Bryan, what do u think of this crazy theory??

[Old Baldy]

Maybe Gardener!?

Guys: This is going to sound very crazy also. I started losing alot of the hairs on my legs, especially on the thighs, about the same time as I started losing the hairs on the top of my head.

I've been on finasteride. since late Dec., 2004 and there is NOTICABLE regrowth of hairs on my thighs!!?? Shins have a little regrowth also. Just a little so far.

I'm not kidding. I'd take a picture but you guys would puke.

 

[jimmystanley]

wow...i'm amazed at the response here...i was expecting site wide ridicule. i understand that it will take months to see results..but a few (3) guys that i know who are using fluridil say that they saw results pretty quickly...like a week! But i think that was just a stoppage of hairloss.

 

[Dice_Has_Hair]

wow...i'm amazed at the response here...i was expecting site wide ridicule. i understand that it will take months to see results..but a few (3) guys that i know who are using fluridil say that they saw results pretty quickly...like a week! But i think that was just a stoppage of hairloss.

Stoppage of hairloss is good. It means that fluridil does what it is supposed to.

 

[jimmystanley]

soooo....why don't they market this to chicks who grow staches?>???

 

[Dice_Has_Hair]

soooo....why don't they market this to chicks who grow staches?>???

LOL!! Its easier for them to take anti androgens for that, I would think.

 

[Footy]

okay..the truth is i also saw some logic to it but i wrote it as a crazy idea just to avoid any acusations in case it was bizzare.

Hey, that never stopped certain other individuals from posting bizarre theories! In fact, if your initials are "SF", you are MUCH more likely to post bizarre theories! :wink:

i would do it on my pubes if fluridil wasn't so expensive. I guess this also means it would take a long time for anti androgens to work on the scalp too...

Exactly. It cracks me up when newbies post things like, "I've been using Propecia [or spironolactone, or fluridil, or whatever] for a couple months now, but haven't seen any results yet."

It would be fascinating if one of us would apply some relatively inexpensive topical spironolactone to one side of our beards for a few months, and record the before-and-after results with a digital camera. That would be KEWL!

Bryan

It's funny how you like to have the odd dig at me in these threads Bryan, but i have to thank you for continuing to post studies that support my theory, even when they refute yours :wink:

Very sporting of you i must say. Your latest contribution is at your `safe haven' of Farrels censored site (yet again) :roll:

This concerns your `U' turn regarding the implications of the immuno-deficient mice transplantation study.

Glad to see you are finally starting to see the light Bryan 8)

If you want to post that in the experimental forum here, i have some links that shed light on why male pattern baldness follicles regrow in this study.

By the way, go ahead and try your spironolactone `facial' experiment. I reported on this when i did my own facial experiment remember?

I had been using Crinagen on my beard area, and this reduced my beard growth. When i switched to spironolactone, my beard growth increased!

S Foote.

 

[1derphull]

Foote and Bryan, PLEASE dont start another one of your stupid arguments on this thread......

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Amen!

 

[Bryan]

It's funny how you like to have the odd dig at me in these threads Bryan...

It's just so damned much FUN, Stephen! :wink: I wanted to see if you were paying attention.

...but i have to thank you for continuing to post studies that support my theory, even when they refute yours :wink:

Only in your most fevered, sweat-dripping wet-dreams have I ever posted studies that support your theory.

Very sporting of you i must say. Your latest contribution is at your `safe haven' of Farrels censored site (yet again) :roll:

This concerns your `U' turn regarding the implications of the immuno-deficient mice transplantation study.

Glad to see you are finally starting to see the light Bryan 8)

If you want to post that in the experimental forum here, i have some links that shed light on why male pattern baldness follicles regrow in this study.

HUH?? I posted the same thing right here in this very same forum, under the same subject heading! Why don't you post your comments in that thread?

By the way, go ahead and try your spironolactone `facial' experiment. I reported on this when i did my own facial experiment remember?

I had been using Crinagen on my beard area, and this reduced my beard growth. When i switched to spironolactone, my beard growth increased!

How are you judging the results? Did you do as I suggested, and apply the Crinagen to only ONE SIDE of your beard? Please explain all the details of what you did.

Bryan

 

[1derphull]

Fuckin a here we go again.

At least Gunner and Tynan's arguments were entertaining.

Maybe if I can't sleep tonight, I'll come back and read some Bryan vs Foote threads.....works just like valium!! ZzzzzzZZZzzZz

 

[MidnightFlyer]

At least Gunner and Tynan's arguments were entertaining.

That's because Tynan and Gunner are one and the same!

 

[Footy]

Fuckin a here we go again.

At least Gunner and Tynan's arguments were entertaining.

Maybe if I can't sleep tonight, I'll come back and read some Bryan vs Foote threads.....works just like valium!! ZzzzzzZZZzzZz

I know, i know :lol:

This is why i asked Bryan to post about that study in the experimental forum OK :wink:

S Foote.

 

[Footy]

HUH?? I posted the same thing right here in this very same forum, under the same subject heading! Why don't you post your comments in that thread?

By the way, go ahead and try your spironolactone `facial' experiment. I reported on this when i did my own facial experiment remember?

I had been using Crinagen on my beard area, and this reduced my beard growth. When i switched to spironolactone, my beard growth increased!

How are you judging the results? Did you do as I suggested, and apply the Crinagen to only ONE SIDE of your beard? Please explain all the details of what you did.

Bryan

I did look look for your usual duplicate post here Bryan, on the forum here designed for `study debates'. I also looked on the first page here, but didn't see anything.

As you can see from the reaction, people on this forum have other priorities!

Getting back to the topic here, i can't say i tried just one side in my beard experiment. But i can say that Crinagen used like an after shave, did significantly reduce my beard growth to around half it's original growth rate over around 3 months. After about 5 months, i replaced the Crinagen with 5% spironolactone cream, and my beard growth increased!

The spironolactone did not reduce my beard growth at all!

Go ahead and try it yourself. But if you are going to try a `spot' experiment on the beard area, just remember there is case based on the lymphatic layout (an independent drainage route each side), why you could get a `one side effect' here in my theory.

I would suggest you use a chest hair `spot' as well as a control.

S Foote.

 

[Dice_Has_Hair]

HUH?? I posted the same thing right here in this very same forum, under the same subject heading! Why don't you post your comments in that thread?

By the way, go ahead and try your spironolactone `facial' experiment. I reported on this when i did my own facial experiment remember?

I had been using Crinagen on my beard area, and this reduced my beard growth. When i switched to spironolactone, my beard growth increased!

How are you judging the results? Did you do as I suggested, and apply the Crinagen to only ONE SIDE of your beard? Please explain all the details of what you did.

Bryan

I did look look for your usual duplicate post here Bryan, on the forum here designed for `study debates'. I also looked on the first page here, but didn't see anything.

As you can see from the reaction, people on this forum have other priorities!

Getting back to the topic here, i can't say i tried just one side in my beard experiment. But i can say that Crinagen used like an after shave, did significantly reduce my beard growth to around half it's original growth rate over around 3 months. After about 5 months, i replaced the Crinagen with 5% spironolactone cream, and my beard growth increased!

The spironolactone did not reduce my beard growth at all!

Go ahead and try it yourself. But if you are going to try a `spot' experiment on the beard area, just remember there is case based on the lymphatic layout (an independent drainage route each side), why you could get a `one side effect' here in my theory.

I would suggest you use a chest hair `spot' as well as a control.

S Foote.

I wonder if you used 2% spironolactone solution instead of the 5% spironolactone lotion, you would have gotten better results. Who knows, maybe the 5% lotion version doesn't absorb very well. Just a thought.

 

[Footy]

HUH?? I posted the same thing right here in this very same forum, under the same subject heading! Why don't you post your comments in that thread?

By the way, go ahead and try your spironolactone `facial' experiment. I reported on this when i did my own facial experiment remember?

I had been using Crinagen on my beard area, and this reduced my beard growth. When i switched to spironolactone, my beard growth increased!

How are you judging the results? Did you do as I suggested, and apply the Crinagen to only ONE SIDE of your beard? Please explain all the details of what you did.

Bryan

I did look look for your usual duplicate post here Bryan, on the forum here designed for `study debates'. I also looked on the first page here, but didn't see anything.

As you can see from the reaction, people on this forum have other priorities!

Getting back to the topic here, i can't say i tried just one side in my beard experiment. But i can say that Crinagen used like an after shave, did significantly reduce my beard growth to around half it's original growth rate over around 3 months. After about 5 months, i replaced the Crinagen with 5% spironolactone cream, and my beard growth increased!

The spironolactone did not reduce my beard growth at all!

Go ahead and try it yourself. But if you are going to try a `spot' experiment on the beard area, just remember there is case based on the lymphatic layout (an independent drainage route each side), why you could get a `one side effect' here in my theory.

I would suggest you use a chest hair `spot' as well as a control.

S Foote.

I wonder if you used 2% spironolactone solution instead of the 5% spironolactone lotion, you would have gotten better results. Who knows, maybe the 5% lotion version doesn't absorb very well. Just a thought.

I think that topical androgen receptor blockers like spironolactone, won't effect beard growth because the androgen receptors that `matter' in hair growth are out of the reach of spironolactone.

spironolactone has been shown to do it's job in effecting surface androgen receptors in sebaceous glands, so there is no reason to think it doesn't have the same effect in hair follicles. If spironolactone isn't working in changing hair growth, the only answer to this is that the receptors in hair follicles, are not important in androgen related hair growth.

According to my theory, it is androgen receptors in the deeper lymphatic vessels that matter, and spironolactone cannot reach these!

On the other hand if you can reduce the DHT production in follicles that is effecting the deeper receptors, you can make a difference!

This is why i think Crinagen reduces beard growth, and spironolactone doesn't.

S Foote.

 

[Bryan]

I think that topical androgen receptor blockers like spironolactone, won't effect beard growth because the androgen receptors that `matter' in hair growth are out of the reach of spironolactone.

spironolactone has been shown to do it's job in effecting surface androgen receptors in sebaceous glands, so there is no reason to think it doesn't have the same effect in hair follicles. If spironolactone isn't working in changing hair growth, the only answer to this is that the receptors in hair follicles, are not important in androgen related hair growth.

According to my theory, it is androgen receptors in the deeper lymphatic vessels that matter, and spironolactone cannot reach these!

On the other hand if you can reduce the DHT production in follicles that is effecting the deeper receptors, you can make a difference!

This is why i think Crinagen reduces beard growth, and spironolactone doesn't.

Ahhh....but you're WRONG about that, Stephen! :wink: Check out my report of a study that was done by none other than Dr. Roger Rittmaster himself:

http://www.geocities.com/bryan50001/spironolactone.txt

He did find fairly impressive evidence that topical spironolactone does slow the growth of hair in hirsute women, at least using a cream vehicle (the actual reason I first posted that excerpt a long time ago was mainly just to argue in favor of using creams over alcoholic solutions). As such, it represents yet another nail in the coffin for your theory. However, I'm sure you'll put on your thinking-cap tonight and figure out another ad hoc way to explain those results, so that they fit in with your theory! :wink:

Bryan

 

[Felk]

Bump.

Did anyone ever stick out their antiandrogen tests on their body hair? I'd be interested in the results.

 

[bubka]

sure, but who is to say that anti androgens that work on secondary sex body hair will work on hair on your scalp...

 

[S Foote.]

Honestly, save it for your head. We already know these compounds have anti androgen activity!

YOU know it and _I_ know it, but not EVERYBODY knows it or believes it. Some people on these hairloss sites insist that topicals are ineffective, spironolactone in particular. It would be fascinating if we could document its effect on beard (or some other body hair) growth. That would lend a lot of support for its use in male pattern baldness. It would also be more evidence for me against Stephen Foote's theory.

Bryan

I am still waiting for you to present "ANY" truly scientific evidence against my theory Bryan :roll:

I know through my own experiments with both topical 5ARI's and 5% spironolactone cream, that topical spironolactone does squat to androgen driven hair growth.

Beard growth is "definately" an androgen effect, that you Bryan try to claim is direct. So topical spironolactone should block the androgen effect at source (according to you?). The use of such topical anti-androgens, should be the most effective way to deal with any "direct" action of androgens in-vivo according to your claims Bryan!

But i know and others can try this for themselves, that topical spironolactone has no effect whatsoever on slowing beard growth. Topical 5ARI's "do" slow beard growth.

So i am all for people experimenting for themselves here as you are Bryan. Then they can see for themselves how much trouble "YOUR" theory is in! :wink:

S Foote.

 

[IBM]

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