any topicals that DONT need to be applied 2x daily?

[Jacob]

Honesty doesn't mean much to you, does it, Jacob? You just can't admit that the count I did earlier was completely honest and accurate...

You've tried that excuse/explanation/diversion many times when this topic gets brought up. Not only will I repost the above again..I'll start out with something I said earlier in this thread:

Why do you keep posting that idiotic "I measured my actual number of posts.." nonsense..when we all know that when it comes to products that you just happen to push..it's always Proctor's. And less frequently- Revivogen. The other 90% of your posts are arguing with ppl like S Foote or talking about stumpied tailed midgets and the like. You *seem* to be very knowledgeable, as Nene mentioned...but you're still stuck on pushing the same stuff you've been pushing for 10+ years.

It'd be at least a bit different if there were more evidence that Proctor's or even Revivogen did much..and/or if they were really that unique and worth using compared to the numerous other things out there these day,.


And again...


Why would I waste my time doing that when I explained why it's idiotic that you keep bringing it up?

Ahh...you're starting to get a little smarter! A good many of my posts _do_ have to do with people who have various oddball interpretations of the balding process, and quite a few of them are dialogues I'm having with those kooks. But that's happening less and less nowadays, as I'm becoming bored with many of those people. You still see me post a lot, though, about specific things that interest me; an obvious recent example would be that post I did recently about percentages of minoxidil in products like Rogaine, and how that percentage changes when you apply it to your scalp. Another recent example was when I actually defended Propecia (oddly enough) against the outrageous claims being made by another poster.

Yeah, we don't see you post a lot. Yet whenever you get a chance to promote Proctor..you're there. Again..reread what I said about your counting. Maybe you'll get a little smarter.

As I've already told you in the past, I generally only mention that "stuff" when there's a damned-good REASON to mention it, like when somebody is fretting about having to stop using Propecia, and has no idea what else to use. You can bet your sweet *** that I'm going to mention what Dr. Proctor says is even better than Propecia. Better get used to it (it only happens 6% or 7% of the time, anyway)! :smack:

Better get used to it? 10+ years and I'm not used to it? :shock: Dr. Proctor makes up so much garbage..the last thing anyone should believe is his claims. 10+ years and nothing to prove them with. Many of the newer products these days have more "studies" and information on their ingreds/products than Dr. P has ever been able to provide. They even have patents :woot:

 

[Jacob]

But why Proctor, he's like that Mercola guy to me, a complete quack! His products are not even proven to work like minoxidil, finasteride and ketoconazole. Can you find a sucess story of someone who used only Dr. Proctor's products here? of course not

Be careful...the guru from the other site loves Mercola(after ridiculing him for years at Regrowth).

Bryan will come back with...what are you talking about? Prox contains minoxidil! etc. The thing you should be asking is for proof that it works better than any agent out there..as Dr. P claims and Bryan has been parroting...for 10+ years.

 

[Bryan]

You've tried that excuse/explanation/diversion many times when this topic gets brought up. Not only will I repost the above again..I'll start out with something I said earlier in this thread:

Why do you keep posting that idiotic "I measured my actual number of posts.." nonsense..

Why do you think it's "nonsense"? Because it's the TRUTH? Does truth mean nothing at all to you, Jacob?

when we all know that when it comes to products that you just happen to push..it's always Proctor's. And less frequently- Revivogen.

Not always. As I explained to you very recently, I spent a great deal of time very recently defending Propecia to somebody. Tell the TRUTH, Jacob, even if it hurts.

 

[Bryan]

The thing you should be asking is for proof that it works better than any agent out there..as Dr. P claims and Bryan has been parroting...for 10+ years.

That's another lie of yours, and you damned-well know it.

 

[Nene]

Bryan, I don't mean to offend you, and I'm not accusing you of anything. However, those regrowth pics are so bogus, it's hard to believe that anyone would believe that. I mean, the result is better than a hair transplant! If it was THAT effective, none of us would bother with the big 3 or hair transplants. I saw the pics of your results after that fight you got into with HT55. Your results were modest at the very best. You've also made statements that Proctor's products are just as good or maybe better than the big 3, we all know you know better than that.

BTW, Bryan, that 6% and 7% thing you keep posting really doesn't prove anything. As we've said, you often post in threads that have nothing to do with treatments or alternatives to the big 3. No one is accusing you of talking about Proctor when the discussion is about systemic absorption of topical spironolactone, or the pseudo hermaphrodites in the Domincan Republic. If you came out of left field and started talking about Proxiphen in those instances, you would be banned by now. However, if you could somehow calculate the % of posts you make about Dr. Proctor when the thread is similar to the one here, and it would be germane to the discussion, I'd bet the % would be well above 50%. I mean, I predicated you were talking about Proctor in this thread, and I'm not a psychic. What does that tell you?

 

[Nene]

In fact I'm shocked none of the other vets on here call you out on this. Maybe they are just averse to any arguments. Like I said, I'm not looking for a fight, I've found some of your posts very helpful, I've found others condescending and obnoxious. All in all you've been a great contributor to this forum. However , your unwavering support of Proctor is very odd and honestly suspicious, and I'm not afraid to call you out on it.

 

[Jacob]

You've tried that excuse/explanation/diversion many times when this topic gets brought up. Not only will I repost the above again..I'll start out with something I said earlier in this thread:

Why do you keep posting that idiotic "I measured my actual number of posts.." nonsense..

Why do you think it's "nonsense"? Because it's the TRUTH? Does truth mean nothing at all to you, Jacob?

when we all know that when it comes to products that you just happen to push..it's always Proctor's. And less frequently- Revivogen.

Not always. As I explained to you very recently, I spent a great deal of time very recently defending Propecia to somebody. Tell the TRUTH, Jacob, even if it hurts.

Since you're still playing stupid....I'm just going to repost the whole long exchange again. But WOW...Propecia too? The FDA approved drug? The non-topical?

Honesty doesn't mean much to you, does it, Jacob? You just can't admit that the count I did earlier was completely honest and accurate...

You've tried that excuse/explanation/diversion many times when this topic gets brought up. Not only will I repost the above again..I'll start out with something I said earlier in this thread:

Why do you keep posting that idiotic "I measured my actual number of posts.." nonsense..when we all know that when it comes to products that you just happen to push..it's always Proctor's. And less frequently- Revivogen. The other 90% of your posts are arguing with ppl like S Foote or talking about stumpied tailed midgets and the like. You *seem* to be very knowledgeable, as Nene mentioned...but you're still stuck on pushing the same stuff you've been pushing for 10+ years.

It'd be at least a bit different if there were more evidence that Proctor's or even Revivogen did much..and/or if they were really that unique and worth using compared to the numerous other things out there these day,.


And again...


Why would I waste my time doing that when I explained why it's idiotic that you keep bringing it up?

Ahh...you're starting to get a little smarter! A good many of my posts _do_ have to do with people who have various oddball interpretations of the balding process, and quite a few of them are dialogues I'm having with those kooks. But that's happening less and less nowadays, as I'm becoming bored with many of those people. You still see me post a lot, though, about specific things that interest me; an obvious recent example would be that post I did recently about percentages of minoxidil in products like Rogaine, and how that percentage changes when you apply it to your scalp. Another recent example was when I actually defended Propecia (oddly enough) against the outrageous claims being made by another poster.

Yeah, we don't see you post a lot. Yet whenever you get a chance to promote Proctor..you're there. Again..reread what I said about your counting. Maybe you'll get a little smarter.

As I've already told you in the past, I generally only mention that "stuff" when there's a damned-good REASON to mention it, like when somebody is fretting about having to stop using Propecia, and has no idea what else to use. You can bet your sweet *** that I'm going to mention what Dr. Proctor says is even better than Propecia. Better get used to it (it only happens 6% or 7% of the time, anyway)! :smack:

Better get used to it? 10+ years and I'm not used to it? :shock: Dr. Proctor makes up so much garbage..the last thing anyone should believe is his claims. 10+ years and nothing to prove them with. Many of the newer products these days have more "studies" and information on their ingreds/products than Dr. P has ever been able to provide. They even have patents :woot:

 

[Jacob]

The thing you should be asking is for proof that it works better than any agent out there..as Dr. P claims and Bryan has been parroting...for 10+ years.

That's another lie of yours, and you damned-well know it.

What..are you saying it's only been 9 years?

 

[Bryan]

Bryan, I don't mean to offend you, and I'm not accusing you of anything. However, those regrowth pics are so bogus, it's hard to believe that anyone would believe that. I mean, the result is better than a hair transplant! If it was THAT effective, none of us would bother with the big 3 or hair transplants.

Oddly enough, I once had an argument with a poster on some site (I'm forgetting where it was, and who it was) who seemed to be seriously claiming that there was no significant difference in the before-and-after hair of that guy in those pictures! As you can imagine, I was absolutely INCREDULOUS that he would say such a thing, but I couldn't shake him on that. Was he just yanking my chain? I've always suspected he was, but he seemed to be serious at the time.

I saw the pics of your results after that fight you got into with HT55. Your results were modest at the very best.

I agree. My own results with Prox-N (not Proxiphen!) were definitely more modest. It definitely stopped further loss for two full years, with only a slight additional gain, but there wasn't any dramatic regrowth like the guy in those pictures had with Proxiphen. I've always freely acknowledged that. You should, too.

You've also made statements that Proctor's products are just as good or maybe better than the big 3, we all know you know better than that.

I don't know that for sure! Dr. Proctor has claimed that while Proxiphen is "unquestionably" more effective than Propecia alone, it's only a bit more effective than Propecia + topical minoxidil. I have no reason to doubt his professional judgement.

BTW, Bryan, that 6% and 7% thing you keep posting really doesn't prove anything.

It proves that I don't "constantly" or "always" or "only" talk about Dr. Proctor's products, which some individuals have foolishly claimed.

As we've said, you often post in threads that have nothing to do with treatments or alternatives to the big 3.

I'm repeating this again for the umpteenth time: when somebody posts something that obviously calls for a reference to Proxiphen and a suggestion for its possible use ("I had to stop Propecia because of sides! What can I do??"), I won't hesitate to make the obvious suggestion.

No one is accusing you of talking about Proctor when the discussion is about systemic absorption of topical spironolactone, or the pseudo hermaphrodites in the Domincan Republic. If you came out of left field and started talking about Proxiphen in those instances, you would be banned by now.

Why would I talk about Proxiphen in a post about pseudohermaphrodites? By the way, has anybody been banned for talking about Propecia or Rogaine? How about Tricomin or Folligen? Why is Proxiphen so much different from any of those other four products, when it comes to what we can talk about? :dunno:

However, if you could somehow calculate the % of posts you make about Dr. Proctor when the thread is similar to the one here, and it would be germane to the discussion, I'd bet the % would be well above 50%.

I'll go you one better: all the posts I make about Dr. Proctor and Proxiphen are germane to the discussion. Probably 100%.

 

[Jacob]

all but probably 100% :dunno:

It's just obvious that they're germane to the discussion. I mean what else could one possibly recommend when they want an alternative to minoxidil :woot: or cannot take Propecia? Or they're looking for something besides minoxidil or Propecia? It's obvious these dinosaur of topicals are the clear choice. Why? Because the guy selling them says they're the best. He's got patents- no one else does! The information on the products and especially the ingredients...there's so much information there the website cannot be updated! But wait, there's more! The evidence behind the claims would require yet another website- so don't bother asking...just trust him!

In fact I'm shocked none of the other vets on here call you out on this. Maybe they are just averse to any arguments. Like I said, I'm not looking for a fight, I've found some of your posts very helpful, I've found others condescending and obnoxious. All in all you've been a great contributor to this forum. However , your unwavering support of Proctor is very odd and honestly suspicious, and I'm not afraid to call you out on it.

A lot of these "vets" would have no problem going after other lesser-known..possibly lesser-knowledgeable posters if they'd be doing much less. I know many have. I even had HLH tell me to stop posting in Prox/Proctor threads because I don't use such products. He had nothing to say when I pointed out that Bryan and another poster(D2) do not use such products either. So I think many have just become so used to Bryan posting about Proctor/Prox...even if they suspect something is up. After all..it's been 10+ years. But they need to ask themselves...would they give others doing the same..a pass?

 

[Cassin]

Bryan, I don't mean to offend you, and I'm not accusing you of anything. However, those regrowth pics are so bogus, it's hard to believe that anyone would believe that. I mean, the result is better than a hair transplant! If it was THAT effective, none of us would bother with the big 3 or hair transplants.

Oddly enough, I once had an argument with a poster on some site (I'm forgetting where it was, and who it was) who seemed to be seriously claiming that there was no significant difference in the before-and-after hair of that guy in those pictures! As you can imagine, I was absolutely INCREDULOUS that he would say such a thing, but I couldn't shake him on that. Was he just yanking my chain? I've always suspected he was, but he seemed to be serious at the time.

It was here and within the last year I think.

It all runs together so it could have been a month ago for all I know

 

[Jacob]

Was he arguing that it just looks like he grew his hair out longer? Or..given the super high quality of the pics :woot: ...any # of other things?

BTW..I was just looking at Proctor's site again...the "science" page etc. The lack of information..forget studies..is astonishing...for the hype this guy and his products have been given. For 10+ years. Of course mostly by Proctor himself and Bryan..

 

[Jacob]

You can see via this internet archive site..that the information and pictures are almost all the same...from/since 1998!

http://web.archive.org/web/19981205135021/http://www.drproctor.com/

 

[Rabid]

I'll tell you what we can do: for every post I make in which I talk about Dr. Proctor's products, I'll give you a dollar. For every post I make in which I don't talk about Dr. Proctor's products, YOU give ME a dollar. Do we have a deal?

No, because not every thread would be appropriate to discuss Dr. Proctor and his products.

First we have to know how many dollars Dr. Proctor give Bryan every time he recommends his products? :laugh: