Theory: Cooked Fat =DHT(Dihydrotestosterone) Baldness

[docj077]

Yeah for some reason messing up your hormones with propecia is the most effective way to stop male pattern baldness as of today. I still have a hard time believing science knows enough to alter the hormones of anyone and say what the consequences will be.

What is really funny about this thread is that drugs like finasteride and dutasteride actually cause a hormonal imbalance through their mechanism of action. A 10% or higher increase in testosterone with a subsequent mild increase in estrogens, I believe. However, this "hormonal imbalance" actually regrows hair...even when it's sustained for years.

 

[DammitLetMeIn]

What is really funny about this thread is that drugs like finasteride and dutasteride actually cause a hormonal imbalance through their mechanism of action. A 10% or higher increase in testosterone with a subsequent mild increase in estrogens, I believe. However, this "hormonal imbalance" actually regrows hair...even when it's sustained for years.

Yes but its not natural balance. Neither is eating a high-carb diet which raises insulin levels and lowers SHBG so that it allows dht to act on tissues.

 

[docj077]

What is really funny about this thread is that drugs like finasteride and dutasteride actually cause a hormonal imbalance through their mechanism of action. A 10% or higher increase in testosterone with a subsequent mild increase in estrogens, I believe. However, this "hormonal imbalance" actually regrows hair...even when it's sustained for years.

Yes but its not natural balance. Neither is eating a high-carb diet which raises insulin levels and lowers SHBG so that it allows dht to act on tissues.

How does a high carb diet lower SHBG? What is the molecular mechanism for this claim?

 

[DammitLetMeIn]

What is really funny about this thread is that drugs like finasteride and dutasteride actually cause a hormonal imbalance through their mechanism of action. A 10% or higher increase in testosterone with a subsequent mild increase in estrogens, I believe. However, this "hormonal imbalance" actually regrows hair...even when it's sustained for years.

Yes but its not natural balance. Neither is eating a high-carb diet which raises insulin levels and lowers SHBG so that it allows dht to act on tissues.

How does a high carb diet lower SHBG? What is the molecular mechanism for this claim?

High glycemic carbs increase insulin levels which lower SHBG

 

[docj077]

What is really funny about this thread is that drugs like finasteride and dutasteride actually cause a hormonal imbalance through their mechanism of action. A 10% or higher increase in testosterone with a subsequent mild increase in estrogens, I believe. However, this "hormonal imbalance" actually regrows hair...even when it's sustained for years.

Yes but its not natural balance. Neither is eating a high-carb diet which raises insulin levels and lowers SHBG so that it allows dht to act on tissues.

How does a high carb diet lower SHBG? What is the molecular mechanism for this claim?

High glycemic carbs increase insulin levels which lower SHBG

But, how to high insulin levels lower SHBG?

 

[DammitLetMeIn]

But, how to high insulin levels lower SHBG?

I need a minute to find the precise mechanism but here is a medical study which confirms it is true:

http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/conten ... /79/4/1173

Edit: Insulin prevents the synthesis of SHBG

 

[docj077]

But, how to high insulin levels lower SHBG?

I need a minute to find the precise mechanism but here is a medical study which confirms it is true:

http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/conten ... /79/4/1173

Edit: Insulin prevents the synthesis of SHBG

How?

 

[DammitLetMeIn]

How?

Well from the medical articles I've just been reading, the precise inner-body mechanism is not known. Although, most of what I've read states that it inhibits SHBG production in the liver.(however, i've only been searching for 5 mins)

But I did find this which states:

In vitro, insulin is a potent inhibitor of SHBG production by HepG2 cells, and reduces the stimulatory effect of 17B(?)Estradiol and thyroxine.

http://www.eje-online.org/cgi/reprint/143/1/85.pdf

 

[SkylineGTR]

so why isnt every hypoglycemic bald?

 

[DammitLetMeIn]

so why isnt every hypoglycemic bald?

Of those who have the male pattern baldness gene. I would contend that many many of them are.

However, other macronutrients can increase SHBG which may serve to negate the decrease in SHBG.

Edit: also, as male pattern baldness is a gradual process, it would not be presumptious to suggest that one may hypothetically have to be hyperinsulemic for perhaps a considerable period

 

[SkylineGTR]

actually my g/f is hypoglycemic.. my best friend is also... i know many that are. I see diabetics and hypoglycemics nightly. I can tell you still its completely random.

 

[DammitLetMeIn]

actually my g/f is hypoglycemic.. my best friend is also... i know many that are. I see diabetics and hypoglycemics nightly. I can tell you still its completely random.

Well, what is not random is that balding men have lower levels of SHBG. Thats proven.

 

[docj077]

actually my g/f is hypoglycemic.. my best friend is also... i know many that are. I see diabetics and hypoglycemics nightly. I can tell you still its completely random.

Well, what is not random is that balding men have lower levels of SHBG. Thats proven.

It's not proven that all balding men have lower SHBG levels, however. What you said is simply not true.

 

[SkylineGTR]

But then in theory when the levels return to normal then so would the hair?

Seeing that males and females have the similar levels of SHBG until puberty males are predispositioned to have lower levels of it anyway because of our increased testosterone. Estrogen raises levels while testosterone lowers levels.

Insulin levels do effect it yes but until you get to the degree of very advanced diabetes or advanced hypo/hyperglycemia I doubt its significant enough. Otherwise they would all be balding ... or anyone with hypothyroidism also which is not the case.

Or in turn everyone that is balding would have hypoglycemia and hypothyroidism which is also not the case.

 

[DammitLetMeIn]

It's not proven that all balding men have lower SHBG levels, however. What you said is simply not true.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/quer ... med_docsum

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/quer ... med_docsum

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/quer ... med_docsum

http://www.pakmedinet.com/view.php?id=8008

Theres four and i've barely scratched the surface. I think its safe to say subnormal levels of SHBG occur in the vast majority of cases of male pattern baldness.

 

[DammitLetMeIn]

But then in theory when the levels return to normal then so would the hair?.

Not if the follicles have been destroyed. But short of this, then yes, in theory they would.

Seeing that males and females have the similar levels of SHBG until puberty males are predispositioned to have lower levels of it anyway because of our increased testosterone. Estrogen raises levels while testosterone lowers levels..

I'm not sure about this. source?

Insulin levels do effect it yes but until you get to the degree of very advanced diabetes or advanced hypo/hyperglycemia I doubt its significant enough. Otherwise they would all be balding ... or anyone with hypothyroidism also which is not the case..

Well, they would need the male pattern baldness gene to begin with. Also, they would need to be hyperinsulemic for a considerable period of time. Moreover, just because they are hypoglycemic it doesn't necessarily mean their SHBG levels are high if they are consuming other foods in a ratio which raise SHBG levels.

Or in turn everyone that is balding would have hypoglycemia and hypothyroidism which is also not the case.

I would contend that for many people the insulin level may not have to be raised that high for SHBG to be decreased. We are all different.

 

[abcdefg]

Its kind of funny that finasteride is more then 10 years old. We really dont know much more then what studies on finasteride told us back then. Everything since then has just been small studies that dont unquestionably prove anything.

 

[SkylineGTR]

http://www.dpcweb.com/medical/reproduct ... /shbg.html

 

[docj077]

It's not proven that all balding men have lower SHBG levels, however. What you said is simply not true.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/quer ... med_docsum

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/quer ... med_docsum

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/quer ... med_docsum

http://www.pakmedinet.com/view.php?id=8008

Theres four and i've barely scratched the surface. I think its safe to say subnormal levels of SHBG occur in the vast majority of cases of male pattern baldness.

Poor sampling size and no external or internal validity taint every article that you posted. Simple, small studies simply demonstrate an idea. They don't prove a theory.

 

[SkylineGTR]

i think its funny his first reference concludes genetics and polycystic ovary syndrome.

the second and third and fourth just say male equivalent of polycystic ovary syndrome.

Only one referenced insulin but but none showed the actual test data and was vague as hell.

It still didn't prove anything other then saying low SHBG levels but it didn't even say there was a control or comparison to what was the "normal" levels. Or the percent differences. Because ALL that were tested were NW2 or worse from what it said.