Green tea inhibits angiogenesis-study

[michael barry]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/quer ... ist_uids=1 2918064&dopt=Citation


It might be better to use another alpha five type one inhibitor like GLA, OA, LO etc.


Something else Ive found out.............ALA pretty much inhibits the prostaglandin-upping effect of GLA. You dont want that. Other fatty acids like Oleic, Palmitic, Linoleinic, Linolic also inhibit DHT formation and would be much better instead. Borage seed oil or borage seeds are the highest natural source of GLA. GLA doesnt have to be in its free form to up prostaglandin, but it does to inhibit alpha five reductase. Unfortunately, its extremely expensive to produce in its free form.


Green tea ups SBHG production (good), and inhibits alpha five type one (good, but maybe not super necessary), but since it inhibits the rebuilding of damaged microcapiallaries, one needs to do something angiogenic (SE, or minoxidil, or VEGF upregs) to counter that 'bad' effect IMO

 

[CCS]

the link does not work.

stopping angio synthesis is good for stopping cancers. does it stop blood vessel repair, or just the making of new blood vessels? if you get hair grafts, you need the new blood vessels.

I could care less about GTE's 5ar blocking ability. dutasteride takes care of that. i'm more concerned about it's androgen receptor blocking ability.

I will reduce my flax seed intake to maybe one or two table spoons per day, and will supplement with borageseed oil.

So i can put straight borage oil on my head and get anti-inflammatory effects. Good. Then i only have to separated the fatty acids if I want to inhibit 5ar.

GLA is expensive, but you can get a gallon of borageseed oil for $122. Then you just need to break all those ester links to get the fatty acids. Micheal Berry, do you know how to do that?

 

[CCS]

i just looked up angiogenesis. It occures during development, growth, wound healing, and tumor formation.

So I think your scalp should be fine.

I wonder if muscle rebuilding after a workout would count under the wound repair, or if skin repairing from copper peptides counts. I'd have to see the study to know what they found.

 

[barnabas]

The link works fine if you copy/paste it, the forum doesn't register the end of it as being part of the link thanks to the space.

 

[htownballa]

I'm not sure why prevention of angiogenesis would necessarily be a bad thing for hairloss...maybe it would stop the effect of minoxidil but other than that?

 

[michael barry]

The microcapillaries that directly feed blood to hair follicles apparently endure some of the worst damage in the pathiogenesis of male pattern baldness. They get savaged by superoxides and TGF does them no good.

Anything that can hurt them or prevent their redevelopment at the beginning of each new anagen phase might be somewhat hurtfull if not offset with something agiogenic. One might look up other foods/supplements associated with angiogenesis if they are going to take a great deal of green tea



CollegeChemistryStudent.......................I know there is a coupld of other fatty acids in borage seed oil. 22 percent GLA, and I think the others were palmitic and oleic but dont hold me to that. It sure has found its way into many shampoos as of late.

Prostaglandin analogue activity is why latanaprost apparently grows so much hair and produced hypertrichosis in eyebrows. GLA is a prostaglandin e-1 analogue...................................so getting a bunch of it might make your hair darker and thicker. ALA, disrupts this activity of GLA however


I dont know how exactly to make chemically GLA break down to its free form in borage seed oil.

I DO know that the highest amound of naturally occuring free form fatty acids are in saw palmetto extract with 85 percent or more sterol content. Thing is though...................you need to take five hundred or so mgs of this a day to have a real noticeable effect in many's opinion. Dr. Loren Pickart mentioned that he knew bodybuilders who took over 1000 mgs a day for extended periods and got b**ch tit, despite their high testosterone levels. Thats pretty anti-androgenic if you ask me.




Im interested in how I could mix up some beta-sitosterol with alchohol and water for a private topical I'd like to test on body hair..........................................would you have any Idea how to do that Collegechemistrystudent? Its been over a decade since Ive had any chemistry class.........................all that stuff is out of my mind now. I remember very little of it.

 

[StevetheSearcher]

Michael Barry-Angiogenesis

Michael Barry-If you are looking for information about Angiogenesis I am your man.

Basically Polyphenols Green tea and a host of other substances particularly Genestein inhibit Angiogenesis.

The reason for this is that they strengthen capillaries and in order for Angiogenesis to happen endothelial cells have to leak from the existing vasculature and so therefore strengthening the capillary walls disrupts this.
The process is threefold.First there has to be migration and then proliferation of endothelial cells and then finally the creation of the new blood vessel or capillary.

Both Hedgehog Agonists and TB4 work by promoting Angiogenesis/wound healing.

I am actually in a bit of a rush here but I can elaborate on this if there is an interest in this here.

 

[Newbaldy84]

so to sum up all of it. IS green tea extract good or bad for hair loss?
I dont want to cause any harm by puting it on my scalp.

 

[CCS]

is angiogenesis good or bad for hair loss? If GTE strengthen's capilaries, that sounds good.

I read a post that some stuff in GTE inhibits the androgen receptor strongly. If this were true, wouldn't a lot of people have had good results by now?

Also, I heard that caffine reacts with minoxidil, and GTE has caffine in it.


I bought some SOD pills, the ones that are 32500 daltons. I'm planning on putting them on my head.

 

[michael barry]

CCE,

Ive read that GTE ups globulin and inhibits type one alpha five strongly, but never anything about blocking a receptor or mimicking estrogen and compeditively binding with a receptor..................web search green tea and receptor blocker, etc. and get back to us.


Your microcapillaries with each follicle rescind at the end of anagen phase and have to grow some four fold at the beginning of each new phase to reach the baby dermal papilla. Its important that MANY of these little phuckers do this and you have a DP fed by several of them that are good and wide. Green tea would seemingly help them once they are rebuilt, but during the buidling stage......................................who knows, it might inhibit things a bit.

I imagine if one did minoxidil to offset this...........they'd be alrighty. Other stimulants that apparently excite haircells like peptides or prostaglandin agonists might do this ..................or not. Hard to say. All in all I'd say GTE is much better for hair than not. However, other things do inhibit type one alpha five and other things also interefere with androgen uptake also. Its up to us to experiment on things like this and report our results back to each other.


Steve, great post. You know your stuff. Its always good to get well read guys on here sharing info.

 

[CCS]

http://www.hairlosstalk.com/discussions ... hp?t=29143

what do you think of that?

do you know which chemical is responsible for stopping angiosynthesis, and if we can get the others separately?

 

[Newbaldy84]

ok I just got my Green tea extract in powder
should I or should I not? :?

 

[CCS]

i just find it hard to believe that if i put GTE on body hair, new hairs won't be able to grow because they can't get a blood supply. I'd really like to hear if anyone has tried that.

i wonder if cancer has a different type of angiogenesis, and if they are affected differently by green tea. this really needs to be looked into further. i just doubt many studdies have looked at GTE effect on the angiogenesis of hair.

sounds like such a powerful treatment if this is not a problem. just wonder why no one has said it is effective in the past.

 

[CCS]

http://www.hairlosstalk.com/discussions ... hp?t=29143

oK, I think i got some of it figured out. the curcumin is in both GTE and in tumeric powder. Both GTE and tumeric powder inhibit angiogenesis. Therefore, I suspect the curcumin is responsible for inhibiting the angiogenesis.

As for drinking lots of Grean tea, i never heard of people losing hair as a result. and indian men who eat lots of tumeric powder don't either. So i'm not worried about systemic effects. I still am mildly concerned about topical effects of curcumin.

But if you read that link, GTE has other compounds that inhibit 5ar, or rather inhibit testostosterone, or something. Anyway, one of them reduces growth even in the pressence of DHT. That is the one I think we need. EGCG (epigallo- catechin-3-gallate) is what we want. I wonder if we can get it from a different extract that does not have curcumin.

Anyone want to search for it and post it here?

I also want to point out that we need to know the concentration of curcumin at which angiosynthesis is inhibited, and the concentration of EGCG and curcumin at which DHT and curcumin are inhibited. We also need to know the relative amounts of each in the GTE. If we can get some snips from PUB med articles, and if Bryan can tell us the size of a flank organ, we may be able to get some good estimates and find out if the GTE is safe after all.

 

[Newbaldy84]

I got one that is standardized for EGCG. Yesterday I tested on two spots on my body hair. I 'll see if there is a diffrence when hair starts to regrowth
will update...

 

[sublime]

GTE only inhibits blood vessels in tumor growth. It does not inhibit normal blood vessel formation.

 

[CCS]

thanks sublime. I'd like to see the source on that, but it sounds believable.

 

[sublime]

:bravo:

 

[jakeb]

I am so psyched about GTE.

That is all.

 

[Newbaldy84]

I just added GTE to my apple poly spray. Just to let you know guys GTE stinks!