Anyone Here On Lllt? Please Lets Share Our Experience!

VJ6

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I underwent PRP in Sep 18 and started Lasercap (Theradome, at home treatment) in October. I would like to share my experience and know about others' too.
 

VJ6

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Hello,

It has not been great. Since my use in Oct '18, I have experienced continued shedding of tiny hairs (1-3 inches long, all with a white bulb at the end), scalp changes - increased oiliness and itchiness and hair is dull, lifeless and thinner than ever. My hair doctor has not provided any solution or suggestion other than "this is normal". Initial shedding is expected but the what I'm seeing isn't very common from the looks of it. I've noticed every time my scalp gets oily/itchy, more hair falls out. As of now, I'm just experimenting with different shampoos to regain scalp health. I can't do much. Reduced laser time to 15 mins, twice a week instead of 30 mins x3/week.

PS: My labs are normal. I'm doing my best to handle a genetic situation.

Anyone else? would love some inputs.
 

Cate

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I have not had this experience, my scalp is not oily and no extra shedding as such. However, I am doing a host of other things. Can you isolate the shedding to the laser helmet? Or is it due to hormones etc? I have never heard of Lllt causing oily scalp... anyone else?
 
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Lynnwood

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Hi everyone. I bought a Laser Messiah from OMG about 5-6 months ago, I am female, age 62. I have a lot of thinning, hereditary. To be frank, I’m an aging hippie chick. I don’t wear makeup or jewelry, but I am known for my very long hair. My Mom went nearly bald so I decided I had to take action before I went bald too. I decided on the Laser Messiah because of OMG, John, he knows what he’s doing as far as the laser helmets are concerned, and he has a regimen that is all his knowledge of things that are working right now. His helmets are very high quality for a reasonable, affordable price. Considering the laser diodes are clinical quality (like with a $40K machine), worn as a helmet, it seems clear it’s an excellent choice.

So it took me a couple months to get to wearing it 3 times a week, and even then it took another month to start to add other elements of his regimen. Slow start for me, He recommended I stop the Minoxadil and suffer through the shed, so I did that. Not much to report yet but I will be back with future reports. I did take some poor selfie type photos for comparison later.

It is probably my imagination but when I grab the hair at the top of my head, it feels thicker. But it could be that hopium I’ve been smokin’ ... lol
 

VJ6

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I have not had this experience, my scalp is not oily and no extra shedding as such. However, I am doing a host of other things. Can you isolate the shedding to the laser helmet? Or is it due to hormones etc? I have never heard of Lllt causing oily scalp... anyone else?
Hi Cate,

Thanks for sharing. My labs are all normal including thyroid. Doctors didn't think any action was needed. My ferritin tends to be low (still within acceptable range) because I'm a vegetarian but it wasn't a problem before. In fact, I am more diet conscious now than I was 5-6 years ago. I have been on Nutrafol since last November and I have been on multivits for almost a decade.
I've reached out to OMG too and he said this was unheard of. The timing is incriminating, which is why I suspect the laser. My scalp would act out now and then because of weather but all temporary, never shed so many tiny hairs and scalp was generally healthy. Even though hair was thinning, I could still see new growth around my temple and mid line until last July. I have lived in MA for 1.5 years now and it is known for long, hard winters, but this isn't my first winter here. This whole nightmarish struggle started in September '18 when I had a week of massive shed and oiliness because of 2 weeks of Rogaine use. I never was comfortable with it so stopped it after 2 weeks. Then I had high density PRP procedure in Sep which the doctor said would show promising results in a couple of months. Nothing yet, may be it did something to halt further loss but I DON'T see any new growth/hair quality improvement. But with all this extra shedding, the net effect is close to zero. Remember Rogaine making my scalp oily too. I waited for Rogaine shed to plateau before starting lasercap. Ever since, there has not been a day where I have not shed these tiny hairs. I don't know if these are all just miniaturized hairs that would have fell anyway or growing hairs for some reason pushed to fall.

I'm well aware that lasers cause initial shedding in some people because it stimulates follicles, so for new hair to grow, old hair must be shed. But I've waited patiently for 3.5 months now, I see no progress. May be it will stop at some point, but what's the guarantee I will recover all hair that I have lost. I did not have thick hair to begin with to bear this loss. I did come across on published study (not funded by any of the laser guys) that reported scalp pruritis (itching/inflammation) as an adverse event -> https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10103-018-02699-9

Some shampoos I'm experimenting with are products I used in the past with no problems. Its possible I'm suddenly allergic to them, so I'm trying out different shampoos. Not a huge fan of oiling my scalp because I shed a lot when I massage oil into my scalp. It could be coincidental but the oiliness has seemed to have gone down a notch now that I've reduced laser time. 30 mins of lasercap did make my scalp warm and humid.

Cate- what other things are you doing? what's your laser usage regimen?

ETA: I'm an asian (indian) woman with black hair, light brown/olive skin. The user manual of my LLLT device (Regrow by Hairmax) says this technology hasn't been studied in dark brown- dark skin. Wonder if there's any correlation. Doctor didn't say anything about my skin color before prescribing (more like pushing it..lol) this device.

A quick search on FDA MAUDE database that houses all medical device issues and adverse effects for LLLT devices (with FDA defined product code 'OAP') for the past 19 years yields only 8 results, which means only 8 people have volunteered to report a problem. And keep in mind, these are all VOLUNTARY reports by the user/patient. I work in Medical devices and I know this is BS. These are regulated Class II devices which means there are mandatory reporting guidelines to be followed by the manufacturer and the doctor prescribing. In 19 years, no manufacturer/ doctor has raised this issue? Yes, its not life threatening, its still a serious problem?! The box clearly states "No clinically adverse side effects". Hah! how incredibly deceitful. There are reports saying people had migraines because of lasercap. Does FDA truly not see all this?
The whole thing about Capillus and iGrow devices being sold on Amazon (and not being sold by a prescribing physician) messes this system up. You can't hold the company accountable at all. FDA truly sucks at monitoring anything other than cancer, diabetes and cardiovascular problems.
 
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Cate

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I'm using the 101 system with a lot of success.. https://www.101.com.au/101-hair-formula but I also do laser (home use). I started on Minoxidil so went through crazy shedding and like you, stopped cold.. my scalp was horribly itchy also during that time.. was a nightmare.. I was furious I was put on it because the hair place I got it from didn't warn of the side effects. Can I ask how many hairs you shed a day?

The other things I do are mainly diet related. I take a special hair protein shake https://www.mhra.com.au/shop/help-hair-protein-shake/ and have always eaten very healthy (but a fruitarian for a long time so I was low on iron etc. (ferritin levels have to be high .. so I recommend you taking a really good quality supplement - a high dose - with vit c) Now I am vegetarian.. drink a lot of water, eat a good variety of food.)...

My DHT was slightly above the range, the Doctor said it shouldn't cause a problem, but I felt it was worth tacking. There is no medication for high DHT in women (as far as I'm aware) so my diet really is focused on herbs and foods that block it. That has been v successful (Saw palmetto.. although disputed on this forum.. has been very helpful. I take a high dose)

Your findings make me want to stop laser..

(BTW I am also known for my v long hair. so I truly understand the mental trauma you are going trough)
 

VJ6

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Cate,

On hair wash days, I shed about 50-60 regular size strands and 20-30 small hairs, 1-3 inches long, most of them look frail and discolored. Some days are bad, when I shed about 50-60 tiny hairs. Worst sheds after I oil my scalp/ when there's excess sebum and itchiness, 100-130. I know this shed may not sound too horrible, but this is too much for me, because except for a period after high school (15-16 years ago), when I had massive shed which I wasn't even aware of, excess shedding was never a problem because I did everything to prevent it- diet, supplements, no chemical treatments, natural hair care whenever possible. I can confidently say this shed has caused a cosmetic difference in a short period of time.

I doubt Ferritin levels are a problem for me because I was always a vegetarian and my PCP doesn't think I need anymore iron in my body, my current Ferritin levels are within acceptable range, meaning not low, but lower than the levels for meat eaters- but it could be a cause, I don't know. What brand of iron supplement do you use and how do you take it- with fruits/breakfast etc?

I remember my DHT actually being low when I tested last August. The Doctor didn't think that was anything to worry about. The hair supplement I take, Nutrafol, has saw palmetto and bunch of other stuff. I'm hoping its doing something for me internally, no visible results yet.

I'm not willing to chalk this up to stress. I've certainly have been through many many stressful events in my life, while they may have induced an increase in shed at some point, nothing was this persistent and annoying. And with lasers, its not the technology I have a problem with. I'm livid about the lack of accountability from manufacturers and the doctors and FDA's indifference. Ok to make some money, but have some ethics and don't promise miracles! The bigger picture is that the medical community does not care enough about hair issues, hence the general apathy.
 

Cate

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hmmm.. that's a mystery... you shed more than you used to? have you checked b12, and D? I sometimes shed short hairs, but I have breakage, so put it down to that. I shed about 20-30 a day (inc wash days).. I can only speak for myself, anything herbal suggested on the forum is met with a lot of (understandable) scepticism - but I didn't stop shedding until I went onto the 101 hair system.. it was formulated over 100 years ago in China, and I cannot speak highly enough of the change it has made to my hair in a short period of time.

I also invert every day and feel that helps. Additionally,I use Bondi Boost products for growth (all natural and good for shedding etc. https://bondiboost.com.au/)

I take an effervescent iron supplement and take it at breakfast with 1000 mg of C, but the help hair protein (the link I sent above) also has Iron in so I feel as if I am covered.

Re oil, it can make you shed if you leave it on the scalp overnight (the long hair community forum has a lot on this.. google the forum if you are not aware of it) .. Only leave for an hour. Also better to wash your hair often if you have an oily scalp. Check out this lady
5 years ago she had alopecia and now look at her.. she busts a lot of myths re stretching between washes.. she studied trichology herself to cure her issues.. and now...wow....

Green tea rinses are good for shedding..

My diet is all hair food, every day - avocado, bananas, eggs, milk, soy, yogurt, black seed oil, wheat grass, barely grass (and others) plenty of berries for C, tomatoes, mushrooms etc.
After about 2.5 months on the diet, I started to see an improvement. But, the shedding only stopped when I started the 101 system. It's good..

(Oh and agree re the medical industry re hair... they are clueless imo.. )
 

VJ6

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I'm glad your system works for you. Any chance the video is available in english? There are no english subtitles on it.
The multivit I take has iron in it, I take it religiously and I eat iron rich foods on a regular basis. One thing i could start doing is eat plenty more fruits while I take the multivit so that iron gets absorbed. I'm not sure I really want to be taking anymore pills.

As far as my diet goes, I eat all of the stuff on your list except the grasses and black seed oil.

I have started apple cider vinegar rinse and I want to do it for a month before commenting on the results. And about oiling, on the rare occasions i oil, I dont let it sit for more than an hour. I wash my hair 3 times/week. It worked without glitches until last summer.

Going to this hair specialist to do something for my hair has only messed it up.
 

Cate

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I'm glad your system works for you. Any chance the video is available in english? There are no english subtitles on it.
The multivit I take has iron in it, I take it religiously and I eat iron rich foods on a regular basis. One thing i could start doing is eat plenty more fruits while I take the multivit so that iron gets absorbed. I'm not sure I really want to be taking anymore pills.

As far as my diet goes, I eat all of the stuff on your list except the grasses and black seed oil.

I have started apple cider vinegar rinse and I want to do it for a month before commenting on the results. And about oiling, on the rare occasions i oil, I dont let it sit for more than an hour. I wash my hair 3 times/week. It worked without glitches until last summer.

Going to this hair specialist to do something for my hair has only messed it up.

Yup - same.. it mucked me up when I went to a so called hair specialist who sold me laser and minoxidil for a few thousand. Wish I had never done it. What you are doing sounds great. The vid has subtitles (click the subtitle button on YouTube and you can read.. she has an instagram, account also in Russian which you cam use Google translate to view.)

3 times a week sounds fine. Are you sure all your sheds are from the root and not breakage?

Black seed oil was recommended to me by someone else who had been through this. so I simply added it to the intake of everything else I'm taking.. ..the benefits of it as a "miracle oil"v are well recorded..
 

VJ6

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The guy I went to is a practicing doctor, even with degrees I guess not everyone cares or knows enough.

Yes, I clicked on subtitles on YouTube and only Russian subtitles were available :( You know her name? I can look her up...

While there is some breakage hair I see (small and long), I know for a fact all those tiny hairs I'm shedding have a white bulb at the end, meaning they are telogen hairs. How do you use blackseed oil- just in salad dressings or do you cook with it?

I had sort of a eureka moment last night- a possible reason for scalp problems and lifeless hair. For the past 2 months, I've noticed my warm water smells like Calcium. Massachusetts is supposed to have better (only moderately hard water) water than other states, but I'm beginning to think the town I live in has been supplying f*#@ed up water for a while (man I really hate this place). Interestingly, I don't think water quality was an issue last year- I've been living here for 1.5 years. I have ordered a shower filter and I also plan to rinse my hair with distilled water. I'll add to this thread what the outcome is. I'm not however sure if mineral deposits in water lead to the kind of shedding i'm seeing. Even if the shower filter restores scalp health, its a huge win.
 

Cate

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The guy I went to is a practicing doctor, even with degrees I guess not everyone cares or knows enough.

Yes, I clicked on subtitles on YouTube and only Russian subtitles were available :( You know her name? I can look her up...

While there is some breakage hair I see (small and long), I know for a fact all those tiny hairs I'm shedding have a white bulb at the end, meaning they are telogen hairs. How do you use blackseed oil- just in salad dressings or do you cook with it?

I had sort of a eureka moment last night- a possible reason for scalp problems and lifeless hair. For the past 2 months, I've noticed my warm water smells like Calcium. Massachusetts is supposed to have better (only moderately hard water) water than other states, but I'm beginning to think the town I live in has been supplying f*#@ed up water for a while (man I really hate this place). Interestingly, I don't think water quality was an issue last year- I've been living here for 1.5 years. I have ordered a shower filter and I also plan to rinse my hair with distilled water. I'll add to this thread what the outcome is. I'm not however sure if mineral deposits in water lead to the kind of shedding i'm seeing. Even if the shower filter restores scalp health, its a huge win.

Ahhh very Interesting, there is a lot on the Long Hair Forum re types of water and how it affects hair. https://forums.longhaircommunity.co...70.1275930125.1551419260-907633227.1548916151 (You need to do a search for the threads). That may help you....

Her name is Anastasia Sidorova....she is pretty amazing..

I take black seed oil direct in the morning.. it doesn't taste nice.. but bearable.. a couple of tea spoons a day....https://www.stylecraze.com/articles/how-to-use-kalonji-black-seed-oil-for-hair-growth-baldness/#gref (I just take internally.)
 
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VJ6

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Ahhh very Interesting, there is a lot on the Long Hair Forum re types of water and how it affects hair. https://forums.longhaircommunity.co...70.1275930125.1551419260-907633227.1548916151 (You need to do a search for the threads). That may help you....

Her name is Anastasia Sidorova....she is pretty amazing..

I take black seed oil direct in the morning.. it doesn't taste nice.. but bearable.. a couple of tea spoons a day....https://www.stylecraze.com/articles/how-to-use-kalonji-black-seed-oil-for-hair-growth-baldness/#gref (I just take internally.)

Thanks much for all your inputs. I have been on the long hair forum before, will check it out again.
Weird gunk in water is why I started the ACV rinse. I'm beginning to also think I have developed some sort of allergy to shampoos I didn't have problems with before. We'll see...
 

VJ6

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Hi,

Don't know if anyone is following this thread. I wanted to post an update for anyone interested.
1. My scalp is leaning more towards normal behavior and is slightly better now when compared to Dec-Jan-Feb. I had issues of scalp dryness/tightness on wash days followed by intense oiliness and itchiness. Increased shedding of hairs 1-2 inches long was also a problem. Now that its much warmer but also more humid in New England, I don't know if the moderate improvement is weather related.

I still shed tiny hairs, some days even 25-30 and still have some oiliness/itchiness, but its not as bad as before.

2. I traveled to Dallas in March where miraculously my hair felt almost normal. I did not have weird scalp issues and my hair seemed fuller. the water, may be?
3. I used Nature's gate shampoo in Dallas and its part of my routine now. Natures gate is good for scalp but doesn't volumize or thicken which I badly need. Also tried various other shampoos (ones I had before) but so far, none have really worked. The hunt for the perfect shampoo is still on.
4. I still do my ACV rinse and do a final rinse with distilled/canned water. Again, don't know how much these are helping. They can't harm my hair, so going to continue.
5. I have taken a break from the evil laser cap (which I believe is causing this hair cycling-> shedding of tiny hairs). I plan to not use it for a month at least and see if it helps the shedding. Honestly, might just return it and get my money back. Absolute POS.
6. While Nutrafol's magic has not kicked in (yet), I highly recommend their hair mineral analysis which is available at no extra cost at 3 months of the subscription. The 45 min consultation was thorough and made a lot of sense to me. The doctor opened my eyes to a lot of things I was doing wrong w.r.t my supplements and other habits and suggested a better supplement regimen. Particularly, upping Ferritin levels because i'm a vegetarian. While its a hard pill to swallow (pun intended) that there are women out there who don't give a s#*t about supplements/diet and have beautiful hair, I guess it might be useful to try.
7. I wash my hair every other day now and I seem to prefer it. My previous regimen was 3 days/week, now its 4 days. Not much of a difference but it helps my scalp greasiness and keeps my scalp cleaner.
8. Tested for PCOS, it came negative. Whew!
9. I ended up not using the shower filter because a) my apartment maintenance would not fix it for me b) If the shower filter messes up the water pressure or completely blocks the flow, I don't have another bathroom to shower in. I feel like I don't smell that calcium deposit in the water that much, but that's something out of my control.

I sincerely hope my hair would go back to what it was last summer. At this point, I don't even want thicker, beautiful hair, just want my old hair before I started these so called 'treatments'. I guess i would have to accept the fact that this is my life and try to find happiness.
 

Cate

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Hi,

Don't know if anyone is following this thread. I wanted to post an update for anyone interested.
1. My scalp is leaning more towards normal behavior and is slightly better now when compared to Dec-Jan-Feb. I had issues of scalp dryness/tightness on wash days followed by intense oiliness and itchiness. Increased shedding of hairs 1-2 inches long was also a problem. Now that its much warmer but also more humid in New England, I don't know if the moderate improvement is weather related.

I still shed tiny hairs, some days even 25-30 and still have some oiliness/itchiness, but its not as bad as before.

2. I traveled to Dallas in March where miraculously my hair felt almost normal. I did not have weird scalp issues and my hair seemed fuller. the water, may be?
3. I used Nature's gate shampoo in Dallas and its part of my routine now. Natures gate is good for scalp but doesn't volumize or thicken which I badly need. Also tried various other shampoos (ones I had before) but so far, none have really worked. The hunt for the perfect shampoo is still on.
4. I still do my ACV rinse and do a final rinse with distilled/canned water. Again, don't know how much these are helping. They can't harm my hair, so going to continue.
5. I have taken a break from the evil laser cap (which I believe is causing this hair cycling-> shedding of tiny hairs). I plan to not use it for a month at least and see if it helps the shedding. Honestly, might just return it and get my money back. Absolute POS.
6. While Nutrafol's magic has not kicked in (yet), I highly recommend their hair mineral analysis which is available at no extra cost at 3 months of the subscription. The 45 min consultation was thorough and made a lot of sense to me. The doctor opened my eyes to a lot of things I was doing wrong w.r.t my supplements and other habits and suggested a better supplement regimen. Particularly, upping Ferritin levels because i'm a vegetarian. While its a hard pill to swallow (pun intended) that there are women out there who don't give a s#*t about supplements/diet and have beautiful hair, I guess it might be useful to try.
7. I wash my hair every other day now and I seem to prefer it. My previous regimen was 3 days/week, now its 4 days. Not much of a difference but it helps my scalp greasiness and keeps my scalp cleaner.
8. Tested for PCOS, it came negative. Whew!
9. I ended up not using the shower filter because a) my apartment maintenance would not fix it for me b) If the shower filter messes up the water pressure or completely blocks the flow, I don't have another bathroom to shower in. I feel like I don't smell that calcium deposit in the water that much, but that's something out of my control.

I sincerely hope my hair would go back to what it was last summer. At this point, I don't even want thicker, beautiful hair, just want my old hair before I started these so called 'treatments'. I guess i would have to accept the fact that this is my life and try to find happiness.

Good update - thank you! I no longer use the laser cap either.. won't use it ever again. Finished. I take a range of herbs (which help), wash every two days, and am having great success with the Chinese 101 hair system.. (which is poo pooed on this site along with other non traditional treatments - but I understand the reasons). As well as that, positive thinking, positive affirmations are working wonders also.. so going good! So so so glad to hear you're on a good run with it all - what a relief! Xx
 

VJ6

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Good update - thank you! I no longer use the laser cap either.. won't use it ever again. Finished. I take a range of herbs (which help), wash every two days, and am having great success with the Chinese 101 hair system.. (which is poo pooed on this site along with other non traditional treatments - but I understand the reasons). As well as that, positive thinking, positive affirmations are working wonders also.. so going good! So so so glad to hear you're on a good run with it all - what a relief! Xx

Hi Cate, good to hear from you.
I'm far from relief but some improvement is good improvement. I still have bad days just not as frequent. Good luck with your hair care!
 
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