What Can I Do Now? dutasteride Not Working.

[tysono]

Hey guys

So a bit of a story, I started finasteride (1.25mg daily) when I was 17. I tried minoxidil for a few months, however it gave me heart palpitations so I discontinued. I tried nizoral around that time as well but it made my hair look pretty bad, so I only ever used it a few times. I stayed on finasteride for about a year, and within that year my hair loss stabilised and towards the end, I felt I needed something a bit stronger. I got dutasteride prescribed from my Doctor, 0.5mg daily and have been taking that since then (I’m now 21). My hair thickened up quite a bit, however as of late, I seem to be thinning pretty rapidly. The only thing that I’ve changed is taking a multi daily, so not really anything viable that would be making a difference. I consulted an endocrinologist just to discuss my hormone levels, and he noted that my free testosterone levels have been rising since taking dutasteride. He advised that I take dutasteride EOD instead of daily, which I’ve been doing. I understand that testosterone can also have an effect on male pattern baldness, so I was thinking maybe my free test levels could be affecting my hair loss. Anyway, my question is, what should I do now? Should I try nizoral? Dermarolling? I’ve read so much and am just sort of trying to piece together some changes/additions I should make to continue treating my hair loss. I always thought dutasteride was the last resort, and that taking it would at least give me a few more years than it has. Side note; the only side effect I get from dutasteride is slightly weaker erections, which I dealt with for ages, however recently started taking cialis 5mg EOD (this stuff is amazing).

Any help is appreciated

 

[Hair-pun]

Hey Tysono, I was in this exact position about a year ago- I thought dutasteride was the last resort and was devastated when I continued to lose hair. Many people have the same response as it seems dutasteride is not much better than finasteride at the front. The solution for you is to either use 50mg RU58841 in 1ml of stemoxydine (I use RedKen Cerafil) to apply topically to balding areas of the scalp (cut hair short to get all over coverage) or some others recommend 100mg daily Spironolactone to counter the rise in testosterone. It's unfortunate that RU has not been properly trialled but i found that it was the only option (after trying everything else under the sun). Clascoterone is around as effective as RU and is being trialled currently and seems safe but around 4 times the price of RU so may be difficult to afford 50mg per day. I alternate 1 day RU and one day Clascoterone to minimise the risk. Once you are stable on RU you could add dermarolling (don't apply RU or CB on dermarolling days). You can buy RU or Clascoterone from Kane or Anagenic online and mix 50mg into the stemox daily, it's really no hassle and just becomes part of your routine. For any more info on this maybe check out a thread I made recently 'Guide for those starting their hairloss journey'- it has all of this info on it. Goodl luck!

 

[stejames]

Hey Tysono, I was in this exact position about a year ago- I thought dutasteride was the last resort and was devastated when I continued to lose hair. Many people have the same response as it seems dutasteride is not much better than finasteride at the front. The solution for you is to either use 50mg RU58841 in 1ml of stemoxydine (I use RedKen Cerafil) to apply topically to balding areas of the scalp (cut hair short to get all over coverage) or some others recommend 100mg daily Spironolactone to counter the rise in testosterone. It's unfortunate that RU has not been properly trialled but i found that it was the only option (after trying everything else under the sun). Clascoterone is around as effective as RU and is being trialled currently and seems safe but around 4 times the price of RU so may be difficult to afford 50mg per day. I alternate 1 day RU and one day Clascoterone to minimise the risk. Once you are stable on RU you could add dermarolling (don't apply RU or CB on dermarolling days). You can buy RU or Clascoterone from Kane or Anagenic online and mix 50mg into the stemox daily, it's really no hassle and just becomes part of your routine. For any more info on this maybe check out a thread I made recently 'Guide for those starting their hairloss journey'- it has all of this info on it. Goodl luck!

but youre also taking dutasteride?

 

[Hair-pun]

but youre also taking dutasteride?

Good point- yes I forgot to say that you need to continue taking Dutasteride every day or every other day and add RU topically daily

 

[Derelict]

RU or spironolactone, i'd recommend spironolactone as it has more science and health risks about it known. Expect drop in libido, some gyno(30% chance at 100mg) avoid lots of potassium, keep hydrated etc But giving RU shot first is probably best.

 

[tysono]

Should I get powdered RU or pre mixed?

 

[cyclonite]

Are you really see serious thinning just after experiencing thickening?. In clinical trials on anti androgens like finasteride virtually everyone who were experiencing growth in the first year kept experiencing growth over the entire period of the trial and I am talking about trials that were something like 5 and 10 years. I could've show you links but its been a while since I saw the articles about those trials, but they were quite big and known trials so I don't think it would be a problem to find them on google.
Are you really taking several 0.5 mg Avodart per day?.

May be your case is something unusual that doesn't fit the data from the trials but it is also plausible that you just think that your hair is getting thinner because sometimes the hair can look thicker or thinner in different times. You might thought that your hair got thicker and then you saw that it isn't thicker than before and thought that your hair got thinner. I didn't saw your hair but you should at least consider this possibility.

If dutasteride really doesn't working for you you should consider medication that stops testosterone production completely or close to that. That will prevent you from having children while on being on those drugs(you can always stop taking those drugs or start taking testosterone in small dosage) because testosterone is needed for sperm production but that won't prevent you from having an erection and having sex. You can be surgically castrated and still be able to have an erection. You don't need testosterone to be a man, its not like you will become a woman if you won't have testosterone and losing your testosterone will have much less impact on you than loosing your hair. it is also much easier to reverse than baldness.

 

[tysono]

Hey Tysono, I was in this exact position about a year ago- I thought dutasteride was the last resort and was devastated when I continued to lose hair. Many people have the same response as it seems dutasteride is not much better than finasteride at the front. The solution for you is to either use 50mg RU58841 in 1ml of stemoxydine (I use RedKen Cerafil) to apply topically to balding areas of the scalp (cut hair short to get all over coverage) or some others recommend 100mg daily Spironolactone to counter the rise in testosterone. It's unfortunate that RU has not been properly trialled but i found that it was the only option (after trying everything else under the sun). Clascoterone is around as effective as RU and is being trialled currently and seems safe but around 4 times the price of RU so may be difficult to afford 50mg per day. I alternate 1 day RU and one day Clascoterone to minimise the risk. Once you are stable on RU you could add dermarolling (don't apply RU or CB on dermarolling days). You can buy RU or Clascoterone from Kane or Anagenic online and mix 50mg into the stemox daily, it's really no hassle and just becomes part of your routine. For any more info on this maybe check out a thread I made recently 'Guide for those starting their hairloss journey'- it has all of this info on it. Goodl luck!

Thanks heaps mate

 

[tysono]

Are you really see serious thinning just after experiencing thickening?. In clinical trials on anti androgens like finasteride virtually everyone who were experiencing growth in the first year kept experiencing growth over the entire period of the trial and I am talking about trials that were something like 5 and 10 years. I could've show you links but its been a while since I saw the articles about those trials, but they were quite big and known trials so I don't think it would be a problem to find them on google.
Are you really taking several 0.5 mg Avodart per day?.

May be your case is something unusual that doesn't fit the data from the trials but it is also plausible that you just think that your hair is getting thinner because sometimes the hair can look thicker or thinner in different times. You might thought that your hair got thicker and then you saw that it isn't thicker than before and thought that your hair got thinner. I didn't saw your hair but you should at least consider this possibility.

If dutasteride really doesn't working for you you should consider medication that stops testosterone production completely or close to that. That will prevent you from having children while on being on those drugs(you can always stop taking those drugs or start taking testosterone in small dosage) because testosterone is needed for sperm production but that won't prevent you from having an erection and having sex. You can be surgically castrated and still be able to have an erection. You don't need testosterone to be a man, its not like you will become a woman if you won't have testosterone and losing your testosterone will have much less impact on you than loosing your hair. it is also much easier to reverse than baldness.

Are you really see serious thinning just after experiencing thickening?. In clinical trials on anti androgens like finasteride virtually everyone who were experiencing growth in the first year kept experiencing growth over the entire period of the trial and I am talking about trials that were something like 5 and 10 years. I could've show you links but its been a while since I saw the articles about those trials, but they were quite big and known trials so I don't think it would be a problem to find them on google.
Are you really taking several 0.5 mg Avodart per day?.

May be your case is something unusual that doesn't fit the data from the trials but it is also plausible that you just think that your hair is getting thinner because sometimes the hair can look thicker or thinner in different times. You might thought that your hair got thicker and then you saw that it isn't thicker than before and thought that your hair got thinner. I didn't saw your hair but you should at least consider this possibility.

If dutasteride really doesn't working for you you should consider medication that stops testosterone production completely or close to that. That will prevent you from having children while on being on those drugs(you can always stop taking those drugs or start taking testosterone in small dosage) because testosterone is needed for sperm production but that won't prevent you from having an erection and having sex. You can be surgically castrated and still be able to have an erection. You don't need testosterone to be a man, its not like you will become a woman if you won't have testosterone and losing your testosterone will have much less impact on you than loosing your hair. it is also much easier to reverse than baldness.

Nah my hairline has definitely recessed more unfortunately

 

[tysono]

Also is scalp tension normal with male pattern baldness? It’s when applying pressure on scalp, sort of feels like a headache on the outside (only way I can explain it)
Also, is dutasteride eod as effective as ed if I’ve been taking it ed for 3-4 years?

 

[cyclonite]

Nah my hairline has definitely recessed more unfortunately

Do you have pictures of the before and after the thinning that came after taking dutasteride?. Or pictures showing your hair before and after dutasteride?.
It is natural that your testosterone levels increase because less testosterone is converted to DHT in the body, so I don't think the free testosterone is the problem here. have you checked your DHT levels?. Are you really taking several capsules of dutasteride per day? how long are you doing it?.

If I were you and actually see thinning after taking dutasteride for a while I would take medication that stops testosterone production. It will actually gives you results unlike taking dutasteride every other day instead of daily. it doesn't seems like there is any scientific support for this advice you got about taking dutasteride every other day instead of daily.

 

[tysono]

Do you have pictures of the before and after the thinning that came after taking dutasteride?. Or pictures showing your hair before and after dutasteride?.
It is natural that your testosterone levels increase because less testosterone is converted to DHT in the body, so I don't think the free testosterone is the problem here. have you checked your DHT levels?. Are you really taking several capsules of dutasteride per day? how long are you doing it?.

If I were you and actually see thinning after taking dutasteride for a while I would take medication that stops testosterone production. It will actually gives you results unlike taking dutasteride every other day instead of daily. it doesn't seems like there is any scientific support for this advice you got about taking dutasteride every other day instead of daily.

I don’t have any photos, just tried to not remind myself too much about it by logging photos close up of my hairline etc, but that’s just me. I take 0.5mg dutasteride once ED currently, and no more than that. The only reason I ask is because my endo recommended I take it once EOD due to rising free test levels.

 

[Hswb]

RU or spironolactone, i'd recommend spironolactone as it has more science and health risks about it known. Expect drop in libido, some gyno(30% chance at 100mg) avoid lots of potassium, keep hydrated etc But giving RU shot first is probably best.

Interesting. I’m a long time duta user, going downwards for the past 2 years after some years of very good results. Do the same possible side effects of spironolactone also count for RU? By stating it is best to try RU first, I assume this is less strong than spironolactone?

 

[cyclonite]

Interesting. I’m a long time duta user, going downwards for the past 2 years after some years of very good results. Do the same possible side effects of spironolactone also count for RU? By stating it is best to try RU first, I assume this is less strong than spironolactone?

What were the results exactly? you had a lot of regrowth or it was mainly stopping your hair loss?. you have pictures of your hair?.

 

[Hswb]

What were the results exactly? you had a lot of regrowth or it was mainly stopping your hair loss?. you have pictures of your hair?.

0-3 yr fina > massive regrowth. From NW3 with diffused in NW6 to full NW1,5/2 ish.

3-5 yr duta > Fina stopped working, so upgraded to duta. Loss stopped and previous gains came back even stronger.

6-7 yr from duta back to fina > started losing gains since duta stopped working. Switched back to fina since I read the theory my body could possibly has adjusted itself to the medicine. So hoped to give everything a reset. Hair went slowly backwards this year.

7-8 yr upgraded from fina duta > thought that a year would be enough for the reset and so back to duta again. For about 5 months now. Loss of previous gains continues slowly. Still a bit above baseline: estimated Norwood 2,5/3 and little thin in Norwood 6 but not diffused that much.

don’t have much (detailed) pictures.

 

[cyclonite]

0-3 yr fina > massive regrowth. From NW3 with diffused in NW6 to full NW1,5/2 ish.

3-5 yr duta > Fina stopped working, so upgraded to duta. Loss stopped and previous gains came back even stronger.

6-7 yr from duta back to fina > started losing gains since duta stopped working. Switched back to fina since I read the theory my body could possibly has adjusted itself to the medicine. So hoped to give everything a reset. Hair went slowly backwards this year.

7-8 yr upgraded from fina duta > thought that a year would be enough for the reset and so back to duta again. For about 5 months now. Loss of previous gains continues slowly. Still a bit above baseline: estimated Norwood 2,5/3 and little thin in Norwood 6 but not diffused that much.

don’t have much (detailed) pictures.

I don't think the theory you heard have any scientific support behind it. You shouldn't waste a year on something like that and loose hair because of it. You might just thought that you are loosing hair on duta and then started to really loosing hair when you switched back to finasteride.

You had significant regrowth from finasteride in the first year?. I remember that in a 5 years finasteride trial virtually all the patients who had gains from finasteride where above baseline and even kept having growth after 5 years while the patients who had gains only after the first year lost their gains by the final year. another trial which was 10 years had similar results with finasteride not loosing its efficiency and with many patients who keep having regrowth all the way to the 10th year of the trial.

The dutasteride dosage isn't meant for treating hair loss and it known that higher dutasteride doses reduce much more of the DHT in the scalp so if you experience hair loss while being on duta everyday you can take higher doses of duta. Here is a research about various dutasteride levels: https://www.bernsteinmedical.com/research/dutasteride-vs-finasteride/

But I think you should consider to simply take medications that stops testosterone production if even regular duta dose doesn't help you. it can be easier and even more effective than higher doses of duta. I have good regrowth with duta but I am still thinking about taking some drug that will drastically reduce the testosterone production in my body.

 

[losingbattle88]

I don't think the theory you heard have any scientific support behind it. You shouldn't waste a year on something like that and loose hair because of it. You might just thought that you are loosing hair on duta and then started to really loosing hair when you switched back to finasteride.

You had significant regrowth from finasteride in the first year?. I remember that in a 5 years finasteride trial virtually all the patients who had gains from finasteride where above baseline and even kept having growth after 5 years while the patients who had gains only after the first year lost their gains by the final year. another trial which was 10 years had similar results with finasteride not loosing its efficiency and with many patients who keep having regrowth all the way to the 10th year of the trial.

The dutasteride dosage isn't meant for treating hair loss and it known that higher dutasteride doses reduce much more of the DHT in the scalp so if you experience hair loss while being on duta everyday you can take higher doses of duta. Here is a research about various dutasteride levels: https://www.bernsteinmedical.com/research/dutasteride-vs-finasteride/

But I think you should consider to simply take medications that stops testosterone production if even regular duta dose doesn't help you. it can be easier and even more effective than higher doses of duta. I have good regrowth with duta but I am still thinking about taking some drug that will drastically reduce the testosterone production in my body.

Took 2mg to 2.5mg of oral duta for 9 months today. No thickening, no regrowth, thinner hair. But suffer from ejaculation disorder thanks to duta. So I fucked myself over for nothing. Even applied it topically. It has been a total fail. It didn't even reduce my shedding. I think T has continued to f*** my hair over. So I'm using spironolactone topically everyday with dutasteride. And added oral minoxidil. Fuk oral duta I can barely shoot out my sperm anymore.

 

[zetta98]

Took 2mg to 2.5mg of oral duta for 9 months today. No thickening, no regrowth, thinner hair. But suffer from ejaculation disorder thanks to duta. So I fucked myself over for nothing. Even applied it topically. It has been a total fail. It didn't even reduce my shedding. I think T has continued to f*** my hair over. So I'm using spironolactone topically everyday with dutasteride. And added oral minoxidil. Fuk oral duta I can barely shoot out my sperm anymore.

Bro I was shedding, receding and thinning for TWO years when I started dutasteride. Kept at it because logically speaking it makes no sense that dutasteride would accelerate hairloss or not help. And in the end I recovered everything I lost. Thicken my hair immensely. And everyone keeps telling me there was no way I was balding when in fact I was aggressively. It works. You have to keep at it. Stick it out. I also more recently added RU58841 to my regimen. Also side effects for me last much longer than 9 months but I recovered. Testosterone doesn't increase dramatically on dutasteride like people think. I have mine tested multiple times a year. Levels aren't increasing. Doctor said they look good. And I only take .5 mg dutas daily.

 

[losingbattle88]

What u mean side effects last much longer than 9 months but u recovered? What sides u had can u elaborate. My sperm seeps out of penis only lucky days it can shoot out a little bit. Only Once it was a normal ejaculation in 9 damn months dude. I was super lucky that day. But ye 99% of the time sperm seeps out from dick without any force this won't magically dissappear lol. This can't be good long term someday I will have a dry orgasm I bet. I was thinking of trying it once a week then twice a week and so on if sperm gets better, and only do 0,5mg never 2mg or 2.5mg ever again. That dose is for prostate cancer lol.

 

[zetta98]

What u mean side effects last much longer than 9 months but u recovered? What sides u had can u elaborate. My sperm seeps out of penis only lucky days it can shoot out a little bit. Only Once it was a normal ejaculation in 9 damn months dude. I was super lucky that day. But ye 99% of the time sperm seeps out from dick without any force this won't magically dissappear lol. This can't be good long term someday I will have a dry orgasm I bet. I was thinking of trying it once a week then twice a week and so on if sperm gets better, and only do 0,5mg never 2mg or 2.5mg ever again. That dose is for prostate cancer lol.

Well I couldn't even get hard fully for over a year. My libido was very low and yeah sperm was on the lower side. The bodies plasticity is pretty damn impressive. It's not magic. It's adjustment. Sometimes though side effects won't go away. I even had sensitive nipples. Thats gone too. Then again I wasn't on 2.5 mg. A bit overkill if you ask me.