How Long Until A Non-dht Blocker Halt To Hair Loss?

pegasus2

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@c_super2 no offense..and I'm saying this in the nicest way possible...but ur kinda stupid lol, don't get Replicel mixed up with Tsuji. They are different potential cures. Replicel is still scheduled to most likely be released in Japan in 2018. When asked to prove your source for your assumption of Replicel being released in 2020...u posted the source that dealt with talk about Tsuji...and then you admitted you were wrong but then again said something misleading by saying Replicel "definitely wont be out by 2018 according to the source". The source you provided us discusses Tsuji.......

My source: http://replicel.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/RP_FS_Q2.pdf

That was uncalled for. Maybe he just doesn't keep with this stuff the way you do. It's easy to forget what's what for people who only skim the forums occasionally.

Your right though, next year is the target for Replicel/Shiseido. I can hardly believe it's just one year until we finally, hopefully get a cure.
 

supersaiyannorwood6+

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That was uncalled for. Maybe he just doesn't keep with this stuff the way you do. It's easy to forget what's what for people who only skim the forums occasionally.

Your right though, next year is the target for Replicel/Shiseido. I can hardly believe it's just one year until we finally, hopefully get a cure.

I don't think it was uncalled for, because regardless if he doesn't know....its wrong and a disservice to people who read this forum, to spread misinformation. When a person spreads false information, and other people read that persons post...the people who read the persons post will have wrong information and so on and so forth. I simply checked the dude and said "in the nicest way possible". Also, I didn't dislike his post, I just corrected his belief, so everyone else wouldn't be confused. I can't wait for Replicel to be released in Japan next year and potentially give us a maintenance treatment.
 

pegasus2

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I don't think it was uncalled for, because regardless if he doesn't know....its wrong and a disservice to people who read this forum, to spread misinformation. When a person spreads false information, and other people read that persons post...the people who read the persons post will have wrong information and so on and so forth. I simply checked the dude and said "in the nicest way possible". Also, I didn't dislike his post, I just corrected his belief, so everyone else wouldn't be confused. I can't wait for Replicel to be released in Japan next year and potentially give us a maintenance treatment.
You could've done it without insulting him. That's all I took issue with.
 

That Guy

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I'm honestly quite surprised when people say "2020 is forever away!" or something to that effect.

Like, I'm 25 and still talk to a few highschool friends and someone will start the story of "Do you remember when, in X teacher's class..." and then we're all like "Holy shitballs, that was 10 years ago now!"

Time flies — two years is nothing.
 

Netsky

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2 years in hair loss terms i quite a lot really though. BTW replicel/Sheishedo definitely works right? We're just waiting on a release date ?
 

Spanishboy97

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Hello everyone, I'm new in the forum, although I've reading you for a few couple of months now. I just saw a tweet from the CEO of Replicel in which he said that phase II hasn't started yet, and the tweet is from April. I don't know if that is news to anyone, but if they haven't started phase I don't know how the hell they are marketing it in 2018. Anyone can coment on that? @That Guy I notice you know your sh*t around here ;)
 

Scrappy

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I'm honestly quite surprised when people say "2020 is forever away!" or something to that effect.

Like, I'm 25 and still talk to a few highschool friends and someone will start the story of "Do you remember when, in X teacher's class..." and then we're all like "Holy shitballs, that was 10 years ago now!"

Time flies — two years is nothing.
Two years seems like nothing when you're 25, but I'm more than ten years older than you.
 

SamFT

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Hello everyone, I'm new in the forum, although I've reading you for a few couple of months now. I just saw a tweet from the CEO of Replicel in which he said that phase II hasn't started yet, and the tweet is from April. I don't know if that is news to anyone, but if they haven't started phase I don't know how the hell they are marketing it in 2018. Anyone can coment on that? @That Guy I notice you know your sh*t around here ;)
Replicel hasn't stared their Phase ll personally I don't give a damn that they haven't cause if the release date was up to this company we would see this out in 2030 lol
Shiseido is doing a Trial right now and the treatment would be out in 2018 through Shiseido not Replicel
 

That Guy

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2 years in hair loss terms i quite a lot really though. BTW replicel/Sheishedo definitely works right? We're just waiting on a release date ?

To summarize:

The Phase I results of RepliCel saw an overall stabilization of hairloss in all patients treated to protocol, but exactly how much density the patients wound up with varied widely. So it works, but optimizing it for consistent density improvement across the board is the next step.

Shiseido's Phase II will be multiple injections at set intervals rather than the single, high-dose injection that patients were given in Phase I, which is really concerned with safety above all else

Hello everyone, I'm new in the forum, although I've reading you for a few couple of months now. I just saw a tweet from the CEO of Replicel in which he said that phase II hasn't started yet, and the tweet is from April. I don't know if that is news to anyone, but if they haven't started phase I don't know how the hell they are marketing it in 2018. Anyone can coment on that? @That Guy I notice you know your sh*t around here ;)

This is a common point of confusion because in 2013, RepliCel licensed their hair tech to Shiseido, a Japanese cosmetics firm who began a Phase II trial in July of 2016.

Replicel themselves have completed Phase I, but a point of contention between the two companies is that RepliCel hasn't begun their own Phase II trial as per the deal; Shiseido was/is expecting that data to better and further their own research.
 

Spanishboy97

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To summarize:

The Phase I results of RepliCel saw an overall stabilization of hairloss in all patients treated to protocol, but exactly how much density the patients wound up with varied widely. So it works, but optimizing it for consistent density improvement across the board is the next step.

Shiseido's Phase II will be multiple injections at set intervals rather than the single, high-dose injection that patients were given in Phase I, which is really concerned with safety above all else



This is a common point of confusion because in 2013, RepliCel licensed their hair tech to Shiseido, a Japanese cosmetics firm who began a Phase II trial in July of 2016.

Replicel themselves have completed Phase I, but a point of contention between the two companies is that RepliCel hasn't begun their own Phase II trial as per the deal; Shiseido was/is expecting that data to better and further their own research.
Yeah, it is kinda confusing, so we know the data from replicel phase one, but do we actually know anything about sisheido's own investigation? And also, even if sisheido releases RCH-01 in Japan in 2018 (hopefully), they only have the license to do so in Asia. I assume in Europe and the US we'll have to wait for Replicel to complete phase two and three in order to get the FDA approval, and you guys are saying that right now for some reason they wanna delay everything as much as they can (?). Am I right? f***. This doesn't seem like a close deal at all.
 

Abelibano

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I dont really know why but we,older members seem to ignore one very simple but crucial detail.HAS THE PRODUCT REACHED PHASE III?
If YES then you have serious chances you see a decent product in 2-3 years.
If NOT don't hold your breath.It will take 4-5 years in best case scenario (=it makes it to phase III)
I was looking at some statistics though and many drugs fail even in Phase III
 

That Guy

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Didn't Shiseido and Replicel have a problem getting cultured cells to grow hair? Has it been fixed or how are they performing the trials? Sorry for my ignorance but haven't been browsing these forums for long yet.

This is a different process with somewhat different goals. Dermal sheath cup cells are isolated from the dermal papilla, multiplied and then put back into the scalp with the goal of their migration to thinning hair and bestowing them with the properties of the balding resistant hair. It is also hoped that this could give rise to new follicles entirely, but we'll have to see.

What you're thinking of is an issue regarding hair multiplication in vitro for the purpose of transplantation into humans. Riken aims to actually multiply primordial hair follicles and inject them. The problem is that it requires both epithelial and mesenchymal stem cells, but epithelial cells cannot be multiplied infinitely while retaining their hair-inducing properties; you must multiply both in equal, high quantities. However, there is much ongoing research on this and in the interview they did with hairlosstalk, they said that recent research has shown them potential solutions to it and they recently stated that they are still on track to begin human trials in 2019.

Other methods, like TissUse by my understanding, use a different approach and as such may or may not face that issue.

Yeah, it is kinda confusing, so we know the data from replicel phase one, but do we actually know anything about sisheido's own investigation? And also, even if sisheido releases RCH-01 in Japan in 2018 (hopefully), they only have the license to do so in Asia. I assume in Europe and the US we'll have to wait for Replicel to complete phase two and three in order to get the FDA approval, and you guys are saying that right now for some reason they wanna delay everything as much as they can (?). Am I right? f***. This doesn't seem like a close deal at all.

Japan's revamped stem cell and regenerative medicine laws allow for conditional market approval after 2 phases instead of 3 so long as the product is safe and has efficacy. Recently, the US adopted a somewhat similar law called the "21st century cures act" and in some statements from Lee Buckler, RepliCel does plan to leverage that if they can. As a result, Shiseido could release the product late next year or soon after depending on results and what they decide to do.

There is also the matter that most countries accept foreign data up to some extent and this appears to have happened when Shiseido licensed the technology. However, there are literally hundreds of pages in every country's version of the "FDA" as to what things they accept and what must be done on in their own country. As far as I know, in Canada anyway, foreign data is accepted on drugs and medical devices provided X,Y, Z protocols were followed but I'm not sure what their stance is if it involves cells.

Shiseido's treatment will NEVER leave East Asia, as they have an exclusive license for that continent and that continent alone. So if you wanted that before 2020, it's a pretty safe bet that you'll have to fly to Japan. However, depending what North America and Europe accept for foreign data and laws like the 21st Century Cures Act (or if Trump gets his way with the FDA lol), it may not be too long after.
 

Spanishboy97

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This is a different process with somewhat different goals. Dermal sheath cup cells are isolated from the dermal papilla, multiplied and then put back into the scalp with the goal of their migration to thinning hair and bestowing them with the properties of the balding resistant hair. It is also hoped that this could give rise to new follicles entirely, but we'll have to see.

What you're thinking of is an issue regarding hair multiplication in vitro for the purpose of transplantation into humans. Riken aims to actually multiply primordial hair follicles and inject them. The problem is that it requires both epithelial and mesenchymal stem cells, but epithelial cells cannot be multiplied infinitely while retaining their hair-inducing properties; you must multiply both in equal, high quantities. However, there is much ongoing research on this and in the interview they did with hairlosstalk, they said that recent research has shown them potential solutions to it and they recently stated that they are still on track to begin human trials in 2019.

Other methods, like TissUse by my understanding, use a different approach and as such may or may not face that issueI

Japan's revamped stem cell and regenerative medicine laws allow for conditional market approval after 2 phases instead of 3 so long as the product is safe and has efficacy. Recently, the US adopted a somewhat similar law called the "21st century cures act" and in some statements from Lee Buckler, RepliCel does plan to leverage that if they can. As a result, Shiseido could release the product late next year or soon after depending on results and what they decide to do.

There is also the matter that most countries accept foreign data up to some extent and this appears to have happened when Shiseido licensed the technology. However, there are literally hundreds of pages in every country's version of the "FDA" as to what things they accept and what must be done on in their own country. As far as I know, in Canada anyway, foreign data is accepted on drugs and medical devices provided X,Y, Z protocols were followed but I'm not sure what their stance is if it involves cells.

Shiseido's treatment will NEVER leave East Asia, as they have an exclusive license for that continent and that continent alone. So if you wanted that before 2020, it's a pretty safe bet that you'll have to fly to Japan. However, depending what North America and Europe accept for foreign data and laws like the 21st Century Cures Act (or if Trump gets his way with the FDA lol), it may not be too long after.
I knew that in Japan you only need 2 phases, but has sisheido started phase 2 already? The 21st century act allows for this kind of treatment to only go through 2 phases to hit the market? The only travel with waiting is that I imagine that treatment will require a week or two of injections and Japan is not precisely a cheap place to stay.
Hey men, I just wanna say that you are doing tremendous job in this forum giving good information. Keep it up because I'm sure that there is a lot of people just like me who read the blog even if they don't comment and your clearance against the negative "broscience" is been a bless to us.
 

Afro_Vacancy

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How much will Replicel and Shiseido's treatment cost?
 

Afro_Vacancy

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$1000, at least that was said in some articles.

That sounds like production cost and not manufacturing cost.

But if it's that much, I'll buy a $2,000 ticket to Tokyo.

If it comes out in the same few-month interval as Histogen in Mexico, which would you recommend spending money and time on?

The way I see my treatment progressing, best case scenario:

By January 2018, Brotzu comes out. For 3 months I add it to my current treatment putting it on at night whereas my current treatment is in the morning. After 3 months I withdraw my current treatment.

Mid 2018, go get histogen or recplicel.

ETA: By manufacturing cost I meant consumer cost.
 
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MomoGee

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By January 2018, Brotzu comes out. For 3 months I add it to my current treatment putting it on at night whereas my current treatment is in the morning. After 3 months I withdraw my current treatment.
Link? Didn't the message on the fidia website say "by 2018". That could be any time within 2018 not January.
 
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