Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[coco_304]

hi all.
my hair loss stop but no regrowth.
what is next..?

currnet regime:
25 cypo + 6 estriadol

by the way...
is it wise to reduce cypo to 12.5 ??

Tank you.

 

[bridgeburn]

maybe it's all ready way too high for us. Bridgeburn I have been meaning to ask you abut this for a long time. Do you have any idea what we can do?
The only thing I can think of trying is upping my cypro and lowering my estradiol. Maybe taking some estriol would help?

spironolactone and minoxidil because of extra vasolidation would likely make matters worse.. getting plenty of sleep is also crucial which you might need a little more of on these meds, veins show up under white skin easier, I always had visible chest veins, its no different before and after but my chest rarely got sun. getting a tan can help reduce appearance, or a fake tan..

The best I could find was this article but it is specifically for under eye blueness/ purple:
https://delightandinspire.com/2015/...w-to-get-rid-of-under-eye-blueness-and-veins/

Y'all could also try some tretenion on the face.

If none of that works, then reducing estrogen is likely required.

 

[Obsessive]

I squeeze out a couple eyedrops on each temple and then put either oestrogel or topical minoxidil on right after.

I actually started doing it in a similar way: 5 drops of dexamethasone in 1 mL liquid minoxidil. mixed in with a bit of estrogel. Mix this up until homogenous then apply over scalp. I think, at least on paper, dexa combined with a growth promoter, estrogen, and a 5 AR is a very powerful approach. Thanks again for the recommendation.

 

[Obsessive]

The best I could find was this article but it is specifically for under eye blueness/ purple:
https://delightandinspire.com/2015/...w-to-get-rid-of-under-eye-blueness-and-veins/

.

Just ordered some of this sh*t. Well see if it helps unde the eyes.
Seriously, I think I've discovered the holy grail for hair regowth, for me at least, but I need to find a way keep the oral minoxidil. in my regimen. For me, it's finasteride, oral min, and estro...I was about to add an anti-androgen but luckily haven't had to go there yet.

 

[bridgeburn]

I cannot find any scientific articles to support that. Please let me know. Everyone says estrone is bad but where is the evidence?

usually it is mentioned as bad in terms of breast cancer risk because after menopause estradiol goes down and estrone becomes predominant while breast cancer risk is increased. It is not necessarily bad overall, but estrone prefers alpha receptor over beta. ERa knockout mice lack mammary development, but in older women it could be an issue. ERa actually improves insulin sensitivity and fights metabolic syndrome.

ERa: boobs and insulin sensitivity.

ERb: benefits skin and hair.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Estradiol: Activates both ERa and ERb stronger than estrone and estriol, has equal binding preference.

Estrone: activates ERa more than ERb

Estriol: activates ERb more than ERa

Young Women Levels: Estradiol is number 1, Estrone is number 2, Estriol is number 3

Pregnant Women Levels: Estradiol is number 1, Estriol is number 2, Estrone is number 3

 

[Marky]

No. My dick never stopped working when I wanted to use it.. but in the beginning I had much lower libido and didn't use it so much.. estradiol improved my libido.

So erection worked but shooting blanks?

 

[bridgeburn]

Also, I think in my case the side effects of Spironolactone won't be as bad as when I was on Accutane. So, I think it might be bearable for me (I hope). On Accutane, the side effects which had the potential to cause a disturbance to my day was exacerbated depression; my depression was already severe but Accutane made me feel suicidal everyday.

I'm certain having better hair will fight depression.

I'm hoping I will be able to take an anti-androgen all of my life... There are a significant amount of transgender women who do not get the surgery (Blaire White being an example) so I'm assuming they would have to rely on the use of an anti-androgens permanently.

Its not necessarily required. Estrogen alone for many can reduce testosterone to castrate ranges.. the only caveot is that the levels must be kept consistently high. Wearing patches can help with that, especially overnight..

Also, the longer on HRT the harder it becomes to regain testicular function. and the easier it will become to suppress it. So, the first few years you should use anti androgens just in case, but after that taking only estradiol will keep it surpressed.. 4 to 6mg should be plenty.

" Estrogen-only therapy reduced the testosterone, luteinizing hormone and follicle-stimulating hormone levels from 731.5 to 18 ng/dL, 6.3 to 1.1 U/L and 9.6 to 1.5 U/L, respectively. Estrogen plus cyproterone acetate reduced the testosterone, luteinizing hormone and follicle-stimulating hormone levels from 750 to 21 ng/dL, 6.8 to 0.6 U/L and 10 to 1.0 U/L, respectively. "

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5910633/

 

[Gaz121]

Hi, I'm now nearly 2 months on Cypro (50mg) and Oestradiol (2mg orally). I've also been applying the Oestradiol gel (1.5mg) for 2 weeks. This is in addition to minoxidil (topically) and Propecia for the last few years. It looks like I have some very fine minor regrowth coming through in some areas in the form of fine vellus hairs, however, I'm continuing to lose hair at the same rate as usual. My hair is loss is noticeably continuing. Is it normal to continue to be losing hairs despite having some regrowth? I thought my hair loss would reduce / stop first and then I'd get some regrowth?

 

[bridgeburn]

Hi, I'm now nearly 2 months on Cypro (50mg) and Oestradiol (2mg orally). I've also been applying the Oestradiol gel (1.5mg) for 2 weeks. This is in addition to minoxidil (topically) and Propecia for the last few years. It looks like I have some very fine minor regrowth coming through in some areas in the form of fine vellus hairs, however, I'm continuing to lose hair at the same rate as usual. My hair is loss is noticeably continuing. Is it normal to continue to be losing hairs despite having some regrowth? I thought my hair loss would reduce / stop first and then I'd get some regrowth?

that sounds like how it was for me at first, I was shedding same amount as usual, hair on top was still thin but I was noticing up close tiny hairs appearing.. wait until at least 3 months to expect overall thickening

 

[Gaz121]

that sounds like how it was for me at first, I was shedding same amount as usual, hair on top was still thin but I was noticing up close tiny hairs appearing.. wait until at least 3 months to expect overall thickening

Ok, thanks bridgeburn.
Just to be sure for my own piece of mind, I'm taking the 50mg Cypro and the 2mg Oestradiol pill once in the morning and applying the 1.5mg Oestradiol gel once in the evening. Is this ok or do I need to split the pills and gel so that they're 12 hours apart instead of 24 hours apart?

 

[Father_of_Shiseido]

Ok, thanks bridgeburn.
Just to be sure for my own piece of mind, I'm taking the 50mg Cypro and the 2mg Oestradiol pill once in the morning and applying the 1.5mg Oestradiol gel once in the evening. Is this ok or do I need to split the pills and gel so that they're 12 hours apart instead of 24 hours apart?

How long have you been on these meds? What feminizing effect have you noticed so far? Still producing sperm?

 

[bridgeburn]

Obsessive you should know that estrogen alone can raise cortisol levels which can cause thin skin which causes the vein problem. I suggest you try these supplements and then try taking the estradiol again and see if the problem disappears.

I've used PS and ash before but I didn't know about the skin connection. What's one more supplement on top of the 13 I already take

The only thing I fear with this is, what if the thinner skin is part of the benefit to hair? Bald men have thicker scalp, because of fibrosis, than non bald men..

 

[bridgeburn]

Here is the guy that had great success with castor oil:

https://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/threads/hair-regrowth-great-on-castor-oil-but-need-help.99112/

You can check out his post history.. quite interesting.

I'm gonna add Castor oil back in, topically and orally, why the heck not..

He doesn't give pictures

 

[bridgeburn]

Did bridgeburn take pills or eye drops? How do you feel these drops give you something? oral probably better. but I'm not sure.

do not take it orally, dex is a harsh drug.

 

[bridgeburn]

Something which is bizarre is that my GP offered to prescribe me finasteride, which is metabolised through the liver, but he is putting spironolactone on hold.

they always push for FDA approved first.. doctors don't believe anything other than FDA approved drugs can help.. or they are not allowed to believe.

Honestly, I'm not sure where it's processed... It probably is metabolised through the liver, although I doubt it would have a negative impact on my liver as it is used to treat cirrhosis of the liver.

everything is processed by the liver, even food you eat.. processed sugar is worse for the liver than alcohol.

When you take estradiol sublingually it doesn't avoid the liver. It is better for the liver than if you swallow it because if you do the afterward it all hits the liver. sublingual puts it into your bloodstream then it diffuses and travels throughout the body before making its way to the liver gradually.. Overall theres no additional strain because Testosterone is processed out by the liver too, you take estradiol andthe body produces less testosterone so it balances out.. Unless you take a really high dose then yes too much of any hormones can impact the liver.

Ethynl estradiol (found in birth control, Diane 35) is harsher on the liver than estradiol. thats why its more risks for blood clots

 

[bridgeburn]

you will not follow here ??

I'm still here, for now

 

[bridgeburn]

I'm thinking I do not know if I buy 17 beta estradiol 2 mg and take 8 mg per day or vomit diane 35 that has ethinyl estradiol and cyproterone, take 5 capsules ... is better?? with diane 35 in addition to ethinyl estradiol would have 10 mg of cipoterone

absolutely dangerous to use that much Diane. do not do it!!

 

[bridgeburn]

Dr. Ray Peat believes the female life expectancy rate is higher largely due to progesterone. In fact he seems to have an overall negative

he also believes its estrogen which causes hairloss. *shaking my head

 

[bridgeburn]

Since the reported liver issues with cypro have been with doses of 100mg or higher and within the elderly, would it have much of a negative effect on my liver at 25mg per day...?

lots of transwomen (outside of USA) take 25mg. unless there is something wrong with your liver or you love getting drunk then no.

 

[bridgeburn]

Please tell me what should I do now? Shall I stop taking spironolactone?

You should stop taking 400mg of spironolactone.
your pottasium is evident of that.. don't f*** around with pottasium. that is what they inject criminals on death row with to kill them.

I know cypro is not available for you but it would be better.. or Bicalutimide or flutamide if possible.

try progesterone