?

 

[Bryan]

What do you mean, I "don't understand it"?? Obviously it _does_ work by a kind of "radiator principle". Cabanac et al proved in their own experiments that it helps with cooling, although possibly for more than just one reason.

What other reason, what other cooling mechanism? Wild guesses now Bryan. And what does it help to cool? scalp tissue yes, but certainly not the brain as explained in the Falk critique.

Oh for the love of God...are you going BACKWARDS again to claiming that anything at all was said about male pattern baldness in that critique of Falk?! Will you please pick a story and STICK TO IT??? You just admitted a little while ago that Falk had nothing to say about male pattern baldness, and I complimented you on finally admitting that; now you're going back the OTHER way again. Jesus Christ...

Sweet Mother of Mercy! You FINALLY answered my question, after only about half a dozen requests from me!! Will wonders never cease??

Yes, from what I can tell, Falk apparently suggests that a number of evolved mechanisms help cool the brain. That certainly doesn't disprove the theory that balding is yet another evolutionary change to provide even MORE cooling.

Rubbish, what other methods of brain cooling has Falk proposed? be specific. The bald scalp does not provide any "extra" brain cooling, read the link i provided to the Falk critique! This idea does not hold up, cant you read!

Go back and read that Falk link again. Trying to explain to you all the various details of cooling they talked about in that discussion would be an incredible exercise in futility, especially when I was struggling ALL DAMN DAY just to get you to answer ONE single question!! uke:

Oh i see. Private messages between self elected internet science experts, who will remain nameless because they are afraid to put their names to their "expert" opinions. And one of these nameless "experts" said you had a "slam dunk" citation in your favour! And your so excited about this, you say your not joking! Wow i am really impressed, and am am sure everyone else here is also. :woot:

That has to be the most telling response about your personal delusions i have had from you Bryan :bravo:

I bet everyone here is just dying to know what this "slam dunk" of yours is? I know i am? Or is this just going to remain among your private messaging fan club :whistle:

The point is that people have laughed at YOU for not being able to resist the effort to trumpet to everybody that Sawaya was actually nice to you briefly, and gave you what appeared to be a few kind words of encouragement. But not by any stretch of the imagination are Sawaya and other researchers now thinking along the same lines as YOU are, as you so hilariously said in an earlier post. In fact, Sawaya's own study in support of the Standard Theory was a "slam dunk", as another poster said.

 

[Bryan]

[quote="S Foote.":2l4td3pi]The question i ask is how could androgens be "directly" involved at such an early stage, when it is only DP cells that have androgen receptors?

Give me a reference or citation in support of that claim.

Are you saying that other follicle cells have androgen receptors? If so please clarify.[/quote:2l4td3pi]

No. I've never heard that only DP cells have androgen receptors. I'm asking you for a reference or citation to support that claim.

 

[armandein]

From a common sense everyday observational point of view men go bald and women generally do not. Hormones are the main difference between men and women so it fits that is the reason for hair loss.

Differences with hormones in blood flow or in scalp hairs?
You must to know that the real important androgens metabolism in hair is produced in the proximity of pilosebaceous unit. It can make androgens starting from cholesterol.
Do you know studies regarding androgens differences between scalp hairs from women and men?

 

[S Foote.]

Its funny how crazy some theories of male pattern baldness get when we know in one part of the process at least that androgen are the definitive factor. From a common sense everyday observational point of view men go bald and women generally do not. Hormones are the main difference between men and women so it fits that is the reason for hair loss. Also I notice asians and men that are older like 30+ with no hair loss and teenage hair lines generally have no facial hair at all like I did when I was 19 and had no hair loss at all. It all has to be more then a coincidence combined with the fact we know androgens are the culprit our current treatments just frankly suck. I want to see a 100 percent perfect androgen inhibitor and see the results of how that works.
Really sweat glands and fluid pressure? Why do women not have scalp tension like that and I know fat girls that are diabetic and eat garbage all day but never lose any hair how does that happen if diet is so important?

Just to clarify, my theory fully accepts that androgens are the primary cause of male pattern baldness, it argues however that this is an indirect effect, and not a direct effect.

In regard to women in Cabanacs sweating study, he used women and un bearded younger males as controls. This was a very well done comprehensive study.

My point being that it was proven that in the male male pattern baldness scalp, androgens were causing a major increase in sweat secretion. I dont go along with any diet theory of male pattern baldness either, for reasons including some you point out.

 

[squeegee]

DHT affect male pattern baldness indirectly ! this is it!!.. this study shows that DHT is just being proactive! ..... People claiming that hair becomes suddently sensitive to androgen are so funny!

Endocrinology. 2010 Jul;151(7):3307-16. Epub 2010 Apr 28.
Dihydrotestosterone suppresses foam cell formation and attenuates atherosclerosis development.
Qiu Y, Yanase T, Hu H, Tanaka T, Nishi Y, Liu M, Sueishi K, Sawamura T, Nawata H.
Source

Department of Medicine and Bioregulatory Science, Kyushu University, Higashi-ku, Fukuoka 812-8582, Japan.
Abstract

The role of testosterone in atherosclerosis remains unclear because it is aromatized to estrogen. We investigated the effect of the nonaromatized natural androgen 5alpha-dihydrotestosterone (DHT) on the rabbit atherogenesis in relation to the proatherogenic molecule lectin-like oxidized-low-density lipoprotein receptor-1 (LOX-1) and its downstream molecules. Thirty-nine male New Zealand white rabbits were divided into four groups: 1) noncastrated group with normal chow diet (n = 6); 2) noncastrated group with high-cholesterol diet (HCD) (n = 10); 3) castrated group with HCD plus sc placebo pellet (n = 11); and 4) castrated group with HCD plus sc 150 mg DHT pellet (n = 12). Implantation of sc DHT or placebo pellet was performed at the time of castration. After castration or sham operation, the rabbits were fed the HCD for 8 wk, and plaque areas were assessed in the entire aorta. The HCD-induced increase in plaque area, which was most aggravated in the castration plus placebo group, was attenuated in the castration plus DHT group. Microscopic examination of the proximal descending aorta revealed that DHT significantly reduced HCD-induced foam cell formation, which was mostly composed of macrophages in the intima layer, compared with the placebo group. The decreased accumulation of foam cells with DHT treatment was accompanied by a marked reduction in the expression of LOX-1 mRNA in these cells. In cultured macrophages prepared from male wild-type mice that express the androgen receptor (AR), 1 x 10(-8) m and 1 x 10(-9) m DHT inhibited the formation of foam cells induced by oxidized low-density lipoprotein. Moreover, the expression of LOX-1 and inflammatory cytokines in the cultured macrophages was significantly suppressed by DHT. Such suppressive effects of DHT on foam cell formation and cytokine expression were not observed in cultured macrophages prepared from male AR-null mice, suggesting an involvement of AR in the mechanism. In conclusion, physiological levels of DHT attenuated the development of atherosclerosis in rabbits through the suppression of intimal foam cell formation of macrophage partly via the suppression of LOX-1 expression.

PMID:
20427482
[PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Free full text
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[S Foote.]

No. I've never heard that only DP cells have androgen receptors. I'm asking you for a reference or citation to support that claim.

Choose any in-vitro follicle cell study you like Bryan. If other follicle cells apart from DP cells have androgen receptors, they would have been refered to in these studies surely?

If you can show that other follicle cells have androgen receptors, dont be shy.

 

[squeegee]

I think that male pattern baldness is just side effects from an endothelial dysfunction being in androgen environment. :whistle:

 

[Jacob]

I think that male pattern baldness is just side effects from an endothelial dysfunction being in androgen environment. :whistle:

I like that. I guess we all have EDAE

 

[squeegee]

I think that male pattern baldness is just side effects from an endothelial dysfunction being in androgen environment. :whistle:

I like that. I guess we all have EDAE

LOL! unk:

 

[squeegee]

posted here for a new member elequent..

Endocrinology. 2003 Dec 18

Dihydrotestosterone Promotes VCAM-1 Expression in Male Human Endothelial
Cells via a NF-{kappa}B Dependent Pathway.

Death AK, McGrath KC, Sader MA, Nakhla S, Jessup W, Handelsman DJ,
Celermajer DS.

There exists a striking gender difference in atherosclerotic vascular
disease. For decades, estrogen was considered atheroprotective, however
an alternative is that androgen exposure in early life may predispose
men to earlier atherosclerosis. We recently demonstrated that the potent
androgen, dihydrotestosterone (DHT), enhanced the binding of monocytes
to the endothelium, a key early event in atherosclerosis, via increased
expression of vascular cell adhesion molecule-1 (VCAM-1). We now show
that DHT mediates its effects on VCAM-1 expression at the promoter
level, through a novel androgen receptor (AR)/nuclear factor-kappaB
(NF-kappaB) mechanism. Human umbilical vein endothelial cells (HUVECs)
were exposed to 4-400 nM DHT. DHT increased VCAM-1 mRNA in a dose- and
time-dependent manner. The DHT effect could be blocked by the androgen
receptor (AR) antagonist, hydroxyflutamide. DHT increased VCAM-1
promoter activity via NF-kappaB activation without affecting VCAM-1 mRNA
stability. Using 5' deletion analysis, it was determined that the
NF-kappaB sites within the VCAM-1 promoter region were responsible for
the DHT-mediated increase in VCAM-1 expression, however
coimmunoprecipitation studies suggested there is no direct interaction
between AR and NF-kappaB. Instead, DHT treatment decreased the level of
the NF-kappaB inhibitory protein, IkappaB. DHT did not affect VCAM-1
protein expression and monocyte adhesion when female endothelial cells
were tested. AR expression was higher in male- relative to female-
endothelial cells, associated with increased VCAM-1 levels. These
findings highlight a novel AR/NF-kappaB mediated mechanism for VCAM-1
expression and monocyte adhesion operating in male endothelial cells
that may represent an important unrecognized mechanism for the male
predisposition to atherosclerosis.

Is it why people claim to regrow all their hair with high-dose of sulfasalazine? This is getting damn interesting!!!!

 

[S Foote.]

What do you mean, I "don't understand it"?? Obviously it _does_ work by a kind of "radiator principle". Cabanac et al proved in their own experiments that it helps with cooling, although possibly for more than just one reason.

What other reason, what other cooling mechanism? Wild guesses now Bryan. And what does it help to cool? scalp tissue yes, but certainly not the brain as explained in the Falk critique.

Oh for the love of God...are you going BACKWARDS again to claiming that anything at all was said about male pattern baldness in that critique of Falk?! Will you please pick a story and STICK TO IT??? You just admitted a little while ago that Falk had nothing to say about male pattern baldness, and I complimented you on finally admitting that; now you're going back the OTHER way again. Jesus Christ...

I must admit i have encouraged you here by brieifly going along with you that male pattern baldness was not mentioned in that Falk critique. Sly i know, but i just wanted to demonstrate to people here what a sham you really are Bryan

male pattern baldness in respect of Falks theory WAS CLEARLY refered to in that critique!! Now it is clear to people that you have been diliberately trying to mislead them :thumbdown2:

Its on the very first page introducing Falks theory, i have put the exact reference to male pattern baldness in capitals, so you dont "miss" it again :whistle:


"In modern humans under conditions of heat stress, the flow of conditions of heat stress, the flow of relatively cool venous blood through the two emissary veins charted by Falk in fossil crania actually reverses direction, going back into the brain, according to several recent studies directed by physiologists Michel Cabanac of Laval (Quebec) University and Heiner Brinnel of Hopital-Maternite in L'Arbresle, France.

Cabanac and Brinnel placed the tips of ultrasonic probes on the heads of BALD MALE VOLUNTEERS at sites where emissary veins poke thorugh their tiny cranial conduits. The probes recorded the direction of blood flow.



Falk also contends that the evaporation of sweat from the scalp, a little of which enters the braincase, helps cool emissary blood as it returns to the brain."

Your busted Bryan

Oh i see. Private messages between self elected internet science experts, who will remain nameless because they are afraid to put their names to their "expert" opinions. And one of these nameless "experts" said you had a "slam dunk" citation in your favour! And your so excited about this, you say your not joking! Wow i am really impressed, and am am sure everyone else here is also. :woot:

That has to be the most telling response about your personal delusions i have had from you Bryan :bravo:

I bet everyone here is just dying to know what this "slam dunk" of yours is? I know i am? Or is this just going to remain among your private messaging fan club :whistle:

The point is that people have laughed at YOU for not being able to resist the effort to trumpet to everybody that Sawaya was actually nice to you briefly, and gave you what appeared to be a few kind words of encouragement. But not by any stretch of the imagination are Sawaya and other researchers now thinking along the same lines as YOU are, as you so hilariously said in an earlier post. In fact, Sawaya's own study in support of the Standard Theory was a "slam dunk", as another poster said.

Point one, professional scientists have to be honest in their comments in the public arena, otherwise they lose all professional credibility. Apart from Dr Sawaya there have been other professional hair scientists that have commented on my theory including Dr Bazan and Dr Yechiel Phd the president of Elsom research, who posted about my theory on HairLossTalk.com.

These professional comments about my theory are on the record, and If i really wanted to i could post what Dr Yechiel had to say about your rantings on hairloss forums Bryan! :thumbdown2: Then your comments above about scientists not saying what they really think would totaly be blown out!

Point two, if you are so confident about this "slam dunk" Sawaya study, why wont you post this? Talk is cheap :whistle:

 

[hairhoper]

Bryan and S Foote should start a sitcom.

 

[Bryan]

No. I've never heard that only DP cells have androgen receptors. I'm asking you for a reference or citation to support that claim.

Choose any in-vitro follicle cell study you like Bryan. If other follicle cells apart from DP cells have androgen receptors, they would have been refered to in these studies surely?

If you can show that other follicle cells have androgen receptors, dont be shy.

As I've already said, I don't recall any studies that had any such a finding, one way or the other. One rather authoritative source which I've quoted over the years (David Whiting's "Male Pattern Hair Loss: Current Understanding") made no mention of such a claim. So once again, I'm asking YOU to tell ME where you heard that claim. Don't be shy.

 

[Bryan]

I must admit i have encouraged you here by brieifly going along with you that male pattern baldness was not mentioned in that Falk critique. Sly i know, but i just wanted to demonstrate to people here what a sham you really are Bryan

male pattern baldness in respect of Falks theory WAS CLEARLY refered to in that critique!! Now it is clear to people that you have been diliberately trying to mislead them :thumbdown2:

Its on the very first page introducing Falks theory, i have put the exact reference to male pattern baldness in capitals, so you dont "miss" it again :whistle:

"In modern humans under conditions of heat stress, the flow of conditions of heat stress, the flow of relatively cool venous blood through the two emissary veins charted by Falk in fossil crania actually reverses direction, going back into the brain, according to several recent studies directed by physiologists Michel Cabanac of Laval (Quebec) University and Heiner Brinnel of Hopital-Maternite in L'Arbresle, France.

Cabanac and Brinnel placed the tips of ultrasonic probes on the heads of BALD MALE VOLUNTEERS at sites where emissary veins poke thorugh their tiny cranial conduits. The probes recorded the direction of blood flow.

Falk also contends that the evaporation of sweat from the scalp, a little of which enters the braincase, helps cool emissary blood as it returns to the brain."

Your busted Bryan

ROTFLMAO!! Yes, without going to the trouble of reading that whole link again, I now vaguely recall the author (not necessarily even Dr. Falk) mentioning that work by Cabanac and Brinnel done on the subjects with male pattern baldness.

Goodness gracious, is THAT your huge moment of triumph, merely pointing out that I hadn't remembered a particular passage from a 3- or 4-page discussion by several scientists? Is THAT what makes you think I'm a "sham", that I'm trying to "mislead" people, and that you've "busted" me, and after I had repeatedly asked you to answer my question about that issue??

If THAT is all it takes for you to feel good, Stephen, enjoy it while you can!! :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Point one, professional scientists have to be honest in their comments in the public arena, otherwise they lose all professional credibility. Apart from Dr Sawaya there have been other professional hair scientists that have commented on my theory including Dr Bazan and Dr Yechiel Phd the president of Elsom research, who posted about my theory on HairLossTalk.com.

Really? And what did they say about it?

These professional comments about my theory are on the record, and If i really wanted to i could post what Dr Yechiel had to say about your rantings on hairloss forums Bryan! :thumbdown2:

Be my guest!

By the way, I had one very brief exchange with Dr. Yechiel a year or two ago, over on hairsite. He replied rather briefly to things that I and a few others had posted, then disappeared from the site, with no further comment on what we had said.

Point two, if you are so confident about this "slam dunk" Sawaya study, why wont you post this? Talk is cheap :whistle:

I've already posted it a long time ago, back when we were talking about this stuff a few years ago. It had to do with Sawaya's careful measurement of various follicular androgen-related cellular substances and growth-components, and how they were greatly affected by the application (or non-application) of RU58841. That's what was so convincing, the other poster called it a "slam dunk" that it's the direct action of androgens on scalp hair follicles which suppresses their growth.

 

[S Foote.]

I must admit i have encouraged you here by brieifly going along with you that male pattern baldness was not mentioned in that Falk critique. Sly i know, but i just wanted to demonstrate to people here what a sham you really are Bryan

male pattern baldness in respect of Falks theory WAS CLEARLY refered to in that critique!! Now it is clear to people that you have been diliberately trying to mislead them :thumbdown2:

Its on the very first page introducing Falks theory, i have put the exact reference to male pattern baldness in capitals, so you dont "miss" it again :whistle:

"In modern humans under conditions of heat stress, the flow of conditions of heat stress, the flow of relatively cool venous blood through the two emissary veins charted by Falk in fossil crania actually reverses direction, going back into the brain, according to several recent studies directed by physiologists Michel Cabanac of Laval (Quebec) University and Heiner Brinnel of Hopital-Maternite in L'Arbresle, France.

Cabanac and Brinnel placed the tips of ultrasonic probes on the heads of BALD MALE VOLUNTEERS at sites where emissary veins poke thorugh their tiny cranial conduits. The probes recorded the direction of blood flow.

Falk also contends that the evaporation of sweat from the scalp, a little of which enters the braincase, helps cool emissary blood as it returns to the brain."

Your busted Bryan

ROTFLMAO!! Yes, without going to the trouble of reading that whole link again, I now vaguely recall the author (not necessarily even Dr. Falk) mentioning that work by Cabanac and Brinnel done on the subjects with male pattern baldness.

Goodness gracious, is THAT your huge moment of triumph, merely pointing out that I hadn't remembered a particular passage from a 3- or 4-page discussion by several scientists? Is THAT what makes you think I'm a "sham", that I'm trying to "mislead" people, and that you've "busted" me, and after I had repeatedly asked you to answer my question about that issue??

If THAT is all it takes for you to feel good, Stephen, enjoy it while you can!! :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Your not fooling anyone with this Bryan, people can read in this thread that you ranted at me claiming thatMPB was not refered to in the Falk link, and so it was not rellevant to the brain cooling issue.

It clearly was, and the scientists explained why scalp sweating was not important in brain cooling, which was my original point.

You need to be a lot more honest in debates Bryan, if you expect people familiar with real science to take you seriously.

Point one, professional scientists have to be honest in their comments in the public arena, otherwise they lose all professional credibility. Apart from Dr Sawaya there have been other professional hair scientists that have commented on my theory including Dr Bazan and Dr Yechiel Phd the president of Elsom research, who posted about my theory on HairLossTalk.com.

Really? And what did they say about it?

http://www.hairsite.com/hair-loss/forum ... 51409.html[/url]

It was in that post that he made his comment about you Bryan! Quote:

"The other important thing about your article is that you provide a method
to test its validity, That is not something that eccentric people do (I saw
that unfortunate comment about your posting which came out of the blue and
I was surprised that a seemingly intelligent person would resort to such
insults for no reason and without apparent provocation). Eccentric people
are beyond proving their statements and they are also never wrong (at least
they will never admit to being wrong)"

Says it all

Point two, if you are so confident about this "slam dunk" Sawaya study, why wont you post this? Talk is cheap :whistle:

I've already posted it a long time ago, back when we were talking about this stuff a few years ago. It had to do with Sawaya's careful measurement of various follicular androgen-related cellular substances and growth-components, and how they were greatly affected by the application (or non-application) of RU58841. That's what was so convincing, the other poster called it a "slam dunk" that it's the direct action of androgens on scalp hair follicles which suppresses their growth.

Still no link then I pressume this was another of the irrelevant in-vitro studies. Irrelevant for two reasons, first follicle cells behave very differently in-vitro than in-vivo, even in the complete absence of androgens. Even the culture method itself changes characteristics.

Initial Characterisation of a New Model of
Dermal Papilla Cell Culture
C. Higgins1, G. Richardson1, G. Westgate2, M. Green3,
D.J. Tobin4, C. Jahoda1

Human dermal papilla (DP) cells grown in culture have been studied
extensively. However, some key differences between DP cell
behaviour in vivo and in culture have been identified. Smooth muscle
 actin (SMA) is a sheath-cell specific marker in vivo, but once in
culture both papilla and sheath cells express SMA. Cells derived
from anagen DP’s are highly proliferative whilst the same cells in vivo
do not proliferate. Expression of extracellular matrix proteoglycans
changes during the hair cycle. The chondroitin proteoglycan Bamacan
is expressed in the anagen DP yet lost on entry to catagen and telogen
whilst Syndecan-1 is absent in anagen but present in the telogen DP.
In contrast, Perlecan expression remains constant throughout the hair
cycle. We previously demonstrated that DP cells grown in suspension
culture in tiny volumes form small spheroids which appear morphologically
to be more akin to DP found in vivo. We have now investigated
the differences between the two culture conditions using the
expression profile of SMA, proteoglycans and markers of proliferation.
Human DP cells at P4/P5 were plated in 35 mm dishes or placed
in hanging drops. All cells were cultured in MEM containing 10%
FBS. Cells were harvested when 80–90% confluent whilst spheres
were harvested after 30 h in culture. The two culture methods were
compared using RT-PCR and immuno-cytochemistry. The integrity
and viability of the spheres was confirmed using TEM and viability
markers. Results show that dermal spheres have a different profile
from normally cultured DP cells suggesting spheres may be an interesting
new model for studying DP cells in vitro. Perlecan and
Syndecan-1 expression is similar in both cells and dermal spheres in
contrast to Bamacan which is reduced in dermal spheres. SMA and
Ki67 are expressed in DP cells but not in dermal spheres, even though
the spheres remained viable.

Secondly the well discussed immuno mouse study were human male pattern baldness follicles regrow (you know the one i mean ) completely overruled any rellevance of the in-vitro studies as i and others have explained to you many times.

So much for your great "slam dunk"