My Armani consultation, pretty good price... Few Questions..

[gr0]

Both my consultations were with a rep.

I was told 0.8 punch is gonna be used for extraction.

I've been doing a lot of reading on survival rate on fue, it's always pointing to 90% to 95%, feller is the only one saying it's 70% to 80% from an article I read, still waiting to get a reply from feller or someone working for him.

About the session time or number of grafts in one session... I figure this would really depend on the ammount/skill of people assisting the Doctor. I forgot to ask the rep how long the session is going to be and how many people are going to be working on me. The rep is currently checking alvi and sara armini's schedules to see what dates they have available for me, so I'm waiting to hear back from him and I'll be sure to ask those questions when I do.

oxymoron can you ask how many people are going to be assisting Dr. Cole for comparison.

 

[oxymoron]

Both my consultations were with a rep.

I was told 0.8 punch is gonna be used for extraction.

I've been doing a lot of reading on survival rate on fue, it's always pointing to 90% to 95%, feller is the only one saying it's 70% to 80% from an article I read, still waiting to get a reply from feller or someone working for him.

About the session time or number of grafts in one session... I figure this would really depend on the ammount/skill of people assisting the Doctor. I forgot to ask the rep how long the session is going to be and how many people are going to be working on me. The rep is currently checking alvi and sara armini's schedules to see what dates they have available for me, so I'm waiting to hear back from him and I'll be sure to ask those questions when I do.

oxymoron can you ask how many people are going to be assisting Dr. Cole for comparison.

When I was talking to Michelle last week, she explained it would be Cole doing the extraction and incisions with a couple techs doing "most" of the placement under his supervision. I've got a few other questions so I'll bring that up again to verify.

 

[gr0]

I was just reading a bit on cole`s site about available grafts using FUE. It`s a bit complicated the way it`s explained but if I`m understanding this correctly he`s claiming 10,030

The total available donor area in Follicular Unit Extraction (FUE) and Follicular Isolation Technique (CIT/FIT) expands from 11,830 potential follicular groups or units to 17,000 potential follicular units from scalp hair alone. This is an increase of 144% more potential total scalp donor area. If the same 59% of the follicles are removed on the average patient, the potential donor reserves soar to over 10,030 potential grafts in the average patient.

full thing here
http://www.forhair.com/fit_new3.htm

so at least it`s not just armani claiming 10K...

 

[oxymoron]

I was just reading a bit on cole`s site about available grafts using FUE. It`s a bit complicated the way it`s explained but if I`m understanding this correctly he`s claiming 10,030

The total available donor area in Follicular Unit Extraction (FUE) and Follicular Isolation Technique (CIT/FIT) expands from 11,830 potential follicular groups or units to 17,000 potential follicular units from scalp hair alone. This is an increase of 144% more potential total scalp donor area. If the same 59% of the follicles are removed on the average patient, the potential donor reserves soar to over 10,030 potential grafts in the average patient.

full thing here
http://www.forhair.com/fit_new3.htm

so at least it`s not just armani claiming 10K...

Uhh....
Are you talking about when he says avg scalp harvesting...
confused. Doctors claiming more than 1k grafts a day is the discussion?

 

[gr0]

yeah I was talking about available donor grafts for havesting there. It was being discussed earlier in this thread.

The main questions I'm looking to get answers for in this thread are...
How many grafts are available with FUE?
What is the graft survival rate with FUE?
How is it possible for Armani to do so many grafts in one session?

I'll ask the latter to the rep next time I talk to him

 

[s.a.f]

How is it possible for Armani to do so many grafts in one session?

I'd like to hear the answer to that one, it could explain the recent poor results from him.
Feller never estimates more than 1000 FUE grafts in a 1 day session, but usually manages 1000 - 1300. He says that patient characteristics play a huge role in how easy/difficult it is to extract the grafts. So for Armani (or one of his reps) to be promising 4/5000 seems abit dodgy.

 

[gr0]

on the last consultation the rep said 3400 maximum in 1 session, tough on the first consultation he did quote me a session for 3560 grafts.

So yeah it`s a little shady, but it`s not 5000 for sure.

 

[Petchsky]

Had a quick look but didn't see anything about when you are thinking of getting the work done? any ideas or are you open?

 

[gr0]

Had a quick look but didn't see anything about when you are thinking of getting the work done? any ideas or are you open?

Around Christmas time for sure since I get 2 weeks off work.

 

[HT55]

I have been talking with Dr. Cole in Atlanta and finally set up an 1000 graft fue for the end of Nov. I show up at 8am and leave at 7pm. In that time frame, which includes a pre-op walk through, he would only be able to perform 1500 grafts (but w/ me he's doin 1000). That is all that he feels is feasable in one day. I'm not sure if he would guarantee it but he claims 95% survival minimum. From what I understand he's a very reputable hair transplant surgeon.

95% is high for FUE but since he is taking all day to do 1K grafts vs Armani doing 3K plus I be Coles odds are much better

I'm guessing you need hairline work ?

Actually crown only. My top is thin but screw it... it happens. I've got a very bizarre hairloss pattern so i'm going for 1000+ just to even it out. I'll attach a pic. Looking down from the back, I need to fill in high left and also lower center. I actually don't mind the thinning, I just want it to look natural
Clearly it would take more than 1000 grafts to fill that sucker in though

Why not fill it all in ?

 

[HT55]

yeah I was talking about available donor grafts for havesting there. It was being discussed earlier in this thread.

The main questions I'm looking to get answers for in this thread are...
How many grafts are available with FUE?
What is the graft survival rate with FUE?
How is it possible for Armani to do so many grafts in one session?

I'll ask the latter to the rep next time I talk to him

Well those reps are questionalble to say the least especially Shane.

Anyhow grafts available vary from person to person

show me a link to the 90-95% MEGA FUe survival rates

Aramni and his clan claim things no other dR does as far as FUE survival

As I tolds you before I heard many times Armani is using some sort of motorized device to extract FUE

 

[HT55]

full thing here
http://www.forhair.com/fit_new3.htm

so at least it`s not just armani claiming 10K...

No Armani has made claims of 15K and even 20K


10 bucks says that $5 graft rate is for cancellation.

I would be very carefull with Armani. As the other poster said he has had a lot of poor results lately and has lowered his prices quite a bit.

You need to post these questions on hair loss help

 

[gr0]

Well those reps are questionalble to say the least especially Shane.

Anyhow grafts available vary from person to person

show me a link to the 90-95% MEGA FUe survival rates

Aramni and his clan claim things no other dR does as far as FUE survival

As I tolds you before I heard many times Armani is using some sort of motorized device to extract FUE

according to oxymoron cole is claiming 95% aswell, I found this site with a good comparison chart. http://www.truedorin.com/follicular_extraction.php
claims 1 to 5 percent extraction damage.


I can`t seem to be able to login on the new hairlosshelp forum I`ve been doing a lot of reading tough, there`s a few happy armani patients and a ton of haters. That board is a little outta hand don`t you think? it seems everyone is there just to criticize armani with no apparent reason. Where are all these poor results pictures? All the pictures I`ve seen are pretty good. do the bad ones get removed?

I read this whole thread here and it`s just ridiculous.
http://hairlosshelp.com/FORUMS/messagev ... adid=79324


This is another good example
http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/mess ... adid=77266
look how ugly that thread turned , everybody assumed the worst when the photos went down briefly Pretty good results for that guy for 7 months too, crown is lacking but still early I guess.

If you got any good threads for me to read pls post. About cancellation rate, I don`t believe so, the first consultation was back in may and I got the same prices.

 

[HT55]

Is cole performing 3,000 + FUE grafts per session and gettting a 95% survival rate ?

You seem to have your mind made up which I think is funny since a thread next to this one has a guy who had 4K fue with Armani and nothing grew.


To answer your question yes the people who have bad hair transplant's from Armani and need repair always seem to vanish. My Guess is it's a condition of th touchup that you don't post on the forums anymore.

There is a reason all those people are on Armani's case, They have made ridiculas claims in the past and never back them up.

IMO you are too young for your amount of hair loss to have a transplant with anyone.

 

[HT55]

according to oxymoron cole is claiming 95% aswell, I found this site with a good comparison chart. http://www.truedorin.com/follicular_extraction.php
claims 1 to 5 percent extraction damage.

Yes the 1 - 5 % is for EXTRACTION damage. That means those grafts have no chance of growing. The actaul survival rate for FUE has not been calculated yet according to this site. It also says 400 - 1500 grafts per session


ü Rates of follicle damage during extraction may vary from 1 – 5%

ü Extraction survival rates not yet documented

 

[Devender]

I think you would be better off with strip. It's cheaper, and easier if doing a big session. You can normally get up to 4/5000 grafts done in a session. Also go on another consultation with another clinic, this is not something you want to rush in to doing.

Check out there forums for transplants http://www.pb-hair.co.uk/forums/ http://www.hairlosshelp.com

wtf!!!! why should he go for strip? Thats crazy advise. He is going to get his crown filled in. FUE and bht is the way to go in that area.

 

[gr0]

Yeah i think strip is a no no for me. Even when I had a full head of hair I always shaved it to #1.

I really don`t know what to think about armani anymore, I`m seeing a lot of good results, but then there`s all the negativity...

I was reading BHR Clinic (Dr. ********) posts on HLH and his take on fue on their website.
http://www.bhrclinic.com/html/fue.htm

They really make a lot of sense, about the number of available grafts, and average hair count on grafts determining if a FUE procedure is gonna yield good results or not.

Maybe this is why Armani`s are hit and miss because he is not doing any testing and performs it on anybody.

I wanna do their FUE test, too bad they`re all the way in Brussels, I wonder if Feller is doing a similar test, filled up the contact form on the website twice , no one got back to me...

 

[Petchsky]

I think you would be better off with strip. It's cheaper, and easier if doing a big session. You can normally get up to 4/5000 grafts done in a session. Also go on another consultation with another clinic, this is not something you want to rush in to doing.

Check out there forums for transplants http://www.pb-hair.co.uk/forums/ http://www.hairlosshelp.com

wtf!!!! why should he go for strip? Thats crazy advise. He is going to get his crown filled in. FUE and bht is the way to go in that area.

It's not crazy advise at all, as it happens Strip is a no go for gr0 as he mentioned, but strip is still the number one method, and most Docs will say that the immediate future is strip and FUE combined, at least until FUE techniques improve. And i know you are a big proponent of BHT, but that is also still in it's infancy.

FUE is obviously most people's first choice, as who really wants a thin scar at the back of their heed, but extraction techniques are still being perfected.

 

[HT55]

I would call Feller's office, maybe he is having an email issue or is out of town. I would definitly consult with him before making a decision as he does both FUE and strip


As far as you wanting to shave down to a #1 with your extensive hair loss at such a young age I would probably wait until you are at least 30 before getting a hair transplant. You do know Donor hair is limited correct ?


There is no doubt FUE will take more grafts to give the same density as Strip. FUE in the crown will take a lot more grafts than strip to provide the same coverage.

Here ia pretty good Armani thread to look at. Notice how the poster lost my swagger talks about all the unhappy Armani patients who just disappear

http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/mess ... erthread=y


Don't forget alot of the Armain results you see on the internet are from his strip surgery or from a combo of Strip and FUE ( Aramni reps Pats205 and Shane who both had strip andFUE)


BTW I just pm'd an Armani rep I worked with and that $5 graft is DEFINITLTY for a last minute cancellation rate as it's $7 graft for the for 2,000

 

[gr0]

Hey guys been a while since I posted. I`ve been talking to a rep from dr. ********`s clinic in belgium and pretty much got all my questions answered. Very professional and honest. I am seriously considering them, very close to confirming the procedure. Going for 4000 strip + 1500 fue

one thing that is boggling my mind, I believe Dr. Bisanaga was trained my Dr. Cole. (read this on hlh) From my consultation with Dr.B i was told 4000 FU can be extracted maximum with FUE , they`re only extracting 30% of the donor grafts to keep the area from looking moth eaten. and to get maximum of my donor area strip and fue combination is best, just like most people been saying on the forums anyways.

now I`m doing an online consult with cole as well, I send my photos and I get a reply with a quote for 2000-3000 grafts. dates available in Christmas and some tiny discount if I choose those dates. Really pushing for a sale very unprofessional, anyways I replied back with a few questions...

What is the difference between FUE CIT and FIT?[***** wrote:] The difference is the instruments used and the technique/training

The 2000-3000 Grafts quoted is going to be done with what procedure?[***** wrote:] Dr. Cole does the CIT extraction method… with his own instruments

What density is the 2000-3000 going to give me in terms of FU per cm2?[***** wrote:] Dr. Cole does 35-40 per cm2

Other doctors have estimated 4000 - 5500 grafts to achieve full coverage with good density, how come Dr. Cole estimate is so low?[***** wrote:] Dr. Cole cherry picks the exact grafts he needs to use where… he only transplants intact follicular units and he does not dense pack

How much grafts can you typically harvest in total? My donor density is around 70/cm2[***** wrote:] The average person has about 7000 grafts

Which harvesting technique will provide the most grafts?[***** wrote:] We believe that FUE/FIT/CIT since you can harvest the entire donor area

With FUE what percentage per square cm of the donor area can you extract wihtout leaving the donor area looking moth eaten?[***** wrote:] well about 30-40

How long would the 2000-3000 session be and how many people will be assisting Dr. Cole?[***** wrote:] 2-3 days… he has 5 techs that are highly skilled and trained by him… they have been with him for years.

I have two whorls in the crown, the one on the left is clockwise and the one on the right is counter clockwise. I have attached a photo and highlighted them. Is this going to cause any complications in the placement? Am I going to keep the whorls?[***** wrote:] Dr. Cole will follow the natural growth of the hair

Can you have Dr. Cole draw a hairline on one of the photos I have sent previously?[***** wrote:] he prefers that you draw the hairline you want and then he will give you his recommendation

I`m really confused now as how could dr.b who was apparently trained by dr. cole has such a different opinion/approach . I`m really having a hard time believing anything that the dr.cole rep said, I`m not even sure dr.cole even seen my photos maybe i`m just dealing with a salesperson on a commission, that draw your own hairline really threw me off. also I got the reply within minutes of asking those questions and it does look kinda rushed the way it`s worded.

oxymoron did you ever go through with your procedure? how was your experience? how much did he cover with the 1000 grafts?

also I tried contacting feller a couple of more times , no reply.
waiting for hasson and wong to reply as well, got confirmation that they`re reviewing my photos.


1 thing that are really on my mind is the strip scar width... ******** is claiming 1 - 2 mm and it can be covered by #2 guard. that is not so bad I can live with a #2 , but I want to hear opinions from ppl that had a strip with the trichophytic closure... what`s the width of the scar? and what`s the shortest you had your hair with out the scar being visible

another thing , I ended up buying a digital microscope during my consultation with dr.b to measure the density of the donor area. , really cool piece of technology and I`m keeping it till I do the procedure so I can look at the progress. here`s a photo of the donor area at 80x