Hair is not Life but it's Pretty Damn Close; HRT and Pictorial Posts Prove it.

[JaneyElizabeth]

This is so interesting. The 80s were awesome (even though I wasn't even born yet lol).

I really have enjoyed sort of proceeding through the history of baldness cures. Every time you try a new one, you have that anticipation that this is going to be the thing that finally does it and most of the ones I have used, sort of worked so I never gave up and kept trying and people on HairLossTalk.com are really not folks to ever give up which is one of the great human characteristics as detailed by Camus in The Myth of Sisyphus.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Responses to my Testing Results on Reddit:

It would seem that the consensus is that I need to start tapering down. Damn, I just bought ten tubes of Estrogel

I will be using it more sparingly. The goal is always to be able to simply take pills in the long run once I feel that I have reached my hair and body and facial feminization goals. It's as though, okay, seven years in and I see a chick looking back at me and what do I do with her now that's she's fully formed. The hair aspect has driven so much of this. I remain strictly chickly in terms of sexual preference so that hasn't changed for any cis-guys with that concern.

https://www.reddit.com/r/AskMtFHRT/comments/ko4ro6

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Seborrhoeic Dermatitis continues to me to appear to be a significant part of the hair loss puzzle. Speaking of being puzzled, as I find some dermatitis on my nose when I have essentially zero testosterone. It might be linked to the oral minoxidil but I am uncertain. I am now establishing a firm dosage of oral minoxidil at 12.5 mg which is found at the .25 ml mark on a metric dropper:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seborrhoeic_dermatitis

Eunuchs, owing to their low androgen levels and small sebaceous glands, do not develop seborrheic dermatitis.[17]

 

[Marky]

2020, So Long:

Wait! What happened to stem cells coming out in 2020 and curing all of us? Maybe tomorrow? Aren't some cures coming out soon from Eastern Europe or was that last year?

Anyone remember the Flaming Homer? It was the drink of the century but was stolen by Moe the Bartender. To get revenge, Homer publishes (in the legal sense) the formula to everyone in Moe's bar. One week later, Famous Meaux were being sold everywhere.

Is this the future of hair restoration? I continue to believe that there remains a substantial component of men who actually are more able to accept baldness than the weak folks like me. Man up, as they say but I sort think that if a cure came out that was either expensive or painful, we would see great numbers of men who would shrug their shoulders and say, "hmm, I will have to look into that but there's no hurry". Many of us could have perfect teeth for $10,000 to $20,000 but eh, how many of us bother. We can always do it in the future.

So yes, part of the horrible and urgent nature of hair loss has to do with the loss of control, I think, along with the shame of balding young. Why this should be shameful, no one knows but I was ashamed. Maybe because my father had perfect hair and people would see and tell us that he looked like the son. Nice, huh? There's no other human defect where people feel as though they can just tease and deride someone and expect it to be funny. I did it once, when I was 17 to an older male and look what happened to me, karma, baby. I never saw hair loss coming. Virtually no one of a white or Semitic background looks better bald unless they have Son of Sam hair, though, so I have little patience with people like my mother (hi mom!) who kept telling me that "women love bald men". Um...No, they don't. Finally, one night we were watching an old Alfred Hitchcock television program about, I can't remember the plot but the guy put on a toupee and all the gals started liking him and even my mother admitted that the actor looked like a creep without the rug.

On the bright side, this was the year where Dimoxidl became a reality. A treatment that you could drink or swallow that actually regrows hair like Jesus's, or at least Nixon's. That Nixon hairline always haunted me. I have greatly enjoyed the interactions with all of the folks who have contributed and help me find answers for myself and others. I was looking at an Ikarus post earlier, which I linked but we have had absolutely no trolling, well a couple, but if any of you take a look at that thread, Ikarus is just as bad as the trollers and the insults sling back and forth for many pages and then Ikarus flew too close to the sun and disappeared. Bless you Ikarus and bless all of the other HRT pioneers that have published their own experiences to help the rest of us.

Cheers and Happy New Year,

Goddess Bless,

Janey

Ouch on that son comment, reiterates that indeed hair is youth more so than wrinkles or getting fat.
My opinion is with your high E levels as you taper down a bit you may want to add dutasteride and/or cpa to continue progress. CPA is the most potent by far of all the tools in the drawer from my experience. Two weeks in at 12.5mg x 3 a week is enough to drop my libido and semen levels 80%. Not sure what 50mg 7 days a week would do to me like bridge was on for several months.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Ouch on that son comment, reiterates that indeed hair is youth more so than wrinkles or getting fat.
My opinion is with your high E levels as you taper down a bit you may want to add dutasteride and/or cpa to continue progress. CPA is the most potent by far of all the tools in the drawer from my experience. Two weeks in at 12.5mg x 3 a week is enough to drop my libido and semen levels 80%. Not sure what 50mg 7 days a week would do to me like bridge was on for several months.

I take dutasteride but thanks for reminding me. CPA is probably not for me. I forget what you are all taking, Mr. Marky, the mysterious one. Bridge and I, in different ways have sort of blown the doors off in terms of certain dosages. At least I test a couple of times a year. I wonder if he is still taking those big doses without testing. I think I saw him give a like in early February on one thread. I wonder if he lurks or if you can actually get this interest in hair loss out of you after reaching one's goal.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Microneedling:

I continue using a 2.0 mm roller. I have upped my usage to two to three times a week. I am not sure if I have gotten my technique down but it appears less painful using the deeper needles. I am curious about any others and what depth is preferred and how often you guys do it. I think some only do it once a month or maybe twice. I used to do it to a slight bit of blood or more and it seems to work regardless. I won't say that it is foolproof but lighter is probably better in terms of pressure. I have a couple of warrior photos that I might post with the blood running down the forehead of my completely bald head in the fall of 2019.

 

[Marky]

I take dutasteride but thanks for reminding me. CPA is probably not for me. I forget what you are all taking, Mr. Marky, the mysterious one. Bridge and I, in different ways have sort of blown the doors off in terms of certain dosages. At least I test a couple of times a year. I wonder if he is still taking those big doses without testing. I think I saw him give a like in early February on one thread. I wonder if he lurks or if you can actually get this interest in hair loss out of you after reaching one's goal.

I'll post my cycled regimen when i return from holidays next week. But generally in a 4 month cycle i use cpa for the first month to jump start things. I dont like cpa either, it seems to disturb my sleep. But as i said its the most powerful from expeience.

 

[Norwoody]

Microneedling:

I continue using a 2.0 mm roller. I have upped my usage to two to three times a week. I am not sure if I have gotten my technique down but it appears less painful using the deeper needles. I am curious about any others and what depth is preferred and how often you guys do it. I think some only do it once a month or maybe twice. I used to do it to a slight bit of blood or more and it seems to work regardless. I won't say that it is foolproof but lighter is probably better in terms of pressure. I have a couple of warrior photos that I might post with the blood running down the forehead of my completely bald head in the fall of 2019.

Insightful thread on it here:

https://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/threads/microneedling-photo-results-summary.121072/

Also, there is a guy on here called Somebody, YT channel "Somebody Alex", he had massive regrowth on a regimen that included 1.5mm dermarolling daily, but he would do it gently without bleeding, just to help aid minoxidil absorption.

The general consensus for regrowth seems to be at least 1.5mm once every one or two weeks with a decent amount of wounding. But I think it can be adjusted by your individual tolerance, how aggressive you needle, length and number of needles, what topicals you are on, etc.

I did Alex's method for several months and it did help me get more out of topical minoxidil, but I seemed to only gain some weak vellus that never progressed. For me, wounding has a better chance of developing terminal hairs. Perhaps a combination of both methods could be used though, say, a few times a week of a non-bleeding 1.5mm to help with absorption, and then an aggressive 2.0 or higher with wounding every 2-3 weeks.

I took a break from any dermarolling most of this year because I was using fluridil, which breaks down upon contact with water in the bloodstream. It also has isopropyl alcohol in it, so needling is not an option with fluridil.

I started RU a couple weeks ago and I just started dermastamping last week. I'm going to do a weekly wound at 2.0mm.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

I'll post my cycled regimen when i return from holidays next week. But generally in a 4 month cycle i use cpa for the first month to jump start things. I dont like cpa either, it seems to disturb my sleep. But as i said its the most powerful from expeience.

Well you are doing something very different. I hope you will explain your methods.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Insightful thread on it here:

https://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/threads/microneedling-photo-results-summary.121072/

Also, there is a guy on here called Somebody, YT channel "Somebody Alex", he had massive regrowth on a regimen that included 1.5mm dermarolling daily, but he would do it gently without bleeding, just to help aid minoxidil absorption.

The general consensus for regrowth seems to be at least 1.5mm once every one or two weeks with a decent amount of wounding. But I think it can be adjusted by your individual tolerance, how aggressive you needle, length and number of needles, what topicals you are on, etc.

I did Alex's method for several months and it did help me get more out of topical minoxidil, but I seemed to only gain some weak vellus that never progressed. For me, wounding has a better chance of developing terminal hairs. Perhaps a combination of both methods could be used though, say, a few times a week of a non-bleeding 1.5mm to help with absorption, and then an aggressive 2.0 or higher with wounding every 2-3 weeks.

I took a break from any dermarolling most of this year because I was using fluridil, which breaks down upon contact with water in the bloodstream. It also has isopropyl alcohol in it, so needling is not an option with fluridil.

I started RU a couple weeks ago and I just started dermastamping last week. I'm going to do a weekly wound at 2.0mm.

Wow. Dude, you are on some of the big experimental meds. Maybe you can tell us where you purchase and how you determine dosaging. What do you think about dosing oral minoxidil? We have sort of four types, female, MtF, cis-guy using hormones and cis-guy not using hormones.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Blondest Countries in the World (people, German, England, Finnish) - Europe - City-Data Forum

Behold, a thread to finally put all the other threads about blondes to rest these are statistics which show the countries with the highest % of

www.city-data.com

 

[Norwoody]

Wow. Dude, you are on some of the big experimental meds. Maybe you can tell us where you purchase and how you determine dosaging. What do you think about dosing oral minoxidil? We have sort of four types, female, MtF, cis-guy using hormones and cis-guy not using hormones.

I've got Eucapil from Bonanza. I believe there were clinical trials that approved it in the Czech Republic. It's only a 2% concentration so it's pretty weak. But it seemed to be effective at maintaining and combating the itch. It's recommended to do 2ml once a day, but since there are virtually no side effects I used it two times a day, or sometimes even three if I felt an itch. I only needed 1ml each time though since I only used it on my hairline. As far as RU, I've been using a premixed formula from Anageninc, 5% KB solution, 0.5mL twice daily (50mg per day). Its half life is about 5 hours topically.

Oral minoxidil is probably best in small dosages twice a day because its half life is only 4 hours; within 24 hours it's no longer in the serum. Once a day can definitely work too though. If you are getting side effects it'll give you more time to clear it by taking it once a day. Dosing is going to be highly individual. I'm really not sure how much females or MtF should take. Probably less because it can dry up the skin.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Here's something that I am glad to find because it confirms something we all know pretty much and is a big more specific than the white/Semitic reference that I have been using:

Ethnicity and Hair Loss Rates

Male pattern hair loss is something a majority of men could experience at some point in time. Even though the severity of hair loss may vary person to person, it still begs the question why? Genetics (which controls ethnicity) is the primary cause of hair loss, and interestingly enough, specific...

www.htandrc.com

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

I've got Eucapil from Bonanza. I believe there were clinical trials that approved it in the Czech Republic. It's only a 2% concentration so it's pretty weak. But it seemed to be effective at maintaining and combating the itch. It's recommended to do 2ml once a day, but since there are virtually no side effects I used it two times a day, or sometimes even three if I felt an itch. I only needed 1ml each time though since I only used it on my hairline. As far as RU, I've been using a premixed formula from Anageninc, 5% KB solution, 0.5mL twice daily (50mg per day). Its half life is about 5 hours topically.

Oral minoxidil is probably best in small dosages twice a day because its half life is only 4 hours; within 24 hours it's no longer in the serum. Once a day can definitely work too though. If you are getting side effects it'll give you more time to clear it by taking it once a day. Dosing is going to be highly individual. I'm really not sure how much females or MtF should take. Probably less because it can dry up the skin.

I don't know the extent of your previous hair loss. Has it improved enough pictorially? Do you have any thoughts on this meds for male pattern baldness vs. diffuse hair loss?

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Who's right: the trans community or drugs.com?​

Hi! There seems to be very conflicting information on spironolactone and bicalutamide on drugs.com compared to what is touted in the trans community.
For instance, drugs.com lists "voice deepening and slight androgenic effects" as side effects (frequency unknown) in women taking spironolactone. Obviously this seems strange and counterintuitive because spironolactone is frequently given to women with conditions such as PCOS for the purpose of reducing symptoms of hyperandrogenism.
Second, the bicalutamide vs. spironolactone debate. Bicalutamide has been described both as safer and more effective in feminizing effects by several well respected voices in the trans community. Yet a quick comparison of the two using drugs.com shows that spironolactone more frequently induces gynacomastia (13% users experience it) compared to bica (1-10% of users). spironolactone also appears to be safer. For instance, spironolactone has no dangerous "very common" side effects, and the only "scary" common side effects (subjective, I know, but take a look for yourself) appear to be hyperkalemia and hyponatremia, whereas bica lists as either common or very common side effects: heart attack, various cancers, cataracts, pain, infection, in addition to anxiety and depression. Blindness (!) is also listed as a "less common" side effect of bica. Last, bica appears to induce hair loss and thinning more frequently than spironolactone.
With all this said, is drugs.com a reliable source to look at information for drugs you're considering taking or not? Because these effects seem to fly in the face of the opinions of many medical professionals. (I would love and so appreciate if /u/Aly234237 could also give her opinion!! )
Thanks so much for reading this!

JaneyElizabeth

1 point · just now

This is useful and I am going to post this on my hair loss thread because for the cis-guys, avoiding gyno is a top priority. My reading of the three main AA's is that first, they are greatly overused. Second, bica seems to be tolerated the best by the most people but is harder to get than spironolactone and much more expensive. Third, spironolactone is slightly safer than either in the long-run but it has by far the most crippling side-effects of the three.

We need to promote much more titration of these meds in my opinion as they can be jarring to the system. When I say crippling about spironolactone, I mean that it can greatly interfere with the enjoyment of life and completion of daily tasks. I have never had sides from any other HRT meds including finasteride and dutasteride. From spironolactone, I experienced: constant need to urinate, even if voided at times, excessive sweating to the point that I couldn't leave air conditioning in summer, fatigue, great loss of muscle strength--couldn't open the damn peanut butter jar, a massive hair shed which appears common with AA's if not used carefully, others experience "brain fog" which I equate with fatigue. T goes up so some experience masculinizing perhaps from it. The main benefit is that it made laser beard and hair removal work better and my beard felt scratchier when I desisted from spironolactone. Maybe people should start at no more than 25 mg and slowly titrate if an AA is absolutely needed.

Finally, for our cis-male friends, some claim that bica dampens libido less or much less than does spironolactone. I have never used an AA without E2 and have only used spironolactone but some find that spironolactone greatly diminishes sex drive and perhaps penetrative capacity more so than bica.

spironolactone and bica are also not straightforward in terms of how they affect T and E2 and they more so spoof higher E2 and lower T than actually cause this making testing a bit more vague.
I think the community needs to compare MPA which lowers T in a straightforward way and for me, has no sides and seemed to give me much more mental energy. They are all synthetic.

 

[Norwoody]

I don't know the extent of your previous hair loss. Has it improved enough pictorially? Do you have any thoughts on this meds for male pattern baldness vs. diffuse hair loss?

I've very gradually gone from NW2 to NW1.5 over a few years, so nothing significant pictorially. If I get to a NW1 I will definitely post results.

I would say fluridil and especially RU are going to benefit most on the hairline, since they can block T (RU has the same binding affinity for the AR as T) and the hairline seems very sensitive to T. Other areas of the scalp seem to not be as sensitive to T, thus I believe even RU's benefits will be generally limited there. But I'm sure it still can help. As far as AAs/5ARIs go, I think that if I also had issues with my crown, I'd try either oral or topical dutasteride/finasteride on the crown, while using only RU on the hairline, and possible some on the crown too. However, this is probably also dependent upon the area you are trying to recover. If you're trying to go from NW3-4 to NW2, you may not really need to be so specific with AAs (but you still may); that is, 5ARIs will likely do a good job. If you're trying to go NW1 or NW0, it seems to me that you'll absolutely need to target androgens and increase estrogen for those extra sensitive hairs. For the low hairline you will likely need to avoid increasing T and DHT, which means using a topical AA and probably estrogen too. Of course it depends on the gender context as we mentioned earlier. Some people can go pretty close to "all in" (females, MtF) and address these things with powerful orals.

In my current regimen, (oral minoxidil, RU, bi-estro), the only thing I am not accounting for is 5ARI since I responded with hyperandrogenicity to finasteride. If I get desperate, I might get on dutasteride, because I'm not doing much to address DHT specifically. For now though, oral minoxidil cured my shedding and so I'm going to stick with this regimen (just swapped fluridil for RU and added bi-estro) for at least 6 months.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

I've very gradually gone from NW2 to NW1.5 over a few years, so nothing significant pictorially. If I get to a NW1 I will definitely post results.

I would say fluridil and especially RU are going to benefit most on the hairline, since they can block T (RU has the same binding affinity for the AR as T) and the hairline seems very sensitive to T. Other areas of the scalp seem to not be as sensitive to T, thus I believe even RU's benefits will be generally limited there. But I'm sure it still can help. As far as AAs/5ARIs go, I think that if I also had issues with my crown, I'd try either oral or topical dutasteride/finasteride on the crown, while using only RU on the hairline, and possible some on the crown too. However, this is probably also dependent upon the area you are trying to recover. If you're trying to go from NW3-4 to NW2, you may not really need to be so specific with AAs (but you still may); that is, 5ARIs will likely do a good job. If you're trying to go NW1 or NW0, it seems to me that you'll absolutely need to target androgens and increase estrogen for those extra sensitive hairs. For the low hairline you will likely need to avoid increasing T and DHT, which means using a topical AA and probably estrogen too. Of course it depends on the gender context as we mentioned earlier. Some people can go pretty close to "all in" (females, MtF) and address these things with powerful orals.

In my current regimen, (oral minoxidil, RU, bi-estro), the only thing I am not accounting for is 5ARI since I responded with hyperandrogenicity to finasteride. If I get desperate, I might get on dutasteride, because I'm not doing much to address DHT specifically. For now though, oral minoxidil cured my shedding and so I'm going to stick with this regimen (just swapped fluridil for RU and added bi-estro) for at least 6 months.

I need to actually learn all of those Norwood pics. For some reason I find them and the Tanner pics to be creepy to look at plus with diffuse thinners, often none of those balding archetypes seemed to fit. I seemed to have a combo of male pattern baldness with slight crown and hair line recession but all of my hair especially on the sides was affected and experienced a sharp diminution in quality more so than coverage, of course, I have been remarkably lucky in terms of maintenance even before HRT. That's a fascinating and detailed exposition of the different balding areas and using different approaches. Part of the "expertise" many of you have is that we have just looked at hair lines for years, male and female and sometimes I feel I can predict what might bald next for certain people when I see pics but it's more anecdotal I suppose at this point than scientific.

One thing that came to me today, in terms of MtF's who do well hair-wise but then slip back is that perhaps the second slippage is a type of female pattern hair loss and because it is diffuse, we see it as more so shedding but the body must at this point, regard the scalp environment as female. Perhaps that could be part of the puzzle missing for folks who recover and then experience the frustration of thinning again.

 

[Norwoody]

I can't remember which one it is, but there was a thread mentioning an AA that spoofed test levels to be essentially unchanged in the serum, but it would bind to AR. Thus, it would appear that your T is normal, but you wouldn't feel like it since the effects upon AR are feminizing. Essentially it just makes it sit there and do nothing. It was something to that effect.

 

[Norwoody]

I need to actually learn all of those Norwood pics. For some reason I find them and the Tanner pics to be creepy to look at plus with diffuse thinners, often none of those balding archetypes seemed to fit. I seemed to have a combo of male pattern baldness with slight crown and hair line recession but all of my hair especially on the sides was affected and experienced a sharp diminution in quality more so than coverage of course, I have been remarkably lucky in terms of maintenance even before HRT.

Yeah I'm actually not big on the Norwood scale. For one, it's well acknowledged in this community that there's a lot of "halfsies" (1.5, 2.5, etc). The shapes of hairlines sometimes really do not fit the model.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

I can't remember which one it is, but there was a thread mentioning an AA that spoofed test levels to be essentially unchanged in the serum, but it would bind to AR. Thus, it would appear that your T is normal, but you wouldn't feel like it since the effects upon AR are feminizing. Essentially it just makes it sit there and do nothing. It was something to that effect.

That's right. What I can't find an answer to is whether the more straightforward MPA which actually lowers testosterone without interfering with specific receptors might be a better approach. I think that because CPA. bica and spironolactone hit some receptors more than others, it might be jarring to the system and unsettling to the user in a way that neither estrogen nor MPA or progesterone might be. Thus estrogen and MPA might be said to have much smoother overall systemic effects while the others seem to be heavily side effect specific for many.