Finasteride Accelerated My Hair Loss Would I Be Dumb To Try Dutasteride Now

[baba_yaga]

yeah but before u go ahead and say something is “fine to take”, go ahead and tell us u are impotent and u have tits. Give the whole picture, otherwise u put ppl in danger.

Those "people in danger" must be real dumb.

 

[baba_yaga]

no, we all were new to this once

I remember when people here falsely claimed that gyno develops in the beginning and then subsided once u continue treatment. Obviously it doesn’t, once u learn how progesterone works. It didn’t stop them from lying. Anyone who hasn’t spent a lot of time searching wouldn’t know it’s a lie. Oh next thing u know u have gynooo... irreversible.

Everyone should do their research, that's my point. If they blindly follow what they've read on the net, they would in danger in many other situations during their life.

 

[NorwoodingMyWay]

yeah but before u go ahead and say something is “fine to take”, go ahead and tell us u are impotent and u have tits. Give the whole picture, otherwise u put ppl in danger.

Where did i say something is "fine to take" ?? You are adding nothing to the discussion, and you keep twisting everything, beware of a 5th ban buddy.

 

[NorwoodingMyWay]

Cancer cells will upregulate. You cannot assume that the same happens with healthy cells in scalp hair follicles.

finasteride is a weak AA. It's inhibition of 70% DHT with a 10% increase in T (normal DHT levels are about 10% of total T levels, so it is even) will not lead to any sort of upregulation in the overwhelming majority of people.

finasteride does not cause a 10% increase in T. It's anywhere between 20-80%, depending on how much T was coverting to DHT.





How can you explain what i got through with dutasteride then ?? And the study i linked, it shows that finasteride does remodel the AR expression in the prostate, albeit cancerous cells. If finasteride can remodel ARs in prostate, who's to say it won't do it in the scalp, where balding scalps have higher 5AR/DHT than non balding scalps ??

 

[NorwoodingMyWay]

That's the same study you broscientists always point to. Can you explain how a 10% increase in AR activity coupled with a 70% decrease in DHT is not a net decrease in androgen activity? You know better than to think finasteride can cause male pattern baldness. You're giving this poor kid hope that it's not his messed up genes.

When did i ever claim "finasteride can cause baldness" ?? We all have messed up genes, no need to be such a jerk about it. If you suffer Androgenetic Alopecia, your genes suck. Noone is better than the other.

 

[NorwoodingMyWay]

3rd*

I’ll log in on @TomRiddle

explain to me why the dude u tried to push CPA to sent me a PM asking me about it. If u want to be impotent be impotent, don’t drag ppl with u. What u do is highly dangerous and has a variety of irreversible sides on both the genital parts and the liver. You’re dangerous and in a path of no return. Which rational individual would be in the state u are rn?

Which dude you talking about ?? I got lots asking me about my regimen, and i tell them honestly what to expect and to research throughoutly before doing anything. If you have to lie, then just be good at it, also, you suck at being a social justice.





I'll keep pushing CPA to everyone, don't worry about it boyou.

 

[NorwoodingMyWay]

shrimpenis

I don't have a penis. Not anymore.

 

[baba_yaga]

finasteride does not cause a 10% increase in T. It's anywhere between 20-80%, depending on how much T was coverting to DHT.





How can you explain what i got through with dutasteride then ?? And the study i linked, it shows that finasteride does remodel the AR expression in the prostate, albeit cancerous cells. If finasteride can remodel ARs in prostate, who's to say it won't do it in the scalp, where balding scalps have higher 5AR/DHT than non balding scalps ??

I dont know why you had such a reaction when your androgens "total effectiveness" should be down.
Also first time I've heard finasteride increases T by 20-80%. Any links?

I am not saying that upregulation does not happen in scalp hair follicles. I am saying that you cannot conclude they do/dont upon observation of upregulation in prostate cancer cells.

 

[TomRiddle]

lol, no words left

 

[NorwoodingMyWay]

definitely credible then


and normal

I mean, that's what you want to hear, so be it.

 

[NorwoodingMyWay]

dude do u have a working penis or not? quit lying to this community and come clean!

You are so obsessed with my penis. It's quite concerning really..

 

[NorwoodingMyWay]

I dont know why you had such a reaction when your androgens "total effectiveness" should be down.
Also first time I've heard finasteride increases T by 20-80%. Any links?

I am not saying that upregulation does not happen in scalp hair follicles. I am saying that you cannot conclude they do/dont upon observation of upregulation in prostate cancer cells.

dutasteride raises T levels by 20% : https://www.researchgate.net/public...clinical_significance_of_testosterone_changes








Browsing r/tressless, seeing blood tests results from users, and doing my own research. I searched highs and lows for what was happening to me on dutasteride, and even coming into the conclusion that my T was raised 20%, it didn't make sense for the hyperandrogenicity that i experienced. I can only hypothesis that blocking half of 5AR type 1 (which dutasteride does), it got upregulated. Everyone's different, you just can't dismiss a user's experience because "there is no scientific evidence for it" just like @pegasus2 is saying. There are users immune to 5ARIs, should we dismiss them because there is no scientific evidence for such things ??

 

[NorwoodingMyWay]

u just said u have no penis man how can we obsess over something that’s not there

You keep asking for me to "come clean" about something that's not there..

 

[baba_yaga]

dutasteride raises T levels by 20% : https://www.researchgate.net/public...clinical_significance_of_testosterone_changes








Browsing r/tressless, seeing blood tests results from users, and doing my own research. I searched highs and lows for what was happening to me on dutasteride, and even coming into the conclusion that my T was raised 20%, it didn't make sense for the hyperandrogenicity that i experienced. I can only hypothesis that blocking half of 5AR type 1 (which dutasteride does), it got upregulated. Everyone's different, you just can't dismiss a user's experience because "there is no scientific evidence for it" just like @pegasus2 is saying. There are users immune to 5ARIs, should we dismiss them because there is no scientific evidence for such things ??

I though you meant finasteride raises T by 20-80%
Yes duta increases T by 20% on average.

Well, you’re reasoning is plausible.
Talking about immunity to 5ari, is there any other way to find if you’re one of them other than tests and continued hair loss (possibly).

 

[NorwoodingMyWay]

I though you meant finasteride raises T by 20-80%
Yes duta increases T by 20% on average.

Well, you’re reasoning is plausible.
Talking about immunity to 5ari, is there any other way to find if you’re one of them other than tests and continued hair loss (possibly).

If dutasteride raises T, then so would finasteride to a varried extent (that 10% increase cannot be generalized to everyone).





About the 5ARI immunity, the only way to know is blood tests. As we know, T can keep baldness progressing even if DHT is being blocked. I've seen countless users (either from tressless or trans subreddit), claiming their DHT didn't budge with 5ARIs (and providing their blood tests), or it did decrease, but stayed within normal range. It's quite weird to think about it, like why is there NO study or research about this phenomenon..

 

[NorwoodingMyWay]

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28408350/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24717976/

also, a slight increase in total testosterone levels is because the body tries to balance hormones, so both testosterone and estradiol may increase. There is a huge increase in shbg, thus a decrease in the bioavailable free testosterone levels. On top of that, your one and only potent androgen responsible for skin, bones, body hair, penile function and brain function is blocked. A skin enzyme responsible for adipose tissue accumulation and burning is also blocked and your liver also suffers mildly. Morning erections disappear, which impairs the size and function of your penis permanently. Gynecomastia develops initially through progestin receptors, breast development continues and the absence of androgens favor the development of glandular tissue which is terrible and irreversible unless a surgery is performed which leaves permanent visible scars around the areola and the puffiness doesn’t go away even then in most cases. The drug suppresses the pituitary gland, thus decreasing LH, FSH, thus decreasing total testosterone levels too after a long time, signaling and spermatogenesis. Not to mention it shrinks a healthy prostate which isn’t good at all for a variety of reasons.

Enjoy your hair loss treatment. It is no accident that millions suffer from it. Those two articles give you a glimpse of what it leaves behind. If you consider this poison a cure then you’re mad. It should be off the market. Period.

These 2 studies didn't say a word about SHBG, let alone "huge increase SHBG, thus a decrease in the bioavailable free T levels". finasteride does cause a decrease in neurosteroid hormones, yes, it's been known for ever, and it's due to the blockade of 5AR Type 2. DHT, while praised by metalheads and know-it-all internet hairloss members, is NOT important (for the majority) after puberty, provided you don't have low T to begin with. What you quoted is already known and established. However, PFS sufferers are not "millions", they are hardly thousands. finasteride/dutasteride do not cause loss of erections / gyno or some other severe crap if you aren't already disposed to them. Fix your T levels, then come blame finasteride for all your problems.





And yeah, let's take finasteride out of market just cause @norwood 11 said so, and screw over millions who are praising the drug.

 

[NorwoodingMyWay]

Are these blood tests after months of being on finasteride and not skipping doses?

@norwood11 Nobody wants to be on these drugs. It's just necessary if we want our hair back. I'm not denying that there are side effects and some long-term damage could be done, but I will take that trade off to avoid being bald. I am still able to function sexually and mentally, and haven't noticed any negative impact in my life so far from 5-ARIs. There are more effective treatment options, but those carry more serious side effects.

Yeah, taking into account that they swear to be religious with their treatments, you can go to reddit and search "Blood test" in r/tressless, you'll see all kinds of weird crap there.

 

[Here For the Lulz]

Take it or don’t. Just get on with it. It’s not the feelings of others that matter, it’s your own feelings. Whatever choice makes you feel best is the one you should. The fact you have had bad experiences in the past and that you are asking this at all seems to indicate that, for you personally, the risks seem to outweigh the potential benefits. If you can’t get to a place where the inverse is true, then not taking it is probably the best call.

 

[MKP05]

Here is a summary of my journey:

Winter 2018- I notice first signs of very minor hair shedding in shower

Summer 2018- I go on minoxidil which shed my hair which I somewhat recovered from a few months later. Hair loss is still very minor at this point. I don't think I even had Any miniaturization, just minor shedding

Fall 2018- I start finasteride to "maintain hair" at norwood 1-1.5. i immediately start shedding hundreds and hundreds of hairs a day all over scalp. And scalp is inflamed. No crown loss before and after 3 months I develop a nice bald patch on the crown. I decided to stick with it for 6 months from the advice of you idiots telling me it is normal to shed 300 terminal hairs a day with a "hairloss drug" dropped a whole norwood on finasteride and lost tons of hair density.

May 2019- I finally give up on finasteride. Heavy Shedding subsides but i still shed about a hundred hairs a day.

Summer 2019- I was using minoxidil only. Because I was shedding less my hair slightly thickened after quitting finasteride. I maintained decent hair for 4 or 5 months.

Winter 2019/2020- I start shedding massive amounts of hair again on a minoxidil only regimine. Dropping me another norwood.

So now I am about a norwood 3 with low density. In a span of about 18 months going from norwood 1. Both temples were wiped out this winter. And I also have a burning tingly scalp itch wherever my hair is thinning now.

Should I try dutasteride or spironoctalone or is this just a lost cause seeing how bad my body upregulated itself from finasteride.

In my opinion you should be extremely cautious about getting on dutasteride given your experience with finasteride. I was in exactly your position last November after being on finasteride for 17 months. Just like you I had minor hair loss at the temples before getting on finasteride. Just like you, within 3 months I lost density everywhere (not the back or sides). Just like you within months I was suddenly thinning In places I’d never had hair loss and was left with a diffuse horseshoe pattern. At 6 months it “stabilized” but the density I lost never grew back. I continued to slowly and progressively recede along the hairline and temples from month 6 to 17. By month 17 I was very dissatisfied with the way my hairline was continuing to progress (which again was the only area I was trying to stop losing hair when this began) so I started dutasteride. I’m exactly 4 months in and, in hindsight, this could turn out to have been a catastrophic mistake. I immediately lost hair on the back and sides within one week. So the one place on my head that was still healthy and full now has the density and texture of the hair in my diffuse Norwood region. It has still not grown back and is thinner than ever right now. My hairline/temples - again the area I was trying to save the most - has continued to recede. I now have a bald spot which is expanding right in the middle of my forelock making the area behind my hairline exposed. I’ve lost slightly more density all over. these medications are designed so that you will shed the weak DHT impacted hair but that should be replaced with hair which is protected from DHT. But there could be numerous reasons why you may shed the weak hair but never see regrowth - whether it be poor scalp health, autoimmune/ inflammation issues, bad genetics, age, AR up regulation (Which i know can be debated all day long). I can tell you firsthand that the shed from dutasteride is real and almost assuredly inescapable. So don’t for a minute believe anyone on here who claims that it’s going to magically and immediately halt your hair loss. you have to be willing to endure a massive shed from which you may or may not recover. If you look at the hair loss forums you’ll always find a very small handful of guys who switched from finasteride to dutasteride and had positive results. Some even claim immediate results although that seems to be extraordinarily rare. You will find many, many more who had poor results and it is not uncommon to lose hair in your donor zone - albeit temporarily - although in my case I have not recovered 4 months later.

I’m not ready yet to make a final conclusion because I’m willing to give it some more time before giving up but I’m trending toward a poor result. If you do try dutasteride just go into it with the appropriate amount of expectation. Who knows. You could be one of the lucky ones Good luck with whatever decision you make.