DHT, androgens, and their uses

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
DHEA is the first hormone, and genetics determine how much you make at a given age. How much testosterone you can make is determined by how much DHEA you have. My father has optimal testosterone levels for a 25 year old, but 10% the DHEA levels of one. He is very athletic at age 60.

Testosterone is a bulk hormone, like cortisol. It is produced by one or two organs/glands for the rest of the body. You know the effects of testosterone on your system from the blood levels.

Estrogen, DHT, and some others are non-bulk hormones. They are manufactured in individual cells by enzymes that are controlled by genetics. Their concentrations are higher in those cells than in the blood, since the amount in the blood is just what leaked out. This goes for estrogen in breast tissue, and DHT in breast tissue, and DHT in skin, hair, penis, prostate, nerves.

Testosterone makes your muscles grow. More makes them grow more. Exercise makes more testosterone. Insulin helps with bringing in protein for growth. Steroid mimic testosterone to make more growth 24-7. Muscles don't make DHT, and it either has no effect on them, or works not better than testosterone.

But most tissues don't use testosterone for androgenic signalling. They make it into DHT first. DHT is needed for nerves to stay healthy. It has uses in many organs as the androgen signaller. It is what tells your penis to grow during puberty, which is when genetics tell your penis to make more DHT. Though researchers measure the elevated blood levels that leak out during this time, the cellular concentrations are much higher. So naturally during experiments when DHT is added to the blood of adults to match adulescent levels, the penis does not grow.

DHT also causes body hair to grow, head hair to die, and sebum glands to get big and give you big pores. It also make the prostate grow a similar number of men as those who lose their hair. But we do need it in nerves, which fortunately make it with 5ar1.

As we age, our cells make diferent hormone levels, often for the worse. It is incorrect to think that we make more or less DHT or estrogen. It is better to think of what each individual tissue is making. To measure blood levels is just as erroneous as to to other diseases as to male pattern baldness.

Just as DHT evenually brings some immune attack to hair follicles, and also cause produciton of damaging chemicals, a similar effect probably occurs in other cells, like in the joints. Arthritis, lupus, asma, allergies, etc are all auto-immune conditions, often treated by steroidal drugs like prednisone. Prednisone is bad. Hormones are the bodies communicaiton tool, the maker's of which are coded for by DNA. Some are systemic, like testosterone, insulin, and cortisol. Others are cellular, like DHT and estrogen.

To fix our problems, we must think cellular, not systemic. It makes sense to bring DHEA levels to that of a 25 year old since it is needed to make the sytemic testosterone. But if women want to increase estrogen levels, or men decrease DHT levels, we must do this on a tissue by tissue basis for two reasons:
1. If you fix the blood levels to that of a 25 year old, you still don't get the tissue levels of a 25 year old. The blood levels are just what leaked out of the cells, mixed, and was disluted. Some cells need more, others less.
2. If you change stuff systemically, you help some tissues and hurt others. Dutasteride is great for hair, but could be bad for nerves and your penis. I read that men's penises get a little smaller as they age.

You can grow your penis by stretching it, just like a woman without steroids can build muscle. Dutasteride makes it harder. DHT injection in your penis would be like a guy building muscle on steroids. Just as muscles respond to testosterone, your penis and body hair respond to DHT. But your adult penis makes as much DHT as a woman makes testosterone, by analogy. and even if a study says blood DHT levels are similar, it does not matter. Only the amount made inside the penis, buy the penis, matters, so you have to apply DHT topically to the penis to get enough in there without affecting your whole body. And stretching it with a pump is kind of like working out: don't to it too much if you don't got the hormones to back it up.
 

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
hmmm....
 

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
testosterone gel would not work like DHT gel because we are on finasteride, and even without finasteride, not enough testosterone is converted to DHT in the penis.
 

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
what better way to find out than to look on a steroid forum and see which ones cause the most hair loss. then wikipedia them.
 

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
what if I use miracle grow?
 

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
http://www.endotext.org/pediatrics/pedi ... cs11_2.htm
book marked


In conclusion, the patients who change to male sex are more socially adapted than the ones that keep the female social sex, with their small size of penis being their main problem. New approaches to increase penis size will help them to be more integrated in life.

Treatment: A careful psychological evaluation performed by an experienced psychologist in sexual identification must be carried out in order to determine the patient's sexual identification. When the patient presents male sexual identification, the change in social sex must be made along with the correction of perineal hypospadias and of cryptorchidism. The results of treatment of MPH due to 5-a-RD deficiency with T has seldom been reported in literature. The use of high doses of exogenous T for prolonged periods of time in a group of 4 patients with MPH due to 5-a-RD deficiency, and in two patients with androgen receptor defect, was able to promote greater virilization than normal T doses (189). The treatment of our patients with high doses of T and or DHT, although inducing an increase in penis length, was not enough to correct penis size. Penis size remained below 2 SD of the normal average (182). After treatment, we observed an improvement in sexual intercourse in most of the patients. The topic treatment of our cases with DHT cream, even with adequate absorption, did not prove more effective than T in inducing penis growth although DHT serum levels during treatment were higher than physiological levels.
 

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
some of those guys had androgen receptor insensitivity. These guys had micro penis. The DHT made them grow, but not enough. I wonder if they gel was applied to the penis, or elsewhere. I think the gel combined with a penis pump would do more good, and that the gaines are proportional to starting length. So I'd get better results. And DHT gel means I don't have to stop propecia.
 

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
Abstract

Background: Percutaneous administration of dihydrotestosterone (DHT) has been successful in promoting phallic growth in infants and children with 5-reductase deficiency raised as males. We investigated whether percutaneous administration of DHT is similarly effective in patients with micropenis due to alternative diagnoses. Methods: Six patients (age range 1.9-8.3 years) with micropenis of variable etiology were studied prospectively. 2.5% DHT gel was applied to the phallus once daily at a dose of 0.15-0.33 mg/kg body weight. Serum DHT concentrations were measured at 0, 2, 4, 8, 12 and 24 h following application of DHT gel. Results: Peak DHT concentrations were attained within 2-8 h after application of the gel and subsequently remained within the normal adult range in all but 1 patient, who had received the lowest dose of 0.15 mg/kg. An increase in phallic growth, ranging from 0.5-2.0 cm, was achieved after 3-4 months of treatment in all patients whose DHT concentrations were maintained within adult range. Conclusion: Percutaneous administration of DHT in a dose of 0.2-0.3 mg/kg once daily for a period of 3-4 months may be useful in the management of patients with testosterone biosynthetic defects, who have sufficient masculinization to warrant male sex assignment, or in patients with micropenis prior to reconstructive surgery.

Copyright © 2002 S. Karger AG, Basel
 

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
not just the stretching is good. It is the erection holding in the DHT and building up concentrations.
 

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
Andractim is only available with a doctor's prescription. Proviron ground up into a topical cream would be an inferior but OK substitute. Also requires prescriptions.
 

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
JayMan said:
you cannot grow your penis by stretching it.

do not quesiton the ways of CCS. ...or I'll squirt borageseed oil at you.
 

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
now I wonder if DHT only works in kids. And Andractim is not on drugstore.com.
 

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
It is called Andractim, but I can't find it at any pharmacies. I wonder if they make it in the states.
 

seekinghair

Member
Reaction score
0
I've always wondered whether topically applied DHT on your penis could be a workable alternative for those who suffer sexual sides from finasteride or dutasteride. Since according to Bryan the DHT that actually makes you go bald is that produced in your follicles it shouldn't counteract 5 AR inhibitors’ effects in your scalp hair.
Of course, if sexual sides are elicited by high estrogen levels and not by the low DHT then I don't think I would make any significant contribution.

We know sooo little :evil: .
 

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
topical DHT could make your dick hairs longer or give you dick acne. I'm not sure how far it would penetrate into the dick, either.

Also, I don't know if the important tissues of the dick have 5ar1 or 2. The prostate has 2. But the sebum glgands of the dick have 1. But what about the other tissues in the dick? GOt to figure that out. Might not have to stop finasteride for testosterone. DHT side steps the finasteride issue.
 

s.a.f

Senior Member
Reaction score
67
JayMan said:
you cannot grow your penis by stretching it.

I can grow my penis by watching p**rn.
 

CCS

Senior Member
Reaction score
27
Top