Questions From A Would-be To The Pros

[smoothieoperator]

Hi,

I'm looking into getting a hair system. My hair is rapidly getting worse on account of me stopping Minoxidil 3.5 months ago after using 1.5 years. I have been losing hair all over for approximately a month and it's driving me insane. Here's hoping that what it's all temporary telogen hair loss, but on the off chance it isn't, I want to have a hair system at the ready.

I've been lurking this forum for a couple of weeks now, and I've noticed that there are some really experienced and helpful posters (most prominently Noah and BaldBearded). I have a couple of questions for you guys, if you have the time, and anyone else who would be gracious enough to share some of your wisdom with a hopeless hopeful.

I'd like to know the following:
1) Is it possible to live an active life-style with a thinskin system? One of the two salons I've consulted (Non-UK European country, there's not an abundance of hair system salons here) only does thinskins and I don't want to rule them out just yet.
2) Is it possible to attach thinskin systems with tape? I saw Noah talking against this, but again, one of the salons I consulted said that it's okay.
3) It seems that going all-tape instead of all-glue or even mix of glue and tape bonding is the most time-efficient solution. Would you agree with this?
4) I really want to style my hair down, i.e. with a covered hairline. Similar to the pictures 3-4 Noah linked to a thread a couple of days ago (titled something like styles for a professional in 20s) BUT perhaps even shorter. Do you think this is doable?

Thank you in advance for any and all in-put you can give to me: happy to see that there's a supportive community if I decide to go the system route!

Best,

Smoothieoperator

 

[Noah]

Hi Smoothie

I had a similar experience myself - started finasteride, got sides, stopped finasteride, hair fell out in ruinous handfuls. I hope it is telegenic in your case.

As to your questions:

1) Is it possible to live an active life-style with a thinskin system? One of the two salons I've consulted (Non-UK European country, there's not an abundance of hair system salons here) only does thinskins and I don't want to rule them out just yet.

Yes; it's just less comfortable. The system itself is probably even more secure, because generally skin systems are attached by a whole-scalp glue bond. But if you sweat the moisture gets trapped under the system, which I find uncomfortable. It doesn't seem to affect the stability of the unit though.

2) Is it possible to attach thinskin systems with tape? I saw Noah talking against this, but again, one of the salons I consulted said that it's okay.

You're right; some people do it. I guess it probably depends on how thin the "skin" is. I still think it would be risky to use tape on the thinner grades of skin base, because you could tear the base when you take the system off your head, or when you take the old tape off your system. With lace, you can drip alcohol through the mesh onto the surface of the tape which is sticking to the system, and break the bond. Because skin bases are impermeable, you can't do that, so you are pulling the tape off the base while the adhesive is still operating at full strength. Having said that, I think it is safe to be guided by whoever is selling you the system. They should know what adhesives are suitable.

3) It seems that going all-tape instead of all-glue or even mix of glue and tape bonding is the most time-efficient solution. Would you agree with this?

Yes, it is the most convenient and the strongest. However (1) tape doesn't give the best most undetectable hairline, so it is not suitable for a hairstyle which exposes the hairline; (2) skin bases tend to make a "plastic bag" noise when you scratch them, unless the whole surface of the base is attached. If you just use a perimeter tape bond on a skin piece you will get that issue; and (3) there is the danger of tears if the skin is one of the finer grades (see above).

4) I really want to style my hair down, i.e. with a covered hairline. Similar to the pictures 3-4 Noah linked to a thread a couple of days ago (titled something like styles for a professional in 20s) BUT perhaps even shorter. Do you think this is doable?

Definitely. That's a good style for use with a system.

Noah

 

[smoothieoperator]

Thanks for the quick reply Noah. I'm seriously impressed by your knowledge and selfless attitude. To be honest, I've been feeling very depressed this past month, bordering on self-destructive. It's reassuring to me that there is a way to live with hair on your head, despite being bald. And that there is a community out there.

On another note, I read on reddit that there was a user who was seriously let down after he got a hair system, because he noticed that his hair doesn't grow straight down, but rather as a whorl from his crown. I have the same thing going on. Do you think this will be an obstacle for getting a hair system?

Thanks again.

 

[Hair Newbie]

1) Is it possible to live an active life-style with a thinskin system? One of the two salons I've consulted (Non-UK European country, there's not an abundance of hair system salons here) only does thinskins and I don't want to rule them out just yet.

I wear thinskin (UTS) and French Lace. I consider myself an active person. I do a lot of outdoor sports and go to gym regularly.

2) Is it possible to attach thinskin systems with tape? I saw Noah talking against this, but again, one of the salons I consulted said that it's okay.

Definitely you can. I've experimenting using tape on the thin skin. I can't tell much difference between using tape or glue. Both gives me the same felt that the hair is growing from the scalp.

3) It seems that going all-tape instead of all-glue or even mix of glue and tape bonding is the most time-efficient solution. Would you agree with this?

Short term wearing (2-3 days):
For lace base: I prefer Walker 1522 tape because the clear up is so much easier. Just peel it off the tapes from the base without leaving any residue.

For thin skin: I prefer to use Got2b gel because it only take few minutes to rinse off the gel from the skin base without getting the hair wet.

Long term wearing (7-10+ days):
For lace base: I use walker waterproof lace front blue tape , very strong tape that can hold for few weeks. The down side is take more time to clear up and it might leave a lot of residue on the lace.

For skin base: I use either Esha Absolute Adhesive or Walker Ultra Hold (both are waterproof). I like to use tape around the perimeter on both side and leave 1 inch open gap on the back of the system for ventilation.

4) I really want to style my hair down, i.e. with a covered hairline. Similar to the pictures 3-4 Noah linked to a thread a couple of days ago (titled something like styles for a professional in 20s) BUT perhaps even shorter. Do you think this is doable?

Totally doable, hair system is pretty much same as my own hair, I can do any styles I want.

 

[smoothieoperator]

Wow! Thanks for the great advice Hair Newbie. That ventilation idea for thin skin is genius. As an active person, how often do you clean your thinskin system?

 

[Hair Newbie]

Wow! Thanks for the great advice Hair Newbie. That ventilation idea for thin skin is genius. As an active person, how often do you clean your thinskin system?

I started wearing lace base system 8 months ago. l wore it for 10-14 days using walker lace front tape and ultra hold when I first started which is fine for me. After discovered how easy using Got2B gel (black tube)along with skin system , l do the re-attach every 2-3 days. lt only take few minutes to clean the skin base and few minutes attached. If I have a weekend camping trip, I will wear it for more days with stronger glue.

 

[Hair Newbie]

Hi Smoothie

You're right; some people do it. I guess it probably depends on how thin the "skin" is. I still think it would be risky to use tape on the thinner grades of skin base, because you could tear the base when you take the system off your head, or when you take the old tape off your system. With lace, you can drip alcohol through the mesh onto the surface of the tape which is sticking to the system, and break the bond. Because skin bases are impermeable, you can't do that, so you are pulling the tape off the base while the adhesive is still operating at full strength. Having said that, I think it is safe to be guided by whoever is selling you the system. They should know what adhesives are suitable.

Noah

Agreed with @Noah. If you are using strong tape like Walker Front Lace tape for skin base it can be very easy tear off the skin base when you remove it. They are very difficult to remove even on the lace base. I use mild tape like Walker 1522 which is very easy to remove with a 91% Isopropyl Alcohol. The tapes left on my scalp instead of the skin base when I removed the system.

 

[Noah]

Using Got2Be is a great idea if you wear a skin unit. I think that is what I would do if I wore one regularly.

Hair Newbie: have you ever experienced problems with the system (attached with Got2Be) loosening because of heavy sweating? For example, could you use it at the gym?

"I like to use tape around the perimeter on both side and leave 1 inch open gap on the back of the system for ventilation."

I think it would be more drainage than ventilation in my case .

"there was a user who was seriously let down after he got a hair system, because he noticed that his hair doesn't grow straight down, but rather as a whorl from his crown."

I'm not sure I understand, Smoothie. Is his complaint that his natural hair has a swirl at the crown, but his hair system doesn't? If you order a custom hairpiece you can specify that you want a crown swirl, and you can say where you want it to be, and what direction you want the hair to go in around the swirl. A lot of people don't bother, but it is a nice touch of realism. The same with a parting, if you wear your hair with a definite parting.

 

[Hair Newbie]

Using Got2Be is a great idea if you wear a skin unit. I think that is what I would do if I wore one regularly.

Hair Newbie: have you ever experienced problems with the system (attached with Got2Be) loosening because of heavy sweating? For example, could you use it at the gym?

"I like to use tape around the perimeter on both side and leave 1 inch open gap on the back of the system for ventilation."

I think it would be more drainage than ventilation in my case .

I'm doing a full head bond with Got2b on skinbase almost everyday now and my morning routine show as below:
1. Spray water on the hairline and comb hair back.
2. Flip the HS up side down on the mannequin head
3. Wipe the skin base with 91% alcohol
4. Apply a small amount of Got2b gel on the skin surface.
5. Spread them out and apply it as thin as possible

I find the best way to achieve maximum hold by applying a very thin layer of the gel and wait 2.5 minute until the gel is almost completely dry, I will have a good stronger hold for 2-3 days (if I don't do any exercise). These is just me so it might not work out on other people. I don't know why thinner or less Got2b is better?

6. 2 minute brush teeth time while waiting Got2b dry up.
7. Spray a mist of 91% alcohol on the skin base for positioning.
8. Attachment.
9. Style hair and ready to go out.

The above procedure take about less than 15 minute. When I used to have my bio hair, I spend at least 30-45 minute doing my hair every morning so HS really save me a lot of time. People said wait 24 hours later to do an exercises after attachment but I go to the gym an hour later to start running on the treadmill or elliptical. My forehead started dripping sweat like waterfalls after 15-20 mins running uphill on the treadmill and I usually run about 45 mins so you can imagine how much sweat coming down on my face. Yes, the bond is slowly breaking down or maybe less sticky but the HS still holding on my scalp nice and tight. When I done with the cardio. I do 30 to 45 mins weight training exercise, handstand for stretching. By the time I done, my sweat is all dry up and surprisingly the got2b is bond on my scalp nice and tight again like before I walk into the gym. I shower (use shower cap to cover up the HS) and leave the gym without doing any hairline touch up. The hair system still stay on my scalp nice and tight next morning. I go to the gym next day doing the same routine and I can feel the bond is weaker than the first day but it didn't give me any trouble. When I remove the whole system on the second day at night, I have to use small amount of force to peel the system off from my scalp without using any solvent to remove it. I just use cold water rinse the skin base to wash off all the gel without getting the hair wet. It only take about few mins to do that.

One time I was sweating like crazy in a motorcycle helmet (That day was over 90F/ 33C). I can feel the bond is breaking down badly when I removed the helmet. Fortunately, the weather here in the west coast is pretty dry so I just wait few minutes late and then the hair system feel nice and tight on my scalp again. If I use walker 1522 tape or Esh glue that day it won't have any issue. I think if I live in the humid countries or States like New Orleans or Southeast Asia , Got2B is not going to work out for those humidity climate countries.

 

[smoothieoperator]

I'm not sure I understand, Smoothie. Is his complaint that his natural hair has a swirl at the crown, but his hair system doesn't? If you order a custom hairpiece you can specify that you want a crown swirl, and you can say where you want it to be, and what direction you want the hair to go in around the swirl. A lot of people don't bother, but it is a nice touch of realism. The same with a parting, if you wear your hair with a definite parting.

Yes that was exactly his issue. Also perhaps that for him there wasn't a clear part, which made the system he ordered stand out from his biological hair. You can read his post and make your own assessment of his issues here.

As for myself, I think I'm going to order a stock pieces from one of the sites you guys recommended. Might actually order two: one with the color I think might be right and one in blond so a salon can color it and my bio hair if my color judgement is way off. @Noah and @Hair Newbie, do you think the latter is a viable option?

 

[Noah]

So the system was "nearly indistinguishable" from his own hair, was comfortable, secure, had a "perfect" hairline, and he had paid top dollar for it, but he threw it away and buzzed his head because the crown didn't have the same swirl pattern as his natural hair? Words fail me. Achhh.

I doubt one person in 10 million is aware of what his acquaintances' crown swirls look like, or whether they have them at all. But the fact is a hair system can "account for genetic randomness and entropy" (not to sound pretentious or anything), but you have to design it to do so. You can have the hair knotted and ventilated any way you want - but you have to ask. If you are expecting the manufacturer to work it out from your DNA then you are in for a disappointment, for sure. I'm glad he's a biologist, and not developing atomic weaponry.

Returning to the real world: for your colour match, why don't you send the supplier a small sample of your natural hair and ask them to send you the closest matching stockie they have?

 

[smoothieoperator]

Again, thank you very much for your insight Noah. I agree that it was a bit silly. Also, I think he committed the deadly sin of thinking a little too much of what others may think of him wearing a hair system. As with many things, throwing away what is essentially conditioned shame can really set you free (now I have to apologize for sounding pretentious).

Might I ask one more question? As far as top-of-the-line suppliers go, really the best of the best, is there any particular one you might recommend? I've heard of Cesare Ragazzi, but I'm not really sure. I'm looking to get the Hollywood / Pavel Durov level of hair system, if I choose to go down that route. I'm willing to travel across Europe if need be.

 

[BaldBearded]

Again, thank you very much for your insight Noah. I agree that it was a bit silly. Also, I think he committed the deadly sin of thinking a little too much of what others may think of him wearing a hair system. As with many things, throwing away what is essentially conditioned shame can really set you free (now I have to apologize for sounding pretentious).

Might I ask one more question? As far as top-of-the-line suppliers go, really the best of the best, is there any particular one you might recommend? I've heard of Cesare Ragazzi, but I'm not really sure. I'm looking to get the Hollywood / Pavel Durov level of hair system, if I choose to go down that route. I'm willing to travel across Europe if need be.

I will PM you.

 

[Noah]

PM from me too.

 

[Hair Newbie]

As for myself, I think I'm going to order a stock pieces from one of the sites you guys recommended. Might actually order two: one with the color I think might be right and one in blond so a salon can color it and my bio hair if my color judgement is way off. @Noah and @Hair Newbie, do you think the latter is a viable option?

If you have a hairdresser cut the hair system for you. You can buy from any suppliers.