Is retina-a and tretinoin creams the only things people like here? Any other popular retinoids? I have been using OM for 2.5m now and have yet to notice anything. But would like to take preventative measures. Taking collagen supplements and micro-needling the face before doing my scalp would probably be my go to.
@habababa42 If you are under 25 it will presumably affect your skin less as your collagen production is naturally high.
@JaneyElizabeth What depth did they use on your face, and what frequency or holes/cm^2? From what i have heard it should be different depth around different areas, curious how the clinic did it. Going to start doing it when my D2 arrives.
You think that I would have asked at the cosmetic and surgery center that I attend but I forgot. The machine that they used appeared to be certainly not a roller and I don't think that it was a pen either. It is very expensive and probably not worth the cost in a salon for most folks but I am trying most things for hair and beauty so that I can blog about them more coherently. It is also difficult when someone is using retin-A in addition to other facial treatments. It was $300 here in the DC suburbs and slightly more painful than derma-rolling my scalp or hair at home but also likely healthier but for most of us, that is just too much to spend. Recovery time for my face was much longer then when I do it facially at home and there also appeared to be more exfoliation then at home. I also did a chemically peel a couple of weeks after that for $75 and that appeared to be much less efficacious than the micro-needling.
Compared to the likely effects of botox on the masseter muscles, I would forgo salon treatment and have the masseter (chewing) muscles relaxed, which in one study indicated an improvement of 18% whatever that means. I have so many treatments and meds that it is all but impossible to tell what is working for me but it is almost certainly due to estrogen levels and before HRT due to finasteride and Min.
The results were great though but probably too subtle for a photograph even though I generally take meticulous pictures. I have a couple of bloody and I mean bloody pics from derma-rolling at home last year and it all looked much more painful than it was but it was still needlessly harsh in the short-term and along with spironolactone and Rob's harsh massage techniques probably cause a violent "benevolent" shed meaning spironolactone and the other mechanical treatments were working "too fast" cosmetically. That's why I have posted pics of the shed and the recovery.
Related to oral minoxidil, my expectation is that it begins working almost immediately on hair that we already have, while lagging six months to a year for hair regrowth at the hairline or in the crown. Most people who mention times of efficacy are talking about hair growth from slick bald or almost slick bald scalp and are not focused on the fringe areas. We also have to remember that females have up to three times or more of hair staying in the anagen phase compared to males. This in itself is likely to curtail the efficacy of any non-estrogen meds used by males as well as why "female" hair is much easier to grow long. Ultimately for me, it's the ability to grow my hair long that matters much more than actually wearing it long.
In terms of needles, I have and have used the five most common mm sizes from .75mm to 1.0 mm to 1.25 mm and then 1.5 mm. Now I am using 2.0 mm primarily based upon Rob's recommendations and bio-feedback. The 2.0 mm is better for people who still have substantial scalp coverage or longer hair or who derma-roll the entire scalp because it tangles much less in the hair.
When people ask how often, I would say one to four times per month and no more than eight times per month. Make sure that healing which usually takes 12 to 48 hrs is complete before rolling again. Derma-rolling is not a cure and it is a pain in the *** but for cis-males it is one of only a few things capable of at least temporary hair regrowth, along with finasteride/min. Derma-rolling also helps with the powerlessnss that comes from balding and not being able to do anything personally to halt it as so many guys ask if exercise will help halt balding which probably never works or if it does, not enough in terms of cosmetic improvement.
In terms of cosmetic improvement, there are essentially no treatments that appear to work for males that are non-hormonal in nature except for oral minoxidil and one hears more about oral minoxidil than one sees photographic evidence. Regular min and even together with dutasteride, rarely if ever results in cosmetic improvement but only maintenance which is still better than anything that exists going back to the late 80's when topical Rogaine came out.
