"99% Of Men Don't Lose Hair On Dutasteride"

[buckthorn]

hmm good question......well Telogen Effluvium does not destroy the follicle so if i were you i would stay on dutasteride or finasteride and dont think about hair for the next 6~12 (hard to do i know) months... after this time reevaluate.... if it did become really bad just stop the finasteride and dutasteride..... if you really suffer Telogen Effluvium the body should recover from it as soon as you stop the 5ar inhibtion.

Good point, however, the Telogen Effluvium will not stop unless you remove the cause (finasteride / dutasteride)... so, it would stop for a couple months, then start again. Sure, you would be inhibiting 5AR, but with constant Telogen Effluvium, you would always be playing catch up.

I just don't understand why people who lose hair consistantly on finasteide, WITH the associated scalp inflammation of Telogen Effluvium, always jump to the "upregulation" or "increased T" theory... when it could simply be telogen effluvium.. NO one has been able to answer this question for me.

 

[jetlife1]

He does not!..... Pseudohermaphrodits have elevated test and elevated DHT from 5AR I..... they just lack 5ARII and that is why they never encounter hairloss. If you wipe out like 99% 5 AR II with dutasteride you should be set for life. This forum is a f*****g echochamber and some brosciene and myths here got repeated so often that people start to believe them. I have never seen somebody drop a Norwood on dutasteride..... they never ever have photos to proof that "dutasteride has eaten their hairline over night". And the infamous AR upregulation... it is just not a thing ok ? Castrated stop losing hair (and they have higher DHT levels than a dutasteride User) forever... AR upregulation does not look like a problem there does it ?

To be honest, I haven't even seen someone drop a Norwood on finasteride. I think that the people who claim they're losing hair on dutasteride or finasteride are just going through a normal shed which is part of the hair cycle and they don't wait long enough to realize that their hair will come back.

In my opinion which is backed by a lot of evidence, if you start dutasteride or finasteride with a certain amount of hair, expect to maintain/improve that hair as long as you take it.

 

[AlwaysRock]

Thank you!!!!!!!! It feels so good to to hear a voice of reason and positivty through all the BDD negativty on this forum

 

[Wave]

To be honest, I haven't even seen someone drop a Norwood on finasteride. I think that the people who claim they're losing hair on dutasteride or finasteride are just going through a normal shed which is part of the hair cycle and they don't wait long enough to realize that their hair will come back.

In my opinion which is backed by a lot of evidence, if you start dutasteride or finasteride with a certain amount of hair, expect to maintain/improve that hair as long as you take it.

This is not true. finasteride/dutasteride does lose effectiveness over time. I'm the perfect example. I still have hair, hair loss isn't noticeable, but I can see it gradually thinning out. It's not a 3 year-long shed, I can tell you that much.

 

[jetlife1]

This is not true. finasteride/dutasteride does lose effectiveness over time. I'm the perfect example. I still have hair, hair loss isn't noticeable, but I can see it gradually thinning out. It's not a 3 year-long shed, I can tell you that much.

I mean obviously there will be some exceptions because no drug is perfect, but for the majority it works well and is effective. I have a question for you.. What would you say your hair is at compared to when you started and do you use anything besides finasteride/dutasteride?

 

[Wave]

I mean obviously there will be some exceptions because no drug is perfect, but for the majority it works well and is effective. I have a question for you.. What would you say your hair is at compared to when you started and do you use anything besides finasteride/dutasteride?

I would say it's slightly worse off. Here is a link to a recent post I made: https://www.hairlosstalk.com/intera...will-work-after-8-years-on-finasteride.99871/

I've been on finasteride for 8 years, and I would be completely or nearly bald by now without it. However, it is starting to lose effectiveness. If you look at the picture in the link, my crown is starting to go slowly. I wish I had taken a picture of this before 8 years ago, but I remember it being nearly covered. Either way, I'm happy with the results, just need to extend my hair as long as possible.

 

[jetlife1]

I would say it's slightly worse off. Here is a link to a recent post I made: https://www.hairlosstalk.com/intera...will-work-after-8-years-on-finasteride.99871/

I've been on finasteride for 8 years, and I would be completely or nearly bald by now without it. However, it is starting to lose effectiveness. If you look at the picture in the link, my crown is starting to go slowly. I wish I had taken a picture of this before 8 years ago, but I remember it being nearly covered. Either way, I'm happy with the results, just need to extend my hair as long as possible.

Honestly bro your hair still looks great especially for being in your 30s. I think that changing from finasteride to dutasteride can induce a shed so stay the course and I bet it thickens up. If not, then at least it will hopefully maintain your flow. I went through a shed when I started finasteride and I'm sure starting dutasteride will cause the same. Keep us posted on how dutasteride works out and remember to be patient.

Also, your crown almost looks like a cowlick which is natural. Not sure if it is though, but def doesn't look bad at all. You really can only know for sure if it is working by looking at pics before you started because sometimes your eyes will deceive you.

 

[AlwaysRock]

Ahh the famous "i remember"...... all i see is a full head of hair with maybe a little bald spot (could also be a big cowlick)...

 

[Prada1]

Hey Guys Im on the same boat. Ive been on finas for over 8 years and it worked amazing for me. Ive mentioned many times that I even used anabolics dozens of times, so I had 10x the testosterone and other hormones and no hairloss. Last two years with no anabolics Ive lost a lot of hair. I still have a head full of hair but its thinned out. At first I thought it was just my predetermined genetic make up but now Im thinking maybe I should have gone on dutas. I think finas blocks 70% of DHT and perhaps now we are sensitive to even the remaining 30% due to our age and DNA? Or even with dutas would be a lost cause? I guess what many of us are wondering is what caused many of us to being less responsive to finasteride. Intrestingly it seems many people the average time is 10 years and I agree that without it I think I would be bald. Both my parents are thin but didn't have an aggressive version of baldness. My dad slowly but surely lost his hair over a very long time. He wasn't bald in his 20s. Im 37 and still have a head full of hair albeit thinned out.

 

[AlwaysRock]

And all studies on finasteride conclude ( damn i miss hairlosshelpguys like DecadeTwo or ahadabans) that finasteride and dutasteride becomes MORE!! efficent with time..... in the long 10 years studies even the worst responder maintained after year 5....

 

[jetlife1]

Hey Guys Im on the same boat. Ive been on finas for over 8 years and it worked amazing for me. Ive mentioned many times that I even used anabolics dozens of times, so I had 10x the testosterone and other hormones and no hairloss. Last two years with no anabolics Ive lost a lot of hair. I still have a head full of hair but its thinned out. At first I thought it was just my predetermined genetic make up but now Im thinking maybe I should have gone on dutas. I think finas blocks 70% of DHT and perhaps now we are sensitive to even the remaining 30% due to our age and DNA? Or even with dutas would be a lost cause? I guess what many of us are wondering is what caused many of us to being less responsive to finasteride. Intrestingly it seems many people the average time is 10 years and I agree that without it I think I would be bald. Both my parents are thin but didn't have an aggressive version of baldness. My dad slowly but surely lost his hair over a very long time. He wasn't bald in his 20s. Im 37 and still have a head full of hair albeit thinned out.

Now when you say thinned out are you talking about looking like Wave? Because to me that is not "thinning out" especially for guys in their late 30s. Once again a before and after pic will clear that up. I'm not saying it isn't possible that you got thinner since baseline but maybe it has to do with fluctuating androgen levels when taking anabolics. Also, it could be that the minoxidil you are using has lost some effectiveness. But I do not think it has to do with the finasteride.

finasteride actually blocks 90% of 5AR Type 2. Type 2 is the one that causes male pattern baldness and lowering it that much is on the level of pre pubescent males.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/replicels-cell-therapy-pattern-baldness-120000877.html ; here is a possible answer if you actually are thinning on finasteride

 

[kir]

.5mg daily with minoxidil is working wonders for me.

 

[kir]

haha... I was just joking. Actually, I have my masters in molecular bio with published research, so I am always one to respect legit studies. If you're losing your hair and not afraid of sides, dutasteride is definitely the way to go. People like myself become bitter, because we are the rare minority that not only do not sustain on drugs like dutasteride, but rapidly progress our Androgenetic Alopecia. finasteride definitely did it for me, as confirmed by THREE derms. I took dutasteride for only a couple months, but the EXACT scalp sensations I had while on finasteride came back - pin point burning in left temple and severe tingling and crawling in midscalp and crown.

I think what occurs in people like me is Telogen Effluvium. This was also confirmed by my derms. I just simply don't understand how more people don't get Telogen Effluvium from dutasteride. Women give birth, people have surgery, change medications, alter hormones, rapidly lose weight, etc.. there is a common occurrence of telogen effluvium. If you're on dutasteride and experience this, it would become chronic until you stop. It's happened to me and many others I have read about. I don't really know. What do you think about this @AlwaysRock? @Roberto ???

Did you ever try to up your dutasteride dosage, say 1mg or above?
If nothing works, the only thing that might work is to combine finasteride/dutasteride with Bicalutamide once a week. In theory this seems to be the most powerful approach while being the safest compared to other intense treatments. You might also want to add some minoxidil as candy. I personally won't go near this regimen.

 

[Dench57]

I just don't understand why people who lose hair consistantly on finasteide, WITH the associated scalp inflammation of Telogen Effluvium, always jump to the "upregulation" or "increased T" theory... when it could simply be telogen effluvium.. NO one has been able to answer this question for me.

The "increased T" theory is bullshit as another poster outlined. However I do think the people who get burning/itching from finasteride are people who are responding in a unique way to that drug and I don't think it's Telogen Effluvium. There are a metric fuckton of people who claim finasteride/dutasteride raped their hairline, made them shed loads or whatever, but only a few who got that burning inflammation that me, you and several others got. It's something different and more sinister imo. Unless you had the burning before finasteride? I had 0 inflammation.

I never shed anything pre/during/post finasteride despite having insane scalp pain/burn/itch this whole time. Just rapidly accelerated miniaturizing follicles which Telogen Effluvium doesn't do. And most people who have this reaction to 5ARi's also get huge spike in libido and/or increased sebum which points to increased androgen activity. That may well be increased T since it's all over the body. But the burning/itching points to androgen activity at the hair follicle. It's well known some people with male pattern baldness have these sensations. Either something fucked up with the androgen receptor or the 5AR2 enzyme itself imo.

 

[Prada1]

Now when you say thinned out are you talking about looking like Wave? Because to me that is not "thinning out" especially for guys in their late 30s. Once again a before and after pic will clear that up. I'm not saying it isn't possible that you got thinner since baseline but maybe it has to do with fluctuating androgen levels when taking anabolics. Also, it could be that the minoxidil you are using has lost some effectiveness. But I do not think it has to do with the finasteride.

finasteride actually blocks 90% of 5AR Type 2. Type 2 is the one that causes male pattern baldness and lowering it that much is on the level of pre pubescent males.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/replicels-cell-therapy-pattern-baldness-120000877.html ; here is a possible answer if you actually are thinning on finasteride

Im not sure who Wave is. My actual hairline hasn't regressed really and inherently I have so much hair that even if I lost I maybe 20-30 percent I still look "lucky". However If I were to put gel or wet my hair you could see my scalp, unlike when I was in my 20s. I noticed a regression in my hair maybe 2 years ago. Im very conscious of always looking at my hands when I wash my hair and never was there more then 5-6-7 hairs. But then I was losing 10-15 for weeks and weeks. I was so incredulous that I suspected my fina was fake or bunk. But I changed sources 2-3 times and nothing helped. It was mostly the front part of my hair that thinned out. Only thing that resorted it was 15% minoxidil twice a day. Luckily Ive hair the same hair stlylest over the last 10 years so he knows me well. He also said "man you're starting to thin in front". So yeah my hairline hasn't regressed much at all, just a little like most men over age but the density is much less. The last two years have been the worst. Again kinda weird that over the 10 years using "hair safe" anabolic with over 10 times the endogenous amounts of hormones I had no problem at all, zero. However now from 35-37 when I suppose my natural T-Levles are starting to drop and with no hormones all of a sudden I start thinning. Now I know people here have a tendency to panic or be emotional and irrational in their claims but Im for one that always believe that you have to give months and months even years to determine if a treatment is working or that its not working. In my case its been now close to 2 years. Im assuming that if Im on finas, minoxidil and nizoral that switching to dutas may block an extra 7% DHT but won't probably do much?

 

[Wolf Pack]

The better you do in year 1 with finasteride, the more indicative it is of the future prognosis. If you do well in this time frame, you have a 0.04 probability iirc of losing hair over a 10 year period (according to the 10 year study). No DHT = no baldness essentially for most of us. I've been taking finasteride for 20 odd months and the hair still improves and I know it's far from done with me yet. I expect the crown to keep improving in my 30s - mildly thin at the moment. If I got on this medication earlier I wouldn't have had to have a frontal transplant for quite a while at the very least. Taking out 90% of DHT (by inhibiting 5ARII with finasteride) is enough for most of us. DHT levels are in the castrated range and we know about the pseudohemphrodites. I might jump on dutasteride just to see if I can accelerate crown filling but there is no urgency.

The testosterone theory is crap and is always written by a guy called abcde or something. He has been on here for 11 years and never taken meds and nor has hair loss apparently.

In the end I gave up arguing about finasteride/dutasteride power with the "other group." Other group is full of paranoid folks, bald or ignorant people. Just keep taking the pill and enjoy.

 

[transam]

No DHT = no baldness essentially for most of us.

I patiently await for that day to come.

 

[buckthorn]

The better you do in year 1 with finasteride, the more indicative it is of the future prognosis. If you do well in this time frame, you have a 0.04 probability iirc of losing hair over a 10 year period (according to the 10 year study). No DHT = no baldness essentially for most of us. I've been taking finasteride for 20 odd months and the hair still improves and I know it's far from done with me yet. I expect the crown to keep improving in my 30s - mildly thin at the moment. If I got on this medication earlier I wouldn't have had to have a frontal transplant for quite a while at the very least. Taking out 90% of DHT (by inhibiting 5ARII with finasteride) is enough for most of us. DHT levels are in the castrated range and we know about the pseudohemphrodites. I might jump on dutasteride just to see if I can accelerate crown filling but there is no urgency.

The testosterone theory is crap and is always written by a guy called abcde or something. He has been on here for 11 years and never taken meds and nor has hair loss apparently.

In the end I gave up arguing about finasteride/dutasteride power with the "other group." Other group is full of paranoid folks, bald or ignorant people. Just keep taking the pill and enjoy.

Wolfpack,
What's your theory for people that RAPIDLY lose hair on finasteride? I am done with calling finasteride crap, because I am biased as hell and am trying to transition more into understanding why this happened to me. My theory, for my self at least, is that the hormonal changes induced Telogen Effluvium, that was ongoing (chronic) as long as I would take the medication.

I don't see why the possibility of finasteride causing Telogen Effluvium isn't recognized by people. Especially for those that are extremely sensitive to Telogen Effluvium, like myself, my Mother and my Brother (could be a genetic vulnerability somehow).

Women give birth - Telogen Effluvium. People have severe injury - Telogen Effluvium. Surgery - Telogen Effluvium. Anesthesia - Telogen Effluvium. Medications - Telogen Effluvium

and yet... we discount that a heavy duty hair loss medication that alter hormones can equal - Telogen Effluvium.

It's important to consider this because the medication is causing a reaction in your body that is resulting in the exact thing you took the medication to counter. AND, if this happens to you, it will continue to happen until you stop.

p.s. I am NEVER trying to scare of fear monger anyone. I am simply trying to understand why this has happened to me and why, when I hear accounts of the same symptoms in others, this possibility is rarely recognized. I will always advocate finasteride as the first line of attack in Androgenetic Alopecia.

 

[Ziggyz123]

I took and am still taking dutasteride for 11 months (finasteride 2 years before this). My hairline itches all day every day and I have scalp pimples on it as well. My hair line is dying still on dutasteride so you CAN loose you hair on it. This thread should be deleted because it's retarded. Hate when people just start making claims and haven't even tried the drug.

 

[buckthorn]

The "increased T" theory is bullshit as another poster outlined. However I do think the people who get burning/itching from finasteride are people who are responding in a unique way to that drug and I don't think it's Telogen Effluvium. There are a metric fuckton of people who claim finasteride/dutasteride raped their hairline, made them shed loads or whatever, but only a few who got that burning inflammation that me, you and several others got. It's something different and more sinister imo. Unless you had the burning before finasteride? I had 0 inflammation.

I never shed anything pre/during/post finasteride despite having insane scalp pain/burn/itch this whole time. Just rapidly accelerated miniaturizing follicles which Telogen Effluvium doesn't do. And most people who have this reaction to 5ARi's also get huge spike in libido and/or increased sebum which points to increased androgen activity. That may well be increased T since it's all over the body. But the burning/itching points to androgen activity at the hair follicle. It's well known some people with male pattern baldness have these sensations. Either something fucked up with the androgen receptor or the 5AR2 enzyme itself imo.

Good post. I still don't understand why this would discount the possibility of Telogen Effluvium though. You say you never had burning, itching, or other symptoms of inflammation before finasteride?? Well, I never had these symptoms until I had knee surgery either... three months later, and BAM - pinpoint burning in left temple, crawling and itching in midscalp and crown AND... RAPID hair loss, which was confirmed as Telogen Effluvium by three derms.

finasteride DID THE EXACT SAME THING - three-four months after I popped the first pill - burning in the EXACT same spot of left temple, crawling in the EXACT same spot. the SAME hair loss pattern (concentrated mostly through crown and left side of head, as when I had knee surgery. Once again confirmed as Telogen Effluvium from the same derms.

So... it caused it in me, no doubt. I don't know why I stuck with it, I was desperate.

You say Telogen Effluvium can't cause miniaturization, however, in a person with Androgenetic Alopecia, losing hair in general causes miniaturization, especially if your regimen isn't preventing it.

I don't know man. You and I (and several others) are in this horrible, confusing situation that seems to have no answer. I am just shocked that no one has looked into these responses to finasteride further. Perhaps finasteride coupled with another type of medication, or topical could work for us if this was more thoroughly researched???