Anyone successfully avoid their sides w/ lower finasteride Dosage?

[Balding Scot]

It's been talked a lot about, but I've failed to find any experiences or evidence regarding this.

Can anyone actually claim that they had sides when taking 1mg of Propecia, but after cutting it to 0.25mg of Propecia, their sides went away?

I'm mostly concerned about the Neurological effects, but really, anyone who was capable of avoiding side effects by lowering their dosage, PLEASE share your stories here.

I'm hoping to collect as much anectodal evidence here to convince myself and others that a quarter dose of propecia is safe, where a 1mg dose can be poison, as it was in my case.

Thanks!!!

 

[YouKnow]

When I was taking 1mg I got gyno, now at .5 mg it has drastically lowered the side effect.

 

[YouKnow]

When I was taking 1mg I got gyno, now at .5 mg it has drastically lowered the side effect.

 

[Jm0311]

anyone else?

 

[DoctorHouse]

I wonder not only if they lowered it and reduced sides but also did not lose any ground and were able to maintain? I have been on it for over 3 years and I am getting sides which I never had a problem with before. I have no choice but to cut it to half a propecia per day. I am ready to get off this drug but I have to take the test to see if I respond to finasteride well. If I prove to get a low response, I am going to stop it and just stick with Dr Proctor's arsenal.

 

[Balding Scot]

Can we confirm the science behind why it might work? I've read rumours that it's because lowering the dosage significantly cuts down the level of scalp DHT, but not serum DHT, and it's serum DHT that causes sides.

Anybody reuptable and/or educated able to confirm that?

 

[Axl_Rose]

I wonder not only if they lowered it and reduced sides but also did not lose any ground and were able to maintain? I have been on it for over 3 years and I am getting sides which I never had a problem with before. I have no choice but to cut it to half a propecia per day. I am ready to get off this drug but I have to take the test to see if I respond to finasteride well. If I prove to get a low response, I am going to stop it and just stick with Dr Proctor's arsenal.

What sides are you experiencing, House?

 

[DoctorHouse]

Axl, see your PM.

 

[Bryan]

Can we confirm the science behind why it might work? I've read rumours that it's because lowering the dosage significantly cuts down the level of scalp DHT, but not serum DHT, and it's serum DHT that causes sides.

How and why would it do that?

 

[Balding Scot]

Bryan, if I had any idea at all, I wouldn't be posing questions like this.

I'm trying to find out if there's any evidence (either study-based, or even anecdotal) that might show that a quarter of a propecia pill is going to reduce sides while still being somewhat effective. This study is the closest thing I've found to anything medical:

http://www.physics.upenn.edu/facultyinf ... index.html

And it doesn't really talk much about sides.

So it's mostly anecdotal evidence I'm looking for. So far not much in the way of people coming out and attesting to the idea that 0.25 is any better than 1mg.

Would you happen to know anything from your research? You seem to be fairly well respected on these boards.

 

[Bryan]

Bryan, if I had any idea at all, I wouldn't be posing questions like this.

What I'm specifically interested in is the claim that a tiny dose of finasteride would reduce scalp DHT, without altering serum DHT. In all the years I've been interested in hairloss, this is the FIRST time I have ever heard that specific claim. Does it make sense to you? It doesn't make any sense to ME. Why on earth would it do such a thing?

I'm trying to find out if there's any evidence (either study-based, or even anecdotal) that might show that a quarter of a propecia pill is going to reduce sides while still being somewhat effective.

I tend to doubt the likelihood of success of such an approach, but you might as well try it and hope for the best. I think it's just as likely that as you reduce the dose, the desired effects on your hair might drop-off faster than the side effects, rather than the other way around.

 

[beaner]

Bryan, if I had any idea at all, I wouldn't be posing questions like this.

What I'm specifically interested in is the claim that a tiny dose of finasteride would reduce scalp DHT, without altering serum DHT. In all the years I've been interested in hairloss, this is the FIRST time I have ever heard that specific claim. Does it make sense to you? It doesn't make any sense to ME. Why on earth would it do such a thing?

I'm pretty sure he's referring to this: http://www.physics.upenn.edu/facultyinf ... peciafda2/

The graphs show that a .05mg dose lowers scalp DHT to levels similar to a 1mg and 5mg dose while lowering serum dht to a somewhat lesser degree.

Do you think this is accurate?

 

[Bryan]

I'm pretty sure he's referring to this: http://www.physics.upenn.edu/facultyinf ... peciafda2/

The graphs show that a .05mg dose lowers scalp DHT to levels similar to a 1mg and 5mg dose while lowering serum dht to a somewhat lesser degree.

Do you think this is accurate?

Nah. Measurements of "scalp DHT" are so inconsistent and unreliable, different studies have produced different results. I think all the Frankel paper shows is that yes, finasteride does indeed have a nearly "flat" dose-response.

 

[Balding Scot]

I wouldn't claim to know why it would work, but you must admit, the likelyhood could go either way -- a loser dose could indeed cause just as many sides and be less of an impact on one's hair.

But I'd like to imagine an equal likelyhood, perhaps something even more likely, and that would be that lowering the dose will perhaps yield less growth, but still help to maintain hair (IE. in the case of someone who wants a transplant), and will more importantly be a reduction in dosage enough that side effects are no longer noticeable or even existent.

You have to admit that if it is a flat response, and sides are equal to effectiveness, then lowering the dose might still be *somewhat* effective, or *effective enough*, and at the same time might be miniscule enough that the body won't react negatively to it in other ways.

That seems a lot more likely and realistic to me ... I guess we won't know until I guinea pig myself and give it a shot. I'll go on 0.25mg after my shows this weekend.

 

[Balding Scot]

To add to my list of possibilities in my post before this, couldn't it also be possible that different bodies have different sensitivity to the drug? Where 1mg might be just fine for one body chemistry, another's might be too reactive to it, where it would react to 0.25mg very well?

I guess what I'm saying is, isn't it possible that different bodies have different "Sweet spots" of dosage?

My last experience obviously proved that 1mg was not sweet at all. Maybe 0.25 will give me the same result as 1mg does in somebody who has no side effects at all, but all the benefits?

 

[Bryan]

Oh, there are definitely variations in the response that people have to finasteride, but that has to do with the MINIMUM DOSE that they require to have a significant effect on their DHT. That minimum dose appears to be in the neighborhood of about 0.04 mg/day for the average person, but for a given specific individual, it may range below or above that figure, depending on how that person absorbs and then metabolizes the drug. I think the dose that Merck chose for Propecia (1 mg) is large enough to catch virtually all the "outliers" out there who require a somewhat larger minimum dose.

 

[Balding Scot]

Ok, cool, that makes sense. So even if the average is 0.4mg, that means that a few people would respond well even at a lower dose (ie. 0.25mg) ... and at the same time, could respond adversely (side effects) at higher doses (ie. 1.25mg, like I was taking before).

I think this is enough to dare me to try the stuff again. Though it'll be depressing if I go mental again from a mere 0.25mg. That'll mean I can never touch the stuff for the rest of my life, which would probably keep me from having a truly permanent hair transplant.

Cross your fingers for me!

 

[Bryan]

Ok, cool, that makes sense. So even if the average is 0.4mg...

You're off by an order of magnitude! The average is around 0.04 mg.

...that means that a few people would respond well even at a lower dose (ie. 0.25mg) ... and at the same time, could respond adversely (side effects) at higher doses (ie. 1.25mg, like I was taking before).

I doubt that anybody would start getting side effects just from going from a somewhat lower dose to only 1.25 mg. In the early stumptailed macaques studies, the monkeys were given 1 mg/kg/day of finasteride, which, if translated into my own body weight (I weigh about 100 kg), would be the same as if I took 100 mg of finasteride every day. The monkeys had no apparent problem with that dose.

And even humans have indeed taken as much as 80 mg per day of finasteride for three months in early testing of the drug, with no harmful effects.

 

[Dblbass128]

I got much less sides from 0.25 fines as oppessed to 1 daily.Never gave it long enough to find out whether it was still efficacious though.

Am currently using an estimated 0.7 ish daily absorbed through the scalp and I have been getting sides (moderate to heavy loss of libido reduced thinner seman). Gonna keep slowly lowering it untill the sides go completly and see how I go from there.

Are you using Xandrox +? I have been and I think I may be getting sides (high anxeity, weakness and fatigue) just feeling like plain sh*t

Im wondering if the AXandrox 6+ once a day is causing it