If Wounding Works, Why Do Most People Experience Shock Loss With Hair Transplants

[Badbald]

I thought this was a big enough and undiscussed subject to create a dedicated thread.

Im sure it must have been spoke about before but I cant find anything in depth.

For those who do not know, when you get a a hair transplant most people experience "shock loss" where many of the existing surrounding hairs fall out due to the trauma caused by the wounding of the hair thats penetrated in. It really is the ultimate form of dermastamping when you think about it, a super deep wound that directly goes in-between any exiting hairs so to not disrupt whats already there.

The shock loss is really emphasised by many surgeons so the patients are not surprised when their hair looks way worse for many months following the FUT/FUE they call it the ugly duckling phase. So my question is why would this create the complete reverse of what we think wounding should give.

I want this new emergence of wounding to continue as its looking very bleak once again heading into 2019 but this is the strongest argument I can see against the positive effects of wounding.

When you think about it hair transplant surgeons are the best people to ask when it comes to their opinions on puncturing the scalp and whether it would cause regrowth as they do it all day everyday sometimes on 3 or more patients each day. Collectively they would have a huge amount of data with results, and would know about averaging "responders" to "non responders" ive never heard of someone getting a hair transplant and growing hair before the transplanted hairs start as what is theorised in the wounding studies. the transplanted hair can take a year to see especially when its on the crown so if any regrowth did happen it would begin before the transplanted hair.

I know some peoples argument against this is well its only one wounding session but remember thats a very, very deep session and one would think it would create far more of these up regulating hormones, proteins etc then we could do from needling. Also just because it is one session it dosent mean the results would go the complete opposite way by causing the hair to fall.


Thoughts?

 

[INT]

"If wounding works, then why does blowing your head off with a shotgun not grow hair?"

 

[disfiguredyoungman]

"If wounding works, then why does blowing your head off with a shotgun not grow hair?"

Have you tried it? This will be my ultimate regimen..

 

[Badbald]

"If wounding works, then why does blowing your head off with a shotgun not grow hair?"

Because thats exactly the same thing as the wounding caused from a hair transplant

 

[disfiguredyoungman]

Because thats exactly the same thing as the wounding caused from a hair transplant

Neither is wounding with a dermapen and FUE incisions, that's the point.

 

[Francesco17]

I'm confused. Hair lost to shock loss regrows in the end?
Anyway, as far as I know needling and transplanting are not comparable procedures

 

[INT]

Because thats exactly the same thing as the wounding caused from a hair transplant

You do see the irony in your comment, right?

 

[justlol@you]

Because thats exactly the same thing as the wounding caused from a hair transplant

Are you also so stupid as to suggest that if i run you through with a bowie knife that is functionally the same as knicking yourself while shaving, simply because both produce cutaneous wounds?

 

[thickhaironhead]

Neither is wounding with a dermapen and FUE incisions, that's the point.

Nor is falling head first into the fire like the old man did. After this he had alot of hair growing out on the scalp.
https://www.hishairclinic.com/my-ha...ere-anything-that-can-reverse-this-hair-loss/

 

[disfiguredyoungman]

Nor is falling head first into the fire like the old man did. After this he had alot of hair growing out on the scalp.
https://www.hishairclinic.com/my-ha...ere-anything-that-can-reverse-this-hair-loss/

is difficult to imagine many hair loss sufferers volunteering to plunge their scalps into a fire to see if their hair grows back!

They obviously have never visited this forum. Anybody got more on this story?
All burn victims I know lost their hair and stayed bald.

 

[JonnyGo]

They obviously have never visited this forum. Anybody got more on this story?
All burn victims I know lost their hair and stayed bald.

I remember reading that story. I think the guy who sustained the injuries didn’t go to hospital to get it treated and decided to let it heal on its own. I’m not really sure though and I could be wrong but that would kinda make sense as to why he regrew hair and other burn victims didn’t.

 

[thickhaironhead]

They obviously have never visited this forum. Anybody got more on this story?
All burn victims I know lost their hair and stayed bald.

There is not only one way of getting burned, prob not many cases of people falling in the fire with the head first in burning coal, so letting fire burn the skin, no it will not grow hair. But yeah glowing coal to the skin may be a another story.
https://i.imgur.com/BlXwLEV.jpg

 

[disfiguredyoungman]

There is not only one way of getting burned, prob not many cases of people falling in the fire with the head first in burning coal, so letting fire burn the skin no it will nott grow hair. But yeah glowing coal to the skin may be a another story.
https://i.imgur.com/BlXwLEV.jpg

Meh not slick bald, not the whole scalp was burned...dodgy photos.

 

[thickhaironhead]

Meh not slick bald, not the whole scalp was burned...dodgy photos.

However the point was that the burned scalp showed hair generation and most importantly, not only where he was burned but all over his head from what we can see in the photos down below.
From this: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/core/lw/2.0/html/tileshop_pmc/tileshop_pmc_inline.html?title=Click on image to zoom&p=PMC3&id=1351889_bmjcred00266-0059-c.jpg
to this: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/core/lw/2.0/html/tileshop_pmc/tileshop_pmc_inline.html?title=Click on image to zoom&p=PMC3&id=1351889_bmjcred00266-0059-e.jpg

Thats pretty good.

 

[couldntthinkofaname]

There is not only one way of getting burned, prob not many cases of people falling in the fire with the head first in burning coal, so letting fire burn the skin, no it will not grow hair. But yeah glowing coal to the skin may be a another story.
https://i.imgur.com/BlXwLEV.jpg

damn better density in the front than most implants

did they hairs fall out again or stayed?

 

[That Guy]

 

[Badbald]

Your all not really thinking about this correctly, the implant stage of a hair transplant is minute puncturing of the scalp many times, this is the similarity to dermastamping. Quite different to what you are comparing it to, "but a hair transplant is different to dermastamping" is an obvious statement and a very simplistic way of thinking about things, your telling me you know the exact differences placing a small hair follicle within the wound has on neogenesis has itself? you dont and I doubt would even the top scientists within the field because its never been studied.

Try to look beyond the obvious and think more about how the puncturing/wounding of the scalp itself is what is said to cause the shock loss not anything to do with the hair follicles themselves. If you haven't already then watch a video on an FUE and look at the implanting stage to see how its similar, once again this is whats said to cause the loss.

 

[2young2retire]

Hair that is lost due to shock loss, is hair that is at resting phase. The exact same hair will most of the times come back stronger in the anagen phase. After all, Fue is a fair good amount of wounding. Dermarolling will also cause shock loss to your thinning, catagen phase hair. If you create a new blood supply network with dermarolling and angiogenesis (and maintain it), then most probably, this shock loss lost hair will come back in the anagen phase. This happens to transplant subjects too along with the implants from their donor. Now think for a while. All this procedure has countless variables (DHT , stress hormones, transaction rate, % of fibrotic recipient tissue prior to implants, etc). There is no model for an answer. I am sorry.

I thought this was a big enough and undiscussed subject to create a dedicated thread.

Im sure it must have been spoke about before but I cant find anything in depth.

For those who do not know, when you get a a hair transplant most people experience "shock loss" where many of the existing surrounding hairs fall out due to the trauma caused by the wounding of the hair thats penetrated in. It really is the ultimate form of dermastamping when you think about it, a super deep wound that directly goes in-between any exiting hairs so to not disrupt whats already there.

The shock loss is really emphasised by many surgeons so the patients are not surprised when their hair looks way worse for many months following the FUT/FUE they call it the ugly duckling phase. So my question is why would this create the complete reverse of what we think wounding should give.

I want this new emergence of wounding to continue as its looking very bleak once again heading into 2019 but this is the strongest argument I can see against the positive effects of wounding.

When you think about it hair transplant surgeons are the best people to ask when it comes to their opinions on puncturing the scalp and whether it would cause regrowth as they do it all day everyday sometimes on 3 or more patients each day. Collectively they would have a huge amount of data with results, and would know about averaging "responders" to "non responders" ive never heard of someone getting a hair transplant and growing hair before the transplanted hairs start as what is theorised in the wounding studies. the transplanted hair can take a year to see especially when its on the crown so if any regrowth did happen it would begin before the transplanted hair.

I know some peoples argument against this is well its only one wounding session but remember thats a very, very deep session and one would think it would create far more of these up regulating hormones, proteins etc then we could do from needling. Also just because it is one session it dosent mean the results would go the complete opposite way by causing the hair to fall.


Thoughts?