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In Discord
Topical Dutasteride Case Assessment Thread
- Thread starter FilthyFrancis
- Start date
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- 83
Yeah that's my bad.. I joined the WhatsApp but I had to download an app for discord (never heard of it before) I've probs missed some valuable info!
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I'd like to join the discord and whatsapp groups, what's the info?
Could you just summarize briefly what the conclusion was of the Discord discussion?
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Nothing yet, we have to test it and get serum DHT levels checked to come to a conclusion
https://discord.gg/2fRxHk2
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Any news, fellas?
I have an extra bottle of 1% liposomal dutasteride that can sell. I bought 3 bottles because the shipping and small discount offered by Farmacia Parati, it ended being almost the same price as 2 bottles. The expiry date on it is 01/21 and I won't be able to use it all up by then as I use it 2x/week. From Canada here. PM me if interested. Thanks.
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any results ?
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Pretty much all the talk is happening on discord now
It's definitely helped reduce the shedding. I was on topical minoxidil before but, I stopped because I wasn't sure if the minoxidil vehicle might somehow enhance the absorption of the dutasteride. I don't feel like I lost the gains I got from minoxidil but, there's been no additional growth either so, I would say this stuff works very well for maintenance.
I have an appointment with my dermatologist next month to get a blood test and see if she'll give me a script for oral minoxidil. Dr Mwamba said that a lot of patients of his and other doctors have had good results with it.
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Frequency? Percentage?
Sorry for the dumb question but would it be safe to mix 30 tablets of 0,5 mg dutasteride with 30 ml Min? Would you need another vehicle for safety? I am 4 weeks in on a daily 0,25 ml of 0,1% finasteride + min solution and seem to get sides from it. I am not sure whether to quit or try applying it every 3 days or so.
Update to my previous post and repost from the discord. This is less than perfect data and so usefulness is limited.
As a reminder a while back I used the topical dutasteride for the first time. I mistakenly applied ~4mL of 0.5% topical liposomal dutasteride immediately after a hot shower and with an open wound on my head. I experienced what seemed like side effects in the following days (ball ache, lower libido).
16 days after applying this mega dose (comparable to putting 40 Avodart capsules on my head) my serum DHT was reduced to 37 ng/dL. Relative to my "baseline" of 49 ng/dL this is a 25% decrease 16 days after the dose. This 25% decrease 16 days after the dose is compared to a ~61% serum DHT decrease when on 0.5mg daily oral finasteride. After a solid 4 weeks I was feeling great again. I assume that soon after the dose my trough serum DHT was much lower than the 37 ng/dL, and was then increasing over the subsequent 16 days, something like below:
I know definitively the two green data points based on blood tests, but I don’t know what the red data points are. What would be more useful is a follow up DHT test 24 hours after the application, then again 7 days after the application. This would give a more complete picture of the serum DHT response to the dose.
My hope/goal is to figure out a dosing concentration, amount, and frequency that will result in a response more like the red line below (grey dotted line is the mega dose for comparison). I’m hoping by applying a smaller amount and concentration every ~7-10 days I can minimize serum DHT reduction to ~10%. If I still feel like sh*t at 10% reduction oh well it was a good try!
So yesterday morning I got a full blood panel, came home and immediately applied the 1 mL of recently received 0.1% liposomal dutasteride, left it on my head for 3 hours before showering it out, then today about 24 hours after applying that dose I got a serum DHT blood test. If my schedule allows, I'll get the same DHT test next week (7 days after applying). I realize this is a pretty weak dose by comparison but at this point would rather start on the weak side and build up if the dose is tolerated. Feeling fine so far.
I'll update with results when I get them. based on discord discussion seems like everyone is different so yall won't know till you try
As a reminder a while back I used the topical dutasteride for the first time. I mistakenly applied ~4mL of 0.5% topical liposomal dutasteride immediately after a hot shower and with an open wound on my head. I experienced what seemed like side effects in the following days (ball ache, lower libido).
16 days after applying this mega dose (comparable to putting 40 Avodart capsules on my head) my serum DHT was reduced to 37 ng/dL. Relative to my "baseline" of 49 ng/dL this is a 25% decrease 16 days after the dose. This 25% decrease 16 days after the dose is compared to a ~61% serum DHT decrease when on 0.5mg daily oral finasteride. After a solid 4 weeks I was feeling great again. I assume that soon after the dose my trough serum DHT was much lower than the 37 ng/dL, and was then increasing over the subsequent 16 days, something like below:
I know definitively the two green data points based on blood tests, but I don’t know what the red data points are. What would be more useful is a follow up DHT test 24 hours after the application, then again 7 days after the application. This would give a more complete picture of the serum DHT response to the dose.
My hope/goal is to figure out a dosing concentration, amount, and frequency that will result in a response more like the red line below (grey dotted line is the mega dose for comparison). I’m hoping by applying a smaller amount and concentration every ~7-10 days I can minimize serum DHT reduction to ~10%. If I still feel like sh*t at 10% reduction oh well it was a good try!
So yesterday morning I got a full blood panel, came home and immediately applied the 1 mL of recently received 0.1% liposomal dutasteride, left it on my head for 3 hours before showering it out, then today about 24 hours after applying that dose I got a serum DHT blood test. If my schedule allows, I'll get the same DHT test next week (7 days after applying). I realize this is a pretty weak dose by comparison but at this point would rather start on the weak side and build up if the dose is tolerated. Feeling fine so far.
I'll update with results when I get them. based on discord discussion seems like everyone is different so yall won't know till you try
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YOU ARE A LEGEND
corkmeister
Established Member
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Nice analysis. A couple of remarks. If we assume that these readings give an accurate picture (dht fluctuates significantly, which is why in studies/trials, I believe they take multiple tests and average them out, something which is unrealistic for us) a 25% reduction after 16 days is still an interesting result. All things considered, it's actually a relatively low reduction.
It seems to me that, if we look at the literature (more specifically the study by Gisleskog et al), your application of 20mg on a wet scalp, with an open wound, is comparable to an oral dose somewhere between 0.2mg and 1mg. That does indeed suggest a rate of systemic absorption which is very low, at least compared to topical finasteride. Of course, we still don't know whether that also means that only a neglible part got to the follicle, but setting that aside for now.
If the result of applying 20mg is 'only' a 25% reduction after 16 days, then that may very well mean that there's a lower dose that would have only a negligible systemic effect. There's a lot of wiggle room here to further reduce the dose, and that's exactly what you're using by reducing the dose 20-fold for your next experiment.
I have a bottle of liposomal dutasteride sitting next to me and I'm currently trying to arrange bloodtests before and after application (it's a hassle where I'm from). I'm still sort of on the fence but I think I may have seen enough at this point to justify trying it myself. I'm debating the correct dosage to go with but am leaning towards 2.5mg.
This is awesome, thanks for sharing this.
I would advice to apply it after showring over night and not removing after 3 hours
I don't think your levels would have been much different at day 1 or day 16 considering the half life of the drug but the curve would have been more. I am glad to hear you felt great after 4 weeks.
My DHT right now is 350 ng/dl. I also have Topical dutasteride 0.1% here so will perform the same test again (I have done it about 4 times with the same results).
I am holding off on the test as I contacted a laboratory able to perform high liquid chromatography so I can measure circulating androgens on the scalp with RU58841 vs CB 8% vs Topical dutasteride.
I would advice to apply it after showring over night and not removing after 3 hours
I don't think your levels would have been much different at day 1 or day 16 considering the half life of the drug but the curve would have been more. I am glad to hear you felt great after 4 weeks.
My DHT right now is 350 ng/dl. I also have Topical dutasteride 0.1% here so will perform the same test again (I have done it about 4 times with the same results).
I am holding off on the test as I contacted a laboratory able to perform high liquid chromatography so I can measure circulating androgens on the scalp with RU58841 vs CB 8% vs Topical dutasteride.
corkmeister
Established Member
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When considering single doses of dutasteride the half-life is not as long as you might think. If we take 1 mg orally:
You can see a clear difference between day 1 and 16, for example. Given what we know about dutasteride, it is not conceivable that his dht levels dropped by 25%, and stayed there for 16 days. I do not think there is a dose which would realistically achieve this. The drop itself would have to be more significant in order to stay constant for that long.
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whats ur baseline dht again ?
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It seems that my sides have disappeared from switching from topical finasteride to topical dutasteride 0.05. By sides, I mean my brain fog has cleared. Now I just hope it works.
Someone asked if what im using is liposomal but I cant tell from the bottle as it doesn't say. Its from Murray pharmacy and its compounded with 5% min.
Someone asked if what im using is liposomal but I cant tell from the bottle as it doesn't say. Its from Murray pharmacy and its compounded with 5% min.
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Can you send the ingredients? I could tell
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Im considering mesotherapy myself. However I have doubts. Looking at the literature, there aren't many case studies on this. We've got some study with a small sample but good results:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5596657/
I would like to understand how they got good results with such a tiny dose? We are talking 1ml intradermal injection every 3 months, at a dose of 0.01%. That, compared to the oral regimen, is tiny. That's basically a dose of 2 0.5mg pills at once every 3 months. The half life of dutasteride may be longer when delivered intradermally?
I have access to a clinic that is willing to inject me once a month, and I will try to convince them to inject at least 2ml. Overall clinics are pretty ignorant in this field, it's a novel treatment, im just making sure they have the right dosages. There's not too much margin of movements since we don't have much literature on this. Im in France but you should be able to find these treatments in many European countries now, not sure about the US.
Is no one here exploring this route? Seems interesting. The molecular weight of dutasteride isn't too big to work in traditional topical vehicles? this could solve this. However like I said before, I have my doubts about such small dosages working... at least judging by the pic on that study it did, however, im not sure how, like I said, and assuming it's legit.