Anybody Try Raloxifene For Hair Growth?

[Retinoid]

• I have noticed a lot of guys experimenting with Estrogen to help grow or stop hair loss which I think is a little extreme.

However, we cannot deny that estrogen, particularly when it hits the beta receptor, tends to be beneficial for hair growth however the potential for negative effects (gyno, feminization, testosterone shut down, etc.) tends not to be worth it.

Raloxifene is used mainly for osteoporsis treatment. It is a SERM and is also used to PREVENT gynecomastia in people at high risk (steroid users for example) as well as to restart Testosterone production, though it is not as effective as Tamoxifene and Clomid in this regard.

It is an estrogen agonist in the bone (good for bone density), liver (good for lipids) and skin (good for collagen production).

It is an estrogen antagonist in the breast tissue (even stronger than Tamoxifene) which means no gyno and will reduce any preexisting puffiness there.

There are no studies for its effects in the scalp-however there is a study where it is shown to be helpful in prostate cancer due to its estrogen beta agonist abilities and helpful for anti aging (even more than estradiol). If it is an agonist in the skin I would assume it would also be in the scalp---taking this would give you the estrogen benefits without the downsides.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16536755

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19042101

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14533013

From the third link:

Increase of collagen synthesis induced by raloxifene may be activated by both estrogen receptor dependent and independent pathways such as up-regulation of estrogen receptors, up-regulation of IGF receptor, transcriptional regulation of collagen genes by estrogen receptor-raloxifene complex, increasing of prolidase activity or finally by inhibition of MMP-9 expression.

Up-regulation of estrogen receptors, IGF receptors and inhibiting MMP-9 expression are all major positives for hair loss.

 

[whatevr]

I've thought about that, and I've taken it, but my hair always seemed to get worse on it... not a whole lot, but still. Though I've never taken it for more than a few days.

 

[Retinoid]

I've thought about that, and I've taken it, but my hair always seemed to get worse on it... not a whole lot, but still. Though I've never taken it for more than a few days.

You cannot really extrapolate your hair gets worse-but not by a whole lot-after a few days of taking something.

 

[whatevr]

You cannot really extrapolate your hair gets worse-but not by a whole lot-after a few days of taking something.

I knew you were going to say that, but I can feel a change in hair quality within a few days when something affects it positively or negatively. It's nowhere near as bad as letrozole, which actually caused a huge shed and made my temples thin out within 2 weeks from not even a whole pill.

 

[Retinoid]

I knew you were going to say that, but I can feel a change in hair quality within a few days when something affects it positively or negatively. It's nowhere near as bad as letrozole, which actually caused a huge shed and made my temples thin out within 2 weeks from not even a whole pill.

Letrozole did not cause your temples to thin out from taking less than a full dose. Sorry...

 

[Sanchez1234]

@IdealForehead

 

[whatevr]

Letrozole did not cause your temples to thin out from taking less than a full dose. Sorry...

LOL. I love guys like you. Okay buddy. Whatever you say. I guess your theoretical knowledge beats my empirical observations hands down. I have nothing further to add to your discussion.

 

[Georgie]

You cannot really extrapolate your hair gets worse-but not by a whole lot-after a few days of taking something.

I must agree with @whatevr especially where drugs that affect estrogen are concerned. Obviously it’s a little different because men and women respond differently to various sex hormones, but I find that if anything fucks with my estrogen either way, I notice within days. A good example is that in the past if I’ve menstruated, that week my hair fell out in absolute buckets, and other females note the same thing. I think if you have sensitive follicles, it’s entirely possible to respond to systemic changes within days.

 

[BetaBoy]

When this came up somewhere else on here, can't remember the thread, it was pointed out by someone that Raloxifene has basically the same affinity (±10%) for both the beta-ER and alpha-ER.

 

[whatevr]

Why were you taking Letro or Raloxifene anyway?

Letro, in particular is a real rough ride and way too powerful for any long term use.

To combat gyno that I've accumulated from Finasteride and topical estrogens that I used to maintain my hair throughout the past 2 years.
With letro, I never even took the full pill. I was advised by a chemist to make a liquid suspension so that the dose would equate to something like 0.25 mg per day. I then took this orally dissolved in some alcohol. I took it for maybe 2-3 days and that was enough for it to completely nuke my estrogen. I had bone and joint pains, as well as non-stop dry cough for something like 2 weeks. It seems the aromatase enzyme turns over rather slowly, because the side effects lasted way longer than the half-life of the drug itself. In the end I couldn't keep taking it due to the harsh side effects, although it did work quite well for what I intended.

Raloxifene is much smoother, although it tends to give me leg cramps. Alongside orally, I attempted to use it topically dissolved in DMSO as well, but that didn't turn out to be as simple as I'd hoped, at least not when making it from a pill with fillers. It would seem to need some kind of special formulation to work topically anyway (probably due to the molecular mass).

When this came up somewhere else on here, can't remember the thread, it was pointed out by someone that Raloxifene has basically the same affinity (±10%) for both the beta-ER and alpha-ER.

What is more important is whether it ends up being an agonist or an antagonist at the ER's in the hair follicle, and this seems to be tissue-specific. No data on that (that I could find).

 

[BetaBoy]

What is more important is whether it ends up being an agonist or an antagonist at the ER's in the hair follicle, and this seems to be tissue-specific. No data on that (that I could find).

Hmm you make a fair point. Raloxifene is supposedly pro-collagen in skin tissue, which is probably bad news as the alpha-ER seems to be implicated with increased collagen production.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22895361

 

[whatevr]

Hmm you make a fair point. Raloxifene is supposedly pro-collagen in skin tissue, which is probably bad news as the alpha-ER seems to be implicated with increased collagen production.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22895361

And, if we're going by the research that IdealForehead did in this thread:
https://www.hairlosstalk.com/intera...trogen-promote-and-hinder-hair-growth.113077/

Stimulating ER-alpha is at best useless and at worst outright harmful for hair. ER-beta seems to be what we want to stimulate exclusively.

 

[BetaBoy]

And, if we're going by the research that IdealForehead did in this thread:
https://www.hairlosstalk.com/intera...trogen-promote-and-hinder-hair-growth.113077/

Stimulating ER-alpha is at best useless and at worst outright harmful for hair. ER-beta seems to be what we want to stimulate exclusively.

Yeah not only will ERα activation supposedly induce catagen it is also said to be implicated in breast growth moreover, selective ERβ activation may actually work to suppress breast growth.

https://academic.oup.com/mend/article/21/1/1/2738210

 

[whatevr]

Yeah not only will ERα activation supposedly induce catagen it is also said to be implicated in breast growth moreover, selective ERβ activation may actually work to suppress breast growth.

https://academic.oup.com/mend/article/21/1/1/2738210

Super interesting. Not only did estriol (mostly selective beta agonist) NOT cause me any gyno, I thought at the time that it made my preexisting gyno look better, which I didn't think was possible and thought it was merely placebo. But maybe not.

To add to that, now that I'm experimenting with racemic equol (mixed R and S, where the R has a relatively high alpha affinity) I am getting nipple sensitivity and itchiness. Hopefully those homemade brotzu lotions come around soon and we can start using just S-Equol which won't have those problems.

 

[jgray201]

I have taken raxoxifene and tamoxifen in the past for significant periods to keep gyno away. Neither are good for hair. Ralox is much better though and always felt like i could take that for at least a few months at a time without hair quality suffering too much. Both increase testosterone quite significantly and from my experience there is always a risk of losing ground.

 

[michel sapin]

that would be amazing to know if ralox is agonist or antagonist for the hair " receptor " .
Currently taking low dise and it has not impacted my hair for the moment ( " neither the gyno) .
But i have read some studies and while it blocks the receptor at the breast , it increase slightly the serum oestradiol .

 

[Retinoid]

I must agree with @whatevr especially where drugs that affect estrogen are concerned. Obviously it’s a little different because men and women respond differently to various sex hormones, but I find that if anything fucks with my estrogen either way, I notice within days. A good example is that in the past if I’ve menstruated, that week my hair fell out in absolute buckets, and other females note the same thing. I think if you have sensitive follicles, it’s entirely possible to respond to systemic changes within days.

The problem with someone saying, I took X and in a couple of days my hair got worse so I stopped is that it does not really give you an accurate picture. Granted, we do not know if Raloxifene would be positive or not but just think if people just used Minoxidil for a few days--the shed is absolutely terrible for many people (like me...right now). We would all conclude Minoxidil is not good for your hair. So a few days is not enough to dismiss something as good or bad.

 

[sktboiboi]

I must agree with @whatevr especially where drugs that affect estrogen are concerned. Obviously it’s a little different because men and women respond differently to various sex hormones, but I find that if anything fucks with my estrogen either way, I notice within days. A good example is that in the past if I’ve menstruated, that week my hair fell out in absolute buckets, and other females note the same thing. I think if you have sensitive follicles, it’s entirely possible to respond to systemic changes within days.

hey u said u have POF?

this might do something:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11229151

 

[Georgie]

The problem with someone saying, I took X and in a couple of days my hair got worse so I stopped is that it does not really give you an accurate picture. Granted, we do not know if Raloxifene would be positive or not but just think if people just used Minoxidil for a few days--the shed is absolutely terrible for many people (like me...right now). We would all conclude Minoxidil is not good for your hair. So a few days is not enough to dismiss something as good or bad.

No not enough time to fully write something off, but I am saying it can be enough time to gauge if something is having an affect on your hair

 

[Georgie]

hey u said u have POF?

this might do something:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11229151

Lol I appreciate your help but HRT was the first thing I tried, and it doesn’t help my hair. Still doesn’t. I have fallen pregnant once though.