Stopping Frontal Loss

VoRteX

Established Member
Reaction score
1
I would highly recommend 5% spironolactone cream from Dr. Lee.

It will give almost total blockage of DHT at the hairline. You only have to use a very small amount smeared across your hairline border once or twice a day. I would shy away from the 12.5 Xandrox until you try the spironolactone cream since a massive dose of minoxidil could cause a massive shed.

I have a very high hairline naturally so I cant afford to lose any more. Thats why I use the spironolactone cream on my hairline. I use the 2% spironolactone in my diffuse areas since the cream is impossible to get under hair.
 

zak84

Established Member
Reaction score
0
why would you put your faith in minoxidil OVER propecia? propecia has been shown to have a higher success rate in both regrowth and stopping shedding
 

bombscience

Senior Member
Reaction score
7
zak84 said:
why would you put your faith in minoxidil OVER propecia? propecia has been shown to have a higher success rate in both regrowth and stopping shedding

Not in the frontal areas. minoxidil will promote the regrowth in the frontal areas, but Propecia has a low success ratre up front.

Vortex, thanks, I'm going to order some spironolactone today.
 

zak84

Established Member
Reaction score
0
bombscience said:
Not in the frontal areas. minoxidil will promote the regrowth in the frontal areas, but Propecia has a low success ratre up front.

Vortex, thanks, I'm going to order some spironolactone today.

says who? every study ive ever seen has not said "minoxidil grows more hair than propecia", can you show me any proof that minoxidil is grows more hair than propecia (anywhere) - cause i can show you proof propecia grows more hair than minoxidil

not to mention minoxidil is "supposed" to be used on the vertex, not on the front
 

bombscience

Senior Member
Reaction score
7
I know that finasteride is more effective on the vertex of the scalp, and less effective as you move towards the frontal hairline.

The reason I put more faith in minoxidil for frontal preservation is because you have many cases where it has helped or even regrown temple hair back.
 
G

Guest

Guest
bombscience said:
I know that finasteride is more effective on the vertex of the scalp, and less effective as you move towards the frontal hairline.

The reason I put more faith in minoxidil for frontal preservation is because you have many cases where it has helped or even regrown temple hair back.

Why argue or choose? Use them both, and spironolactone too. Best chance for frontal growth as far as I can see.

:rockon:
 

Bryan

Senior Member
Staff member
Reaction score
42
zak84 said:
bombscience said:
Not in the frontal areas. minoxidil will promote the regrowth in the frontal areas, but Propecia has a low success ratre up front.

Vortex, thanks, I'm going to order some spironolactone today.

says who? every study ive ever seen has not said "minoxidil grows more hair than propecia", can you show me any proof that minoxidil is grows more hair than propecia (anywhere)...

Have you ever compared haircount increases from both minoxidil and finasteride studies? _I_ have, a whole bunch of 'em. And minoxidil beats out finasteride rather consistently in that regard.

zak84 said:
- cause i can show you proof propecia grows more hair than minoxidil

Show it to me!

zak84 said:
not to mention minoxidil is "supposed" to be used on the vertex, not on the front

Those are just FDA regulations. minoxidil was only officially tested at the vertex, so that's all the FDA allows in the way of label claims. But it definitely works at the front, just not as well as at the back (like every other treatment).

Bryan
 

zak84

Established Member
Reaction score
0
after re-reading what i said, i made a wording mistake, what i meant to imply is that propecia has a higher percentage of men who regrow hair than minoxidil (atleast rogaine, some versions of minoxidil maybe worse than rogaine) those percentages are 66% for propecia and 55% for rogaine, if you still need me to show you that i will

I_ have, a whole bunch of 'em. And minoxidil beats out finasteride rather consistently in that regard.

ok post them
 

Bryan

Senior Member
Staff member
Reaction score
42
zak84 said:
after re-reading what i said, i made a wording mistake, what i meant to imply is that propecia has a higher percentage of men who regrow hair than minoxidil (atleast rogaine, some versions of minoxidil maybe worse than rogaine) those percentages are 66% for propecia and 55% for rogaine, if you still need me to show you that i will

{SHRUG}
I'm not even sure what "percentage of men who regrow hair" is supposed to mean, in precise terms! :lol: I suggest that you stick with HARD data, like hair-counts and hair-weights. When you use those clearly-defined measurements, you'll see that Rogaine has better numbers.

I_ have, a whole bunch of 'em. And minoxidil beats out finasteride rather consistently in that regard.

zak84 said:
ok post them

Ok, here's something I posted on all the hairloss sites about a year ago. It's a comparison of finasteride, dutasteride, and topical minoxidil hair-counts. It has the references to the medical literature at the end. Read it and enjoy!


Topical minoxidil hair-counts vs. dutasteride hair-counts: a modest comparison...

For quite some time now, I've been telling people that from my reading of various topical minoxidil studies and finasteride studies, it appears that minoxidil is more effective at stimulating regrowth than finasteride; an obvious question nowadays would be: where does the very long-awaited dutasteride fit into the grand scheme of things? We have some good data from the dutasteride phase II trial, so does it finally surpass what Rogaine can do? I decided to look at the data from every topical minoxidil study in my collection and make an objective comparison! Since the only reported data in the dutasteride trial were the hair-counts, I could only use minoxidil studies that also reported hair-counts, to get any kind of meaningful comparison; and there are exactly six of them in my collection.

I've given the full citations to the studies at the very end of this post, in case anyone wants to double-check my figures and computations. As I'm reporting the numbers for each one, I'll just refer to them as (1) through (6)...again, you can check at the end to see the full reference. The minoxidil studies lasted for varying lengths of time like 4 months, 6 months, and 12 months, while the Glaxo finasteride and dutasteride trial lasted only for six months; to compensate for that, I've specified the actual length of each individual trial, and then calculated the hair-count increase PER MONTH, for fairness. Also, all hair-counts are standardized to the familiar 1-inch circular test spot on the scalp. Ok...all set? Here we go:

(The Glaxo trial of finasteride and dutasteride)

Finasteride... +72 hairs, six months (12.0 hairs/month)
Dutasteride... +108 hairs, six months (18.0 hairs/month)


(All the following are the topical minoxidil studies)

(1) 2% minoxidil... +425 hairs, 12 months (35.4 hairs/month)
Also: 3% minoxidil... +372 hairs, 12 months (31.0 hairs/month)

(2) 2% minoxidil... +273.4 NONVELLUS hairs, 12 months (22.8 hairs/month)

(3) 2% minoxidil... +101 TERMINAL hairs, 13 months (7.8 terminal hairs/month)

(4) 1% minoxidil... +149 hairs, 6 months (24.8 hairs/month)
Also: 2% minoxidil... +175 hairs, 6 months (29.2 hairs/month)

(5) 2% minoxidil... +233.8 hairs, 12 months (19.5 hairs/month)

(6) 2% minoxidil... +151 hairs, 4 months (37.8 hairs/month)
Also: 2% minoxidil... +324 hairs, 12 months (27 hairs/month)
Also: 3% minoxidil... +166 hairs, 4 months (41.5 hairs/month)
Also: 3% minoxidil... +338 hairs, 12 months (28.2 hairs/month)


There you have all the data! Averaging all the topical minoxidil data shows an average hair-count increase of +25.1 hairs per month (for that study #6, I'm using just the 12-month data), whereas dutasteride only managed a hair-count increase of +18.0 hairs per month! Finasteride brings up the rear at only +12.0 hairs per month! Summarizing the data is very simple and elegant: dutasteride generates about 50% more regrowth than finasteride (we've been saying that for a long time), and topical minoxidil generates about 50% more regrowth than dutasteride, according to all these studies! And here's a small but important detail: the minoxidil hair-counts are actually a little UNDERestimated, because the numbers reported for studies #2 and #3 were for nonvellus and terminal hairs, respectively. Factoring in TOTAL hair-counts (which weren't reported in those two studies) would make regrowth from topical minoxidil even more impressive.

Bottom line: as I've been saying for a long time, dutasteride is a fine new addition to our weaponry, but it should be considered a potent agent to inhibit the balding process itself, and not really something that's going to stimulate a lot of extra regrowth. For that, you'll have to use a complete program that addresses all the known angles that we've been talking about, like minoxidil, SODs, etc. By no means is dutasteride all by itself any kind of ultimate "cure" for balding; at least, not if any serious regrowth is one of your goals. But if all you need to do is maintain, then it should be an outstanding new drug for you, even by itself.

Bryan


(1) "Topical Minoxidil in Early Androgenetic Alopecia", Kreindler et al, J Am Acad Dermatol 1987;16:718-24.

(2) "Five-Year Follow-Up of Men With Androgenetic Alopecia Treated With Topical Minoxidil", Olsen et al, J Am Acad Dermatol 1990;22:643-6.

(3) "Duration of Minoxidil Therapy to Yield Maximum Benefit", [Letter] Rietschel et al, Arch Dermatol 1988;124:1569-70.

(4) "Dose-Response Study of Topical Minoxidil in Male Pattern Baldness", Olsen et al, J Am Acad Dermatol 15:30-37, 1986.

(5) "Topical Minoxidil Therapy for Androgenetic Alopecia", Koperski et al, Arch Dermatol 1987;123:1483-1487.

(6) "Topical Minoxidil in Early Male Pattern Baldness", Olsen et al, J Am Acad Dermatol 13:185-192, 1985.
 

zak84

Established Member
Reaction score
0
i dont mean to undermine you but you can give a "reputable" website and/or book that matches those statements?
 

Bryan

Senior Member
Staff member
Reaction score
42
zak84 said:
i dont mean to undermine you but you can give a "reputable" website and/or book that matches those statements?

I'm not sure what you mean. I gave the full citations for the peer-reviewed medical journal studies where all that data came from. Feel free to double-check those numbers for yourself!

Bryan
 
Top