Copper Peptide questions

[Bryan]

, told him he called procyte and they told him it contained 1%. [...] I think you saw the same posts I did. Don't call me a "lier", just because of that.

You can't be serious. Come on, you really think that some secretary that would answer the phone at Procyte would go against their company policy, and risk her job by giving up confidential company information, which procyte deliberately chooses not to disclose? Furthermore, I would be surprised if a secretary who answers the phone, would even know the precise details about the percentages of AHK in the frst place!

As I said in a previous post, it _may_ have been Ronald E. Trachy that he talked to (I misspelled Trachy's name myself in a previous post, so you can feel happy about not being so dumb about misspelling words! ). Do you have any idea at all who Ronald E. Trachy is?? :dunno:

 

[Bryan]

Show me the post.

Just answer the question that I asked you: do you or do you NOT know who Ronald E. Trachy is? :dunno:

And explain to me why Procyte would disclose a proprietary product formula, to a random caller, and go against their company policy in doing so.

Maybe Trachy was the one who had originally decided to keep that information about its actual concentration in Tricomin secret, and then later changed his mind, and decided to reveal it.

 

[Bryan]

Maybe Trachy was the one who had originally decided to keep that information about its actual concentration in Tricomin secret, and then later changed his mind, and decided to reveal it.

Oh my gosh this is getting comical, recently you said you didn't remember who made the post, that you keep talking about, where you supposedly read about the AHK percentage, and now you are suddenly changing your story and claiming that the post came from someone in the know. Wow another completely unsubstanciated claim and a second hand one at that, wow, are you really going to play this game. You are just making empty claims now, this is absurd! You are losing all of your credibility here, people are getting fed up.

Carefully read what I said above in plain English, dumbbell: MAYBE Trachy was the one who authorized and made those changes about revealing the information regarding Tricomin's peptide information. That's all the information we have at the current time, about who actually made the decision.

 

[Bryan]

Why did you actually cancel your last post? Is it because you're getting FAR too involved in all this silliness about the percentage of AHK-Cu in Tricomin?

Trust me on this: maybe we'll know the truth (truth that you'll actually believe) when your friends do that testing in the next month or so. Until then, all these hysterical comparisons of photographs showing various different shades of "blue" don't mean very much to me.

 

[blaze]

Procyte also sell "Graftcyte Concentrated Solution" which contains GHK-Cu at around ~1%. Tjhe bottle size is the same size as Tricomin but it cost A LOT more! Like 170.00 per bottle.

Whereas tricomin sells for around 45.00 for the same amount, 6oz. Now if Tricomin really does have 1% how come they sell Graftcyte for so much?

I know bryan will want to know how do I know that graftcyte only uses around ~1% GHK-Cu, to which I have already posted, but I will do it again.

Saline Solutions usually contain 0.9% Sodium Chloride and as you can see in the ingredients list it is the second ingredient listed: Purified Water, Sodium Chloride, Prezatide Copper Acetate, Propylene Glycol, Methylparaben, Propylparaben.

Also information backing this is the following interview by Dr Pickart with regrowth.com -

"regrowth: GraftCyte, Iamin, and Folligen all contain less than 1% of their active ingredient. The studies on Tricomin on 1.25% and 2.5% formula showed only the 2.5% formula was effective for hairloss. Why does Folligen not include a similar percentage of active ingredient? Do you believe Folligen would be more effective than currently if it used a similar higher percentage?

Dr. Pickart: Folligen probably would be more active at a higher percentage. But we are fighting the blue color problem. Also, skin irritation might occur at higher concentrations. We still need controlled clinical studies to optimize Folligen."

So IMO its pretty obvious Graftcyte contains a little less than 1% GHK-Cu based on the information at hand.

GHK-Cu does not cost that much more than AHK-cu if any at all. Someone would have to do a price check.

 

[Bryan]

Procyte also sell "Graftcyte Concentrated Solution" which contains GHK-Cu at around ~1%. Tjhe bottle size is the same size as Tricomin but it cost A LOT more! Like 170.00 per bottle.

Whereas tricomin sells for around 45.00 for the same amount, 6oz. Now if Tricomin really does have 1% how come they sell Graftcyte for so much?

Simple. Graftcyte went through an FDA-approval process, which is why it became a lot more expensive. Anything else you wanna know?

 

[Bryan]

"regrowth: GraftCyte, Iamin, and Folligen all contain less than 1% of their active ingredient. The studies on Tricomin on 1.25% and 2.5% formula showed only the 2.5% formula was effective for hairloss. Why does Folligen not include a similar percentage of active ingredient? Do you believe Folligen would be more effective than currently if it used a similar higher percentage? [snip]"

I have to point out here, too, the same thing I've been talking about on several other threads: it's not just the PERCENTAGE of a copper-peptide that affects how well it affects the treatment of hairloss, it's also how MUCH of the copper-peptide that gets applied. Applying 2 mL of a 1.25% solution will do as well as applying 1 mL of a 2.5% solution. It's what the TOTAL amount of the copper-peptide is, not just the concentration of an applied solution.

 

[blaze]

"regrowth: GraftCyte, Iamin, and Folligen all contain less than 1% of their active ingredient. The studies on Tricomin on 1.25% and 2.5% formula showed only the 2.5% formula was effective for hairloss. Why does Folligen not include a similar percentage of active ingredient? Do you believe Folligen would be more effective than currently if it used a similar higher percentage? [snip]"

I have to point out here, too, the same thing I've been talking about on several other threads: it's not just the PERCENTAGE of a copper-peptide that affects how well it affects the treatment of hairloss, it's also how MUCH of the copper-peptide that gets applied. Applying 2 mL of a 1.25% solution will do as well as applying 1 mL of a 2.5% solution. It's what the TOTAL amount of the copper-peptide is, not just the concentration of an applied solution.

that depends on how much scalp your covering. If you double over the same areas of scalp then yes. But if it takes you 2ml to cover your whole scalp then no, 2ml at 1.25% is not the same as 2ml at 2.5%.

 

[Bryan]

that depends on how much scalp your covering. If you double over the same areas of scalp then yes. But if it takes you 2ml to cover your whole scalp then no, 2ml at 1.25% is not the same as 2ml at 2.5%.

You're confused. I wasn't talking about 2 mL of 1.25% being the same as 2 mL of 2.5%, I was talking about 2 mL of 1.25% being the same as _1_ mL of 2.5%. Jesus H. Christ.

 

[Jacob]

Unless things changed from this 1997 HLH interview..

One fairly recent development is the compound we call PC1358, also tradenamed Tricomin solution. PC1358 is a second generation compound that ProCyte developed and has tested for treatment of androgenetic alopecia (Androgenetic Alopecia). While it is a peptide that chelates copper, it is not the same compound as that found in Iamin or GraftCyte - both of which are wound care products. We recently announced positive results of a Phase II study of PC1358 in 36 subjects with early to midstage Androgenetic Alopecia. At present, we are evaluating future development plans for this compound.

On a separate product focus from our compounds that actively promote hair growth, ProCyte has been studying the use of its compounds and products for wound care. We have a new product that we believe have a positive effect on outcomes in hair transplant surgical procedures. GraftCyte Moist Dressings will be promoted to the physician for use post-transplant. The GraftCyte Dressings contain a copper peptide compound in a new formulation. The dressings are first applied by the physician immediately upon completion of the transplant. Each dressing provides a copper peptide-enriched moist environment, that has been shown to help the transplant area repair faster than historical controls. Following the initial application at the time of surgery, the patient will take the remaining dressings home and follow physician instructions for keeping the transplant area moist and protected.

But regardless..I think they spent quite a bit of money on Tricomin going to..or was it through..Phase II.

 

[Bryan]

Unless things changed from this 1997 HLH interview..

One fairly recent development is the compound we call PC1358, also tradenamed Tricomin solution. PC1358 is a second generation compound that ProCyte developed and has tested for treatment of androgenetic alopecia (Androgenetic Alopecia). [...]

How odd...how very very odd! For the past several years, I've always thought that the peptide in Tricomin is code-named PC1234, not PC1358. It's a copper-peptide consisting of alanine, histidine, and lysine, just like what's in Tricomin (or what I've always THOUGHT was in Tricomin). It's definitely called "PC1234" in the published study that I've quoted numerous times (which first appeared in 1996); was the name merely changed to "PC1358" the following year, in 1997? I don't know; I wish I knew for sure!

 

[lapsedpacifist]

This is a really informative thread, but a lot of it has gone way over my head. I'm interested in trying copper peptides, maybe not right now, but at some point, is there any product on sale that confirms it contains the 2.5% formula? Do we know how much is in Prox-N? Cheers!

 

[israelite]

This is a really informative thread, but a lot of it has gone way over my head. I'm interested in trying copper peptides, maybe not right now, but at some point, is there any product on sale that confirms it contains the 2.5% formula? Do we know how much is in Prox-N? Cheers!

proxiphen contains 1%

 

[Bryan]

This is a really informative thread, but a lot of it has gone way over my head. I'm interested in trying copper peptides, maybe not right now, but at some point, is there any product on sale that confirms it contains the 2.5% formula? Do we know how much is in Prox-N? Cheers!

proxiphen contains 1%

I don't think anybody knows how much copper-peptide (or even what specific TYPE of copper-peptide) is in either Prox-N or Proxiphen. I've never seen Dr. Proctor make any mention of that information.

 

[Jacob]

Because it would be laughed out of these forums.

No information..and no evidence.

Proxiphen NANO Prox Proctor Bryan SPAM Shill garbage crap snake oil no evidence

 

[Bryan]

Because it would be laughed out of these forums.

WHAT specifically would be laughed out of these forums? And why?

 

[Jacob]

Proxiphen NANO Prox Proctor Bryan SPAM Shill garbage crap snake oil no evidence

 

[Bryan]

Proxiphen NANO Prox Proctor Bryan SPAM Shill garbage crap snake oil no evidence

Is that all you're going to say when I cite what may be the best available male pattern baldness treatment ever made? Something designed and produced by a doctor (both an MD and a PhD)? Where the hell did YOU go to medical school, to be able to have an opinion like what you wrote above? :dunno:

 

[Jacob]

Bryan is a shill for Proctor and his products. He's been shill 'n spam'n the crap for 15+ years. There are plenty of docs with hair loss products out there. With patents on their ingreds/products as well. There is no evidence for Proctor's/Bryan's claims or wishes. Not only has Proctor not said which specific cu peptides are used, but he and Bryan also talk about "mysterious ingredients" that are not in the ingreds list(s). Snake-oil talk that is supposed to get you even more excited about the products. For all the reasons above..he should have been laughed out of these forums years ago.

Proxiphen NANO Prox Proctor Bryan SPAM Shill garbage crap snake oil no evidence

 

[Patrickbateman]

Okay so what percentage actually showed good regrowth results?